Through his company, HospiVation, Jason coaches restaurant executives how to make their goals real in the restaurant and teaches restaurant managers how to transform their patterns of management to improve their hospitality leadership.HospiVation helps restaurants through coaching, speeches, workshops and books. They try to meet managers where they are and dive deep in the restaurant’s team to help them build better teams. Jason has wanted to work in the restaurant industry since a very young age and got his first job as a restaurant dishwasher at the age of 15. He’s worked for 20 different restaurant brands during his career. One of the biggest mistakes restaurant managers make when it comes to leadership is trying to do everything by themselves and not learning to delegate. It’s important for managers to understand a restaurant’s KPIs, but it’s also important for EVERY member of the team to understand the KPIs and how success is measured.In an effective meeting, the meeting organizer and leader should talk 20 percent of the time and the rest of the attendees should talk 80 percent of the time. QUOTES “I came in through the side door. I started out washing dishes at a very young age. My mother didn’t even know I got a job.” (Jason) “I’ve worked for 20 different restaurant brands and six of the top 100 brands in the U.S. This has given me the ability to see the Mona Lisa painted 20 different ways. All of those learnings helped to shape my company, HospiVation.” (Jason)  “Ask any social media manager. It’s very hard to get people to follow you and it’s even hard to keep them.” (Jason) “It’s not just managing, leading and coaching – it’s knowing the difference between the three. We use managing more than anything else in our day as a hospitality leader. Leadership is different. Leadership is understanding the overarching items about the industry and where to move the brand next.” (Jason) “Coaching is the mastery of small groups and one-on-ones. Coaching is you creating a space of 30 minutes to listen to your team.” (Jason) “When it comes to mastering your meetings, you have to understand that if you aren’t sitting down to make a decision, you probably shouldn’t be there.” (Jason) “You should never stop training, even when someone puts in a notice (and are departing soon).” (Jason) TRANSCRIPT 00:00.00vigorbrandingHello everybody today’s guest is Jason Brooks he’s a motivational speaker an expert in restaurant management and the author of the book every leader needs followers 10 keys to transform restaurant managers into hospitality leaders Jason. Thanks so much for being here. Um, I’d love to start off with just you talking a little bit about your past like some of the places you’ve been and some of the things you’ve done. 00:26.34Jason BrooksThank you Michael ah, it’s a pleasure being on forktails in amazing podcast. Your listeners are full First they know their business. They know what they’re talking about so I am honored. Um, you know my past is like many. Pasts of coaches of speakers meaning that I came in through the side door and and I started out washing dishes very young age 15 first job. My my mother didn’t even know that I got a job. Ah, she just came home one day after three weeks of working and there were a lot more groceries in the fridge than when she went to work and she’s like Jason where did all this food come from and like mom I promise I didn’t do anything bad I got a child. But cooking has been something that has stuck with me even up to this day I still find different recipes. You could find me on the weekends breaking out the smoker I have a traeger whether it’s brisket or some chicken or some ribs and. I am getting down but I’ve been in this business I’ve been in this industry for thirty plus years and I’m known as what some may call a restaurant lifer. Um, even though I’m a restaurant lifer I had some odd jobs. 01:53.21Jason BrooksIn between here and there because people that get in the restaurant business. They don’t typically wake up at the age of 7 and say I want to work in restaurants. You know they actually say I want to be a fireman or I want to be this? Um, so there was a time there that although I was good. In the restaurant business I fought it and I found that most people fight being in this business at some point because they think it’s trying to change them. They think that it’s trying to change themselves from being authentic. And it takes having that right mentor that right person that you lean on or your spouse or friend saying what are you doing you are you are good at this. You need to do this or you to then say? Okay I’m going to now truly invest my time in this. Um, but I’ve worked for 20 different restaurant brands 6 of the top 100 brands in the us and I always say this has given me the ability to view the Mona Lisa painted 20 different ways. Some of them are some amazing pieces of art. Some of them are just pieces but all of these learnings from all these brands help to shape my company called hospitalation which is hospitality and motivation and is putting that motivation back into hospitality. 03:23.31vigorbrandingFantastic. That’s great. Ah, and I you know I got to see some of your podcasts. They were wonderful and your energy is contagious I Love it. Absolutely love it. Um, so talk we’re gonna talk about your book. But let’s talk about hospiation a little bit I mean talk about what it does What you’ve been doing with it and you know give us some some background there. 03:27.43Jason BrooksAre. 03:42.45Jason BrooksUm, probation was made to help manage lead and coach restaurant tours executives back to some of the foundations that may have been lost, especially within the last four years there’s been some things lost within the skill set. Of our teams and also some some of of the things that as owners we need to recognize more of what our teams are missing to help close that gap so hospitalation helps to close the gap between. Customer or guest expectations and the operator or owner execution and we do this through coaching through speeches through workshops through books. Um, we try to meet. The owner meet the manager where they are and give those pieces and leave everything on the table I mean leave it all on field. There are no secrets. It’s just being able to help dive deeper into that team or into that person. To find out what really drove them to be successful and then help double down on those tactics on those skillsets for them to build better teams around them. 05:01.89vigorbrandingVery good. Um I mean like you know I look at I mean we we employ a lot of folks here in our company and probably 100 and some employees and you know different generations come in and I’ve been doing this for a really long time and you know I see different types of sort of attitudes and stuff and. You know we we we all lived through the whole covid thing and the restaurants I mean getting back and coming back I mean you you have in here about the motivation. Do. Do you feel like restaurants and the hospitality industry in general has lost its motivation. Are you feeling that that that they need that maybe ah, an infusion of ah of motivation. 05:38.37Jason BrooksUm, I mean it is motivation. It’s also a understanding of finding out and just remembering what made you successful before.. For example, there’s a lot of times whenever. Let’s let’s go through the whole ranks when a cook shifts into a manager role. What made them successful as a cook they tend to leave that behind as a manager or a manager into a multi-unit manager. Whenever you are a manager you’re running your own restaurant. Um, you tend to use ah a checklist you tend to create mini gms you tend to have all these things in place because there’s so much on your plate. That you need reminders to help make sure that you cover all the bases that you need to cover and then all of a sudden when they shift into a multi unit manager they tend to shoot from the hip. They don’t have any checklist. They don’t walk into the building studying anything about that business whenever they walk in if they’re running multiple restaurants same thing as owners we think that we are exuding some of the same things that made us successful. 06:56.88Jason BrooksBut we have to revisit. What is it exactly that made us successful within our last role and now how do we bring that into the next and that’s what that’s that motivation that is missing. We can’t leave things behind. We have to bring them with us. 07:14.34vigorbrandingGood. So okay, let’s talk about your book I see it behind you there leadership every leader needs followers 10 keys to transform restaurant managers into hospitality leaders. Um, it’s not easy to get people to follow. You is it as a leader. 07:17.99Jason BrooksUm, I Yes, um. 07:26.71Jason BrooksNo no, ask any social media manager it is it. It’s it’s very hard to get them to follow you and it’s even harder to keep them and that’s where that’s where some of the 10 keys. Covers is not only how do you build a followship and you have to be a wonderful follower yourself. But then how do you keep that as well. 07:54.33vigorbrandingVery good. So what? What? What do you think are the biggest mistakes the restaurant managers are making when it comes to being an effective leader. 08:02.48Jason BrooksHands down doing it by yourself I’ve seen it too many times we come in as a manager and we think that the things again the things I used to do I can just do it and then I’ll do it by myself. I don’t have trust and whenever you you try to lead a restaurant team by yourself. Yes, there’s things that you should bring with you but there’s a lot of management and leadership things that you have to learn because. Managing and leading a group of people is it natural. It is something that you have to invest time and and even money in order to make sure that you do this right? and when I say money as a investment time is money. When we put 3 hours of our life into something else that definitely cost us. We could be doing something else. But the return we get when we invest in the right way to manage lead and coach that return is just amazing and it’s not just. Managing leading and coaching is knowing the difference between the three because managing is using or or having a group of people keep. 09:24.99Jason BrooksKeeping them in the guard rails to hit a certain point by a certain time and remain within a certain budget. We use managing more than anything else within our day as a hospitality leader leadership is different. Leadership is is really understanding that. Overarching ah items about the industry about the trends about what’s going on about where to move the brand to next and it’s also when a group of people have run into a situation that they don’t know what the next step should be. And then that leadership mindset helps to shift it into painting the picture for them to see ah that’s exactly where we have to go I can’t believe I didn’t see that before now coaching is different than managing and leadership coaching is that mastery of small groups. 1 on one. That’s the thing that we forget to bring with us whenever we are trying to lead our teams is the coaching aspect. We think I don’t need to coach my teams. My team has been around been working together for the last two three years I pay him $15 per hour. They better know what to do, but it’s just not true and coaching also isn’t just you making 1 on 1 time to spew more stuff onto them coaching is actually you creating a space 30 minutes to listen to your team to find out what their challenges are. 10:59.85Jason BrooksBut they’re trying to accomplish about themselves a a about their family. All the things that helps build that relationship that when they’re in your building In. You’re not there. They have the the skillset to make the right choices with maximum results. That’s the key to coaching. 11:20.24vigorbrandingYeah that’s ah, that’s well said I know that a couple of things you said there were really really interesting. The 1 thing you said it was a big mistake people make is they do it themselves and you’re right I think as leaders sometimes we’re so used to doing things or we know how to do it and we take it for granted, we don’t take the time to for for lack of a word teach. And bring people along right? I mean you know it’s just ah, it’s one of those things where um, if you don’t take the time to to train and coach. Ah, you’re not you can’t expect them to to learn and and to excel I think that’s ah I think it’s a really good point that you made. Um so you know in your book you have 10 keys for effective restaurant leadership. 11:48.90Jason BrooksUm, but. 11:54.74vigorbrandingWant to talk about 1 of the one of those keys and you talk about kpis I mean obviously it’s important for the managers to know about the kpis but you feel it’s important for everyone to understand talk about that a little bit. Why why? Why are the kpi so important. 12:08.80Jason BrooksBecause of what we do every year as a business every year if you look at your window. Not just we do it every business that is on your block does the same thing they create this business plan. They make the business plan. They put a core of people that’s in the c-suite or just on the on the ownership team they make this business plan print it on a pretty parsial paper put it in a frame hang it on a wall and then maybe a senior manager or 2 knows exactly what that is. And by the time it gets down to the guest-facing employee. It is lost so what I mean by master your kpis as being the number one key is that it isn’t just knowing your numbers It’s not just knowing sales. And and and your profits and your losses it is about how do you create that number and make a connection with the human element that is in your business every position and either help you or hurt you in making those business goals. The question is whenever we make those goals or big rocks. Do we know what we’re doing when we make those big rocks and whenever I say big I like to use the acronym b I g not just because I like the rapper but b I g because b if it’s a big rock. 13:35.69Jason BrooksThe B is for believable is the goal can it actually be attained I intentional. Yes, it may be a goal but are you actually putting effort is your team putting effort behind making that goal happen daily and then G grounded. Grounded is if we don’t make this goal. We will not be successful at what we do so whenever we make those goals those big rocks Those Kpis are we making it believable intentional and grounded and then when we do. How do we create that same pattern for what the buser does what the host does what the matrid does what? what the cook does every single person has to understand what is the human element in the things that they do within their role 3 things that they can do to help. 14:31.40vigorbrandingVery cool. So I mean sometimes though the Kpis the numbers and all that does that get in the way of the customer experience can that some kind sometimes dilute or detract from the attention that they deserve for the customer experience. 14:31.48Jason BrooksMake that happen. 14:37.92Jason BrooksAnd. I think that’s where whenever you break it down to make the human element behind it. That’s where it makes sense because you can say that it is to grow sales. But if it’s only about the dollar item. And you’re only telling that for just the server that they need to grow sales that doesn’t make sense that does take away from the from the experience but whenever you can say whenever you can actually connect with your guest and get them to come back 2 more times because you wowed them. Because you beat the guest to the hospitality meaning you were getting things for them that they didn’t even ask for that. You remembered their anniversary when you can make that true connection and make them choose us over someone else on on the same block. That’s how we build sales. So yes, it is a number but when you can connect the human element to it. That’s whenever you can actually you can improve that experience not just make it numerical. 15:50.00vigorbrandingYeah, you nailed it I mean at the end of the day we’re we’re serving. We’re serving guests and it’s people and we want to make their day. We want to make them feel special and it is more than just numbers at the end of the day there’s numbers involved when we gets paid. We’re doing this for business. It’s ah it’s a living. It’s a passion but it’s you know it all comes around the the customer I think that’s super important I think that ties into the next thing one of your chapters in your book owner like orientation. Ah, really interesting. We. We have a thing here in our company. Um, we we as an agency. Ah. Have a thing called Homeroom which goes back to the old school days we get together on a Tuesday morning the entire organization multiple cities and we we talk about the good the bad and the ugly of the industry and at the end we ask people what they’re passionate about passion is one of our core values. And we also talk about putting your name on the door and what we mean by that is if your name was on the door. What would you do what would you do differently how would you improve the company what do you suggest and so I think that’s like a really important thing and ah we want I want people to to act like owners if owners care. Ah, owners care about the customer so owner like orientation half the feeling might might tie in there. can you can you talk about that a little bit. 17:03.48Jason BrooksYes I think that definitely when we bring our team in with the bigger picture things happen and what I mean by that is that we typically do orientation wrong right now we’ll bring them in. We’ll have a table ready some aprons shirt hat name tag. And then they’ll have a seat a stack of paper and then they’ll scribe until the pen runs hot then we’ll take them back. Put them on a laptop for possibly some computer-based training and then put them on 1 position what we’re doing right? There is that the only thing that that they’re owning is three things. 1 table which happens to be their favorite break table if you ever notice the table you do orientation at ends up being their breakck table then 2 a laptop and 3 1 position and then for the next 6 to eight weeks we’re hoping and praying that they tend to branch out to do more. While the people who train them are just going crazy because they’re like Steve where are you getting these horrible hires from they don’t want to do anything so that’s where we first start out with doing orientation wrong which is one of the easiest way. That any listener can change their ro I on a new hires. What I propose is this tick scene table same setup papers all all of that good stuff when you bring them in shake their hand ask them if they’re thirsty and then say where we we are going to start outside. 18:37.73Jason BrooksYou take them outside and not just outside you take them out all the way out to the road by the curb on the edge by the cars driving by and you then say this is your restaurant and this is mine too and this is the view that every single customer sees whether they are stopping by here or not. They they see it from the curb all the way in and this is how we look compared to our neighbor and this neighbor we actually pick up all this trash from the curb all the way up every single day because we want to make sure that we look amazing to everyone that chooses to eat here or not. And then you walk them on it. We also sweep the parking lot not just up to the curb but all the way to the edge of the lot. This is our sidewalk. We actually scrub this this is our trash cans whenever we drop trash. We pick it up and then we sweep it and we keep the doors closed because we want to keep all the flies inside. We don’t want them flying out and then as you’re doing this as you’re walking them as you’re walking them through you’re you’re also checking their body language. How much does it suck whenever you hire someone and three weeks later they’re like ah this is too much for me I’m out of here wouldn’t you want to know on day zero. This is not going to work out. So as you’re walking them around the exterior giving them that owner like view as you walk them in now talk about sightlines for the customer and break it down to a 1 a 3 and a 5 a one being the lowest or subpar a 3 being par. 20:11.50Jason BrooksAnd a 5 being exceptional service and then you’re talking them through what a 1 3 or 5 is at the host stand with a host creek with it being neat and being tidy as they’re walking through the dining room what they can hear from the kitchen ass are sitting down. You’re now connecting. Your guest experience scores with your walkthrough and they now understand and see the whole building more as you’re doing this? Yes, you do add on forty five maybe fifty more minutes onto your onto your orientation. But the return on investment you get. Of them knowing that they can help when they pull up in the parking lot. Not just when they’re in position and then your trainer’s like oh man Steve these new hires you you you you ah must have got these guys from chick-fil-a. Dunked them in the back office in holy water and then brought them back out saying please and thank you like? no actually I just made sure that they understand the big picture on day one and then that way when I pass them off to you. They now see things differently. 21:22.40vigorbrandingThat’s great. That’s great, Well look as a marketing company I mean we’re hired to help build brands and oftentimes people think a brand is the logo the name. Maybe it’s the social media the personality that we project in the in the advertising and all that which is they’re all parts of the brand. But. 21:26.83Jason BrooksHe. 21:38.69vigorbrandingAt the end of the day I mean it’s how the customer feels when they’re in there. It’s the product of course. But it’s also the experience and that’s part of the brand. So the folks you’re training are your brand. Ah you know evangelists and they’re going to be what people remember when they drive by to use your your analogy going by the road and they look over at that restaurant. They’re going to remember how they felt. 21:40.57Jason BrooksGreater. But we can. 21:57.93vigorbrandingWhen they were there Sure they’re going to think about the food and if it was good and it was a good value. Did I they treat but that that experience and and it’s really going to be those folks that you’re training that are going to make that good or bad and we’ve all eaten it. Phenomenal restaurants. Food was great and and the the service was bad, something went wrong along the way. 22:04.97Jason BrooksAre are are. 22:15.71vigorbrandingAnd in this day and age we can’t afford that I mean every touch point of the brand has to be at its peak and the people are are really integral to the the whole thing um key 6 another one of your your your your keys now I think you and I might disagree on this. Maybe we don’t I don’t know but I’m gonna I’ll dive into it. Master. 22:31.87Jason BrooksI. 22:34.68vigorbrandingMaster your meetings I hate meetings I think meetings end up being half of them more than half of them are a waste of time perhaps because I’m in them I don’t know but I just I don’t find them to be I don’t find them to be valuable at all and you know you have agendas you have follow through. You have ah deadlines and all that stuff. But. So talk to me about mastering a meeting and maybe ah maybe I’m going to learn a lot here because I have a feeling I’m going to. 22:59.23Jason BrooksWell first we suck at meetings and no, no, we we actually suck at meetings because there’s times we we ah ah have meetings in order to fill. 23:02.30vigorbrandingOkay, maybe that’s it Maybe I sucked at me. Maybe ah maybe maybe that’s when I learned this whole thing. Okay, so. 23:16.30Jason BrooksTime and space a meeting should be defined as the reason why I’m asking you to step away from your role is because the thing that we need to make a decision on. We can’t unless you are there. That’s it. 23:32.81vigorbrandingMe here. 23:35.97Jason BrooksIf that doesn’t apply to the person that’s at the table. They shouldn’t be at the table 1 and 2 you probably shouldn’t be having that meeting now a a meeting that is repetitive like let’s say a manager’s meeting why sometimes they suck. Is because it is a data dump. It is a absolute data I treat meetings the same way I treat one on ones except even a bit more extreme if it’s my meeting that I’m running I should be speaking 20% of the time. The rest of my team is speaking 80. 24:12.30vigorbrandingAnd. 24:14.29Jason BrooksAnd that’s because at that point I’ve already done um key number 3 in the book which is delegate by creating many gms I have created many managers within each department and their goal is to report out on. What’s going on and those goals from from my many gms are linked to key number 1 master your kpis they understand what the kpis are they understand the human element that is behind it and they deep dive on that data and bring it to the table. So. When it comes to to key number 6 mastering your meetings. The main thing you have to do is understand that if you weren’t sitting down to make a decision. You shouldn’t be there and 2 if it is something that is a consistent meeting. It’s a 20% from the person that’s running it and 80% from everything else because when you do that you then build this ownership and a different view on things within your building I’ll say one last piece we have gotten into firefighting way too much. We have some amazing firemen and fire women within the hospitality industry but we’ve got to stop firefighting because when you firefight you shoot from the hip you see the fire you pull the hose out. 25:41.82Jason BrooksAnd you just start dumping water on that fire. But when a fire happens in a building think about it. You’re facing one side of the building and you can only see one side.. There can be several things that is going on all around that building. We’ve got to stop being. Fire men and fire women and we had to start being fire Chiefs A fire Chief has firemen and fire women all around the building putting out these fires for us and we can say the same thing about these meetings whenever you are fire chiefing your meeting your fire team. Understands exactly what’s going on but you have put them in places around your business to know where those spires are to where you have better control of everything else. 26:30.96vigorbrandingThat’s good analogy I mean I I love analogies and I think that makes it very so that’s why you’re good at what you do I mean it was very easily understood. Well done. Um, okay so training we talk about the importance of training right? and we ah we know it’s important to train. 26:32.72Jason BrooksAre. 26:44.63vigorbrandingAh, you feel it’s important for ongoing training which I think is interesting and and certainly makes an awful lot of sense. Um, why why is that I mean like let’s face it with with a turnover in this world with with people. Maybe they’re not going to be in the job for three months why would I spend so much time training them. Um you you feel that’s important. Let’s talk about that. 27:03.91Jason BrooksYeah I definitely feel that um, never stop training is one of the keys to being successful and of course we like to say it but we don’t really like to budget it. We can train our way in and out of anything. We really can. How we fall short of executing never stop training is that we don’t have a training plan that again goes back to what the plan is we have we have a training plan. Yes, but it’s a training plan one. That’s probably been the same training plan for the last 3 4 or 5 years versus each year do we sit down and say now that our objective is this? how are we training it’s not just how we hit that number. It’s not just growing digital sales. It’s not just getting better marketing. It’s. Do we have that included within the training poke in in the in the training program for our teams or are we just adding that in here and there second piece to never stop training is it absolutely as you and I both know it needs to be written down that that doesn’t mean. That our team currently trucks at sucks at training that means that our team has several things on their mind bills spouse car. All that good stuff they are going to lose their thought and their focus. 28:31.35Jason BrooksOn the thing that they should be training that that should be a core fundamental. That’s whenever that never stop training that checklist training helps because we we want you to say all the foundational things and with how long you’ve been with me I still want you to add on. That whipped cream the cherry and the sprinkles on top from all the things that you do well to but I want to make sure that the foundation of what’s being said to every single person is done last piece on never stop training I believe that you continue training. All the way up to their last day even if they put in a two week notice you train them all the way up to their last day and do you know why? because if you have 50 people that’s on your staff and you now have 51 because you are replacing one that put in their notice. It doesn’t help you by saying well I got one more so I’m a stop training the person who’s leaving no whenever you train the one that’s leaving you are also shifting that training you’re shifting that mindset you’re training them. How to onboard onto a different team even if it is your competitor you are training them how to get on board. How to get to learn the people how to get to learn their culture because a few things happen when that happens one everyone around you. 30:01.10Jason BrooksIt’s watching the attention you’re still putting into the person that’s leaving and they’re like that is a true coach and then number 2 number 2 is how many times is it that the grass is truly greener on the other side. So you shipped into the alma still keep training you I’m going to train you to be the next whatever that you are getting into. Let’s say you get there and it sucks guess what’s going to happen. Ah Jason ah I actually want to come back because grass isn’t greener. Then you’re able to now still build on your team but I truly believe you should never stop training even when they put in a notice. 30:42.62vigorbrandingYeah I Think that’s Great. We’ve had an awful lot. We call them. Boomerangs. We’ve had several people leave during the great resignation. You know for the grass being greener and we’ve had several boomerangs come back and you make another really wonderful point and that is people around you that are on your team that are staying on your team that are. Loyal and dedicated. They see how you treat people when they leave and um, that’s a reflection on you as a leader and I think that’s really important to to keep that in mind. Ah you know if you sit there and say bad things about somebody. You know the moment the door closes behind them just ah, that’s just really a poor reflection on and on you as Leader. So I think that’s ah I think it’s very sage advice. 31:08.00Jason BrooksAre you. 31:20.12vigorbrandingRight? So um, we talked about training another thing you talk about which I find this to be I think this is really important ah closing the gap between the restaurant manager and what the customer sees I mean again. Ah you know we always often say we’re too close to it I think that may be the case here with with managers you want to talk a little bit about that. 31:20.86Jason BrooksBrother I know. 31:39.10Jason BrooksOh yes I I love this topic um and closing the gap is is. It’s there because we live the 2 wheel life michael do you know what? the 2 wheel life is okay. 31:50.89vigorbrandingI do not know what the 2 wheel life is I don’t own a motorcycle so I assume that’s what it is but I mean maybe not. 31:56.87Jason BrooksIs that although our car has 4 Wheels we are pulling into the parking lot. So damn fast. We may as well be on 2 wheels and do you know why? because we’ve gotten that fourteenth text with the fifth picture about the close last night and our main truck call said that they’re short on drivers and now the truck order is due. third third 30 minutes ago and payroll calls someone forgot to clock out last weekend and you have to log into the portal and change your hours or else they can’t process payroll so that’s why you’re on 2 wheels. Doors open Bigfoot Dragon trying to get out the car and you walk up to the front the host and has a line and you’re like ah let me come help get these table sat bus some tables run to the back, get the line down. Finally get your truck order in fix payroll. But by this time. You are on fire. Your heartbeat is racing 120 beats per minute you are lapping like Nascar you’re touching tables. You’re pointing out things to clean and you’re like whoa girl I’m on fire this is amazing. You work a triple double that day heartbeat racing. And you get home somehow fall asleep and then your email goes off ding and it’s that guest complete a 2 on clean. They had a horrible experience. You just about flip your table but they’re lying no way I was there all day. 33:30.25Jason BrooksI worked the whole day I was lapping like Nascar I was touching on tables I was telling people what to clean. There’s no way. But there’s a gap. There’s a gap between what the operator experiences and what the guest does and that gap is because we are walking through like the terminator. Head on swivel I view Twenty feet out twenty feet wide looking for the next fire fire hose on the hip just looking for that next fire and we are standing at at an average five foot six height looking down to see what that next thing is. Our customers though. It’s very different their heart rate actually slows down when they’re pulling onto our lot first, they want to see are we open. They want to see is the parking lot. Clean does it look like someone lives here. They then pull up they get out. Ah, the car slow walk up to the door and then the the guest learned this trick from covid they now check the little slit of the door to see is the bar there because they don’t want to yank um, make on the door and pull their arm out their sockt like ah it’s open. So then they finally get in like yes I can stop eating from the dashboard of my car they walk in their heartbeats slow down things are good and then they sit down and they’re sitting at an average of three feet high heart rate heart rate has slowed down eyes are dimmer. 34:59.56Jason BrooksWhen your eyes when the the ah light is dimmer your your pupils actually get bigger and then whenever you’re looking at a distance of about eighteen inches from the table to your food. You are looking at that eighteen inch and then no higher than three feet while the manager heart rate fast 20 by 20 view and walking quickly. There’s a huge gap there in order to close that gap one of the things that that you have to practice which is hard is pulling yourself out the shift. Scheduling yourself to not be in position sometimes that’s hard. We are trained from day one that when things are short we are locked in. We make that happen. But at least once a week you have to take that customer view and I’m not taking and I’m not talking taking the view. Right? before it opens. That’s like having a super bowl ad well before the game starts when it’s peak periods walk out to your lot all way to the edge view. What’s going on because that’s when the most advertising is being done walk up through the lot. Then walk in then you’re listening in then you’re hearing what’s going on when you do this during peak volumes once a week even if you can’t once a

Thanx is a leading loyalty and guest engagement platform for restaurants. The company, founded by Zach Goldstein in 2011, helps businesses embrace digital purchasing, capture greater customer data, and take action on that information to personalize guest engagement.Thanx builds digital UX – mobile apps and web ordering experience – that help restaurants differentiate themselves. Thanx also offers dynamic self-service loyalty programs that help restaurants break free from cookie cutter loyalty programs. Before joining Thanx, Emily was a business intelligence consultant.Restaurants face many challenges when it comes to data, including not having resources to analyze and take action on data available to them. They also don’t have a good way to centralize the data and make it useful. Restaurants also struggle to capture enough data. Many loyalty programs fail to capture enough data because the programs are difficult to sign up for (often requiring an app) and they make customers jump through hoops to use the app or program. Thanx loyalty programs think outside the “Spend X, Get Y” box to offer unique loyalty programs that don’t rely on discounts. That includes offers of special food items or LTOs to loyalty members or all day happy hour for loyalty members.  QUOTES “There’s problems associated with getting data and then there’s the problem of doing something with the data (after you get it) that’s meaningful to the business.” (Emily) “Restaurants generally don’t have the resources in house to help them make sense of the data that they have.” (Emily) “Far and away the most common challenge (for restaurants) is that they’re not capturing enough data.” (Emily) “Most revenue is still flowing through in-store channels. This is where loyalty comes in.” (Emily)“Loyalty is the only proven mechanism for broadly capturing data and driving repeat purchasing from it. And yet, most loyalty programs don’t capture enough data.” (Emily) “There are a few restaurants doing loyalty really well. For the rest of restaurants, those loyalty programs are all very similar ‘Spend X, Get Y’ programs. Thanx allows you to build unique, differentiated, bespoke loyalty programs.” (Emily) “Not only do non-discount programs work better, they also cost less.” (Emily) “If you look at why restaurants aren’t personalizing (programs), most of the time it’s not because people think it’s not important or it’s not going to drive results. It’s because it’s really hard to do.” (Emily) TRANSCRIPT 00:00.00vigorbrandingHello Today’s guest is someone who knows a lot about data and loyalty programs which are two extremely important topics for restaurants and any brand for that matter. Our guest is Emily rugabier and she is the Vp of marketing for thanks with an x. So thanks for joining us Emily Rut Gaber I’m sorry I practiced it three times. So. 00:19.99Emily Yeah, happy to be here and you almost got it rugeber very close. Um. 00:27.57Emily So um, yeah, very happy to be here. Thank you so much for having me. Thanks is a guest engagement and retention platform for restaurants. Ah so that’s kind of a mouthful so I’ll tell you what that means? um. We build digital ux so we build mobile apps and web ordering experiences that help restaurants sort of differentiate themselves their first -party ordering from their third parties as I’m sure this audience knows all too. Well, the third -party platforms are higher margin. They don’t get a lot of data shared with them about the customers. And they’re actually being served ads potentially from competitors on that platform and so there’s a lot of reason to want to have your customers order directly which we help brands do we also offer really dynamic self-service loyalty programs that help restaurants sort of bake. Break free from these cookie cutter programs. You know that they launch and then they never change and many of them don’t drive measurable results and then lastly we’re a complete crm and marketing automation platform really sort of differentiated in terms of ease of use. So. There’s a lot of platforms like ours on the market. We really focus on trying to make marketing as easy as possible. We know that every single restaurant that I talk to when I talk to their marketing team. They say they’re bandwidth constrained and they sort of laugh when I talk about this because it’s so true. 01:51.36Emily And they don’t have time to waste on the mechanics of creating campaigns. They want to do personalized marketing but they want to do it in a way that’s really easy so that they can get it done and prioritize it. 01:59.89vigorbrandingvery cool. very cool so okay so let’s talk data last year nation’s restaurant news said customer data is the Holy Grail of restaurant success and you know we have a data analytics company. We know that mining data is super important. We can learn everything that there is to know and. 02:06.30Emily Yep. 02:18.30vigorbrandingAllows us to make great decisions. So the same article reveal that 70% of restaurant operators don’t feel like they’re properly optimizing customer data knowing important how important data is why aren’t more restaurants making more use of it. 02:32.49Emily Yeah, and just a little bit about me I sort of mentioned to this to you before we were talking before I joined. Thanks I actually worked as a business intelligence consultant I was advising some of the largest enterprises I worked with nestle I worked with sap I worked with Target Virgin America and um. This is true, not just of restaurants. This is true with many many businesses. It’s certainly not a unique problem that restaurants have but the way I like to think about this because it’s such a large sort of meaty topic is to break it into 2 categories of problems. There’s the problems associated with getting data in and then there’s the problems associated with. 03:09.23vigorbrandingHere. 03:09.42Emily Doing something with that data that is meaningful to the business so sort of breaking it down in that way and just thinking about getting data in there’s ah you know a few common challenges that we see I think restaurants generally they don’t have the resources in-house to help them make sense of the data that they have. A lot of times they don’t have the technology as well. In the case where they do have some data a lot of times the data really lives in Silos and so they don’t have a good way to centralize it and sort of make sense of it and make it usable for their internal teams and the last challenge which I think is by far and away the most common challenge. Is that they’re just not capturing enough data and this you sort of have to break it down into the online aspects and the in-store aspects I think restaurants have gotten better at the online piece just in light of the fact that they’re transacting more of their business online. Although there’s. Ah, huge amount of room for improvement with online and then there’s the in-store piece I think most revenue is still flowing through in-store channels and so um, this is where loyalty comes in right? There’s ah. Ah, variety of other avenues for capturing Data. You know you hear about wi-fi marketing you hear about reservations. For example, Loyalty is really the only proven mechanism for broadly capturing data and driving repeat purchasing from it. Um, and yet most loyalty programs. 04:23.99vigorbrandingMan. 04:40.37Emily Don’t capture a lot of data and and that’s because I mean there’s ah, there’s a couple different reasons but that’s in large part because they make guests really jump through hoops in order to engage with the program. It’s difficult to sign up. You know you have to download a mobile app How many mobile apps. Do you have on your phone. 04:40.45vigorbrandingAnd. 04:58.66Emily Ah, maybe you have 6 or 7 but there’s a lot more restaurants than that so they force you to download a mobile app you have to show a qr code at the register in order to earn progress and you’ve got a line of 10 people who are frustrated at you because you can’t get internet on your phone. 05:18.51Emily They make it really really hard. This is an area where Thanks is really differentiated. 05:22.20vigorbrandingWe talk about a little bit more about Thanks how how is yours different. How does it look feel how how is it easier to use. 05:31.97Emily Um, yes, that’s obviously a really big question the way I like to think about it is there’s sort of 4 different categories where we’re differentiated. So like I mentioned before loyalty tends to be pretty one size fits all so you know. As a consumer going to restaurants. You know you obviously have engaged with the programs. There’s a few really sort of um, there’s a few restaurants that are doing this really really? Well right? We all know the Starbucks and the chipotles and the dominoes who are doing this really well. But for the rest of. Restaurants by and large those loyalty programs are all pretty similar spend x get y um, and ah, what thanks does differently on this dimension is we allow you to build really unique differentiated bespoke Loyalty Programs so that means going outside the structure of like a spend x get y you can do really cool things that don’t rely on discounts. For example, you can offer. Ah you know a special food item. Maybe an lto some throwback from. 06:39.86vigorbrandingSure. 06:42.19Emily Ah, the past that worked really well you can offer that just to your loyalty members for a short period of time or you can do you know um, all day happy hour for loyalty members or for a segment of your guests. You know your very best loyalty members and so creating a program that’s bespoke. That’s really. On brand doesn’t rely heavily on discounts as sort of the first area I already mentioned the piece around marketing really being designed for ease of use. There’s a variety of ways that we implement this but think of lots of automation really easy a b testing the interface. Self is really dynamic easy to use it loads really quickly all of that good stuff and then the last piece that I would say is really important is this intersection between online ordering and loyalty and this is not an area that most loyalty providers get right? because it’s really hard. 07:19.58vigorbrandingGreat. 07:35.43vigorbrandingI hope. 07:37.27Emily Every single loyalty provider and every single ordering provider are going to have distinct integrations that enable distinct capabilities and so being able to build a best-in-class integration with a variety of online ordering providers doing it in a way that’s really seamless. That’s really hard to do. That’s something that think does really well give you an example of that we have automated campaigns that you can turn on basically with a a switch of a button after you’ve designed an email which automates the process of ah you know. Incentivizing somebody to come back to an abandoned cart. So you’re about to order lunch. You realize you’re late for your meeting. You put the salad in your basket. You’ve got everything ready to go but you realize you have to go and so you leave that cart abandoned the next day you get an email that says hey why don’t you come back. 08:15.93vigorbrandingAnd. 08:33.45Emily You know, pick up where you left off here’s a dollar off to do so that can be completely automated. No ah you know, additional effort after the initial setup through things and through our partnerships with best in class ordering providers. 08:36.48vigorbrandingThat’s great. 08:47.22vigorbrandingYeah, because I mean to your point like a lot of loyalty programs are punch cards and stuff I still do one for my dog food. You know you go to punch it and and after 9 bags I get a tenth bag free and you’re you’re creating more of ah more engagement and almost like a. Ah, vip thing right? You’re treating people special by by by doing business with you being loyal there’s there’s hidden menu things like you said offers things like that and that probably and creates ah additional engagement I imagine right? and probably gets repeat visits visits and everything else. 09:09.83Emily Um, ah. 09:16.42vigorbrandingHow how successful has that been is that do you have any kind of ah information around that. 09:18.88Emily Yes, So there’s sort of 2 ways to think about that one is the success of the revenue that it drives and the other is the cost savings and I think on both dimensions we’re seeing that they perform much better than the alternative sort of more rote Programs. So. Um, and of course like this is that’s a broad statement. That’s not always True. You have to test these things you have to see what works which is something that we offer as well. But um, generally speaking we see about 4 times better redemption rates on targeted Non-discount rewards. 09:55.14vigorbrandingOh. 09:57.28Emily So that’s the first piece. Um, it’s kind of like when you go get on an airplane right? or like when you’re actually before you even get on the airplane when you’re buying your ticket. Maybe you go to kayak and maybe you look for the best price and you know maybe you find a flight but there’s certain airlines you’re not going to go on. 10:14.60vigorbrandingOh. 10:16.70Emily And there may even be that 1 airline that does cost a bit more but you go for it anyway because you know there’s a chance you might get upgraded or you know there’s a chance that you’re going to get better treatment from you know the staff ah because you’ve got that you know status and that you’ve earned. And so you know access to wi-fi these things that aren’t necessarily um, you know, direct to your bottom line but do make you feel this element of having status exclusivity et cetera so that’s one dimension. The other dimension is the cost savings. We see that. 10:35.80vigorbrandingI. 10:53.62Emily Not only do the non-discount reward work better but they obviously also cost less now some of these things have operational costs I’m not saying that. That’s not the case. Ah but a common ah idea that I tell restaurants all the time is take an existing menu hack something you are already doing you know your regulars they come in and they say hey can I get this sauce with this salad I Know it’s off menu. 11:06.83vigorbrandingAnd. 11:13.60Emily And they’ll do it for you because it’s easy take that put it on your menu make it a special. Um, you know members only exclusive or top tier member only exclusive and um, use that as an incentive it costs you nothing. 11:27.33vigorbrandingI love it. Makes everyone feel like an insider makes them feel special and endears under the brand. So what do you think is like the number 1 mistake that you see restaurants making when it comes to designing designing these loyalty programs. 11:30.59Emily Yeah, exactly. 11:41.20Emily Yeah, it’s a hard question because there’s a couple of them. Um I think a lot of times the the first one that I’ll say is I think a lot of times brands spend a lot of time upfront when they’re launching their loyalty program trying to come up with the perfect. 11:44.72vigorbrandingUm. 11:57.27Emily Idea for how the loyalty program should be structured I’ve actually heard of brands hiring very expensive management consultants and paying them hundreds of thousands of dollars to help them come up with their initial program structure and there’s not necessarily anything wrong with that. It’s expensive. I would suggest you know unless you can really justify that and have vetted that thoroughly just get started try something obviously talk to your loyalty provider and they should be able to provide best practices and recommendations but try it get started and then iterate on it. Once you launch the program your customers will tell you what they like right? you got a reward marketplace with 15 rewards in it and you’re seeing that you know 3 of them are never touched. That’s probably a good opportunity to reevaluate whether those rewards should be on the menu. Maybe they should be on the menu but they need to be. On the menu at a lower cost and you can figure out based on the effective discount rate of each of your rewards. What makes the most sense and what’s most cost effective. So that’s the first one is I would say like don’t overengine engineer the upfront setup but just iterate on it over time. The reality is. 13:07.61vigorbranding7 13:11.33Emily That’s really difficult to do in most loyalty platforms and so you have to talk to an account manager you have to do a six-week development cycle you have to do kind of like a transition a full relunch of the program. Um, so there may be some technology barriers there. But if you can. Try to think about it as like an ongoing iteration as opposed to a point in time thing that never changes brands on thanks change their loyalty programs on average 9 times a year yeah exactly the the other one that I would say is we regularly see brands. 13:35.13vigorbrandingFantastic I Assume you help them navigate that. 13:47.22Emily Prioritizing cost saving measures in loyalty program management opting for cheaper technology solutions or you know minimal rewards offerings. They don’t want to make that upfront and investment. But I think an over emphasis on. 13:57.22vigorbrandingYeah. 14:03.16Emily Cost savings can result in lower program participation and missed revenue opportunities in the long run. So when you invest in you know, high quality technology partner and sort of innovative reward structures. You can really start to maximize ah Roi of the loyalty program and drive that sustained growth which is the whole point. 14:20.60vigorbrandingVery cool I mean we see I mean everything about data is personalized customer experiences and I know that’s what you guys are all about but yet we still see all these restaurants doing this one size fits all stuff and it just doesn’t work. Does it. 14:34.95Emily Um, yeah, it’s I think that one size fits all marketing the broad base top of mind marketing does have a purpose you’re trying to stay top of mind. Um. That being set it has to be complemented by a more personalized approach for sure. Um I Think if you if you look at why restaurants aren’t personalizing most of the time It’s not because people think it’s not important or it’s not going to drive results. 14:50.19vigorbrandingHave you. 15:07.92Emily It’s because it’s actually really hard if you’re going to run a personalized strategy. You’re probably creating 3 emails instead of 1 or 5 emails instead of 1 somebody has to design those emails somebody has to determine what the strategy should be somebody has to. 15:20.58vigorbrandingAh. 15:25.25Emily Determine What the incentives should be and what the messaging should be. That’s that’s real work that someone has to do and as I mentioned before a lot of times these restaurant teams are really really small and they don’t have a lot of Bandwidth so it has to be really easy and I think um, the other challenge is maybe you put in that effort. And you put in that energy and then you run the campaign and you get a result and you say was that good was that bad I don’t know was it better than I would have gotten if I had done nothing is there something that I could have done that would have been even more important and so you’re left with this sort of unresolved state. 15:51.14vigorbrandingYou. 16:03.86Emily And now you’re thinking was all that effort. Really worth it and you just don’t know and so I think this is where multivariate testing can come in so you can actually sort of see okay was free fries versus the free shake versus doing nothing at all actually worthwhile and you just let the results of the campaign. 16:18.31vigorbrandingDrive it? yep. 16:23.13Emily Define What you do and ideally in the scenario where it’s something that you can automate you automate the heck out of it So you’re not forcing your team to rebuild and rebuild and rebuild. 16:33.25vigorbrandingMakes total sense so when we’re talking like data’s role in shaping how we use different tools. There’s there’s social media. There’s we talked a lot about email for marketing tools is there 1 that you prefer more is one more effective pros and cons can you talk about that a little bit. 16:45.66Emily Um. 16:48.53Emily Yeah I mean the devil’s in the details here. Um I think both social media and email marketing can be effective tools for restaurants but the effectiveness really depends on a variety of factors such as who the audience is what the goal is what the content strategy is. Um, I think the way I like to think about this and break this down I was actually I was at a conference last year I was at the meg conference the marketing executive group conference and I was sitting at a table. Um, there were like these roundtables and I was sitting at a table. 17:18.42vigorbrandingUm. 17:24.70Emily Talking to a bunch of restaurant marketers just sort of listening in. It was a facilitated session by another team and they were talking about segmentation. They’re talking about the challenges that restaurant marketers face with segmentation what they should do and the reality was I think everyone went around and they had like a hand raise of. Who here is doing any sort of segmented marketing and I I want to say like beyond just like the very very basic stuff and I want to say maybe 3 out of 10 people raised their hand and as I was listening to some of the challenges it really boiled down to. 17:55.40vigorbrandingAh. 18:00.81Emily Just don’t know where to start like I think a lot of times restaurant marketers are thinking about segmentation in terms of like demographic segmentation or maybe they’re thinking like you’re you know, very basic like your top spenders versus not top spenders. What I think is been helpful and what I’ve heard in talking with folks is really helpful is sort of this ah like idea of a framework for how to think about how do you even approach this stuff to start and there’s a variety of ways to do this that can be done really well. But if you’re trying to figure out where to get started I like to advise thinking about it in terms of the lifecycle. 18:35.95Emily Your customers who have only made 1 purchase or maybe 2 purchases. They’re very different than your customers who’ve come in 6 times and who have been coming in regularly once a month versus the people who haven’t been in it all in the last one hundred and eighty days and so think about the customer lifecycle in terms of. You to be acquired customers your to be activated customers meaning they need to have at least made 3 purchases in a certain period of time your engaged customers which are the people that you want to engage and incrementally improve their behavior. They’re also the ones you want to retain over time and then there’s the churned. Customers and there’s really no sense in spending a lot of time on customers that genuinely are not coming back to your business because they have demonstrated no frequency in the last year for example so if you think about it in terms of you know to be acquired activated engaged and churned. You can think about okay, well you know. The way that you’re going to talk to somebody who has only made 1 purchase should be very very different than the way you’re going to talk to somebody who comes in all the time and so for the group let’s say that you want to engage or excuse me that you want to activate. Um, you know think about how do you get that next incremental purchase. 19:50.43vigorbrandingWho. 19:52.63Emily You know from 1 to 2 and how do you go from 2 to 3 and once you get over that hump of activated. We actually see on our platform. We did a study a couple years back if you can get somebody to make a third purchase. They are actually 10 times more likely to come back than somebody who has only made 1 purchase. 20:08.74vigorbrandingAnd. 20:10.95Emily And so if you can get them to sort of start to build that habit they can be so much more materially impactful on your business and so just thinking about it that way and breaking it down in a way that sort of it. Maybe it seems a little bit simplistic. Ah, but even that can be difficult to execute on you can think about you know. Just for 1 campaign getting somebody from 1 to second purchase sorry from first to second purchase maybe you got to do a drip series of 3 outreaches and so to me getting back to your original question I think social media can be excellent for acquiring. 20:46.52vigorbrandingAnd who. 20:47.48Emily New customers. You can build like lookalike campaigns based on your existing customers that are really high value. You can build that lookalike campaign and try to acquire more customers like them I think social media can be excellent at that once you get into the lifecycle. Thinking about well what’s their preference. Maybe they’ve signed up to receive sms you want to use sms with that person. Maybe there’s somebody who said no I don’t want to engage on Sms you can use email so it really just depends. But I tend to think of social media as being a little bit more about acquisition. 21:12.60vigorbrandingAnd. 21:19.41Emily Email marketing being a little bit more about people who have opted in and said yes I want to receive emails from you. 21:23.40vigorbrandingvery cool. very cool it was funny last week I was speaking to a bunch of folks and we talk about they asked me to speak on food trends and we’ve been doing this trends presentation for 15 years and you know I looked back and I always like to look back see these trends that we predicted things that we talked about. 21:39.26Emily Are. 21:41.63vigorbrandingAre they relevant how did they evolve and in the very beginning I mean like twelve thirteen years ago the phones and everything were so new that it was like well we can tell people where your restaurant is like it was a big deal like ooh people can find me now and you know and that’s obviously just so so primitive at this point. And now it’s like it slides all the way up to say like food talk and everything else. So everybody wants to see the restaurant. They want to see everything about it. The food being made all the different things. Everything’s at our fingertips I mean and you you talk about the segmentation which is really super smart going back like the metrics have changed right? It used to be just about getting likes or or impressions. 21:59.90Emily Yeah. 22:16.11vigorbrandingSo you’re talking about all this all these conversions and you know marking dollars are finite. How are you making those conversions easier or at least more affordable to achieve how how is thanks helping with that. 22:18.70Emily Are. 22:27.11Emily Ah, yeah I mean that’s a big question. There’s a lot of different ways. Um I would say what you’re really talking about is like how do you justify the ah roi of a solution like things and um Roi is a pretty complex. 22:44.47Emily Calculation because there are so many different mechanisms to drive revenue and there’s so many opportunities to save costs. Um I think the obvious one is around you know revenue from spend or frequency lift from Loyalty members. Um. 22:57.97vigorbrandingWho. 23:03.12Emily We do a really good job of getting customers to sign up for loyalty as I mentioned and so if you think about there’s a metric called participation rate or capture rate which is essentially the percentage of revenue attributable to a loyalty member and that rate. Tends to be in like the 5 to 10 percent range for most restaurants we drive 30% in six months and that is through a variety of levers. But think of we don’t require you to download an app to participate in loyalty. We do a proprietary card linked. Ah tokenization which allows us to track purchases through credit card swipes instead of through you know these jumping through hoops that I was referring to earlier the combination of those things allow us to drive enrollment in. 23:48.60vigorbrandingUm. 23:56.36Emily I guess the the other one is we optimize digital ordering for loyalty as well. So that everyone who places places an order online is enrolled into loyalty and those things allow us to see something like 10 to 15 times the enrollment of our competitors and. That combined with of course the frequency lift. You’re going to see with any good loyalty program that you know have a bigger audience or are sort of more pool of revenue that can be influenced because you have the better capture rates and then of course you’re going to see the frequency and spend lift on top of that. So that’s like the primary one that’s kind of the obvious one. Um. With a more modern ordering ah user experience. You’re going to see higher order conversion rates. We see order conversion rates in like the eighty to ninety five percent range which is insane. 24:42.70vigorbrandingAh. 24:47.52vigorbrandingUm, right. 24:48.30Emily You also know you you’re driving people online people spend more when they’re online and so there’s going to be a natural lift from just driving more people into ordering. We talked about the cost savings from moving folks over from third party delivery over to first-part delivery one I I can’t remember if we talked about this at. Or not but just the cost savings from the removal of generic and unnecessary discounting. We see brands who are in like the 5% even like the 8 % discount range which is whoops which is quite a bit. A lot of our customers are in like the 1 to 2% effective Discount range. So that’s a huge area where you can see improved roi cost savings on campaigns obviously with a b testing things like that and then I think one that’s a little bit tougher to measure but is absolutely material is just the amount of time you’re saving for people who are not having to do as manual of. 25:23.63vigorbrandingAnd. 25:41.10Emily Ah, lift from a you know marketing perspective. 25:44.42vigorbrandingYeah, well I loved reading about your company I was impressed by the whole idea of ah trying to avoid the discounts for the loyalty all the time I mean let’s face it I mean giving people a discount is just that it’s cutting into their it’s cutting into their overhead their profit and everything else. So it’s great that you can just kind of keep them back and then the customer value. 25:51.48Emily Um, ah. 25:57.39Emily It’s. 26:02.22Emily O. 26:02.33vigorbrandingLifetime customer value the loyalty bringing them back over and over again 4 times. Ah, really obviously increases that we were talking to a restaurant last week at really nice restaurant. Really good revenues. Um, but they really weren’t getting people to do repeat visits. It was they were too infrequent. Ah. Actually maybe we should recommend your program I mean it’s ah it’s definitely. Ah, it’s definitely something they need because there’s nothing wrong with the restaurant. You know I mean it wasn’t the prices weren’t too high. The the quality of food was fantastic. Um, they just were not getting lots of repeat I think there’s a lot of competition in that marketplace. 26:20.11Emily Ah, oh please. 26:25.92Emily Her. Yeah. 26:35.45vigorbrandingAnd maybe people are just going around but a loyalty program I think would help them ensure that second that third and then on on and on and on visits. So I think that’s great. 26:38.58Emily Who. 26:44.34Emily Yeah I was actually just talking to Rob Ertman from mobatas he’s the Ceo of mobeters I was talking to him a couple of days ago and I was asking him for a case study about his. Ah, loyalty program and I couldn’t believe that words that were coming out of his mouth because it was exactly what me as a marketer wants to hear in terms of like trying to write a case study. He’s seen 7 straight months of positive same store sales comps and that is in light of the fact that they’re growing super rapidly. So there’s some cannibalization of existing sales that’s happening he had. 27:12.21vigorbrandingIn here. 27:16.70Emily 15 x increase in enrollment in 1 year versus his previous program which he had had for 5 years and they had seen almost immediately upon transitioning to thanks and actually their online ordering provider olo a 30% increase in digital sales and this was literally like he was just telling me this stuff. And I was of course like furiously writing it down as quickly as I possibly could that like you can’t argue with those results. He attributes a lot of that success to the partnership with thanks which of course we really appreciate but you know in reality it can be hard sometimes to measure. Um. 27:40.68vigorbrandingAh, yeah, it’s great. 27:52.61Emily You know how do you know? if you’re increasing customer lifetime value. How do you know? if you’re increasing frequency right? because it’s it’s heavily biased by how many new stores you’re opening and how many new purchasers are in there and so just being able to sort of relate it back to the real metrics that matter those same store sales comps et cetera that that was really powerful to me and you know. 27:58.41vigorbrandingWhoop right. 28:11.76Emily We of course would love referral over to whoever you were speaking with, but we do genuinely believe in the power of doing loyalty correctly and you know that that’s what gets me excited Obviously as I talk about this. 28:20.65vigorbrandingAbsolutely yeah, it’s great. Yeah, you’re passionate about it’s awesome I mean look let’s face it as marketers we get blamed for everything goes wrong. So when they when things finally go right? We’re allowed to take some credit I mean we deserve some credit there. So I’d get that guy on video and use that as a case study and have it in his words I’d be pushing that out to everybody. So I’m sure good. Yeah yeah I mean nothing sounds better than coming out of the you know the person’s mouth so that’s that’s awesome. 28:39.74Emily Ah, you can find it on our website now but I didn’t do a video I I probably should have ah maybe that’s the next thing. 28:48.57Emily Absolutely absolutely. 28:50.87vigorbrandingSo when we talk about these these these potential these well not potential, but the restaurant does it work for a single location restaurant white tablecloth is it. 10 locations is it a hundred I mean how scalable like talk about your sweet spot. 29:05.63Emily Yep, excuse me. Um our service is scalable and it can benefit multi-unit restaurants from I would say like 5 location establishments up to the biggest of the big chains. Yeah. 29:14.91vigorbrandingGot you very cool, very cool. Um, so like what’s next for. Thanks I Mean do you have anything new. You know it’s deep. It’s it’s it’s a tech so you guys are always working and

Duck Donuts is an American doughnut shop chain based in Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania. Duck Donuts was founded in 2006 in Duck, North Carolina, by Russ DiGilio and Robin Griffith, and has since expanded to over 100 locations in the United States. Duck Donuts is known for its made-to-order donuts in a variety of unique flavors. It recently opened a location in Thailand. Managing growth is something that Duck Donuts (and many franchises) pays careful attention to. The training program for franchisees includes an emphasis on consistent branding and quality. Duck Donuts franchisees typically own just a few locations and often work on a daily basis in the locations they own. The custom, made-to-order model is what differentiates Duck Donuts from its competitors. Duck Donuts is testing kiosks in stores and grab-and-go opportunities for customers who might not want to wait for donuts.  QUOTES “(Managing growth) is challenging. We try to set franchisees up for success in the beginning from a training standpoint and teaching them how we do things.” (Betsy) “We have smaller franchisees. A lot of them have two or three locations and come from different backgrounds.” (Betsy)“What really makes a franchisee successful is someone who has a small business mentality. They’re accountable for their success or failure and we’ll give them all the tools and resources they need to succeed.” (Betsy) “It’s a lot of work and it’s constant. Franchisees have to be in the store and know what’s going on. Having that ability to work ON the business and not just IN the business is important.” (Betsy)“We do try to make (the ordering process) easier because it can be overwhelming for some people. The ability is still there if they want to customize their donut, but if they don’t want to think about it and they want 12 suggestions, here you go, here’s a couple to pick from.” (Betsy) “We’re in growth mode. We opened 32 shops last year and we’ll open 45 this year.” (Betsty) “Donuts are happiness and the world needs more happiness.” (Michael)  TRANSCRIPT 00:00.00vigorbrandingGreat hello I’m joined today by someone I’ve always wanted to have on this show. Betsy ham is our guest. She’s the Ceo of duck donuts and it’s one of the fastest growing donut franchises in the nation betsy. Thanks for joining us. 00:12.88Betsy HammThank you so much for having me. 00:17.00vigorbrandingSo I want to hear all about your story but the duck story. It’s it’s amazing to me and and kind of maybe fortuitous. The the idea I guess actually grew up in my neighborhood. My neighbor Russ was the is the founder and ah. 00:30.67Betsy HammYep. 00:31.37vigorbrandingIf you would tell us the story. You know how it comes from a little neighborhood and in in Pennsylvania and turns into this international and international business. What was the idea behind it how to come come about. 00:38.78Betsy HammSure so it’s crazy. It really didn’t stem out of your neighborhood right? Um, so as you mentioned Russ who’s the founder of rused gilio um had a beach house in the outer banks and these to go down there and you know one night they were sitting around. He emits drinking some wine and raminiscing about these warm donuts that they used to get and the boardwalk is kids growing up. And at the time in 2007 outer banks was um, pretty much a little sleepy town. There wasn’t really even any donut shops that were there. Um, so what started out as a whim when they the next day decided like hey this really has some legs. Let’s create a donut concept. Um, and open it here in the outer banks and Russ is a serial entrepreneur but did not have any food and beverage experience so reached out to one of his friends who helped put together the concept of duck donuts. So the first 2 shops opened in duck and Kitty Hawk ah North Carolina hence the name duck. Um, and it took a few years to catch on. But after about the third season because of course it’s very seasonal location and in the outer banks. It really took off and the people who came there every year just continued to create this cult like following for the brand. And people were asking him to you know, open up in my hometown send me donuts in the mail like I want these donuts more than once a year when I go on vacation. So Russ realized that there was this really huge opportunity that he couldn’t miss and decided to start a franchising company. So. 02:01.74Betsy HammUm, they sold their first franchise in 2013 in Williamsburg Virginia um and now fast forward to 20024 where we have about 150 shops in the United States in 22 or 24 states actually and then we’re also in 6 countries outside the us which has been crazy. So. Um I had the opportunity. Actually we opened in Thailand a few months ago and Russ came along with me for the opening and I said did you ever imagine you would be in Thailand listening to people speak thai talking about Doc Donance being so excited for this concept that just started as something fun. Um, for you to do it and you know he’s so humble about it and he’s just like absolutely not He’s like I had no idea something that started as like a fun side project in the ader banks would literally be um, you know sprinkling happiness across the globe and it’s pretty crazy. 02:52.77vigorbrandingIt’s awesome I mean and you obviously stay close to the branding everything you guys do which I personally truly respect and appreciate I think that’s fantastic. Talk about your journey your your duck donut journey. What did you start out and how did you come about this this ah duck opportunity. 03:07.79Betsy HammSure so I spent the first really half I guess of my career at her. She entertainment resorts in marketing so various marketing roles for the sweetest place on earth which of course was a really amazing job. But it’s really always kept um my ear out there for if there was any opportunities that came up that made sense. And a friend of mine had said duck donuts is opening their corporate headquarters here in the Harrisburg area where where I live in Pennsylvania they want someone to come in and build their marketing team and to be honest I had never even heard of duck donuts I had never been to the outer banks. Um, but I had texted a few of my girlfriends who did go every year I said hey the duck donuts. 03:34.80vigorbrandingHe soon. 03:42.87Betsy HammPlace in the outer banks like they’re looking for a marketing person and they both were so emphatic about the fact that I had to take this interview like it’s the best thing ever that would be the most amazing dream job and I’m like wow these ladies are so excited about a Doda concept. Um, so with that excitement I definitely had to take the interview and and came in and met with ah Russ who was the Ceo at the time and of course the founder and the Ceo and you know Russ painted this picture of here’s this brand that people who know it love it and we want to make it at the time we were sick into the us um a national a national brand. Um, so having that opportunity as a marketing person to come in and you know there’s this love and loyalty for this brand but we have to make it more sophisticated. Um, of course it was very mom and pop when it started out. Um so having the opportunity to come in and start from scratch of. You know, logos and and brand voice and style and and I remember talking to the marketing person who was here at the time like why are we not posting pictures on social of donuts like we keep using these illustrated donuts and there’s a couple ducks going on. Um and she said well we don’t have any pictures of donuts I was like oh. 04:34.70vigorbrandingUm, no. 04:45.90vigorbrandingSo right? yeah. 04:49.27Betsy HammSo you know had this opportunity to kind of start at the base of the foundation and really help take this brand and make it more sophisticated and elevated as we’ve continued to grow. So um, started with a company seven years ago in a marketing capacity and probably about a year and a half after I was here. Ah Russ said you know I think you should take on more. Um, and getting ended up getting promoted to co o which you know they don’t usually let marketing people in charge of operations but um manage to yeah hey worked da um, so did the c o roll for a few years and then um is almost three years ago which is crazy. 05:15.61vigorbrandingFor good reason by the way for very good reason. Ah. 05:26.50Betsy HammAh, you know Russ was always very clear that at some point he’s going to take this company as far as he could when need to bring in um, some additional expertise additional cash. Um, so he sold the company to a private equity group in April of 2021 um and at that time is then you know when I when I was promoted to Ceo so it’s been. It’s been a wild journey and something I would have never. 05:40.91vigorbrandingUm, it’s awesome. It. 05:46.70Betsy HammAnticipated you know 8 ten years ago when I had never had even heard of the brand let alone to be to be a Ceo. 05:52.64vigorbrandingIt’s it’s amazing and and congratulations. It’s awesome I mean I guess I can I can I can understand certainly don’t have a global business but I started out as ah, just a marketing guy. A creative guy started my own business and now I’m Ceo and it’s sort of like. 05:59.95Betsy HammSo. 06:07.28vigorbrandingIt’s amazing what you did then and who you were then and what you do now I mean talk a little bit about that I mean that’s got to be different. You got to and not that you don’t get to do it now. But you’re this marketing person. You brought the fun you sprinkled for fun into everyone’s life that kind of thing and your personality exudes that. And I as we Ceo. What’s what’s that what’s that like. 06:24.77Betsy HammYeah, yeah, you know it’s um, it’s making sure you’re stay focused on the right stuff and and letting the experts and on the team do their job and you know it’s It’s funny because and you mentioned this like with your curse. Sometimes you do things that you don’t even realize do have an impact on where you end up. Um you you probably didn’t think that you were going to open your own. 06:42.54vigorbrandingNow. 06:43.82Betsy HammAgency and be the Ceo and that was certainly never on my you know 1020 year plan um so I think sometimes as you go through and have these experiences sometimes it starts to become a little bit more clear that this may work. Um and I remember when rust talked about selling the company I was like oh they’re going to bring somebody in but but during that time it was covered and. 06:58.28vigorbrandingIn here. 07:03.12Betsy HammYou know he had kind of taken a step back and was like hey I’m going to let you run this I’m here to support you I’m I’m here for assistance. Um, and that’s those like wait a minute I I kind of like this but and I kind of like the direction we’re going so you know, let’s continue to to head down that path. Um, but it is different because you know you have to let the experts and the and the team around you. And just make sure I’m providing tools resources make sure I have the right people in the right seats. So. It’s very different in the day to day and you know trying to make sure I don’t just gravitate towards you know one department or anything like that that I have that well-rounded understanding of what ops is doing and obviously the financials is. 07:31.55vigorbrandingYou. 07:39.33Betsy HammHuge piece of the success of the company. So um, yeah, you definitely have to be a lot more well rounded. But I think having the right people around. You makes that a lot easier to do. 07:48.44vigorbrandingNo doubt no doubt did the whole financial side of things did that come easy to you or is that like something you had to because we all do we gra gravitate towards what we love to do right? and I think that’s ah you have a very grid lesson in there that you got to be love all your kids the same. You got you got to deal with all the things with the same amount of passion. 08:01.74Betsy HammUm, yes. 08:06.23vigorbrandingAnd vigor as you would the things you love to do so did that come come easy to you I mean was that something was pretty natural or. 08:10.95Betsy HammUm, you know it wasn’t too bad I think even when I was at Hershey I think very early in my crew I had the opportunity to be exposed to a lot of different departments I mean we worked very closely with operations and we needed to understand the operations mindset. 08:21.25vigorbrandingUm. 08:23.23Betsy HammUm, and I actually went back to grad school I think it was out of um undergrad probably like 2 years to get my Mba and part of that was the financial piece of it and to give the marketing person credibility that look I understand a p and l I understand numbers I might not be able to sit there and be an accountant or a financial analyst. But. 08:29.47vigorbrandingGood. 08:40.70Betsy HammYou know, give me the data and I can I can make decisions. So um, luckily I had a a bit of a knack for that and and again just as that kind of was something I needed to focus on and I admit when you don’t understand something I think is huge I I think we all would not always show our weaknesses so people pretend like they maybe understand something. So. 08:56.15vigorbrandingUm. 08:58.73vigorbrandingUm, and yet. 08:58.87Betsy HammYou know, not being afraid to ask those questions or say time out I need to understand why this happens or what does this mean or why do we care about Ebada or whatever it is. Um I think it’s really important to ask those questions editing point in your career. 09:06.60vigorbrandingI Think that honesty yeah that honesty and clarity and and and and transparency is huge I I Jokingly well I It wasn’t even joking when I started my company. It was funny I got quoted in the into some of the trades and and. My friends framed it and sent it to me because they they they thought it was a joke and I said my business model is pretty Simple. My goal is to be the dumbest person in the building and you know I want to hire everybody in the company smarter better brighter than I am whatever it is that they have to do and it’s always worked. It’s ah sort of a secret weapon and. 09:28.28Betsy HammUm, ah. 09:38.35Betsy HammUm I Love that? yeah. 09:39.37vigorbrandingYeah, just you know in in ask questions and and and and hopefully you know you’ll you’ll you’ll get the right answers and and and grow from it. So um, so a hundred locations 22 states Saudi Arabia I mean how how do you manage that you go from. Again, the marketing side of things to now. What’s the secret. How do you manage that growth. 09:56.41Betsy HammIt is challenging and I I think whenever. Well even when you have 1 location of a brand. It’s it’s hard right? But then when you multiply that times 100 and you have different owners running each of these local businesses. It’s certainly challenging so we try to set. Franchisee up for success in the beginning from a training standpoint and here’s how we do things and this is what duck donuts looks like and sounds like and this is how um, we’re going to operate and you know the 1 thing that I keep really hammering home to the franchisees is we want duck donuts to be known for a superior product with an exceptional customer experience and it sounds basic. But. If. We can be consistently a superior product and provide an exceptional customer experience that’s going to make everyone’s lives better and easier people are going to come back more often. Frequency will be there. Um, so we try to provide all the tools and for order that to happen in order for that to happen. Um, but it’s tough. 10:47.65vigorbrandingUm, you had. 10:49.21Betsy HammYou know because it’s it’s human and and people are going to kind of have their take so you know sometimes on social media if we get tagged and stuff or there’s user-generated Content. You sort of cringe. Maybe when you see the donuts that are going out the door that aren’t consistent or there are you know some local marketing messages that aren’t on Brand. Um, so it’s trying to really make sure we educate upfront what the expectation is and then just hold people and franchisees accountable as we move forward? Um, but for giving those tools and resources it should help Um, but it is It is tough when everybody kind of has a little bit of their own opportunity to to make a spin on the Brand. So. Do have to remind franchisees at times so that it’s it is ducked and it’s that’s that’s name on the door. 11:29.68vigorbrandingYeah I’m sure because I know from personal experience. We’ve dealt. We’ve dealt with a lot of ah ah franchisee groups and you know you have smart people that own these businesses. Um, they have their livelihood tied into it. They have an awful lot of passion for it and. 11:35.21Betsy HammSo but is this. 11:42.37Betsy HammUm, absolutely. 11:44.37vigorbrandingBut yet they have to adhere to the controls because you know the consistency you bring is key and that’s that’s the livelihood that for everybody ultimately and I think sometimes that’s tough to understand is there a secret secret is there a special type of franchise z that you look for because I know like I’ll say again in my experience. I know some folks that are like master franchisees. These guys might own 5 different brands. Ah they might have 30 different stores in one brand and they have these like like corporations I mean they have to have their own hr their finance I mean they’re you know they’re they’re very large businesses but they’re they’re dealing with multiple due. Is there a certain type of ah. 12:13.75Betsy HammUm, oh yeah, yeah. 12:21.44vigorbrandingThe franchisee that’s perfect for duck downs. 12:22.10Betsy HammSo currently, what our franchisee system looks like is we have the smaller franchisee so a lot of them will have you know 2 3 locations. They’ve come from a different background whether they used to be in education or in marketing or in finance and they wanted to be a small business owner. So. But really makes a franchisee successful or somebody who has that small business owner mentality. They’re accountable, um, for their success or their failure and and we’ll give them all the tools and resources that they need in order to succeed. Um, but they really have to have that drive and motivation and and and ability to be able to move the brand forward on that local level. Um, and you know I think the 1 thing because we have that smaller business model. But if it’s you know the average franchisee has 2 locations. Um, they have to be in the store right? like this isn’t like ah set it and forget it and you know I’ll just build it and they will come. It’s you know so easy I mean that’s. 13:06.78vigorbrandingAnd he. 13:14.67Betsy HammUm, it’s a lot of work and it’s constant. So our franchisees have to be able to be in the store and and know what’s going on but having that ability to work on the business and not just in the business is really important and it’s hard to you know, a lot of times you’re going to get um, dragged into the weeds of hey the fire is networking or someone didn’t showt for their shift. Um, so it’s the ability to be a little problem solve on the fly. Um, and oh by the way manage a team because now you have probably on average 17 year olds um, working in your shop and now you have thirty seventeen year olds that you have to you know, keep engage and have them understand this brand and the concept and and deliver that amazing experience. So it’s a. 13:47.87vigorbrandingUm. 13:53.75Betsy HammIt’s an incredibly tough job and to your point you know Franchisees Invest a ton of money some you know college savings or life savings or whatever it is um to have that small business owner opportunity so we want to do whatever we can to to help support them and and make that dream a reality. 14:08.86vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. Do you have like is there a thing like hey we don’t allow anybody have more than five is there any kind of a corporate rule or just kind of play it out like as it goes. 14:15.78Betsy HammNo yeah, um, we do have a few that have 5 ah is the most. But um, no, not really, we actually just sold a 12 shop deal in um, Chicago last and enroll in 2023 um, but to your point he is a sophisticated franchise owner that owns another brand has the infrastructure has the team. Um, so I think as we grow and our brand becomes more sophisticated. We’ll end up with more of those I mean I don’t know if we’ll ever end up with the franchisees who have. 14:30.16vigorbrandingUm, even yep. 14:38.24vigorbrandingGot you. Here. 14:43.52Betsy Hamm50 or 100 brands like some of them. But you know 10 20 locations. Um, there’s certainly the opportunity for that to be to be built out as they go. 14:52.35vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. So I love the custom made you know to order donut model I think it’s great. Your product’s phenomenal I get to try it. Obviously it’s local to me. It’s at ah at the beaches I go to I mean it’s everywhere I go which is awesome. 15:03.40Betsy HammAre. 15:03.73vigorbrandingSo what separates stuck donuts from the competitors like the crispy creams or the dunk the Dunkin donuts that’s the names we hear a lot what what makes you so different and and then the other thing too is what what I feel is really kind of cool is like look they’re not. They’re not inexpensive as far as donuts go oh it’s not a lot of but if know theres things wild wild animals. no no worries 15:19.85Betsy HammUm, I’m sorry of course somebody rings my door hold on one second, let’s go go? yeah. 15:22.32vigorbrandingAh, good. Ah, no worries. 15:28.71vigorbrandingWe just done it this right? Oh it’s no problem. We we just will just edit that chunk. It’s all good. It’s all good. Yeah, we’re great. We’re great now, Please So yeah, so yeah. 15:33.86Betsy HammIt never fails when I’m on something like that that somebody rings the doorbell. Okay I figured you could just edit that sorry I think they stopped okay the the negative of being at home. Not the office. 15:47.56vigorbrandingAh, um, should I start that question again and okay so I what I was saying let me say I love the custom made-to-order donut model. That’s a big part of what separates duck donuts from competitors like we hear of crispy cream and Dunkin donuts to me. It’s always amazing though because ah, they’re Customade. It is a unique, ah different kind of concept. And then there’s a cost associated with it which and rightfully so they’re they’re basically more expensive and still not a lot of money but you know it’s one of those things. How did that all come to be like what is talk about the the competitors and how what separates you and the whole custom made to order concept. 16:18.63Betsy HammSure so that’s certainly been our differentiator is that is the custom made to order concept and your donuts are always fresh, right? So when you walk into a duck donuts. You don’t see any donuts which is very unusual for any of our competitors and sometimes confusing when we open in new markets or new countries. Ah, that you have to go in. You have to decide what you want and will make it fresh and you get to watch the experience if you choose um so that certainly has been our differentiator is is the warm, the customization. Always fresh. So it’s really continuing to embrace that um, because that is our usp. Ah, but then also make sure that we have the ability to deliver on customers’ expectations if they don’t want to wait so that’s been something that we’ve really been focused on in the last year or 2 of course we don’t have drive-frus we’ve talked about it and right now we just think we’re going to really lean into um the customization and the warm piece which would be really hard to do. And a drive-th through model. Um, but what do we do from a convenience factor that if I don’t want to wait for my donut that I can get it faster. So of course there’s things like online ordering. We now have kiosks and shops as well and we’re testing some other more like grab and go opportunities here in the coming months so we want to. Stay true to what’s made us so successful but also be able to reach those customer um expectations from a convenience factor which we know all has become very important over the last several years for sure. 17:29.31vigorbrandingUm, okay. 17:36.95vigorbrandingAbsolutely so like I love the process of building my own personal donut and I think it’s a lot of fun. So let’s have some fun I’m gonna throw some. You guys have so many great like flavors and and combinations I’m gonna throw some different toppings out and I want you to tell me what you feel is the coding things and you you go from marketer to now you’re gonna be the donut Chef the donut creator. Okay. 17:53.22Betsy HammUm, okay yes, um, chocolate vanilla. Okay, so we need to add to this like chocolate. 17:56.80vigorbrandingSo Chopped peanuts all right oreo cookie pieces Graham Cracker crumbs there you go perfect. Okay, chopped bacon very good I would put peanut butter in here too. But that’s just me it shredded coconut. Very good. 18:10.12Betsy HammAnd marshmallow to make it like a some more. Um, maple Oh yeah, yeah, um, lemon. 18:25.48vigorbrandingI See you guys do these things with the the great names and the great brands and the great taste. What’s the the peanut butter. It’s um I Forget the name of the one with the bacon. Yes, yes, what’s there’s one that what’s the one has the bacon on it all the time bacon in the sun. Yeah, yeah, yeah, is that right? and that’s that’s. 18:30.87Betsy HammOf the peanut butter and paradise oh bacon in the sun. Our number 1 selling donut is the bacon donut I far like not even close to the net number 2 18:44.23vigorbrandingWow, That’s incredible. That’s incredible and so like I mean these the people like you said there’s no donuts in windows people walk in are they are they at all nervous about like oh I’ve got I’ve got to talk to people and and make this thing I mean this is new to me is it ah is there a little bit of ah apprehension there or you hear. 19:01.10Betsy HammAbsolutely yeah, oh there is and it’s funny because it’s something that we have been focused on the last um several years and even back to when I started never going to aduct on it and somebody handed me an ordering pat at the time and I was like I don’t even know what this is this is too much to think about. 19:01.93vigorbrandingAh, is there. Okay, good. 19:15.60Betsy HammUm, so a few years ago we introduced assortment guide. So ah at the counter. There’s some countermats that you can pick donuts that are already created. So of course we have seasonal donuts we have lto flavors like right now we have a jelly donut where the jelly’s just like in the middle of the donut. Um, so we do try to make it easier because it is overwhelming and it can be. A lot to think I don’t know what I want or what? what do I put with what especially if you’re building a half dozen or a dozen so we do make a lot of suggestions for dozens and half dozens and even donuts and and to be honest, that’s majority of what people order whether it’s online or or in shop as they’re picking what’s already created. So. Ah, that’s actually a focus of ours right now from what that customer experience is in shop. You know what do those assortment guides look like what’s on the menu boards. Um, how do we help the speed of service and just take out. Um the decisionmaking process for the for the customers if they don’t want to do it. Of course the ability is still there. Um, if they want to customize their donut. But. 20:08.49vigorbrandingUm. 20:12.17Betsy HammThey don’t want to think about it and they want 12 suggestions here. You go here’s a couple to pick from um just to make it a lot easier and simplify the process. 20:18.66vigorbrandingYeah mean that’s smart too because it be well let’s face it people you said they don’t know ah know there’s a reason vanilla is the number 1 selling ice cream right? So I mean you just you know people don’t know unless you show them all the options and and you guys do a great job of that you have so many unique kind of combinations that it’s almost like I gotta try that is that is that good. 20:25.97Betsy HammUm, right? ah. 20:35.49vigorbrandingYou know and and to your point then you know a bacon donut being the number one flavor I don’t think anyone would assume that ever ah but you guys set that up and and make it happen. Yeah. 20:40.11Betsy HammRight? right? and consistently for years I mean I think since I’ve started and even just says our 23 numbers came in. It’s still number one which just amazes me. 20:51.58vigorbrandingThat’s funny now you guys do a lot of philanthropic stuff Charity overlays things like that. Do we talk a little bit about that. 20:55.28Betsy HammSure, um, so we started partnering with Makea wish last year and thatt national campaign will be coming up in April or may timef frameme this year where each one of our locations throughout the us raises money for their local chapter of Makea-w wish so. Um there’s a makea wish donut with blue and white sprinkles. Of course you have the opportunity just to donate at the point of sale or online. Um, when you’re checking out. Um, so that’s been a really great new partnership. Of course they’re about families and kids which we are as well. Um, so in addition to having that national partnership. We have a program. The umbrella called quack gives back which is. 21:23.98vigorbrandingToss me. 21:30.23Betsy HammSome great little um tag to tie into the brand. Um, but we really challenge our franchisees to be involved in their local community. So but we have everybody involved in the makea wish campaign they have the ability to partner with whatever organizations important to them in their local community. So. Um, and those can look differently from whether you know it’s a boys Club Girls Club Pta different fundraisers. Um but partnering with their local community Nonprofits. We think is very important for us to be able to give back on that national as well as local level. 22:02.50vigorbrandingThat’s fantastic. You know I have to I throw this out because I mean you guys have such a cool brand and you know you look at different things and in in the world to sort of combine like pop culture things. It seems like there might be an opportunity for you guys. Yeah, you have the little little rubber duck right? Really cool. Well brandnded. 22:16.10Betsy HammUm. 22:16.82vigorbrandingYou got the speech vibe going right? So I’ve seen all these guys with jeeps I’m not a Jeep guy I’m actually a I’m a land cruiser guy which is similar but not a Jeep guy. So but I’m seeing all these guys with with rubber ducks ducking each other whatever want to call it with their jeeps so you got jeeps you got the beach you got ducks you got duck donuts you guys got to get involved in that somehow somehow we got be giving away donuts. There’s something there. 22:25.96Betsy HammYes. 22:32.84Betsy HammI know I know yes well and you know what’s funny is we have um just on a local level. A lot of deep meetups will happen in duck donuts parking. Lots. 22:35.22vigorbrandingThere’s something there. 22:42.00Betsy HammAh, so they’ll go in. They’ll buy some ducks. They’ll grab some donuts and they do these meet ups and parking lots but I agree like on a big national partnership level that would be amazing gas. Yes oh I like that. 22:45.14vigorbrandingIt’s perfect. Yeah, yeah,, let’s let’s give away a Jeep for the Beach. You know I think you got something there I think that’s ah you know I think that works So that’s awesome. Um, is there anything else you want to talk about as far as the the franchise. What makes a great franchisee. Which the future hold for duck donuts anything else. You want to throw in before I got a couple other questions but I wanted to open it up to you. 23:03.27Betsy HammYeah I mean we’re just we’re in yeah, we’re in growth mode. So we open 32 shops last year we’ll open 45 this year and want to continue to build that so you know just focused on buildinging the brand across the us as well as globally. Um, and getting our existing shops to be more successful. So while the growth of opening shops is very important. We want our existing franchisees to be more profitable more successful. We want them to open additional shops. Um, so of course this has been a 2023 was a challenging year from. Um, a transaction standpoint for a lot of people within the food and beverage industry. Ah people obviously are are watching their spend a little bit and as much as we would love to think people eat donuts every day. Um, so we just have to become more innovative and and more driving of how we’re going to get people back in the door. Um, more frequently. So that’s been. That’s really what we’re focused on right now. 23:52.69vigorbrandingVery cool. It’s amazing to me I go from my my neighborhood in Central Pennsylvania to your Cairo Qatar and Thailand I mean it’s just it’s ah it’s mind boggling you know. 23:58.48Betsy HammUm, yeah, right, it is mind boggling I agree. 24:03.59vigorbrandingSo you know one one other thing when this time of year I mean let’s face. Everyone’s hard starts thinking about working out and eating healthy and all that and donuts don’t necessarily slide right into that that routine. Do you see that as a problem is that is this ever become an issue seasonally. 24:16.94Betsy HammYou know what? January and again I think sometimes just january is that people are recovering from the holidays and spending money and eating and drinking a lot during that time. So January is certainly always a slow time of year for us. Um, but after that you know it’s. 24:22.67vigorbrandingUm. 24:30.53Betsy HammAll about moderation right? of course and in the court we sell coffee and we sell ice cream So you know there’s lots of reasons to to come into duck. Um, that maybe is a little less calories. But you know certainly moderation is certainly good for everyone. Absolutely. 24:32.10vigorbrandingUm, yep. 24:39.74vigorbrandingI mean donuts are happiness and the world needs more happiness. So you know it’s just just goes hand in glove with donuts. So all right? So if you had ah when if you went into your local duck donuts. It can only order one donut. What are you ordering. 24:54.14Betsy HammI’m actually ordering which I built earlier the samoures donut if it’s not fall because our fall donut is an Apple donut

Broaster Company is an American foodservice equipment manufacturer headquartered in Beloit, Wisconsin. The company is the leader in providing high quality pressure fryers and branded food service programs for over 65 years. “Broasting” is a unique cooking method developed in 1954 when Broaster’s inventor and founder L.A.M. Phalen combined the principles of a pressure cooker and a deep fryer into one commercial cooking appliance. The results – in quality, flavor and cooking speed – were revolutionary.Only restaurants and food service providers that are licensed to use genuine Broaster Company equipment can offer “broasted chicken” on menus. Protecting that trademark and licensing is important to the Broaster Chicken team. In many restaurants, broasted chicken is a champion menu item and sold to restaurants as a featured menu item. Broaster Company has been a global business for as long as the company has been incorporated. The company has a distributor in the Middle East for the past 60 years.  QUOTES “If you were to take the Dakotas over to Ohio, go down probably to Kentucky – that is where the Broaster market is. As people move outside the midwest, that’s how the name spreads.” (Jay) “If you want to say that you’re serving broaster chicken, it starts with the marinades and coatings, it uses the frier and you have to use the process that we dictate to call it genuine broaster chicken.” (Jay) “We have ‘broaster,’ ‘broasted,’ ‘genuine broaster chicken’ and anything around the name broast, broaster, et cetera has been trademarked by the Broaster Company.” (Jay)“We get more calls from consumers (about trademark violations) than we do from restaurants or distributors. Our consumers are our biggest police for monitoring our brand.” (Jay)“I’ve heard of people pressure frying Twinkies, hot dogs, et cetera. You can almost do anything. […] Around the holiday season, one of the favorites is turkey.” (Jay)  TRANSCRIPT 00:01.14vigorbrandingFantastic hello hey today I am joined by someone I’ve known for ah personally for a long time. His name is Jay Cira and he is the Ceo of broster company Jay say hello and tell us a little bit about yourself. 00:14.42Jay CipraHey, how are you Mike how you doing um, first of all, thanks for the opportunity one whenever I get a chance to spend some time with you. It’s exciting but also the opportunity to talk about broster is great. So thanks for the opportunity and inviting me on your show here. Um. Groster company. So I’ll tell you a little bit about myself I’ve been with grocester company for 19 years now so long time can never imagine that I was going to be part of an organization this long but it’s it’s been awesome and it’s been awesome run and looking forward to another 20 years or so so it’s ah the broster company. Is actually a very interesting company and something that you know you think of a you know small business within the us. You know you think it’s fairly simple but it’s a little bit more complex than a lot of people think and that’s because we do a lot of different things. Um, broster company started back in 1954 when it was first organized and the way we got. Our started is ah there was a gentleman by the name of Lewis Phelan and Lewis Phelan was basically an inventor turned businessman and he worked for companies inventing products such as Monsanto. Good year. He worked as part of the Panama canal project et cetera and some pretty cool things. Um, but back in the 20 s he found himself running the Taylor company I think everybody here probably has heard of the Taylor company. The softa of ice cream machines that you see at most fast food restaurants et cetera. But. 01:37.99vigorbrandingUm, and hope. 01:41.93Jay CipraHe ran that organization for several years and actually from there also started something I want to say it’s like Zesto zestomatic or something like that which is another custard machine but he started that and it ended up turning into a a franchise drive-in so anyways, with that. In 9052 53 he was in the midwest and anybody who’s in knows in the midwest especially Wisconsin Minnesota Iowa Indiana it is supper club country and wherever you go not too many people know about supper clubs anymore. But there’s still are some around. And I tell you I still frequent with them because ah they got great food and talk about comfort food. They got it and a lot of them. There have ah their fish rise and their their fried chicken and while at 1 of these supper clubs Lewis ah decided to come up with his own method and what he did was. You know what we can make a better fried chicken and he took a pressure cooker and an open fryer and in 1953 he patented the first commercial pressure fryer into the us. So that’s kind of where we got our start way back when um, I’m gonna say shortly thereafter. He. I’ll developed his own marining encoding so he had a specific taste profile at the same time I think people may have heard of ah colonel Sanders. He was doing something similar. But yeah and Lewis developed the marinade and codings known as ah chickite marinade and slow bro. 02:58.80vigorbrandingSo. 03:13.83Jay CipraAh, coding which is still used today to make genuine brocery chicken. So that’s kind of where we got our start and you know we’ve been running our business through a couple different ownerships I’ll just state on that real quick. Ah alco standard company owned us and some other food service equipment companies. 03:16.23vigorbrandingVery cool. Nice. 03:33.65Jay CipraAnd then this ownership group. Ah we’ve had it since 1990 1991 yeah 03:38.40vigorbrandingWow! Very cool. So I mean I’m going to back up a little bit because it’s intriguing to me First of all I mean you know we always talk about restaurants or cpg and the combination thereof So yours is is ah is a piece of equipment and it actually kind of. 03:53.66Jay CipraUm, even. 03:54.53vigorbrandingTranscends and kinds of slides around into it’s not a franchise but it kind of becomes a program and we’ll talk about that in a second I want to go back to supper club. So like what’s the difference between a supper club and a restaurant like tell me more I’ve never been to a supper club I’ve heard about them. You know, um what? what is it is it actually a club I mean as crazy as that sounds. 04:10.70Jay CipraWill know it. It is just it is the old school um restaurant in the Midwest and basically it’s ah if you want to go in if you go in hungry, you’re not going to come out hungry. That’s for sure. It’s just an old school restaurant. 04:12.99vigorbrandingAh. 04:16.94vigorbrandingOkay. 04:23.16vigorbrandingGot you. 04:27.42Jay CipraWhite tablecloth restaurant. So back in the day they were the higher end restaurant which has since been replaced by a lot of the different you know che steak place et etc but people would go out there for big celebrations and when they were going to go out in the town and they wanted to have a good dinner. They went to the Supper Club but the thing that’s interesting about the supper clubs in the Midwest is you would walk out there and or sit down and immediately you would have a relish tray which would have everything you would have crackers you would have cheese and then everything you ordered would come with a soup a salad the meal. 05:03.12vigorbrandingWow. 05:03.88Jay CipraAnd a deserve. So and everything was included and it was basically you pay for that and that’s what you get and you basically would look around and all your neighbors would be there for their big meals of the week as well. 05:07.97vigorbrandingHe. 05:15.72vigorbrandingVery cool Next I’m in the Midwest you know how next time I slide into Boyoid I’ll have to find a a supper club. So that’s that that’s ah. 05:19.50Jay CipraWe got 1 right there called the butterfly club and we like to take people there. It’s awesome. Absolutely. 05:25.20vigorbrandingAh, and I assume they they sell broasted chicken of course of course. Excellent. Okay, so you know ah the the other thing that’s really intriguing to me is and and I kid you not like you know, um um um I was a kid I grew up in Hershey Pennsylvania and somehow I knew the broster name I mean. You know there’s there’s baked chicken. There’s fried chicken. There’s but somehow I knew broasted and I mean how did it permeate like how would I know that like you know were restaurants serving it. How did that all kind of come to be. 05:54.51Jay CipraWell, you know it’s interesting and again it all gets its stem from the midwest or I’ll say the ah ah the what do I want to say up upper central part of the US so if you were to take the dakoas over to Ohio go down probably to Kentucky that is where the broster market is. 06:07.84vigorbrandingUm, got you. 06:11.82Jay CipraAnd what’s interesting is we’ve really found is people have moved moved outside of the midwest. That’s how the name spreads and while that is our strongest market that we have um what we see are people start to move outside of the us and that’s where the brand starts to build and the brand recognition starts to build. Actually what’s interesting is we had a partnership with a larger chain restaurant and they were selling and I’ll just jar it. It was called Bob Evans roasted chicken. We did a branding thing and we were in all their stores and what was interesting is they did their studies. 06:41.65vigorbrandingFrom her. 06:51.28Jay CipraThey found that when they had broasted on the menu compared to just Bob Evans chicken on the menu. There was a lot more market recognition and brand recognition and people were going into the restaurants more where they called it broasted so it’s got a name. It’s good. There’s something about that name broster that. 07:03.91vigorbrandingHere. 07:09.70Jay CipraNot everybody can really put. Ah you know, get a handle of what it means or what it stands for but they know it and that’s what drives people to try it. 07:17.90vigorbrandingNow are there are are restaurants using that name now to to to enhance. Ah I mean we see like ah co promos with like say a Jack Daniels chicken or things like different things on menus or you know ribs or whatever you mean are people using roasted as a as a marker and paying for a trademark there. 07:24.31Jay CipraThat. 07:31.46Jay CipraNo absolutely they are using it as a marker and we we like to call that as grocery chicken is a a champion menu item and what a lot of people will do with that is they’ll take a section of the their menu. And they actually describe the cooking processt etc and what it means and then they’ll have whatever meals that they serve there but they will use broster on their menu once like so I’m from you know I live in Chicago land area. Our our companies inloit. But um, you know a lot of people have Vienna beef for hot dogs on their signs in Chicago. 08:02.67vigorbrandingHere. 08:06.45Jay CipraAnd for the same thing at these restaurants and the way we’ve always sold 2 restaurants is this is your champion menu item and it’s worked for people. 08:15.54vigorbrandingAnd it’s Amazing. So I Want to talk about sort of that that brand that Trademark. Ah, it’s a piece of equipment. It’s a broster so we have broasted chicken I can’t really think of ah and maybe I just I can’t think of another brand tied to a machine that is part of like the trademark. So for instance. Ah, we we have you know kettlec cooked Chips. We don’t It’s not ah Trademark Kettle. It’s just they say they’re kettle cook obviously in in food marketing when you have a descriptor with it. It just makes it better I mean you know you know healay and sea salt or whatever you know like it always sounds like it’s Better. So. 08:43.72Jay CipraUm, right. 08:50.60vigorbrandingUm, is there something else out there that that has like ah is like a broster or that we would know that you know you hear a name tied to it. It just seems so unique to me. 08:56.59Jay CipraWell, it’s a little bit different and I want to take a step back here because it broster isn’t tied to the equipment alone. Okay, and like I said when it was a personally when we were you know incorporated 1954 it wasn’t just the equipment. It was the equipment and the marinities and codexs. 09:03.58vigorbrandingOkay. 09:14.84Jay CipraSo Basically what it is is if you want to call yourselves or say that you’re using Broster chicken or serving broster Chicken. It has to have this it starts with the marinades and the coatings actually uses the fryer and then you have to use the process that we dictate. On that to actually call it genuine Brocester Chicken. So It’s not just the fryer you want to call it brocester chicken you have to use our Marin needs our coatdings our equipment and cook to our process then you’re able to call Gender Brocester chicken. 09:34.46vigorbrandingGotcha. 09:43.76vigorbrandingVery cool nice that makes a lot of sense then I know it’s it’s interesting because ah because that name is so like I don’t know it’s almost like Kleenex and people just know it. It’s the the brand is is sort of like the product. 09:53.16Jay CipraUm, yeah. 09:57.45vigorbrandingUm, there’s trademark issues I mean people tried to use your name and I know that you have to track that down sometimes in fact I remember there was a time I was driving in the back waters of New Jersey headed to the beach and I saw this big sign. It said the guy said you know I said broasted chicken. It looked like he was handmade so I reached out to you. And I know you’d looked into it so talk about that the trademark protection process and all that kind of thing. 10:20.11Jay CipraSo You know it’s It’s interesting and it’s It’s actually ah, there’s quite a bit of work there and protecting the Trademark. So We do have something that’s out there and like you said earlier a lot of people know what it they know the name but they’re not really sure what it is. And one of the things we found is people have tried to say that broaster chicken is tied to the pressure fryer as you mentioned earlier not only the brocester pressure dryer but any pressure fryer that’s out there and actuality like I said it’s tied to the marinates. It’s tied to the coatings is tied to the pressure fryer and our equipment. 10:46.11vigorbrandingAnd. 10:51.32Jay CipraSo people out there and actually some of our competitors will even say well you’re using fresh fryer just go ahead and call it broaster chicken. You can’t do that. We have broster broasted Genuine Broster chicken and anything around the name Bros Broaster etc is been trademarked by the broster company. So we own all those trademarks. 11:08.31vigorbrandingMe. 11:10.72Jay CipraSo as people go in and may oh let’s just say ah we’ll we’ll be. We’ll be nice, accidentally use the name or sometimes accidentally on purpose use that name. Um, we’ll hear about it and the interesting thing is originally when I first got in the business I’m like So what are our distributors tell us about it. 11:21.49vigorbrandingAh, yeah. 11:29.98Jay CipraOur operators tell us. But how do we hear? we actually get more call from Consumers. Um, than we do from the actual restaurants and our distributors because they go in and said hey we went in for a genuine broaster chicken and it wasn’t general Roaster Chicken I Want to let you know because you don’t want them using their name. Ah your name. Because it’s not the same quality Chicken. So Our consumers are our biggest ah police for monitoring our bread. 11:56.29vigorbrandingThat’s fantastic. That’s very cool and look. You said it started in the Midwest Wisconsin to to be precise supper clubs all that. But you you have a business that’s actually building outside of that I mean Middle East india can can you talk about that a little bit. 12:07.10Jay CipraUm, yeah, we actually we’ve been international business for global business for as long as barster is is been incorporated so to speak. Um, we have distributors I I shouldn’t say as long but quite a long time. We have distributor in the Middle East um that we’ve been working with for I think the past sixty years and we’ve been working in the Middle East I’m going to say internationally we have a strong market in the international in the Middle East we have a strong market in the Australia market and then we have a very strong market in Canada so those are the 3 marks that are really booming for us right now. 12:40.90vigorbrandingUm. 12:46.51Jay CipraAnd what we’re also seeing is just like the us as they get outside of the central us we’re seeing them as they gets out of those 3 areas they’re starting to grow different markets as people are seeing people want western brands and we give them opportunity to get in like you said before. 12:57.27vigorbrandingHere. 13:03.60Jay CipraAh, with a restaurant brand or something that looks and feels like a franchise but it’s not a franchise and we’re able to get into different food service Menues internationally and as people want this western brand they see genuine broaster chicken and they want it and they want to grab onto it and it’s been working very very well for us. 13:07.16vigorbrandingWho. 13:21.15vigorbrandingVery cool. Well I mean let’s but let’s one with that. So ah, you know we we know about restaurant franchises and franchisees franchisors and you know you have Kentucky fried chicken. You have all these but broster kind of goes about it in a different way. So if I have. A bunch of convenience stores I could I could talk to you about a program isn’t that correct. 13:37.98Jay CipraYes, absolutely so. We sell what we call a licensed trademark program and basically what that means is you can go in if you want to use like I stated early the pressure prior our marinades and codings and cook to our process. We will signed a licensed trademark agreement with you. And you’re able to use that and advertise that um at your facility now what we don’t do anymore is allow people to use broster in their name but we do allow them to use on their menu and say serving genuine broaster chickent etc. But it couldn’t be Michael’s broster chicken ah, ah, for example, but um. 14:06.36vigorbrandingYou. Right? right. 14:15.90Jay CipraYeah, so we sell it as a trademark program. We renew that every year with them and through our distributors we make sure they’re doing it right? And if they’re following the program and they’re serving quality chicken then we continue on with that agreement as long as they would like. 14:30.52vigorbrandingYeah, and you don’t want it in the name because if Mike doesn’t do a good job with the product. All of a sudden it really can affect your brand. Yeah. 14:37.40Jay CipraExactly right? pull in a product and you know we’ve had the situation where people weren’t serving to our quality or you know and and the other side where they weren’t properly using Genuine Brocester chicken where we have talked to them and they’ve pulled it off their website pulled it off their menu etc because. Again, we want our brand represented correctly. 14:55.10vigorbrandingUm, yeah, and and it’s amazing because it obviously is a fantastic product so much so that there’s ah, a really large convenience store that really hangs its hat on its chicken I mean. I’m seeing all kinds of advertising about the quality of their chicken and it’s your product Basically right I mean. 15:09.96Jay CipraYeah, so I wouldn’t say it’s our product but it’s definitely using our our equipment our cooking methodology so to speak. But you know royal farms chicken in the I want to say the Norton I shouldn’t say royal farms chicken but that’s actually how they’re becoming more and more known but royal farms convenience stores. Um, they used to just be in the northeast and basically now they’re going up and down the the eastern coast there but they they’re known for their chicken program and we started working with them I’m just going to say five ten years ago somewhere in there and basically have ah. 15:31.52vigorbrandingE. 15:47.62Jay CipraStarted using our pressure fires and they’re selling more chicken and doing a great job and the partnership that we’ve worked with them and developed with them has been a great partnership because they do serve quality product and as that’s associated with our equipment and what it’s Producing. You know that’s something that we’re we’re proud to stand behind and prior to be partners with people like that now one of the things is we go down this path a little bit. You know as I said before we make our our marinise and coatings we have equipment. Um, we have different food products et cetera. If an opportunity comes up and somebody is serving high quality chicken but they want to use their own recipe so to speak and use their own brand. We do have a strong piece of equipment. We feel. It’s the highest quality pressure out in the marketplace right now. 16:34.16vigorbrandingM. 16:38.83Jay CipraUm, we will partner with those companies while they can’t call it roaster chicken. They can still use our equipment and prepare. For example, Royal Farms chicken. 16:46.44vigorbrandingYeah I mean it’s kind of ah it’s kind of an amazing thing because again, what a great Brand Royal Farms I mean quality product quality stores. Great great ah message and they’re really using your product. Ah, they’re known for your product which is really kind of cool I Just wish you guys could get more halo from the from the. 17:01.42Jay CipraUm, yeah. 17:04.73vigorbrandingThe marketing there because ah you know again, they’re they’re drawing people in with their with their chicken. Um is there is there other products that that I mean I I know that the the machine is not quote unquote pro. It’s ah it. Ah, it’s a pressure friar and it’s a quality product. Is there anything else that you’ve ever heard of people putting in that I’ve I’ve read online of Apple pies. 17:24.22Jay CipraApple pies um breakfast burritos. One of my favorite products. We don’t have it anymore but we used to have ah a frozen food product. What? Ah, there were many cheesecakes all those are outstanding. But if you just talked. You know those are all the healthy items I’ve heard of people ah pressure frying twinkies hot dogs et cetera so you can almost do anything but some of the ones that kind of stand on in my mind are pork chops. Outstanding fish Friday fish fries you’re using pressure fryer all the time ribs ribs. Some ribs are done in the pressure fryer. And being here on a holiday season. 1 of the favorites is ah is turkey. Ah, ah you can’t go wrong with roasted turkey. Um, there is ah there’s definitely a a big call out for you know, looking to get the larger pressure priors that we have and cooking. 18:01.94vigorbranding8 18:16.70Jay CipraYou know up to eighteen twenty pond turkey in there and it turns out phenomenal. 18:20.94vigorbrandingThat’s awesome now. Only in the midwest would you consider ah broster chicken cheesecake and Apple Pie Health food but that’s okay I I respect that I respect I respect that. 18:30.70Jay CipraUm, that’s right look look at me. Ah. 18:34.41vigorbrandingAh, so ribs I know you so you mentioned ribs I know you guys have a smoke Aama Kima Talka it’s another another device another piece of equipment right. 18:43.12Jay CipraYeah, we actually purchased this company back probably about ten years ago and it was started bought the same time broser company was down local homeline. It was a company called smoke aroma and they have ah. Really 2 products and the main product that we are manufacturing and selling right now is called the smoke aroma barbecue boss and it is a pressure smoker and what I liked about this opportunity was it has pretty much the the same functionality as what a pressure firering does. But it’s in ah it but it smokes it smokes products so you could smoke ribs in 45 minutes you can smoke a brisket in 2 hours which normally takes 12 hours and basically it does exactly what the broster pressure friar does is you are but you are using pressure and you’re using the heated had to smoke a product. 19:16.62vigorbrandingYou know. 19:35.76Jay CipraWhich is going to produce a moisture product and cook it in much less time than you would have to be it in an open fire and with the pressure with the chicken or a you know a smoker on the rib side. 19:45.73vigorbrandingNow Will you create another again I Love the whole idea the brosure. It’s It’s like kind of like can create a franchise without franchise fees right? You give people a reason to come to your store or their their restaurant. Whatever and the product’s great. Are you going to do the same thing with smoke aroma is that gonna. 19:53.97Jay CipraMany. 20:04.88vigorbrandingSort of stand on its own or you just slide and slide it in or how’s that going to work. 20:08.46Jay CipraWe we you know that was originally started as an equipment home ah company only and didn’t have a program we have since developed the program for them and that’s called Rock County Smokeouts and we are working with conveence stories I believe we have a couple down in Texas right now. 20:15.35vigorbrandingGreat. 20:25.42Jay CipraThat are using the Rock County Smokehouse name and all the products that we have and we ah had the the rubs and the the different marinates and different things that you can use for the smoke product as well. Um, and use that as a license ratemark program as well. 20:40.47vigorbrandingVery Cool. So what? What do you see as I mean again, we talked about a large convenience store who’s really kind of taken nop pun intended you guys under their wing because you’re you’re promoting their ah I mean they’re promoting their brand through your quality product. Um, what’s what’s what do you see as the future like where where where do you go from here. What’s what’s the the growth opportunity. 20:59.11Jay CipraWell I think the growth opportunity for brosters really focus on Lf Facets of our business Again. We got our start as a program and I still think there’s a there’s a strong opportunity out there for food programs not only in restaurants. So when I say program in a restaurant. Yes, it is a menu item. But it’s kind of you have everything that you need with the broaster name and the broster products to just drop that into your restaurant and you’re going to have a top quality restaurant or top Quality. Ah menu item on your on your menu but food service has expanded so far. Um, that you have convenience stores you have college and universities you have grocery stores, Cetera etc that are looking to put in programs and they’re looking to put in branded programs because it’s something about a a brand that Grabs people’s name. So What were. 21:35.40vigorbrandingMe. 21:51.50Jay CipraYou know one of the main areas of focus is further developing out our programs to truly fit into sea stores grocery stores um college and universities even prisons et cetera different things that we can do to get out there and get out in the food service marketplace and give them an option. The second thing is as we were mentioned before with royal farms we have top quality equipment and our proster proster pressure prior I put against anybody’s out there and so what we’re doing is looking out to and we’re actually I shouldn’t even say looking out people are looking to us. 22:17.91vigorbrandingSee me. 22:28.36Jay CipraFor other options for pressure friers and as they look to us. They see what we do on the program side. They know what our quality of the food that it produces they start looking into it so we are innovating not only from a how to go to market perspective to some of these opportunities but also innovating from our equipment side. And for right now. For example, we we’ve just introduced and we’re putting putting out a new um piece of equipment called the eseries e standing for for efficiency e series twenty four and what that is is. That’s the 8 head pressure frier. Um, but it also has an automatic lift as well as automatic oil management system. So we basically you know in today’s market it’s harder and harder to get labor. So we’re innovating by side and how to reduce some of the labor. So what we’ve done is taken out I mean we used to be able to instill to this day we have somewhere. You drop the chicken in a basket and you have to pick pick the basket out of the oil and then dump the chicken on the side. Well in all cases with the the operational conditions that we have from a people perspective. It’s getting harder and harder to retain people. We’re giving an option where basically you load it on a tray and you push a button. And it goes down into the oil when it’s all done. You push a button that comes out of the oil and all you have to do is pick up those trays and chicken and it’s much easier and faster method for the for the operator. So innovation. Um, and then expanding our our footprint into other food service markets. 24:00.94vigorbrandingThat’s super smart I mean I know like just from personal Experience. We’ve been hired by some of the the world’s largest I’ll say food service ah companies and to your point they want a branded program so they can’t just have a coffee shop on campus they want to have like ah. You know, ah you know petes you know,? whatever Columbian coffee or whatever they they want to brand it to it and experience and what I always found amazing about your product Brand is. It’s already Turnkey I Mean there’s a piece of equipment you buy it. You then? commit quality Product. You have the the seasonings you have the program and you have a name and it’s like like you said franchise without franchise fees. It’s like it’s already known and it’s already going to be a quality product and there’s something that that seems so obvious to me about that that that I really feel has a. 24:37.50Jay CipraYeah. 24:50.63vigorbrandingAh, tremendous opportunity. So it’s ah it’s it’s very exciting so all opportunities I mean like you know we to hear about people. You know you said about some people throw the the turkey and into the pressure friar. Um, do you ever consider you know Thanksgiving was just here people were still like burning their houses down and experimenting with ah. Turkeys and and and hot oil I mean do you ever have ah any thoughts on joining for the home is there ever any kind of consideration making sort of a product that that people might want to bring to their house. 25:19.11Jay CipraI will say we’ve been asked to come up with something but when you’re speaking of 360 degree oil under about £12 of pressure. Yeah, that’s ah, it’s a little bit scary I will be honest I got to share a little secret. Not everybody knows. 25:33.14vigorbrandingAnd. 25:33.58Jay CipraUm, at my house I do have a broaster pressure fryer in our garage I do wheel it outside but it cuts it cooks a mean turkey on the holidays. But yeah, right now we don’t have ah anything for the home use at this point um and a lot of that’s just from the liability perspective is, but. 25:40.76vigorbrandingHow back. 25:48.30vigorbrandingSure. 25:52.80Jay CipraIt sure wouldnt be great I can tell you when I do roll that out of the garage people drive by are placing the orders and I become the ah ah the the chef of the of of the town to produces whatever they want I give me so it’s it’s a lot of fun. 26:00.38vigorbrandingUm. 26:07.65vigorbrandingThat’s fantastic. Well in a way I’m kind of glad you’re not going to make it because my wife personally always ah, whatever, kind of new gadget thing. That’s out there. She buys So I’m gonna have to put an additional my kitchen for all the stuff that we bought and don’t use because we have all these. Sort of things that are supposed to quote unquoteealype your Counter. We don’t enough counter space for all the things that are you know, making stuff. So ah, that’s but that’s probably good news. Well I think that’s the you know it. But it is very cool I guess that that led me to another thought though is ah you know because again I feel like it’s a No- brain or this program. 26:24.42Jay CipraYeah, oh I get it. 26:39.53vigorbrandingIs it is the whole idea of this hot oil pressure cooker is that is that a bit of a hurdle you have to overcome you know, let’s say I have I don’t know maybe I have ah 20 convenience stores. You know I’m not part of the the big chain the national chains I want to put a program in I mean is that ah is that a hurdle for some folks. Do they get nervous about that. 26:55.81Jay CipraYou mean as far as the oil and just the. 26:59.31vigorbrandingYeah, just because it is what it is I mean is it ah is a thing you have to like explain to people because I’m sure I know I’ve seen your products. They’re very safe and and they’re very well manufactured. 27:03.85Jay CipraYeah, yeah I mean to say you know for some of the the smaller operators that are new to food service on the convenience store side. It may be something and maybe a hurdle that they have to get over a bit but once they see us operate once they get their hands on it. 27:12.73vigorbrandingOkay. 27:19.63vigorbrandingUm, evening. Yeah. 27:22.88Jay CipraWe do demonstrations we do tests and evaluations we do different things like that once they get their hands on. It’s extremely safe look at the end of the day if I can operate one anybody can operate one. But no, it’s something you know if they’re not in food service. It could be a hurdle but you know we work with them. We have a. Ah, great team that can really walk them through the process and we have a great training program not only on their site but also in bulllight Wisconsin where we invite in operators. We invite invite in new distributors and we put them through a extensive training class so they can really learn exactly. 27:47.11vigorbrandingHe. 27:58.30Jay CipraNot only how to produce the best product that possible but also how to operate as safe as possible and you know at the end of the day. there’s there’s there’s 1 thing that we’re brought of we’ve never had a situation where anything’s been at the fall of broster and that’s because we build them safe. 28:02.89vigorbrandingVehicle. 28:16.97Jay CipraAnd we build the top quality piece of equipment. 28:17.50vigorbrandingVery cool I mean is there anything else, you’d like to talk like what? what’s your vision for say the next ten years or I mean what are you thinking where what would you like to see happen I mean what where you

TEAM Schostak Family Restaurants is based in Livonia, Michigan and has a portfolio of 150 casual dining, family dining, fast casual, and quick service restaurants throughout Michigan, TEAM Schostak Family Restaurants (TSFR) include Applebee’s, Olga’s Kitchen, Olga’s Fresh Grille, MOD Pizza and Wendy’s.Mark is the third generation of a four-generation family business. The company places a lot of emphasis on its road map, which includes its core purpose, its vision (to lead the way), its mission statement and its core values. TEAM Schostak Family Restaurants core purpose is to create opportunities that make lives better – to life. They create opportunities to make lives better with their employees, their guests and within the communities the company’s restaurants serve. The culture created by TEAM Schostak Family Restaurants took many years to create, but they bring it to life by modeling it and living it every day. The COVID pandemic was unprecedented territory for TEAM Schostak Family Restaurants and most restaurants. The first priority for TEAM Schostak Family Restaurants was keeping people employed.   QUOTES “Our core purpose is to create opportunities that make lives better. You have to give people a sense of purpose and they have to recognize that what they’re doing is really important.” (Mark) “You can do a great job with your people, a great job with your guests, a great job in the community and you can do everything with integrity but you have to achieve results.” (Mark)“The only way a culture comes to life in a restaurant is you have to model those behaviors. You have to live it. You have to talk about it all the time.” (Mark) “If you’re constantly going to the outside (to recruit restaurant managers), you’re losing. The only way you’re going to build a culture is you have to internally develop (managers).” (Mark) “People don’t quit companies, they quit managers.” (Michael) “We need to be out there. If you’re in the restaurant business, you need to be eating at your competitors’ restaurants. You gotta be out in the field.” (Mark)   TRANSCRIPT 00:00.97vigorbrandingGreat hello everyone I’m excited today dear friend of mine mark showstack is joining us and if you live in the lower peninsula of Michigan ah, you inevitably have eaten at 1 of Mark’s team show stack restaurants. Mark welcome to the show. You want to tell us a little bit about you and your family. 00:17.83Mark SchostakYeah, sure I’m part of a family business It’s a fourth generation family business I’m third generation and in the ah third generation my brothers and I got involved in the restaurant business and. Family’s legacy business is commercial real estate and we celebrated our hundred year anniversary in 2020 so we’re very proud of that. 00:38.72vigorbrandingAmazing. 00:46.00vigorbrandingIt’s fantastic I mean I know you guys were huge in real estate. It’s just only natural to put restaurants in it. So now you didn’t just put a restaurant in or a couple restaurants in I mean you put it in Applebee’s you have Wendy’s you have August kitchens mod pizza and you know who knows what else you guys are cooking up. You want to talk a little bit about those I mean I think you have ah. Is it a hundred and fifty restaurants 01:03.75Mark SchostakYeah, 150 restaurants who are operating 4 brands today oldest kitchen which is a our proprietary brand. It’s basically a Michigan base company a local iconic brand. We also have applebe’s in the state of Michigan and we have 63 Applebee’s we have 55 Wendy’s and we have 12 my pizzas. 01:29.40vigorbrandingIt’s phenomenal now. So I should do like I know for anybody from Michigan it’s where you live on the hand. So I’d like you to identify every location on the hand of all your restaurants. Ah. 01:37.80Mark SchostakYeah, right be a beat. Be a lot of dots. Um. 01:41.17vigorbrandingAh, yeah, it’s an awful lot of dots. it’s it’s insane it’s just amazing. You know and like you guys I know you guys are huge on core values and I know you and I get to talk about how you manage and I’ve always been impressed with your style I mean you have a ah very familiar. Ah like. Caring family style. Do you want to talk about your like your core values and maybe even your thoughts on leadership and and and management I mean you you know I got to imagine sort of like herding cats 150 restaurants. It’s I mean that’s ah, insane to me. 02:15.65Mark SchostakYeah, so when you scale business and you grow and you’re multi-brands. Um the concept of having what we call a roadmap and we call it. Our tsfr roadmap is really important and gives everybody. Um. Guardrails if you will you know of what we’re doing and how we’re doing it and our our road map is got 5 elements to it. The first element is our core purpose on our core purpose is to create opportunities that make lives better and that is. You know something we talk about all the time and it kind of ties into the whole culture is you got to give people a sense of purpose and um, you got to give them. You know they have to recognize what they’re doing is really really important and so there’s 3 ways that we can. Live our core purpose ah creating opportunities to make lives better with our people that’s first and foremost the second area that we can create opportunities make lives better is just with our guests taking care of our guests making sure they have a great meal a great day sometimes somebody had talked to and then the third way. Is we could create opportunities within our community to make lives better and so our core purpose kind of stands at top of our of our roadmap and then from there we have our vision and our vision is to lead the way. That’s really what we strive for. 03:46.79Mark SchostakAnd we talk about that all the time we chose those words very carefully over the years um and we can easily say to anybody in our organization. Um, you’re leading the way and this is what we’re excited about um and then we have our mission statement which is really how we do it and there’s 3 components to our mission statement. Ah, talented engaged team which is really important. Um that probably delights our guest and increases profits for the benefit of all and it starts with the talented engaged team and if you are got a talented engaged team. You’re going to delight our guest. And you’re going to increase profits for the benefit of all and the benefit of all is really important. You got to make sure if the company’s doing well that everybody’s sharing in that at upside if you will sharing in those profits and then we have 5 core values that we talk about all the time with descriptive phrases are. 04:35.39vigorbrandingIt. 04:45.64Mark SchostakPeople core value. Our guest core value. Our community core value got to do everything with integrity our integrity core value and then lastly is achieve results and I say this often to people you know you could do a great job with your people A great job with your guest. Great job in the community. And you could do everything with integrity but you got to achieve results and the way you achieve results in this business is through utilization of systems and being very disciplined and holding yourself accountable. Um, and then after that we each brand has a its own. So. 05:07.14vigorbrandingUm. 05:19.87Mark SchostakStrategic priorities each year and those those change depending on the needs of the business and then each brand has their metric scorecard. That’s broken off into the 3 categories of people guessed and profits. 05:34.40vigorbrandingThat’s fantastic I mean you know it’s It’s interesting. Yeah, knowing you the integrity ah core value does not surprise me ah you every time I’ve talked to you. It’s always been been from that Perspective. You’ve always had integrity and everything and. Um, always um, when makes sure I say this the right way mad by you know we think about like these fast foodod restaurants and you know we we read about like the and nra. We’ll say like there’s a 70% turnover Employees. So It just seems like almost impossible for for people to even know what’s on their menu if they’re turning over so much. Then you talk about it from this perspective and it it makes sense why you’re so successful I mean it really shows that I guess bringing this through this culture through these core values through everything ah is going to make a difference Now. How do you get that to to permeate I mean 150 restaurants I don’t know how many employees per restaurant but there’s an awful lot of people involved here. How does that. Is it The managers is it. Do you do offsite? How do you?? How do you get this information to us to stick quite candidly. 06:29.68Mark SchostakWell first of all I want to let everybody know that the culture that we created took years to develop and there was a few stops and starts and changes that we had to make and it’s a lot of hard work. It’s a lot of hard work and I tell people if you are. You really want to establish a culture. Okay, you really got to make sure that every touch point in your organization talks about what we call the roadmap every every human touch point every meeting ends starts begins with elements of our roadmap. All the vernacular if you will okay of the organization is all the same. You know everybody understands it we reward against it. We do performance appraisals against it. We hire against it. We fire against it so you know over the when I started you know working on culture. You know you thought that I could sit down and you know come up with set of core values a mission some business priorities and you know hang it up in the office right of the manager’s office and then you know quickly that just became wallpaper. Um. 07:34.87vigorbrandingIs. E. 07:42.16Mark SchostakThe only way a culture comes to life in a restaurant is you got to model those behaviors you got to live it. You got to talk about it all the time I can walk into my restaurants and um I see somebody on drive through this doing a great job in speed of service and I could say to them. You know Michael you led the way today in speed of service. You ran 154 hundred and fifty four seconds um so it’s it’s really about bringing it to life each and every day I don’t know if that answers your question but I can’t stress that enough. 08:06.91vigorbrandingNo it it does. Yeah I mean I think you know like we as a company I mean again I go back. You have 150 restaurants. We have about 100 employees and even that to me is like herding cats. So I can’t imagine what you’re going through. But. We’ve always the 1 thing and and I think it’s been a key to our success. We’ve always stayed true to our core values. We established them probably I think it was like 1995 and they’ve never deviated and ours are simple because I’m not bright enough to remember more than 3 things so ours are respect innovation and passion and ah. Our goal is to to respect the work to respect each other to respect our clients. Ah, and then you know the innovation part is just that we should be thinking of new ways and and always coming up with new ideas to push things and a passion I mean if you don’t love what you do, you don’t belong in this business I think what happens is. Ah, there’s core values like they they become. Ah, ah, part of the recipe of the brand I think they to your point that you got to live it and it becomes who you are and in in an interesting way. It’s ah and I’ve always known this. That’s one of the reasons I was so excited to talk to you I feel like what you’ve done with I’ll say team show stack is you created this brand. That is really your guys your team your playbook and then you can apply I’ll say national brands to it. You know whether it’s ah whether it’s a mod pizza or an Applebee’s or whatever I mean it feels like you can do that. How does that? Um, how do those brands because I’m intrigued obviously by these great national brands that you ah. 09:34.89vigorbrandingThat you manage how how do how do their brands their cultures I guess or their ah personalities I’ll I’ll say because they’re obviously very different types of restaurants. How does that? just ah, how does how does that work with your your team does it just all come together into the show stack name and we do it our way and we put a different logo up there. Ah, can you talk a little bit about that. 09:54.86Mark SchostakYeah, it’s a good question because sometimes the values um of the brand national brand that we’re associated with is could be different than our values and the question is you know who are these? um, the team members of Applebee’s the managers. Are they following dime brands. 10:04.10vigorbrandingAh. 10:11.53Mark SchostakYou know, um core values right? or they following. Um, um, team show stack core values hey on one second and the why phone is thought I put on you got to disturb you try to get hang out went through. Okay. 10:26.96vigorbrandingPerfect, No it was. 10:30.45Mark SchostakI’m sorry about that. Um, so yeah, so what we tell people is that you know we’re party national brands right? and we expect. Um we expect you to follow the brand values of it’s called dying brands which owns Applebee’s and ihop or Applebee’s um and respect those but the your values are team shows tech family values and those what those would govern those you know and by the way something you lot lot of the stuff is very similar. You know so there’s not a lot of conflict. But occasionally there is. 10:55.86vigorbrandingUm. 11:03.37vigorbrandingI Got you very cool How about like when it comes to attracting and retaining talent I mean even with the core values even with the roadmap and all the cool things you do I mean what are some of the things you’re doing that you’re willing to share is there any secrets like attracting and retaining because I got to I just have to think. Again with that number of 70% National average. It’s just ah boy it feels like all you’re doing is educating you know turnover I mean so how does that I mean talk about that a little bit. 11:31.49Mark SchostakYeah, you know so I would tell you that um in our in our core value people. Okay, we have 4 descriptive phrases in our core value of our people the first the first descriptive phrase is train and develop people come in. They got to train and develop them. Training it more the technical and develop is.

The International Food & Beverage Technology Association (IFBTA) is a nonprofit trade association that promotes the use of technology within the global food and beverage industries with a specific focus on education, networking, certification, standards, research, and events, while aligning with other industry associations and groups in support of their technology related initiatives.Rob started his career as a restaurant manager for Bob’s Big Boy and Marriott Hotels. In those roles, he was able to marry his love of operations and restaurants with technology.  Rob is seeing an increase in the use of robotics in back-of-house operations in restaurants, but fewer uses for food delivery to tables. At CES, Rob sees a sharp increase in electric vehicles as a trend and robotics for use in food preparation and fewer uses of VR.   QUOTES “The word ‘technology’ is changing. It’s evolving as a definition in hospitality, food service and retail and that’s a very exciting thing to see.” (Rob) “Certain terms and technology become very popular over time. The way to know what’s popular is to go to a trade show and look above the aisles at the signs. I look at what words are being used. Many years ago it was one-to-one marketing or big data.” (Rob) “I think the concept of drones may be more of a fad than a trend (in food service). I’m not so hot on drones for delivery, I am very hot on autonomous vehicles and even hotter now that I’m at CES. There is a whole room at CES with electric vehicles and half of those vehicles – probably more than half – are using autonomous driving.” (Rob)“I believe in robotics. I think we’re going to see it more in the back of the house for food preparation. That’s very clear here at CES with robotic baristas. There’s going to be at the NRF Show next week a robotic pizza maker that’s being used by Walmart. What we don’t see is a ton of robots being used for delivery of food (in restaurants) to tableside.” (Rob)“I saw a company in Taiwan and they were doing simultaneous translation with earbuds. I’ve seen this before, but it always needed a phone. This one did not need that. So we’re really getting to the point of Star Trek where you put the earbuds in and you’re instantly having conversations with somebody and it’s instantly being translated.” (Rob) “One of the two things I’ve noticed at CES between last year and this year is a whole pavilion on vehicles. Electric scooters, cars and farming equipment. The other thing I noticed is that the big companies that usually do CES have two booths. I see LG electronics, who I normally see in the main building doing video displays and phones, now has a separate booth in the automotive section where they’re showing their cars.” (Rob)  “I believe you can’t talk about technology. The best way is to show people technology and show them how it’s being used.” (Rob)  TRANSCRIPT 00:01.96vigorbrandingHello everyone today’s guest is ah a self-described techovvader and someone I’ve known for a long long time. A good friend. He’s Rob Grimes and he’s the founder and Ceo of the international food and beverage technology Association Rob also has other businesses. He’s tied to he’ll talk a little bit about that. And he’s obviously not in his house unless he has a casino and slot machines in his house. He’s in vegas so obviously ah, you’re at the Ceo show welcome to the show Rob ah, let’s hear a little bit about you. 00:31.18Robert GrimesThank you? Well listen? Yeah I’m in vegas and unfortunately since we’re doing this on a webcam I can’t tell you that what goes on in vegas stays in Vegas but I can tell you that I got elevators behind me I got a Starbucks over that way I got slot machines over that way and. 00:43.23vigorbrandingX. 00:50.50Robert GrimesFront desk over here and when I come out to vegas I still get up my normal time which is about four thirty in the morning East Coast so I was up early and so you just never know what you see coming in and out so I cannot be responsible for anybody getting out of that elevator or going in the elevator. But. 01:04.72vigorbrandingYeah, very cool. Well you know, depending on who comes out of the elevator with whom this might be the most watched podcast of all time. So I’m pretty excited about it. 01:07.52Robert GrimesAnyway, so that’s why I am but I am here for CES. 01:15.90Robert GrimesSome while. 01:18.62vigorbrandingSo anyway I’ve heard I mean you you call yourself? ah a techno vader you want to talk a little bit about that. 01:25.67Robert GrimesSo I don’t call myself that that’s sort of a name that was given to me. Um, now I’ve been called a lot of things but I thought that was sort of interesting and I think it was a combination of putting technology and innovation which is what I spend most of my time looking At. Ah, but at the same time sort of the entrepreneurial side of helping Tech. You know to come Along. So I Just it sort of stuck so I used it and um, but anyway so it’s really the combination I’m not really a highly technical person I can’t program I can’t do things like that. But. What I do do is I spend my time in technology trying to figure out and forecast where I think it’s going to go and then certainly try to predict New Trends and sometimes see new companies which is actually why I’m out here at cs. 02:12.66vigorbrandingVery Cool. So I mean a little refresher for those who aren’t familiar with the international food and beverage technology association and what you and your team do the Ifbta promotes the use of technology within the food and beverage industry considering the constant advances in technology I Mean. You and I do Trends presentations. We speak on Trends and what’s going on in food and beverage and technology and it’s just technology I mean just that’s always a trend. It’s always the topic I mean you know it’s a massive undertaking.. How do you begin to focus on that objective. 02:46.10Robert GrimesWell, ah, gosh you know that’s such a big that’s such a big subject and it’s a very large question so I have blinders on so my blinders focus on technology as it relates to the hospitality food service and retail industry so you can’t look at it all. But. You know I’m very focused on how technology putting aside my own personal interest and my own personal things that I like to use and do besides that. Um you know I’m very focused on how technology might work within our industries. However. What I’ve learned recently and I got a feeling that maybe 2024 is the year that yours and my worlds actually collide or combined and I’ll tell you why because the word technology is changing and so as I go see technology even here at Cs like today. There’s a food tech zone. That’s going to be about technology of food. How do you cook it what type of foods you have that is technology yet most people thought technology in my world was point-of-ale and Kios and drivethroughs and but it isn’t and your world working in the cpg world working with a lot of food products. That is technology as well and how it’s going to be prepared and where it’s going to be served and so I think the interesting thing about is that technology is evolving as a definition in hospitality food service and retail and that’s sort of a very exciting thing to see. 04:09.57vigorbrandingYeah I think there’s no question I mean it’s It’s a part of everything we do and you know whether it’s the the marketing and restaurant world or if it’s in the Cpg world. It’s just it’s it’s ah it’s just a paramount to be on top of the changing. 04:19.35Robert GrimesBut I’ve enjoyed the trends that you put out every year and you put out that report and you’re really talking about food trends that’s something I have to study more now because as those trends are there how that food is delivered and where it’s delivered and whether it’s a fresh food bending machine which nobody ever thought that they could do that or something. You know all of a sudden what you’re putting out in the trends in food I need to actually follow in the trends in technology and put those things together. 04:45.63vigorbrandingYeah, absolutely absolutely so like I’ve heard you say you’re a restaurant manager first I think it’s awesome because you worked at Bob’s big boy. That’s where it’s all started and so you’re seeing needs you you know? Obviously it was a long time ago and technology has just evolved so. Ah, how does that all tie into tech. How did you end up in tech from that start. 05:03.67Robert Grimesum um I always believe that you also puts people in the right place at the right time nobody expects to do what they do and when I talk to students today in hospitality schools and I tell them to do like a focus chart I tell them your focus chart can’t be any more than a year or two out. Because your life could change you know based upon things happen. So I did start as a restaurant manager um actually Roy Rogers then Bob’s big boy both owned by Marriott at the time and then Marriott hotels and then I got asked to do a systems project. And it was supposed to be like six months go to Marriott Headquarters I was working in in a Marriott hotel as a assistant restaurant manager in Washington and it was a six month deal come to come to corporate help us on a systems project. We need somebody who understands operations and then when you’re done. We send you back and you get promoted to restaurant magic well without. Totally getting into my age or where I might have been at the time the world of the pc and I collided at Marriott headquarters and it came out and so you didn’t have to be a programmer anymore to do technology and so I took over point of sale for Marriott globally some Pms and that’s actually how I got started but. I was like the first one of corporate headquarters to have a mobile phone. It was in a bag it was a bag phone pretty funny ah but then I had to convince my boss to pay for it because you had to pay $3 a minute for airtime I told him I was going to use it for support. But anyway so I was able to marry 2 things together. 06:19.36vigorbrandingE. 06:34.16Robert GrimesMy love for operations and restaurants which I still am involved in and then the tech side of it. 06:40.49vigorbrandingVery cool, very cool and it’s It’s always neat how that all kind of comes together and you know I just got I was talking my daughter this morning I said hey look if you love what you do, You don’t work a day in your life. So if you find things you’re really passionate about you can bring them together and really kind of grow in that it’s just ah, it’s wonderful and we’re We’re very lucky for that. 06:52.97Robert GrimesPeople should always do things that they’re passionate about. 06:57.55vigorbrandingYeah, no question and so you you said it you and I both end up speaking a lot of the same things on technology you technology mostly and me food and beverage Cpg and restaurant. But then as you said they come together. So The last couple of Trends Presentations I’m sure that you’ve talked about that I’ve talked about we talk about things like. Drone delivery and robots and restaurants and you know is there a day that pizza and and and Chinese food’s going to be delivered by drone and you know some of the stuff sounds pie in the sky. But but really the way technology is moving. It necessarily is so yeah. 07:28.74Robert GrimesUm, was that a play on words pie in the sky. Yeah, good be pizza pie. Um. 07:30.66vigorbrandingThere you go there, you go Pi the pie. Maybe that should be a company our next company the pie pie in the sky and we’ll do pie delivery. Ah, ah yeah, yeah. 07:41.35Robert GrimesYou know it’s funny certain terms and technology become very popular over time and so what I tell people is the way to know what’s popular is you go to a trade show and it can be an industry show. It can be a general one like cs and what I always do is I look above the aisles. And the aisles have signs and they point in different directions to zones or places you can go and I look to see what are the big words that are being used so many years ago it was 1 to 1 marketing or big data was a term out there. You know drones are so so drones and robotics are sort of interesting now. I’m really shocked. You didn’t say the word ai because that is the term right now and I’m getting a little tired of it. But but that is the term right now. However, here’s an interesting perspective for you about drones specifically I have said for years that I didn’t think that drones were actually going to be the end all method of delivery. 08:18.93vigorbrandingYeah, oh yeah, yeah. 08:36.16Robert GrimesI think they were showy and I think that they were things that people tested and they showed the pizza coming up and dropping it. Do I think the drones will be used to deliver to remote places. Yes, as long as you can get the distance so that you can go ahead and control the drone. Yeah and as long as you can deal with. 08:36.74vigorbrandingThat’s. 08:51.96Robert GrimesAir traffic control seriously and things like that that you have to deal with but their payload isn’t heavy enough to carry really a lot of stuff and you’re going to have food quality issues. Okay, where I really thought and you’ll get the punchline on this in a second. What I really have always thought was going to be the method. Of delivering stuff was autonomous vehicles. Whether a vehicle is just a little bot that goes on a campus or whether it’s a car that drives itself That’s where I thought it was be so here I am at Cs Do you know that for the last 2 to 3 years at Cs putting aside Covid. That when I went to Cs. There was a whole section on drones. Interesting I haven’t seen that section yet as a matter of fact, when we get off this podcast I’m going to look it up because I don’t think they actually have it as a section right now now Robotics is clearly a section that’s here. 09:30.80vigorbrandingHe. 09:44.59vigorbranding3 09:46.89Robert GrimesSo I think the concept of drones may have been more of a fad than a trend now. Do I think the drones are going to be big sure because anybody following current events knows the military uses the drones and that is usually how things get their funding so I’m not so hot on the drones for delivery I am very hot. On the autonomous vehicles even hotter now that I go to cs there is a whole room. Its ceos of electric vehicles and half of those electric vehicles that are there probably more than half are showing autonomous driving. 10:18.84vigorbrandingAnd he. 10:21.79Robert GrimesIncluding how to and equip in a current car but not only that they have smaller vehicles that are autonomous that can do it for delivery. That’s the way I think that you know ah delivery is going to go through autonomous vehicles. Um and the drones are going to be out there and then you talk about robotics you know. I also believe in robotics I think that we’re really going to see it more in the back of the house than the front of house to start for food preparation. That’s very clear here at cs with robotic baristas. Ah there’s going to be at the Nrf show next week a robotic pizza maker that is being used by Walmart but those are all back of the house. What you don’t see is a ton of robots being used for delivery of food to tableside now United Airlines put it in their clubs. 10:58.16vigorbrandingExcuse me. 11:06.42vigorbrandingGive up. 11:09.97Robert GrimesBut it’s mainly to be an assistant to somebody take away dirty dishes or bring something out. We’re not seeing that kind of robotics yet we will. But I think that we will see robotics in the back. So those are 2 huge technologies. You know the autonomous and the robotics that I think you know will make a difference to us. 11:29.20vigorbrandingYeah, and then let’s face it with ah you know talking to all the restaurants and chains out there I mean getting employees is a big deal. So ah, you know Necessities is a mother of invention the the back out as so the backend robotics ah is certainly important to to to help them with their business and keep their business rolling. So. 11:29.25Robert GrimesI. 11:38.40Robert GrimesIf. 11:47.14vigorbrandingI Think that’s that’s ah, it’s a really good point that you make um so when it comes. 11:49.49Robert GrimesUm, well robotics allows us robotics allows us to also open up smaller form factor or self-operated things and I actually consider. Vending to be Robot ah robotics in a box or restaurant in a box that is robotics when they’re preparing fresh food hamburgers and pizzas that are made fresh in a bending machine. Not not something you know, frozen and microwaved or whatever in there. So. 12:05.22vigorbrandingThe. 12:14.70Robert GrimesIt’s not so much about solving the employee problem. It actually is a revenue generator for opening up new units. Um. 12:18.00vigorbrandingYeah, it makes a lot of sense. Well so we talk about back office or in front of house a back of house when it comes to restaurant tech I mean obviously there’s there’s front of house technology. There’s the stuff that consumers see. There’s the back of the house kitchen technology which one is growing faster. 12:29.19Robert GrimesTo change. 12:34.61vigorbrandingAnd and which one is more important. Do you think that the restaurants jump on board. 12:40.76Robert GrimesI think that people will adopt back of the house more and a lot of the technology is in the back of the house. Um, if you want to talk about employees. You know it’s funny I saw somebody yesterday a company out of China out of Taiwan and they were doing simultaneous. Ah translation with earbuds now I’ve seen this before and I’ve covered this before but it always needed a phone that you had to go through the phone to the earbuds. This one did not need that so we’re really getting to the point of like star trek or something where they put the earbuds in and you’re just instantly talking you know conversation with somebody. It’s instantly being translated. So I asked the guy you know what’s your use case for this so half the people I talked to here at cs. They’re all on the consumer side. They never thought about doing anything on the commercial side. So we start talking well he tells me that honey grow is using it in the kitchen. Why are they doing that because they have workers that don’t speak english. 13:30.89vigorbrandingNo. 13:36.21Robert GrimesAnd so what they’re doing is they’re using in the kitchen to train and to do simultaneous now. That’s the only one in the us that’s doing it. They are doing it a ton of them over in China and other places so I see a lot of technology being used in the back of the house to help prepare foods. Ah, to do ventless cooking like sous vide cooking that’s out there I see technology and how the screens and the orders and communicating with the staff in the back of the house being more efficient for doing runner systems and things the front of the house. The biggest technology change I see in the front end house besides having customers do their own ordering which is in certain things is really to do the handheld terminals you know for taking the order at tableside in the payment is almost if you think about it’s almost like the biggest technology change there is but mostly changes in the back. 14:22.63vigorbrandingI mean it makes sense total sense so you know it’s interesting. You’re at Cs Restaurants Nations restaurant news predicts that and 2024 will be the year that restaurant tech industry shrinks as smaller tech startups either shut down or get bought by larger players. Ah, is that do you think that’s a good thing I mean because I will say on this podcast I mean I can have ah I can have a a new tech concept every week because there’s just so many of them out there just it’s they’re everywhere and I’m sure you’re aggregating it. You’re understanding. It. You’re you’re managing it. You’re looking at it. So I’m sure you see the same things. Do you think it’s good that that that industry shrinks. Um, what? what are your? What are your feelings there. 15:02.36Robert GrimesSo you know so as you know I have a podcast called accelerate and I’ve covered this issue a little bit when I talk about all in 1 systems versus best to breed and all in 1 is where you get everything from one company. Best to breed is where you focus on specific areas I think um. 15:13.66vigorbrandingE. 15:18.60Robert GrimesThe ifbta also has something called exchange and which is being released next week which has about 600 different vendors in it. You know, not not paid vendors just sort of listing I think what we’re seeing is a lot of innovation but the innovation is very very focused innovation. Like it could be the the headsets or it could be the displays or it could be your payroll or training or point of sale or loyalty and so. 15:38.78vigorbrandingMean. 15:48.14Robert GrimesThere is consolidation when you have something that comes out of the blue that takes everybody by storm and the big guys sit there and they go oh. We missed the vote I will never forget an fs tech panel I did where one of the major vendors said. We missed the boat on online ordering there’re now over 30 companies and this is years ago they said there’s over 30 companies that are doing this now and they are basically point-of sale companies because they take payments and and they can do an order and they said we miss the boat. So what are they going to do they have to have online ordering so they go ahead and they they purchase and consolidate the companies. Sometimes it’s a matter of 2 companies that come together that have very specific focused technologies and you have to put them together to make it work like 1 has this one has that and you put them together. So I think it’s good. We’re going to see a lot more innovation though I don’t think we’re going to see as much shrinkage and part of the reason for that is the hospitality schools. 16:29.70vigorbrandingUm. 16:38.30Robert GrimesAre now offering innovation and entrepreneurship as a course even Penn State where even Penn State’s doing that. So um I think we’re going to see more because software is a lot easier to develop than hardware and we’re not hardware dependent anymore. 16:39.91vigorbrandingGreat. 16:51.84vigorbrandingIt would be interesting I mean what do you? What are you seeing at Cs I mean I know it’s only been one day so far is there anything That’s really standing out anything new that you want to talk about. 16:54.00Robert GrimesSo I don’t know that I agree with that I hadn’t heard that and I don’t know that I agree with that. 17:05.16Robert GrimesYeah, the general observations is cs and I’m going to have to look for the statistics on this because I’m not exactly sure my impression right now is that cs is not as crowded as it has been number one in the past I know that wasn’t your question but you know, but it also could be because Las Vegas opened up a huge new. 17:15.21vigorbrandingInteresting now. It’s interesting. 17:24.42Robert GrimesConvention center is part of cs it’s connected and I think they spread out more so one of the 2 things that I’ve noticed last year and this year is a whole pavilion on vehicles and and when I say vehicles every electric scooter car truck up to big deer. You know, big deer farming equipment is electrified. They have their own building which is amazing to me with all the ev that’s in there and we’re not talking about autonomous vehicles now we’re talking about all of even even Amazon the other thing I noticed is the really big companies that traditionally do see yes, now have two booths. So. 17:50.40vigorbrandingWhile. 18:03.90Robert GrimesI see Lg electronics who I normally see in the main building doing video displays you know and phones now has a separate pavilion in the automotive place where they’re showing their cars so that’s 2 Yeah, the the expense is is amazing. So I see. 18:09.87vigorbrandingUm. 18:13.41vigorbrandingWow. 18:22.36Robert GrimesSo I think it could be because you have so much more space that it makes it look like it’s not as crowded but I bet you when the stats come in. It’s probably as crowded. Um I haven’t gotten to the wearables area yet which I’m going to do today and there’s actually a food tech area there and I’m also looking for what’s in the home. 18:32.58vigorbrandingMe. 18:40.85Robert GrimesI’m a little bit surprised I haven’t seen so much in the way of glasses right now in the past ah vr I went to the gaming area yesterday just to see what was there. Ah the vr and the glasses are not as widely spread as they were in the past I know that ah meta got a lot of play with the um. With the glasses that came out from raban early this year I don’t view those as very functional because there’s nothing on the screen. It’s basically a gopro in a ah in a nice looking glass. So I’m looking forward to that so I was a little surprised. They didn’t see much of that. Um, the health and wellness area I’m not seeing as many watches and things as I normally would see. Um, and the robotics I am seeing robotics here for sure. Um, there’s a lot of robotics as they relate to showing mechanics of how they can start to become like a human so a robotic dog was very interesting I saw and several. Boost but you always look for those surprises that are here. But there’s nothing so far that’s jumped out at me except maybe what has been missing. 19:43.83vigorbrandingInteresting. Well you want to talk a little bit about the Ifbta I mean this is ah something near and dear to you I mean the talk about that a little bit. What so what? What is ibta going to get from this show. What are you hoping to do? what are your members like talk about that a little bit. 19:55.33Robert GrimesWell our members so you know the ifta the food but international food and beverage technology association Yo we have a number of different missions. We are not a lobbying organization. Although we work with many. 19:59.57vigorbrandingMcburn. 20:09.45Robert GrimesSo our mission is to promote food and beverage technology which at the beginning of this podcast. We talked about maybe having a change in definition. Um, expanding to promote it to provide education and networking for our members globally and so that means chapters that means education like our certification program. Ah, that means events we do at certain industry events where we bring people together who are interested in technology but it also means partnering with the industry owners so to speak the associations like Naqs for convenience stores the and nf for the and nra for restaurants. Ah, you know. Just ah, partnering with them the american hotel lodging association to help them to bring technology because they can’t focus on all these areas. So that’s our mission is education and networking of our members and in that we recognize that our members are really threefold. 1 is the individual of a small the medium or the independent. Which is you’re going to find in every state then you have your mid-tierer and your enterprise which wants something different entirely and then um, you also have the supplier community and you have the other people that are sort of friends of the community that do things so we really have to fill a role for all of them. That are there. So my mission here at cs is everybody can’t be everywhere although I saw a whole contingent of mcdond’s Donald going by on a guided tour yesterday. So not everybody can do that so I see my role here and a couple other people here as being sort of eyes and ears to predict. What’s going to happen. 21:37.80vigorbrandingIn. 21:40.91Robert GrimesOr what we should be looking at and then focus on bringing that to the companies at things like and Nrf or fste or Murrttech or the and nraio or or places like that. So that’s you know that’s really the role and the role I played but I will just point out 1 other thing to you that I believe that you can’t. 21:53.20vigorbrandingAnd. 21:59.27Robert GrimesTalk about technology really the best way is to show people technology to show them how it’s being used and coming up live on our website today tomorrow certainly by by Monday you know you’re going to be able to actually talk to me on the website. But if you saw me at and nf next week I would be this standup hologram. You could talk to and I can answer questions for you as if I’m doing it right now which is a great way of doing it. So we’re going to put that kind of technology to use on our own website and other technologies because we want to be able to show people realistically how it can be used without going cutting edge. We want to be or bleeding edge. 22:21.36vigorbrandingRight. 22:36.66Robert GrimesYou know we want to show them the realistic use of it. So that’s really our world. Yeah. 22:38.38vigorbrandingYeah, you’re trying to bring the the stuff that’s way out there closer home So people can see the actual uses how they can imply it and everything else and that’s brilliant I mean you bring a lot of wealth. 22:45.95Robert GrimesAnd I’m and I’m cheap like everybody else though I don’t want to spend a fortune on it. So I want to work with technologies that exist. 22:51.93vigorbrandingAh, ah, very cool, very cool. Do you want to talk about your other businesses anything like that or is there anything else from ah what you’re seeing at the show I mean you know as we close this out like what are some of the things you want to maybe mention. 23:01.56Robert GrimesYeah, so I mean I am involved in a lot of businesses I think I’ve sort of lost count over time. But personally I believe I’ve been involved in about 80 different businesses. But that includes multiple variations of the same business but in different geographies around the world. So you know I’ve never sold any hardware software ever. I’ve always been more of a services kind of person so today I still own a constrata which is a consulting company and a services company that does deployments for people acting as their internal staff. Never want to sell I don’t run those day to day because i. Certainly don’t want a conflict with the Ita which is totally impartial and open to all and everybody’s equall in the ivta all the operators all the suppliers and then um, you know I spend some time on some other entrepreneurial ventures trying to help people. But again those swim lane the pacoty food service retail services in technology. 23:42.27vigorbrandingIs. 23:58.73Robert GrimesIf it’s outside of those lanes I probably shouldn’t be doing it. Um I am very excited about next week where we’re going to have for the first time a food service innovation zone at the national retail federation show at the javit center that is a huge show is the whole Javit Center what I find fascinating every year is the book ends and I will do an article and I will do a podcast as I do every year called tail the two cities vegas is the first one with cs and rf is the second one which is retail and it’s really all retail so you know, ah. 24:29.76vigorbrandingYou. 24:34.16Robert GrimesI spend my time just looking at these things whether it’s constrata the ifbta or just my personal thing I will tell you 1 thing that sometimes when I talk to people. Yeah about what their preferences are in tech I always like to get a feel for it and so I’m still trying to figure out how I become that tech influencer so Samsung. Just give me 1 of their new tri screen phones that they still haven’t brought out after showing it two years ago but they should just give it to me so I can go ahead and use it and just show it to people like how to use it. So that’s the 1 thing I have yet to achieve. 24:56.24vigorbrandingYeah, yeah, you are kind of an old school influencer before influencers were cool. That’s for sure. There’s no question about that now. 25:08.74Robert GrimesFast. 25:11.19vigorbrandingSo now a couple personal things here. So talk about this polar plunge thing you do this every year. Why do you do it? how many how many years have you been doing this thing. 25:19.29Robert GrimesAh, 4 years so the polar bear plunge in Margate in on the jersey shore since I’m from Philadelphia I’ve had a house of Jersey Shore um I don’t know it was just sort of an idea to run in and you run into the water you got to dive because you got to get. Over this year. It was like really cold. Normally it hasn’t been so cold and it was really cold and you had to run out far enough. It wasn’t deep enough to do the dive because the waves weren’t coming in so I had to go out and I’m like coming out of my ankles and my sins are like just numb. But I’ve been doing it for 3 years maybe 4 and um. 25:52.11vigorbrandingAh, nice. 25:55.49Robert GrimesIt’s like 3000 people they do it all over the jersey shore you could actually do one like at ten o’clock one at 111 at 121 at 1 but it was just something to do it just seemed like a good idea at the time. 26:03.31vigorbrandingyeah yeah I I too I go to the jersey shore and I don’t even go in the water in July because it’s still too cold. So I have no desire whatsoever to do that. But it sounds the same. 26:12.59Robert GrimesI Do want to point out to anybody listening this podcast. We don’t go to the beach. We’re going to the shore and I want to make sure you know that there is a beach at the shore but we go to the shore. 26:24.66vigorbrandingYep I totally get it. That’s a Philly thing. So last question I asked this of everybody if you had 1 final meal. What would you eat and why. 26:34.96Robert GrimesUm, a final meal. Um, well I mean I’m a huge steak fan but that’s like what every prisoner orders for their last meal right? So I’m not so sure I want to I want to be there Um, a final meal. 26:46.23vigorbrandingAh. 26:48.40Robert GrimesThat’s like really ah a tough question I’m sure it would be something it would be something like a steak of some sort that was out there just because I just happen ah like steakhouses and St it might be a plant. It might be a plant. It might be a plant based one by the way over time I did have. 26:58.18vigorbrandingIs there a particular steakhouse that you love. 27:07.39Robert GrimesJust just a note I love having conversations with people so I had a conversation at a function last night with this guy who told me he went vegan and he asked me what I thought the future of vegan was and whether people would adopt it over time and my response to him was this is about tech and food tech I said hey listen who would have thought ten years ago you could go to a burger King and get a whopper that you might not know the difference between a beef flopper one made a plant. So my view over time is that steak that I’m eating and I understand that ah Leonardo Dicaprio invested in a company that’s doing plant-based steak is they’re working on that and over time. 27:30.74vigorbrandingE

GiftAMeal is an app that allows diners to take a photo of their order from a partner restaurant. For each photo taken, GiftAMeal donates to a local food bank to provide a meal to a family in need. Each month, more than 40,000 meals are provided through more than 100 local food banks in 37 states via GiftAMeal. In the last year, GiftAMeal has grown from 200 to almost 1,000 partner restaurants. Andrew fell in love with the profits-with-a-purpose business model as a student at Washington University. While there, he owned and operated a non-profit storefront dedicated to reuse and sustainability. Later, while interning at a venture capital firm, he developed the idea for GiftAMeal on his lunch break. GiftAMeal works with individual restaurants and franchises or franchise groups of restaurants like Red Robin. Making GiftAMeal an easy plug-and-play concept for restaurants and larger chains is a goal in 2024.   QUOTES “Making an impact is something that’s always been important to me. I also love the creative autonomy that comes with entrepreneurship and trying to find those win-win scenarios and align incentives for different parties.” (Andrew) “We’ve seen that guests using GiftAMeal are returning 39% more frequently, they’re spending 20% more per visit and they’re tipping 32% more than a standard guest.” (Andrew) “We started off as a mobile app, but we’ve always paid attention to the different technologies that were being developed.” (Andrew) “Fuse Marketing and 5W PR studies found that 84% of Gen Z were more likely to purchase from a brand if (the brand) gives back and 71% of Millennials would pay more for a product if they knew that some of the proceeds were going to a good cause.” (Andrew)  “Entrepreneurship is not an easy journey.” (Andrew)   TRANSCRIPT 00:00.00vigorbrandingHello everyone today’s episode of flirk tales I am joined by someone who takes cause marketing and entrepreneurial spirit to a new level. His name is Andrew Glanz and he’s the founder of gift a meal. Welcome Andrew and tell us a little bit about yourself and some of your backstory. 00:14.43Andrew GlantzYeah, of course. Um so I’m originally from Los Angeles and I came out to St Louis to go to wash you for college when I was a student there I owned and operated a nonprofit storefront to promote reuse and sustainability and volunteered for various causes and. Ah, then when I had a summer internship at a venture capital firm and got exposed to the startup world I fell in love with the scalability of it and found out about the idea of a profits with a purpose business model that you could do well while doing good and came up with the idea for gift and meal when I was on a lunch break break and kind of ran with it and put my savings into it. Graduated in May Twenty seventeen and started out in St Louis and now started to really scale it up and grow it into what it is today. 01:01.68vigorbrandingThat’s very cool now like you know I’m I’m somewhat of an entrepreneur I started my own business when I was 27 and grew several companies and I love it. I mean I Just think it’s ah a great way to be and and I love the energy of it. So How did you become this entrepreneur. How did you all? sorry. Family of entrepreneurs I mean just had ideas tell me about you like what would would motivate. You. 01:21.14Andrew GlantzYeah I mean I think that making an impact has always been something that’s important to me and then I also just like the creative autonomy that comes with entrepreneurship and trying to find those win-win scenarios and align incentives for different parties and so with gifted meal I was trying to look at how we could. Create a win for the restaurants in terms of marketing win for them and and an easy way to add a community engagement program for them and then for food banks in terms of their fundraising and not taking a lot of effort for them to connect and be able to raise more funding and for diners to be able to discover and support socially conscious restaurants and. So I kind of combined all those together along with Tom shoes warby parker buy 1 give 1 model and applied it to the restaurant industry where guests can just take a photo of their food or drink at a restaurant that’s a partner and then we make a donation to a local food bank to give a meal to someone in need in their community so tried to make it. Easy and align all those stakeholders. 02:19.11vigorbrandingIt’s fantastic I Mean it’s a great Obviously it’s a great cause it’s ah it’s a great concept and it’s ah it’s really, ah, a very smart model I mean I’m I’m really intrigued I Want to learn more about this. Um, so the gift of meal. How how does it work like you know you know you talked about it started. You had the idea you went to school. Um, you want to do good all good things. But how does how does it work like I mean I’ll say this from the entrepreneurial side I mean we all got to make a living I mean you know you have nice clothes on I’m sure everyone’s got to make a living. How does the model work like teach me teach me how it works. 02:40.96Andrew GlantzUm, yeah. 02:47.85Andrew GlantzAbsolutely so the program is funded by the restaurant and free for the guest who’s dining at the restaurant and so the restaurant’s paying a flat monthly program fee to be involved so for a single unit mom and pop. It’s $59 a month then each time a guest dines at the restaurant whether it’s. Dine in take out her delivery. They can scan a Qr code off of signage from the restaurant which launches gift to meal on their phone. They then take a photo of their food or drink and when they do that we make a monetary donation from that program fee that the restaurant pays to a local food bank to cover its cost of providing a meal to someone to need in their community. And then the guest is invited to share that photo on their personal Facebook Instagram or Twitter x and we give an extra meal for each platform they share on since then they’re promoting the restaurant to their friends in a positive way. Um in terms of the donation component. The donations are all local so we match. Each restaurant location to a food bank that services the county that they’re in and each of these different food banks gets food donated to them by supermarkets food distributors community food drives and in storeing these big distribution facilities and then where gifted meal comes in is donating money to help fund the distribution costs. Getting that food from these big facilities to the hundreds of neighborhood pantries where those in need could actually access the food. So typically the food banks have listed on their website for every dollar donated they could provide 4 meals to those in need or 5 meals or three meals. So approximately it costs about twenty five cents to distribute a meal’s worth of food in bulk. 04:19.56Andrew GlantzUm, and so that’s the amount that we’re actually donating per photo taken. 04:23.27vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. So then you’re helping facilitate Basically the outsourcing of the food or the the backend or back office. It’s not really a food thing but I mean you’re you’re funding the the distribution the distribution model. So that’s wonderful and then I mean so you know the the the. 04:33.92Andrew GlantzUm, yeah. 04:40.34vigorbrandingRestaurant themselves in they get to tout the fact that they’re doing this. They can feel good about themselves obviously but from a marketing perspective. They really get to sort of like ah say hey look. We’re really supporting our community here. How are they? how are they taking advantage of that. 04:44.63Andrew GlantzUm. 04:48.94Andrew GlantzYeah, yeah, Absolutely I mean the restaurant could be posting about it on their social media channels about how many meals they’re providing and everything but more than that one step further with gift to meal. It’s an interactive level of social responsibility. Where the guest feels good about themselves because they’re putting in some amount of effort to take the photo but they feel that sense of gratitude towards the restaurant because the restaurant’s the one that’s ultimately paying for it and so it really creates that sense of emotional connection between the guest and the restaurant. 05:14.14vigorbrandingUm. 05:18.83Andrew GlantzAnd makes them feel good about choosing that restaurant in addition to encouraging them to promote the restaurant to friends on social media and so we’ve seen that the guests using gift a meal on average are returning 39 % more frequently. They’re spending 20% more per visit and they’re tipping 32% more than a standard guest. Because of that sense of emotional connection. They have raises and satisfaction rates. You know the restaurant’s getting Goodwill with these customers and they’re also getting more word of mouth recommendations as a result on their social media to their friends and everything so it is something that’s really cool to be able to see a true marketing return without having to. Ah, discount or offer Coupons or anything that slashes the margins for the restaurant. 05:58.88vigorbrandingYeah, it’s it’s brilliant I mean because I mean let’s face it. We are a marketing firm we market and and help market restaurants and you know a lot of times. It’s all the different deals and the the value meals and all these kinds of things that you got to try and entice customers and you you brought forth a really smart ah program. 06:13.95Andrew GlantzNext. 06:15.31vigorbrandingAnd it’s It’s pretty remarkable and and I love the fact that you know your numbers I mean you can you’re you’re able to tell talk about the the growth and sales the tipping which is really important to the servers and we got take care of the servers I think it’s really an interesting ah model Really really, really cool so you should be yeah, be very proud of what you built. 06:22.60Andrew GlantzEnough. 06:32.14vigorbrandingSo like Okay, so how do you? How do you sell Now you know again be an entrepreneur come up with ideas. Great idea. Brilliant idea. Got the numbers. How do you sell like how do you go out and market it and what’s your best way and what’s it like are you knocking on doors are you making phone calls. Are you going to shows I mean how do you get this this program to. 06:49.74Andrew GlantzYeah, it’s a great question I mean originally I when I didn’t have a car when I was in college I was going up and down the street in the snow between 2 and four thirty p m to mom and pop restaurants to try to talk to the owners and to have them join and. 06:50.34vigorbrandingTo the right people. 07:05.62Andrew GlantzAh, pitched them on the program and then from there we were able to sign up some restaurant groups and then we had some franchisees join and then we had a 30 location regional chain sign up for gift to meal and then we started to expand from there now we’re in 37 states across um, almost a thousand restaurants and. Um, at one point seven million meals provided to those in need and so it was kind of continually de-risking ourselves with different types of restaurants and larger restaurant groups. Um, so now we work with multiple brands that you know have over 100 locations system-wide so we work with all 100. 07:38.76vigorbrandingSo. 07:42.32Andrew Glantz30 locations of Lee’s famous recipe chicken all 110 pizza factory locations we work with 162 gong chaw locations and we also work with franchisees of brands like Jimmy John’s and chick-fil-a and um and lots of others and fuzzy talker shop and so red Robin Tgi fridays and so it’s something that’s been really exciting to connect with all these different types of brands in terms of where I meet them. You know sometimes they reach out to us on our website after you know, seeing us in the news. Sometimes it’s introductions from our current restaurants other times it’s going to conferences and. Ah, Mike you’ve said other times it’s just kind of cold reaching out to them with a Linkedin email or phone call and just trying to start up a genuine conversation from a cold interaction and finding those brands that could be a likeminded fit. 08:31.70vigorbrandingYou know I love it and I love the ah the started in the college and no car. You know I have a friend one of my very best friends. Extremely successful guy. He he went to college with his brother. Ah, he ended up going for pizza the first night. Ah. Didn’t know what else to do second nigh second they were hungry. Let’s go for pizza. Third night they were hungry. They went for pizza so 3 nights and early get a pizza shop. They said the pizza guy hey look if we pass out Coupons for your pizza shop. Do you think? maybe you give us like a discount on pizza guys like sure. Yeah pass them out to all the college or that created a thing called the coupon clipper. Coupon clipper is a hugely successful magazine across the country I think there’s something like maybe I get this number wrong. But I’m going to suggest 125 magazines coupon clipper magazines at 1 point in time around the United States it’s ah a huge company ended up being sold to kinet. 09:16.76Andrew GlantzMan. 09:23.13vigorbrandingAh, anyway, just like you did like just a so a simple like I’m going to go out I’m going to knock on a door I’m going to find something out I’m going to go to the next one knock on the door So congratulations I Just I’m always in awe of entrepreneurship and just the people in the and the fortitude that that bring these things and these ideas forth. It’s awesome. 09:37.76Andrew GlantzThank you. 09:39.75vigorbrandingUm, if you ah if you can say I mean who’s your who’s your biggest client and have you are you trying to talk to some of the you know so the franchisees The actual franchise are you having any a look there. 09:48.99Andrew GlantzYes, it’s a little bit of a mix I mean we can work with all different types of organizations whether it’s something system-wide like we could work with a brand across a thousand locations. We could work with a brand if they’re an 100 location brand or a thirty location brand. Ah, for us. We’re really flexible to however the organization does budgeting. So for example for gong cha with their 162 locations. Lee’s chicken 130 and pizza factories one 10 um, those are all paid for by corporate out of their marketing and advertising funds and they pay for all the franchisees to be on gift a meal. 10:18.37vigorbrandingAh. 10:24.18Andrew GlantzUm, but then we also work with the franchisees directly um like a red Robin Franch franchisee Lehih Valley Restaurant group in Pennsylvania has 20 red robins and so we just just work with them directly and they pay for gift and meal. But we don’t have any interaction with corporate on that side. So you know I’d love to have red Robin as a brand across all locations. 10:29.64vigorbrandingHe. 10:40.51vigorbrandingSure. 10:44.17Andrew GlantzUm, that’s one of those things where you know we can hopefully prove out the value to the franchisees get introductions from one franchisee to another get introductions to corporate and continue to go that way so we go both a bottom-up approach and a top-down approach and in terms of the size of the brands like you know there’s. Brands that we’re having conversations with that have thousands of locations and it’s something that’s really exciting there and we’ve gotten feedback from them and built new product offerings where we’ve created and essentially a white labelbeled version of gift ameal that’s custom branded to their brand colors and everything. 11:02.90vigorbrandingAwesome. 11:13.30vigorbrandingHey. 11:18.16Andrew GlantzCould be integrated into their own mobile applications. Their online ordering solutions to have it really feel like a native solution for them. Um, and so that’s something that we’re really can be focused on in 2024 Um, is you know how can we work with these larger players and have get to meal be in really easy plug and play. Social Responsibility Community engagement tool for them. 11:36.55vigorbrandingYeah I Love that idea I think that’s brilliant. The the white labeling and letting them sort of for lack about a word get credit for this concept right? I mean because you know it is it really is your your success is is all dependent upon their their success and and and their brand and that’s why they’re doing it. So. 11:44.42Andrew GlantzYeah, yeah. 11:55.92vigorbrandingI Think that’s fantastic I Think it’s super super smart. How I mean what is the Ah how how likely are people to download the app I mean what are your I mean everybody’s got turbulence. Everyone hits like speed bumps like you always have things, especially it’s not entrepreneur. There’s things you have to overcome. 11:56.30Andrew GlantzUm. 12:07.11Andrew GlantzYes. 12:12.77vigorbrandingI mean the first thing might have been the first restaurant to stop to jump on. Okay, great. So but you have a great story. Ah you you bring forth. Ah, the time when you had your first restaurant you you didn’t have any traction so you couldn’t say we’re going to increase your tips we’re going to increase your sales you were going to increase your visits but you had a great idea so someone took a chance on you and your concept which is great. 12:23.40Andrew GlantzYeah. 12:31.68vigorbrandingBut as we grow as you grow What? what are? what are some of the stumbling the roadblocks and I was wondering I guess is is getting people to download the app or or things like that does that become any kind of a friction point. 12:42.90Andrew GlantzYeah, absolutely. Um and so we we started off as a mobile app but we always paid attention to the different technologies that were being developed so Apple released and a concept called an app clip and Android released something similar called an instant app where you could just scan a Qr code and launch. The app on your phone without having to download an app onto your device and so it’s a really clean and quick full-screen experience. So it’s kind of like a light version of an app. Um, and that’s kind of what we’ve adopted with most of these partner restaurants nowadays that we’ve developed over the last year is this app clip version of gift a meal. Don’t actually have to download the full app onto your phone in order to participate and take your photo. It just gives that quick experience skim the qr code take a photo to give a meal and then you’re done and there’s no account creation or download required. Um, if you want to download the full mobile app you can and you can see the list of all the partner restaurants on there. You can see the photos that other customers have taken and you can have a profile you can see friends photos and all of that. Um, but we realized that there were kind of those 2 different types of consumers. The consumers that wanted that full experience and consumers that just wanted something really really quick and easy. And so that’s why we created both avenues so people can kind of choose how much they want to engage. 13:53.71vigorbrandingYeah I Love it. That’s great. That’s great. Do you ah different. Obviously you mentioned some of your your customers. Um, do do any fine dining restaurants as anybody like that got involved and I guess you know you’re looking for scale so you’re probably looking for larger groups. But I mean like if it was ah you know? ah. Ah Pf Chang or or any it’s something more than a a simple qsr and anything anything like that has anybody like that jumped on. 14:18.71Andrew GlantzYeah, and I mean we have plenty of casual dining and fine dining restaurants and lots of you know we’re about half mom and pops and restaurant groups compared to chains and um, you know we’ve seen that they’ve done well on gift to meal too. It’s just figuring about. 14:26.83vigorbrandingUm, sure. 14:31.99Andrew GlantzHow to promote the program in a way that fits into the restaurant’s customer experience seamlessly. So for instance at a qsr like fast casual brand. They might be able to have a table tent up on the table or a window cling in the drive-through window. 14:36.34vigorbrandingHere. 14:49.67Andrew GlantzAh, so that customers know how to participate in gift a meal and they can scan the Qr code at a fine dining restaurant. You’re not going to put a table tent on a white tablecloth and so it’s figuring out. Okay are you going to have something on the menu so customers know how they can participate. Is it going to be something in like a check presenter. Is it going to be a little menu insert. 14:58.74vigorbrandingA. 15:07.83Andrew GlantzAnd so we’ve had fine dining restaurants be successful, but um, you know there’ve been in terms of our kind of core restaurant grouping it more falls in the line of qsr fast casual casual dining. Um at the elevated casual dining. Um and not as much like super. $4 sign fine dining restaurants. 15:29.50vigorbrandingThat’s great. So like um obviously ah businesses have um times where they’re They’re busy like sales times and gift and meal. It lends right into the holidays gift right? And so I would think this is a great time and probably arguably. 15:39.29Andrew GlantzYeah. 15:43.92vigorbrandingMaybe the middle of the summer would have been the time you’re out there really pushing this but during the holidays this gift meal seems like it could be a great time for you to really kind of like catch fire and and and again I know that ah the last thing the food banks probably needed on Thanksgiving or the day before is a turkey right? They’re probably pretty well covered. Unfortunately and and it’s an important thing to to be honest, all year round for sure I mean this is something the the food banks need food probably more so ah other times a year than than during the the heart of the holidays I guess I’m just wondering. Ah, do you find this to be a good time to talk to people because again the gifting a meal and and feel people sort of feel maybe a little more. Ah, apt to be generous this time of year so selling through and maybe even seeing. Do you see more participation with the the customers in the restaurants at this time of year. 16:29.73Andrew GlantzYeah, it’s good question so I’ll kind of walk through those 3 different groups. The food banks the diners at the restaurants and the restaurants themselves for the food banks I mean they do have a big need in the holiday season and just in the winter season in general when it’s cooled outside. They have a spike in the need for services. In the summer months that is particularly challenging for kids that are facing food insecurity because they don’t have access to the school lunches and um, you know so filling that meal gap for the kids is something really important for the food banks but you know they really just need more support all year round for the food. Banks. 16:54.55vigorbrandingUm. 17:06.25Andrew GlantzOn the ah you know diner side of things that people dining out at restaurants. You know we see that in the season of giving in the holidays people are really apt to use a program like gift a meal and kind of lean into it and something that makes them feel good about themselves and that they’re really actively looking for and so it stands out to them in a really positive way. Um. Again throughout the whole course of the year you know we’ve seen that people are looking to give back I mean there were a couple consumer culture reports. Um, that were done by fuse marketing and 5 wpr and it found that 84% of Gen Z would said that they would be more likely to purchase from a brand if they give back and. 17:42.70vigorbrandingA. 17:44.88Andrew Glantz71% of millennials said that they would pay more for a product if they knew that some of the proceeds were going to support a good cause and that’s regardless of the timing of the year in terms of the restaurant side of things this time of year is tough to get the ear of restaurant owners and executives just because you know holiday season people are busy. 17:53.97vigorbrandingBut. 18:01.11vigorbrandingYeah. 18:03.24Andrew GlantzUm, and so you know typically in terms of you know those types of conversations we get a lot of people saying this is great. Let’s talk in January for the next year but then we also see people that say hey let’s talk now because we’re setting our budgets in November and December Four 24 18:18.29Andrew GlantzUm, or you know we want to launch this on January First we have a number of restaurants that are already set to launch on January first and so that’ll be something really exciting. So you know it’s a little bit of a mix of everything sometimes restaurants are looking for things for the holiday season. Um, but once we’re already kind of in it. Um, you know, just. People in general at any job get busy during the holidays and yeah. 18:38.75vigorbrandingYeah, they got to make their way through right? So and you know I mean um, again I keep sound I’m impressed by the model I Love it and we you know in in in our company. We have several different agencies and one one is an agency that focuses on restaurants vigor and I will. I Going to be sure to talk to our clients about your your your product I think it’s ah think it’s a great I Think it’s a great product I think it’s ah I think makes ah you know you always look for win-win in a way I mean your’s like a win-win win right? The food banks and the folks the food banks are helped the people going to the food banks are helped. The patrons are. 18:57.17Andrew GlantzThanks. 19:10.56vigorbrandingFeeling good about themselves and it’s it’s great marketing for the restaurant so you got like 4 wins there and that’s ah, that’s pretty unheard of so. 19:15.23Andrew GlantzYeah, and tad and another one something that’s kind of cool from the marketing agency perspective um is that with gift tomeal. We give a restaurant access to a dashboard where they could access all of the user-generated content created from the program and they have the rights to use that content in their marketing and social media efforts. 19:28.88vigorbrandingNice. 19:32.58Andrew GlantzAnd so we’ve had our partner restaurants give their marketing agency access to the dashboard so they can create some really cool engaging. Authentic user-generated content pieces to push out in their marketing efforts. That’s been something really cool to see and what the marketing agencies have kind of. 19:37.80vigorbrandingLove it. 19:48.97Andrew GlantzTaken and run away with with gift a meal. 19:49.21vigorbrandingSo if I if I did the math race. It’s around seven hundred bucks a year per location is that is that simply how it breaks down at $59 a month or whatever something like that. Yeah. 19:58.41Andrew GlantzYeah, so that’s the price for an independent restaurant to join for a single location if a restaurant has 5 plus locations we discount based off the number of locations. So if a place has over 30 locations then it’s $39 a month per location if they pay monthly or 34 if they pay annually. 20:05.32vigorbrandingUm, okay. 20:14.22vigorbrandingGotcha. 20:17.65Andrew GlantzUm, and so you know discount rate for more locations they can go month to month with no commitment and cancel at the end of any month. Um or they can pay annually for a slightly discounted rate because it’s you know it’s more predictable cash flow for us and um for budgeting but um, but yeah, so you know it’s a. 20:30.12vigorbrandingSure. Absolutely. 20:36.71Andrew GlantzTry to make it affordable and have a flat predictable rate for budgeting for the restaurants and we cover all the cost of the donations from there. So we have 6 of us on the team right now. So you know we’re small and scrappy stay lean. 20:42.57vigorbrandingI Love it How many employees do you have nice, very cool. That’s hey it’s a way to be if you’re an entrepreneur and you you want to make it. That’s what you got to be? you know the last thing you need is is lots and lots of Pete mouths defeat. But. 20:53.00Andrew GlantzEven. 20:57.82vigorbrandingAre you doing all the sales are you the guy hitting the the payment or you have a team now. 21:01.94Andrew GlantzUm I have a team. Um, yeah Allison and Danny are also working on the sales as well and they’re wonderful. Um, and you know like they’ve you know they’ve started to have some really great ones like I mean Lee’s famous recipe chicken with 130 locations 21:13.58vigorbrandingAwesome! yeah. 21:16.52Andrew GlantzThat was Danny who brought that in in pizza factory with 110 locations that was Allison and then gong cha with 162 that was me and so you know the 3 biggest sales were all from 3 different people on the team and so to you know, really progress in the business to not just be founder led sales is something that. 21:26.34vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. 21:34.48Andrew GlantzHas been really exciting because it shows me that you know we actually have something here. Um, that’s beyond myself and um, you know it’s something where I always want to be kind of involved in sales because I want to be having that customer interaction and be learning what customers need and how to further adapt our product and. 21:36.36vigorbrandingIs. 21:51.79Andrew GlantzAh, you know at the end of the day sales is what’s going to be most important both to grow the business grow our revenue and then also to grow our level of social impact and give the most meals possible. Um, but you know where you can grow a lot faster with people like Danny and Allison on our team. 22:07.86vigorbrandingThat’s great and obviously too I mean scalability is huge right? So you can’t be the guy all the time. So the more that others can can I’ll say enjoy and feel good about the sales. Ah the better it is for your company. It raises right? You know high tide rises up all the boats. So that’s ah, that’s fantastic. So. 22:11.89Andrew GlantzYeah. 22:21.57Andrew GlantzAnd. 22:23.30vigorbrandingAgain as an entrepreneur like you know and have a lot of respect for what you’re doing here. You’re grown fast and you recently beat out 35000 applicants to win an Amazon small business grant. Can you talk about that talk about the program and and it so makes you be very proud of. 22:36.44Andrew GlantzYeah, yeah, I mean I thought it was throwing a dart at a very far away dartboard when I applied for it. I mean like you said 35000 applicants and um with a big name competition from Amazon Business it was something I thought we had no shot at. Ah, but you know I fill out the application because why not it took me 10 minutes to fill out the application talking about kind of our traction our growth over the last year we’ve doubled in size and kind of the vision for where we want to go and um I got the alert that we were 1 of 10 finalists and. Ah, you know that was something that was really exciting and started to think okay, maybe this is something that’s possible and then Amazon business opened it up to everybody with an Amazon business account to be able to vote. Um it was blind voting so we had no idea how many votes we had um and as one but vote pre Amazon Business Accounts no one could really rig it. Um, and it. You know we ended up finding out that we won and we got a $25000 non-dillutive grant and that was something that was incredible and Amazon actually flew out here to St Louis and they had a team of like 11 people to film a video and take photos and all this stuff and that’ll be coming out soon and. Ah, you know it was just something that was a really cool experience and to feel the support from the Amazon business team was incredible. Um, and you know the funding um to be able to support us goes a really long way and so yeah I mean it was something I was. 24:05.54Andrew GlantzPretty flabbergasted with and a positive way and very very grateful for to really push forward with our mission. 24:07.18vigorbrandingIt’s awesome. 24:13.76vigorbrandingThat’s great. So ah I mean so there’s more people on the on the camera crew for Amazon than in your company. 24:17.39Andrew GlantzYes, it was. It was a wild experience like we filmed at the food bank that we work with in St Louis we filmed at one of our partner restaurants and it was it was quite the production. 24:28.70vigorbrandingThat’s great, very cool and so $25000 you probably just went out and what had 1 hell of a dinner right? So what you know I’m just kidding what it ah caviar jets champagne no. 24:35.40Andrew GlantzNot not quiet I I think that that that goes kind of right in you Yeah not not quite more on sales marketing and products. Yeah. 24:44.21vigorbrandingYeah, excellent, Okay, good true. Um entrepreneur I Love it I Love it I Love it. That’s fantastic. What other what other advice. What advice do you have for other entrepreneurs who have a dream or have an idea is there anything you want to? ah you know, throw out there. 24:57.51Andrew GlantzYeah, that’s a good question I mean for other entrepreneurs I Think the big thing is if you have an idea talk to people in the space, especially those are that are going to be your potential partners or customers to figure out the problems that they’re facing and the pain points I think something with gift to meal. 25:11.61vigorbrandingIn. 25:15.31Andrew GlantzUm, but I figured out is that everybody is busy and figuring out how to make things as easy and plug and play as possible was what we found a lot of success with so making it no effort for staff. No mental energy for the restaurant to have another program to have to think about just be really simple and easy. Um and have every touch point. 25:21.71vigorbrandingUm. 25:34.77Andrew GlantzUm, with the customer be something that’s important is something that I figured out and then I think more than anything. It’s just getting out there and doing it and seeing what the response is like and learning and being willing to fail and having a low ego so that you know you could admit when you’re wrong and. 25:35.76vigorbrandingYeah. 25:50.80Andrew GlantzContinually iterate and learn and and like reimplement and just kind of go from there and I think that if you’re also just kind of a kind person and put yourself out there that you know people will want to help you succeed People are generally good and. Um, don’t be afraid to ask people for help in a reasonable way and um, then also you know always make sure to give that back to support everybody else along the way just as those have supported you. 26:18.46vigorbrandingThat’s great and you just like probably put together what you could put a book together on because I mean as far as being an entrepreneur I mean like some of the things you hit I just think are just absolutely ah poignant. Ah, you know don’t be afraid to fail I mean you know I personally have started businesses I’ll be honest

opsi is a daily workflow app built to progress the way modern operators manage their restaurant. With robust recipe management, true recipe costing, task and food prep lists, and product guides, opsi is suited for any operation looking to maximize efficiencies within their kitchen team, and cut down on employee training times.James has 20 years of experience in the hospitality industry and a strong vision for technology’s role in it. His time in the kitchen has taken him from New Jersey to Rhode Island, Washington DC, San Francisco and Minnesota. As a chef, James has worked alongside industry-leading chefs such as Michael Mina and Gavin Kaysen, giving him a profound understanding of restaurant operations. The inspiration for opsi came early in James’ career after he took over as chef de cuisine in a restaurant that was in the midst of change and facing issues with internal communication.   QUOTES “(Being a restaurateur) is a wild and challenging business. From any angle, as an operator it’s even more challenging because you’ve got 50+ people banking on you.” (James)“I love the stories behind entrepreneurial ideas because they’re usually very simple, very true and very authentic and that’s what makes them wonderful.” (Michael) “Technology was a space for me where we could develop a solution where we could keep all the information in there, keep the team on the same page and marching to the same sheet of music and moving in the same direction.” (James)“(opsi) made it easier for us to focus on the larger goal, which was servicing the guest and putting out a really high quality product.” (James)“In any kind of creative business, there’s organized chaos and artistry but I agree that people need and love process. A little organization isn’t a bad thing.” (Michael)  “My belief is that anyone – from a food truck to a three-star Michelin restaurant – can utilize opsi.” (James)   TRANSCRIPT 00:01.48vigorbrandingHello everyone today I am joined by someone who knows a lot about how to run an a fishing kitchen his name is chef James Pasa Faro James how you doing say hello and give us a little bit of your backstory. 00:17.65JamesHi thanks for having me. Um, yeah, my background I started in the cooking culinary world when I was really young something I really wanted to do from a young age bounced around a bunch ended up in Minnesota. I work for some really great chefs like Gavin Casean and Michael Mina and um here I am now working in technology which I never thought I probably have to say out loud. 00:42.10vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. We’re gonna talk about opsy here in a little bit but where did the whole love of cooking come from like where did it start I mean how did you? How did you happen upon it. 00:51.22JamesYeah, um, you know a lot of the times I think generally this story kind of goes for people. It’s like you know they’re cooking in a kitchen if they’re grandmother or mother some some family member or it’s a family-owned operator. My parents. Ah, my mom was in sales for telecoms so she worked for att my father was in floing so he worked worked in union in New York and then he owned a business in New Jersey where we grew up and he just had friends that were in hospitality so they would always throw a a game dinner every year at a restaurant called perona farms and it was run by 3 brothers and. 01:09.94vigorbrandingAnd. 01:25.26JamesThey’re they’ve been in business for over 100 years now and they’re like in their sixth generation of family running it. But at the time um Kirk was the chef and he was kind of running this program where he could. Ah, bring in local hunters and fishers and cook a dinner each year and kind of run it for friends and family and kind of started blossoming from the late 80 s to early 90 s where he actually um, he launched a really successful smoke salmon business and he started sign. Ah the likes like Danielle on Louis Palydan um wolfgang puck 01:54.87vigorbrandingUm, wow. 01:55.80JamesKind of all over the country and then he started bringing these really large name chefs to this game dinner every year. So when I was like ten or eleven it was every Tuesday of every year for first Tuesday every year they would close the restaurant prep for the weekend weeding up to that Tuesday and then these chefs would come off from all over the country and at the time I had. You know and no idea it was like mingai and Robert Irvine and Danielle Balloud and all these people um, but what really drew me to it was just it was seemed like friends having fun together and it was the energy of the space and the camaraderie and the food was obviously a plus on top of it. But it wasn’t ever that. Ah. That magic moment of like something hitting the pan or me tasting something. It was more about being in an environment being around people. Um, and I think really just like the culture and the energy that was built around it at the time was what really drew me in. 02:42.85vigorbrandingIt’s fantastic and the game dinner sounds awesome. Yeah, you have to at the end here if you have ah a recipe for Elk I Need I mean I I always have a freezer full of Elk I’m a diehard hunter and you know there’s nothing better than having a great meal with friends around something you know that you’ve actually worked really hard for so. 03:00.94vigorbrandingAh’s it’s because it’s not easy to cook game I mean it’s not I mean people ruin it a lot so that’s fantastic. Um, so you work in Minneapolis San Francisco Boston um, did you ever have a desire to do your own restaurant. 03:01.38JamesNo, it’s not. 03:15.61JamesUm I did I mean it’s obviously still there right? Ah, you know you travel different paths and it’s something I definitely want to do at some point I hope to pick it up in the future. Um, but it’s ah as you know and people you talked to.. It’s a wildly challenging business. Ah, from any angle of it. But as an operator. It’s you know ever more challenging because you’re looking at 50 plus people that are banking on you. 03:39.33vigorbrandingYeah, and no question Plus well and be an entrepreneur though. But you’re now so you jumped into the tech. So that’s so much easier than running a restaurant right? Ah yeah. 03:46.48JamesUm, bit different ah different skill set different different patients level. 03:52.50vigorbrandingSo how talk a little bit about ah opsy I Mean you’ve said in the past the idea of opsy started with a simple concept right? You know how to get rid of the paper clutter. You want to talk a little bit about that and you know the brain child behind it I Love entrepreneurial I mean I I consider myself one and I love the stories behind them because they’re usually very. 03:59.87JamesYeah. 04:07.95vigorbrandingSimple. They’re usually very true. They’re very authentic and that’s what makes them kind of wonderful. 04:13.31Jamesyeah with opsy um yeah I was about 26 in San Francisco I was working for Michael at the time. Um I just took over as chef de cuisine for a restaurant called r and 74 that was in the fiai. Um, and it was this really beautiful french. Burgundy restaurant built on a great wine program and I was drowning I um, you know took my first step into the really deep end. They trusted me with a lot of so lot of things inside the restaurant and what I really wanted was just something that I didn’t have to chase around paper. Um I didn’t have to. Print all this stuff off overcommunic communicate fill the binders up and I kind of went on this search for something that I thought should have been out there at the time we all had iphones and we all still have iphones and Android devices and there was these like little computers in our hands every day that I just assumed there had to even been something right? and when I went out and looked it. Didn’t really satisfy the need. So I kind of went down this path with my friend and we started building. Yeah a dodpercent. 05:15.12vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. Necessity is the mother of invention right? So so oil stained prepless and recipes you want talk a little bit about that. 05:28.31JamesYeah, it was um yeah we were. We were going through this large change at the restaurant I I came in as an executive soou chef and then when ah the chef Mike Graffiti left I took over as a Cdc for him. Um, it was you know it was very disjointed in communication. It was kind of hurting the team because it was more of a a survived less thrive situation on a day-to-day basis. Um, and we really were very leaning forward into systems and system orientation for communication and kind of removing a lot of this gray area which a lot of restaurants are gray generally. Ah, removing a lot of the gray in this human element of just like collecting the physicals and having to put them on stations and keep them in places because you know they get oil spilled on them and you have to rewrite them or print them out again. Um, but always having a backup somewhere and technology for me was that solution to kind of develop a space where we could keep all the information in there. Keep the team all on the same page marching in and singing off the same sheet of music and moving in the same direction so that every single day when they came in they knew the goal. They knew what their goals were and what they were driving towards and then once you kind of for us when you got rid of a lot of minutiae of like where is it who wrote this who did that who did this where as a recipe. Um, it made it easier for us to focus on the larger goal which was servicing the guest and like putting out really high quality product opposed to just making it through the day because the system was broken. 06:52.28vigorbrandingYeah I mean in any kind of a creative business which obviously being a chef is super creative in a kitchen I mean there’s that organized Chaos. There’s that artistry. But I think I do agree I think that people need and love process I just spent unfortunately way too much time talking about that as far as our business you know. Keeping the time and keeping things organized so that they they are. They’re able to thrive right? A little organization certainly isn’t ah isn’t a bad thing. Um, but talk about your partner and and how your partner got into it in the business and how it got started and all that. 07:10.50JamesYeah. 07:21.67JamesYeah Matt is wildly talented. Definitely completely different skillset than I have he spent a lot of his early career in videography design. He’s done all the architecture from the backend working with our cto justin writing all the code. Um, and he’s done all the uiux experience for opsy which I think is really powerful because the the whole idea is that when I was conceptualizing the idea we were running into these walls of just really large enterprise systems that just weren’t resonating with what I needed every single day and we needed to make sure that the tool we designed and built had to be very streamlined trim light feeling. Not so dense and cumbersome. So Matt is amazingly talented. really really smart he’s taken an incredible approach from just a design perspective and user interface perspective I think he’s he’s setting us up for a ton of success because it’s it should be something that you could easily pick up understand get into get out of and get back to work. 08:19.89vigorbrandingFantastic and opsy recently partnered with ah Gavin Caseson is that correct notable chef ah James Blair word winner. 08:26.88JamesYeah, yeah, Gavin has um, yeah, been a ah longtime mentor friend boss lots of different capacities advisor investor. Um, but ah when I first met Gavin I came out to Minneapolis to dodge at belcour and spoon. Um, and it’s kind of in between what I was going to do next and we’re winding down in San Francisco and he offered me a job and I you know, kind of just expressed the idea that you know if we continue down this path talking about opportunities that I wanted to make sure you understood there was things that I was working on and that I would need this duality of support as I make me this next. Step forward. Even though I didn’t take the job at the time because it wasn’t the the chef role that was open. He immediately gravitated towards us and he became our first adviser very early on probably going to back six years now and then when the opportunity came up to move to a swoon and stable. We started piloting the actual project inside the restaurant. So it was um. 09:22.95JamesBlessing in a curse right? You’re kind of drinking from a fire hose at that point when it comes to feedback when you’re given it to your team. 09:27.13vigorbrandingAbsolutely so I mean you know obviously organization in any business is super important and this is an opportunity for you I guess to sell your dream or your vision here. What types of restaurants need your tool the most like who do you see as your primary customer who’s who’s the most suited to. To to to be involved in the Opsy platform. 09:49.49JamesYeah, we get this question a lot. Um, generally my belief system is that anyone whether it’s a food truck to a threet star Missioncheland restaurant could utilize opsy multiunits single concept multi unit multiconcept the. At the end of the day. There’s a there’s a very large event diagram of functionality that all is true within restaurants right? You are producing food. You’re managing people. You’re pretty prepless like all these things are just common truths throughout the whole industry. So. We started in a place of like a spoon and stable upscale casual. This is just based on my background and Kavin’s background and we built it for the 4 walls of that restaurant and it works extremely well and as we continue developing. We’re focused more on both going downstream to more fine dining restaurants but also on the opposite side of that stream. Going into more casual qsr virtual brands to make sure that you know the tool still fits. We don’t we don’t develop in any specific way that it’s like okay this really only works for Thomas Keller or Danielle or Gavin this doesn’t just work for you know the Mcdonald’s or the larger change or the the quick growing franchises. It’s um. 10:50.64vigorbrandingUm. 10:57.25JamesWe take a really honest approach and when we when we work with a company whether it’s your business or a multiple tuda businesses that that are our partners Now we yeah we have lots of conversation with how we can be become better. 11:07.82vigorbrandingIt’s awesome. It’s awesome. Well I know in this industry I mean I I started my illustrious career in a restaurant like most well I shouldn’t say most everybody did but I was a dishwasher and but I was very fortunate actually because I worked with ah a gentleman who was. Pretty ah, well known it was in Hershey Pennsylvania and he was a chef and he had his own place and it was sort of his last sort of ah chapter he wanted to just do his thing his way and talk about the oiltained recipes I mean this guy was crazy. Um, gourmet magazine was begging him for his. Ah. 11:22.73JamesOkay, you know. 11:39.23vigorbrandingCoconut Cream Emmaellatta recipe. It literally died with Him. He would not let win the building when he made it and I mean there’s a lot of that old school sort of philosophy and like artistry I mean how how how is this help with that I mean are you finding resistance from those old school guys or is everyone really realizing hey look. We’ve got to. We’ve got to have this product ah to help streamline things. 11:59.48JamesYou know when we first started it was a matter of like trying to delutter and reorganize and kind of update because there’s been very little focus on the back of the restaurant when it comes to technology tons on the front. But you know as time goes on I think especially with covid covid has kind of changed the way people think about. 12:13.29vigorbrandingUm. 12:17.82JamesBut staffing and all the hardship that everyone is going through from finding staff now that people want tools that help them do more with a little bit of less systems ultimately scaffold that structure and allow people to do those things because there’s you know a rubric to work within um and now we are starting to see it’s less of we’re not here to convince people. Of what they should be doing I’m not going to be a ah person trying to give in someone how to change the way they run their business. It’s up to them to make that decision. But when we find the people that are coming to us for this Problem. It’s it’s something that is it clicks like they see it immediately. They understand they need to solve the problem and you see it on both ends like older chefs will have to eventually come to this idea because. 12:56.62vigorbrandingWho. 12:56.73JamesThey’re hiring younger and younger cooks and servers and people every single day that the tool has to meet them at their staffing where they are today and yeah when I’m not very old but I’m not young anymore. Um. 13:09.68vigorbrandingJesus. 13:10.85JamesWhen I started. It was like take the muskin out and listen to me talk and write it down and if you don’t write it down. You don’t know what’s going on and now it’s like if I had to give a binder of paper to an 18 year old kid coming off the street to be a prep cook like he’s going to look at me cross-eyed. So we’re we’re hoping to help meet these people this workforce this new generation of cooks and chefs. Where they are and they’re far more technically inclined than any generation before they they grew up with it in their hands. Their whole lives. 13:36.72vigorbrandingIt’s it’s wonderful I mean it’s ah as I was saying earlier necessities of other invention. It makes total sense. It’s a simple concept but it’s a great concept and something it’s it’s absolutely needed I mean where do you see yourselves going in the next day two three years I mean what’s what’s your vision for the business. 13:48.56JamesWe Want to you know obviously bridge a lot of these gaps we want to again meet the people where they are. We want to help bring a little more insight to the day-to-day operators and start to segment out a piece of business that is not so financially high minded. Financial high-mounded tools are great for the controllers cfos accountants of the world but it doesn’t really help the operators that are running the restaurant a day-to-day basis scheduling cooking things like that. So we’re hoping to be a distillation of information at some point it sit in between those tools. Um, and then you know we’re. people that believe we need to stay focused on what we’re great at um and we’ve built a really great tool that I believe works well and we’re going to continue embellishing on it and progressing and changing and ideaating on the tool and making it better and a lot of my focus now going forward is finding strong partners that are also likeminded that are. Best in class technologies that we can work with and we actually you know in the next couple weeks and months we’re going to have a few announcements coming out about some of our partners that we’re working with and people that I I put high value on and what they’re doing and believe they are best in class. 14:53.59vigorbrandingIt’s awesome. Yeah I mean it’s It’s ah it’s remarkable and it’s ah it’s great I mean and I think you have the the absolute right perspective on growing a business you got to stay focused and and take it to the people that need it and and I love it I Love it I’m looking forward to seeing what what the future holds. 15:04.19JamesAnd. 15:08.61vigorbrandingUm, so I have to ask these are we do every year we do food and beverage Trends and restaurant trends and technology obviously is just always there. Always there. In fact, it’s hard to find things that aren’t tied to technology for a trend. 15:14.50JamesFood. 15:21.33vigorbrandingUm, we we read a lot and heard a lot about robots and Kitchens and all that I mean what do you? What’s your honest opinion about Robot servers and that kind of a thing. 15:30.32JamesUm, you know they have their place I’ve been I’ve been to the sushi train places where the the robot brings you your drink and like drives cocktails around for sure. It’ll always exist the the robot cooks like the sweet greens of the world I Think there’s definitely a place for it. There’s you know. 15:33.98vigorbrandingYou. 15:47.82JamesVery fast casual grab and go type situations that definitely serve that purpose. It will fill a gap for sure. Um, for like everything in the middle market I even think like all the way down to fast casual. Yeah I think technology is going to continue growing in a way that helps bolster the human element because. For me again going all the way back to being eleven ten twelve the reason I came into restaurants is people when you go to a restaurant and you sit down and you pay money you you get a server that is talking to you get a cook that is cooking the food. Yeah um. You ideally have a consistent experience but it’s always never going to be the same It’s always going to hopeful build and build and build for you and if you start removing that? yeah humanity out of the experience. Um, and I think all the way down to you know, fast food service elements. There’s. Still pieces of it that the humans are going to be so I believe like technology itself. Everyone’s going to want to talk about Ai replacement of people robots I mean it’s just not realistic. It makes sense. So I think we’ll always go down that path in certain segments. But I think where where technology really needs to go and should go is. 16:48.32vigorbrandingUm, the hunt. 16:59.62JamesHow do you better? The human experience while they’re working and how does that bolster of the human experience while their employees of that space bolster The human experience as a guest and how do you engage with them differently and continue driving that experience and bringing them back. Whether you’re picking up a burger. You’re sitting down and spending thousands or hundreds of dollars on a meal. 17:17.30vigorbrandingYeah, and I mean I love that answer and and I mean the robots are kind of kitchen kind of cool. Whatever’s neat sort of trendy maybe but I love the idea your technology is one that that allows humans to do a more efficient job. Hopefully it’ll drive more. 17:31.76JamesDo. 17:34.74vigorbrandingHappiness culture better experience for the guest and I think at the end of the day you’re right? That’s what we all go out for right? We want that human experience. We want to. We want to be with friends or ah, you know business associates and just have a great time and it’s That’s the overall interaction. It’s The. Ah, the servers. It’s everybody that’s involved that that makes it fantastic and makes it it. It makes an experience right? So I think ah I agree with you I Love the human side of things versus ah maybe what were the robotic side. Um, yeah, That’s right, That’s right. 18:00.81JamesI Mean if we go all the way to robots you’re gonna It’s not go be hospital tow anymore. It’s gonna be something completely different. 18:09.51vigorbrandingThat’s right, is there anything else, you’d like to tell us about opsy I mean anything else about your business the future What you see for technology. Ah any ancillary products anything like that that you want to talk about. 18:21.50JamesNo, we’re you know we’re hoping to push out a bunch of updates here. It’s um, you know the the technology piece is a process that ah, that’s new to me because it’s it’s not so physical. It’s not tangible. It’s more of a conversation then there’s there’s other people that are smarter and better than me ah doing the work and. I kind of I kind of wait for the results to test and play with um, not at the moment we’re we’re really just excited about some of the partnerships we’re going to announce and also um, yeah, we we love being substantially footed inside the hospitality you know with myself my background Gavin we have a couple other. 18:45.57vigorbrandingUm. 18:55.68JamesChef advisor investors that we’re going to kind of bring to the forefront and it’s it’s going to be our prime focus of having these types of conversations and create dialogues with our chef partners to make sure that we are developing the tool in a way that is applicable to their day-to-day life not from a perspective of James has been removed from the kitchen for a year and a half and 19:14.21vigorbrandingUm, yeah, you’re always in Beta right? I mean you’re always in Beta and it’s It’s a tough thing I’ll see for me personally I had to learn like with the the dev work that we do and things like that it is that. 19:14.30JamesHe still believes. He knows what he’s doing because he hasn’t work in the kitchen anymore. Um, it’s it really needs to be rubber meets the road type development. Yeah. 19:30.26vigorbrandingYou know I’m used to in life start and stop like here. We make this and it’s finished but this when it comes to software and anything development. You’re always in beta so um, all right? Why? Yeah, absolutely so I got one last question all right if you had 1 final meal. What would you eat and where and why. 19:31.73JamesWho. 19:38.71JamesThat’s constant churn. 19:49.95JamesUm, you know I hate to bring it all the way back to the beginning of the conversation. But um I I spent a lot of time in the kitchen while early days in the kitchen with my father as he like spent time around his friends. Um, and one of the first things I can vividly remember not making but help put together was a venison carpacco dish um with with ming sigh and it was like toasted sesames hot sesame oil slice Ven Venison Tenderor wine and like a bitter green salad and. 20:13.00vigorbrandingUm, this. 20:23.98JamesBeing an 11 year old kid I’ve never had anything like that or you’re close to raw food and I the the idea is so visceral my mind I think from just the weekend leading up to it and being around my father and being around all these types of people if I had to have 1 final bite. In my life. It would be going back to that moment in time and um I think that is like the the white switch that flipped in my mind to say like you know food is what I want to do because I don’t have to do social studies anymore if I do it? Yeah, we hunted fish still all the way up growing up. 20:55.45vigorbrandingAh, that’s that’s fantastic. So was your father also a hunter then. 21:02.50JamesAh, mostly like upline foul stuff. Yeah. 21:02.72vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. Yeah, very cool, very cool. Yeah I share those passions big time. Um, what’s your favorite game meat. Would it be that or is there ah venison Ah birds I mean. 21:15.12JamesUm I love duck obviously um, we have amazing duck producers out here and then pheasant because that again going back to the experience like the first time I learned how to break down a full bird was um. 21:18.76vigorbrandingWho. 21:32.65JamesJalo we poed on and it was right a year or two before he passed away but it was like just learning experience and it’s not going from like cleaned animal from a bag to the table breaking it down. It was like feathers and heads and wings and like. 21:48.41vigorbrandingUm. 21:49.14JamesEndto-end learning how to do it. It was a really cool experience. It’s something that really super value because it’s applied everywhere right? Ducks Pheasants Chickens Geese All kind of the same. 22:00.67vigorbrandingThat’s awesome I mean like I can totally relate I mean I’ve done all that but never not nearly as sophisticated as you have I can guarantee you that but I mean the whole thing from the you know field to to to table. 22:10.26JamesAnd. 22:12.30vigorbrandingAnd ah and I’ll say this the fun and the camaraderie that comes around with it stories. It’s just ah I mean it’s just something I crave. In fact, if you’re anywhere near my cabin on any given weekend. There’s bourbon being poured and Elk burgers or ah backstraps being being provided I. 22:16.66JamesYeah. 22:30.10JamesAh, so. 22:30.80vigorbrandingI Cook all the time up there for everybody and people just stop by. They see my lights on the not even invited people will stop in because they know I’ll probably be making Elk or you know pouring a good wine or bourbon and it’s It’s always a nice time. So I totally respect that. Absolutely absolutely. 22:41.15JamesAnd well we’ll have to talk offline about that one then. 22:47.75vigorbrandingI listen it James it was fantastic I really enjoyed talking to you I appreciate your time anything else, you’d like to leave us with. 22:53.39JamesNow. Thank you I Appreciate this love to stay in touch and just appreciate giving us a platform to talk about what we’re doing and we’re excited to keep on going forward with everybody. 23:02.12vigorbrandingAbsolutely hey and best of luck to you I Love what you’re doing and I love the attitude behind it. It’s excellent, well done. Thanks. 23:07.31JamesThank you appreciate it.

Home Run Inn is a family owned & operated establishment with nine restaurants throughout the Chicago area. They’ve been making pizza since 1947 and began creating and selling frozen pizzas for grocery store distribution nationwide in the 1960s.  Dan is the 4th generation leader of Home Run Inn Pizza. He started in the family business at the age of 13 as a busboy. Home Run Inn’s signature square-sliced pizzas originated in the 1940s when the tavern would slice the pizza into small sample-sized pieces to entice customers. The restaurant’s frozen pizza was born after a regular customer used to request par-baked pizzas to take to his summer home in Wisconsin. Home Run Inn Pizza has a synergistic relationship between the restaurant brand and the frozen brand and doesn’t view the relationship as cannibalistic when it comes to sales for either brand.   QUOTES “Everyone who has a restaurant wants to get into CPG. They want to put it in grocery stories. They think it’s easy to do CPG.” (Michael) “Our first distributor was our bartender. He would take pizzas after work, walk them down to the corner grocery store and pick up the cash the next day.” (Dan) “Our frozen pizza production facilities model and mirror what we did in the restaurants. My uncle would say, ‘The reason we make it like that is because that’s the only way I know how.’” (Dan)“Pizza is like sex. It’s all good, but some is better than others.” (Michael) “The (Home Run Inn Pizza) restaurants drive brand awareness on the marketing side for our frozen pizza.” (Dan)“A brand is a promise. Many times, an agency is hired to create that story or build that authenticity. What’s beautiful about what Home Run Inn Pizza has, is that (story) is already baked in.” (Michael)   TRANSCRIPT 00:00.22vigorbrandingAnd with some great guests and so I thought well we should keep it going. It’s good for social media. It’s good for you know it’s good. So I mean you know I’ll be honest’ve I’m only done a few of these but it’s been fun and you know I don’t know it’s just ah, you know the guys do a great job. So it turns out all right? yeah. 00:06.19Dan CostelloUm, yeah. 00:16.98Dan CostelloUm, cool, Awesome. Look forward to it. Don’t give hi. 00:19.29vigorbrandingYeah, yeah, yeah, know yeah this will be this will be a lap for you I mean you know it’s just just like your story and I mean it sincerely I mean great story, great family. Great product. It’s just you know it’s just it’s just super cool. We got a guy here working the production Robert who you’re already his fan. He’s a huge fan of home run his friends. 00:28.80Dan CostelloGun. 00:36.54vigorbrandingTook him there and he you know is one of his best buddies is out there archer ra and thirty first street with archer a thirty first yeah Yeah, so yeah, yeah, so yeah, yeah, heyan on one thing we’re you know can keep casual and loose. We’re already kind of rolling here. Um, just 1 thing he got to do once we kind of finish up the convo. 00:42.27Dan CostelloAh, okay, nice Robert very good. 00:55.40vigorbrandingWe just gotta have you hang on the line thus til your tilll your file kind of uplis what locally so we’ probably just got hang out for extra 10 minutes when we’re done reporting just to make yeah just to make sure everything you know gets off load quickly and everything everything like that. Okay, we’re wrong. So guy you’re ready cool hi. 01:02.40Dan CostelloAt the end of it. Yes, yes. 01:12.79Dan CostelloUm, new promise. 01:14.91vigorbrandingWell again, this will be fun casual tell stories. Enjoy it. It’s all good. So I’m I’m ready when if Dan’s ready if you’re ready Robert yeah, we’re good to go best all right. all right 01:24.43Dan CostelloHi whenever you’re ready I’m good Mike. 01:31.36vigorbrandingHello everyone I am joined today by my good friend and our guest Dan Costello Dan is the Ceo of home run in pizza in the Chicago area now home run in pizza says a lot right there Dan You want to say hello and give us a little backstory. 01:46.66Dan CostelloHi guys mike good to hear from me again. Yeah so home run in is a family owned pizza establishment in the Chicago area. We have 9 local restaurants including one that is a partnership in midway airport. We’ve been in business since nineteen business started in 1927 and pizza business started 1947 and we also along with the restaurants we have frozen pizzas. Ah, in across the country. So we’re nationwide with various retailers like Albertson Safeway and they were regional with other retailers like Walmart and um and Kroger and then you know find ourselves in the southeast southwest and covering coast to coast. So. That’s the core of what we do. 02:33.18vigorbrandingYeah, it’s it’s ah it’s it’s an amazing story and so it’s super near and dear to me, not not only your friend but with Vigor we’re we’re obviously really passionate about restaurants and restaurant brands. But. Quench another company we own and have started. It’s all cpg so you cover both worlds. So this is really super intriguing and as I said near and dear to my heart. But let’s talk about how did you get started? Yeah, ah, you’re a bus boy at age 13 you would talk a little bit about the the early days of of Dan’s career 03:00.41Dan CostelloSure, um, so yeah, so I think I said a fourth generation. So it’s family business so we grew up. We grew up in it. We were encouraged especially very early to come into the business. So I you know I started when I when I was 13 I started. As a bus boy at our original restaurant on thirty first street on the on the southwest side of Chicago there store still there. It’s doing really well so grew up on the restaurant side of the business. So that’s back in the oh there’s probably back around 1984 1985 and my uncle who unfortunately no longer is with us. That’s when he really started making a big push to try to take our restaurant product into the frozen ah retail section of the grocery stores. So. He was kind of the driving force behind that 1987 he built our first factory which is behind that original restaurant. Still there today. We still use it. We have a main facility now out in the suburbs of Chicago and Woodridge Illinois but that’s ah you know that was kind of the the advent of the frozen pizza goes back. You know quite, it’s grounded in the roots of our restaurants you know making par big pizzas for people cooking them halfway people taking them home. So my uncle is just kind of like we got to figure out how to how to do this on ah on a grocery type scale. 04:26.53vigorbrandingVery cool. So okay, it says on here. You’re also sausage grinder now some would consider me a sausage grinder my role now but you can talk a little bit about that you started as a kid. You’re a sausage grinder this is the sausage thing um from what I understand pepperoni is the number 1 topping in the United States except for. 04:32.37Dan CostelloThat’s a question. 04:43.31vigorbrandingIn Chicago. 04:44.18Dan CostelloChicago Midwest maybe Milwaukee too I’d have to check with the people there but we know in Chicago the number one pizza dock and sausage. It’s it’s ah yeah, it dates back I mean it’s his historical I mean we just got a lot of ah eastern european that settled here they they went with sausage. So um. 04:48.88vigorbrandingYeah, yeah. 05:01.70Dan CostelloYeah I mean we did everything from Scratch. We’d make our dough. You know we blended our sauce and we would one of the jobs I had as a teenager which was Definite. Weve had a butcher shop I worked in the butcher Shop. We’d get In. We’d get in pork and we’d have to take the bones out So and then we’d we. We’d cut it and then we’d. Grind it. So I Guess yeah, it’s sausage Grinder. You know that was that was a job in the past. 05:25.88vigorbrandingSo I love some of the the history of it I mean it was started in the restaurant I mean I think you told me the story and I’ve I’ve noticed it before I knew you would you know go round pizzas but somehow you guys decide to cut them up in little squares. Why why did you do that. 05:42.30Dan CostelloYeah, so the history on that is you know so my grandfather got out of the war. Um, so nineteen circuit 1945 right and he gets comes back and he’s looking for a job and he was you know he’s a mechanic by trade. 05:59.10Dan CostelloBut he couldn’t find he couldn’t get a job so he went to work from my motherin-law who owned a bar called the home run in and so he’s working at the bar for you know a couple years and he had he he had come. Ah, you know he’s from italy from bar italy so he has you know a version of pizza my grandmother encourages him to. Show it to my great grandmother so they start making it in the restaurant and giving it away to get people to come in to drink and um so what they did is they cut it into small tiny squares. That’s why Chicago tavern pizzas is cut in squares this listen. You know from our perspective this is how it started for us because they needed it to fit on a cocktail napping. They didn’t have plates. They didn’t have China they they weren’t a restaurant. They were a bar they were just trying to so they’re just trying to get people to yeah have a little snack by another beer so that is why our pizzas are cut into. Tiny squares and a lot of the pizzas in Chicago because that’s how it was introduced. It was introduced as this we’re one of the first pizzas in Chicago we started in 1947 we believe that you know like there might have been another 1 or 2 competitors starting in 44 45 but that’s how it came to be for us cocktail mac and head fit. Had to give it away. 07:16.19vigorbrandingThat’s fantastic. Can you tell tell me the story because again, it’s such a cool history. So your Uncle’s in the pizza shop talk about how you got into the cpg site the frozen pizza I mean that’s like everyone’s dream whoever makes or has a restaurant. Ah you know they want to do a dressing. They want to put it in the grocery stores everybody thinks it’s. Easy to jump to cpg? How did it all start with you. 07:36.70Dan CostelloSo I mean if you really go all the way back. It probably goes the story goes back to the 50 s for us where a customer comes into the restaurant. Um, so my uncle’s young at this point and he’s just probably hanging out and. The the gentleman comes in and he he wants a pizza and he wants it to bake bake it halfway he tells my grandfather so we call that par bake today you guys just like bake it halfway my grandfather was he said why? Why do you Why don’t you want this cooked all way and the guys this was our first frozen customer he goes I want I take it home. I’m going to put it in my freezer my icebox right? and he goes I spend the summers up in Wisconsin so he goes I want you to make me a dozen so I have them for the summer up in Wisconsin and he goes and so our original frozen pizza was ten inches because a ten inch pizza would fit in an icebox because it wasn’t freezers back then. So people had ice boxes so that I think my uncle saw that so then the sixty s come around and you know actually we had ah bartenders like hey why don’t we make more of these and I’ll on my way home I’ll stop at the corner grocery store I’ll drop them off. And then I’ll see how many they sell and on my way back to work the next day I’ll pick up the cash and how many they sold and I’ll bring it back so that’s even our first distributor was our bartender he would take the pizzas back to work. He’d walk him down of the corner grocery store pick him but pick up the cash the next day bring him back. 08:58.73Dan CostelloSo my uncle’s growing up in the 50 s and sixty s watching this and and restaurant expansion happens in the seventy s he’s working on that and he he just has this just this vision that hey there’s probably a better way to make these pizzas freeze them. And get him into the local grocery store so he really started investigating that probably in the 70 s and then in the eighty s he starts talking to the local groceries here which back then it was Dominic’s and jewel jewels still here. Dominics is no longer here. Um, but those were the 2 big grocery brands. 09:26.98vigorbrandingStraight. 09:34.97Dan CostelloAnd he starts he starts selling them and he’s then starts figuring out how to make it and the only way he could he knew how to make it was to make it like we made in the restaurant which was to make it in this parb bake format. So he’d make them in the restaurant. He’d put them in the oven. He’d parb bake him he’d throw them in the freezer. He’d wrap him and then he’d start selling in the grocery store. But year over year he just tried to figure out how do I do this better How do I get automation in this. How do he so he had to learn this whole thing. So our our frozen pizza production facilities really model and mirror what we did in the restaurants all these years and my uncle would tell you today if he was still with us. He said the reason we make it like that is because that’s the only way I knew how to do it. So yeah. 10:13.92vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. Yeah, and I was fortunate I was actually with you on a tour you gave us a tour and I was able to try it right there par baked and it was delicious then we actually compared went to the restaurant and compared a frozen to the restaurant pizza and I I say this because it’s True. Um. Was almost as good and I mean almost as good which I think is says ah a lot. Everyone loves Pizza. You know I’ve got this terrible saying that that pizza’s like sex. It’s all good somes better than others right? So I Just think ah ah that that I was amazed how close and how good the frozen pie was and I mean I just was it was it was tremendous. 10:41.78Dan CostelloSo let. 10:48.80Dan CostelloAnd the process real similar so he I give me like he had a very he had a very clear vision on how he wanted to do this and yeah, he spent a lot of years Bc you know equipment had to be developed over you know back in the 70 s and eighty s in order to do this and he was. 10:51.00vigorbrandingUm. 11:05.42Dan CostelloHe was integral in working with people and saying this is what I needed to do? How can we do this and you know got us to where we are today. So it it positioned us really well and you know so we have a healthy restaurant brand and now we have a healthy Cpg brand and you know the restaurants really drive that brand awareness in the marketing side for the frozen pizza. 11:11.28vigorbrandingMeet. 11:24.17Dan CostelloThat’s what why? that’s what makes us a little different than a lot of our competitors you know majority. You look at the competitors and in the freezer case. There’s really only 1 or 2 that have restaurant background and roots of California pizza kitchens one and that’s about it. You know you can find a couple regionals here and there. But. 11:36.74vigorbrandingIn this. 11:41.72Dan CostelloThere’s not a lot of people who do both. 11:43.83vigorbrandingRight? And with all due respect to California Pizza shouldn’t really come from California right? It just doesn’t feel right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it doesn’t feel right? Um, but I mean how but so talk about the the relationship between the restaurant and the frozen product. The cpg product. 11:46.28Dan CostelloI That now you yeah have me way. Yeah will be kind. We’ll be kind right? so. 12:02.00vigorbrandingAh, one drives the other the other drives the other I mean you know it’s ah it’s ah it’s a neat thing because a lot of people have one and they want the other and somehow it’s just kind of organically happened with you. 12:10.10Dan CostelloYeah I mean again, it’s it’s the way that the business grew I mean we call it our flywheel now you know, really these restaurants you know we started in 1947 you know in today we feed we feed over two and a half million people a year out of our restaurants. 12:25.68vigorbrandingWell. 12:27.81Dan CostelloSo You know for us, it’s It’s if if the most you know, Um, if the deepest level of connection with somebody is like is that type of taste experience. It’s a really hard. It’s a really difficult marketing um to to duplicate you know. With just pure dollars and say hey try Myself. We’re actually feeding like our marketing is feeding people and having them talk about the product and enjoy the product and having create these great experiences at our restaurants which is why we do a lot of a why the restaurants allow us to be parts of the community. You know you know once you’re in a restaurant. Yeah we can. We can. 12:47.40vigorbrandingNo. 13:03.63Dan CostelloWork with your local lily we can talk to you you know with your school. We can. We can be part of the community which then gets people to understand our brand nor our brand trust our brand and then that trust we we know translates to when they’re walking down the frozen ile grocery store. So the synergy there. A lot of people ask us like well doesn’t the restaurants hurt the frozen with the frozen hurt the restaurants but we don’t see it like that at all, we see it very very synergistically and I you know thankful that our our product translated from a restaurant into a cpg brand. Um. It’s a hard thing to do and I know like you said like I’ve learned from you a lot of people. This is what everybody wants, but it’s not an easy trick right? It’s very difficult to pull off so I’m sure timing had some of 2 for us I mean we each Joe was an early adopter and moved down this early in the in the career and the life the life cycle of homer in. 13:46.62vigorbrandingSo I. 14:00.81Dan CostelloSo I’m sure that helped I think the fact that it’s a good product. It’s a really good product helps I think that we’re dedicated and our teammates are dedicated to making it the way we do and to be parts of the community that helps so it’s all these pieces have to come Together. You know so you can gain trust with the customer so that they’ll they’ll continue to invest in you. And continue to purchase that product So That’s where it’s um, that’s how I see him working you know the the parts of our business they’re they’re complimentary and they both depend on each other. 14:23.73vigorbrandingLittle. 14:29.68vigorbrandingYeah, it’s It’s very I think it’s a very pragmatic way to go about I think it’s smart it just they just should feed literally no pun intended off of each other because they’re both great brands and the the restaurant might have more history but because the history it allows that. That flywheel if you will to to capture the cpg side and again, yeah, then the product’s great so you get the product in people’s mouths and the rest is is History. You talk a lot about your uncle and obviously 4 generations of family owned and operated how important is family owned and operated for the brand. 15:06.39Dan CostelloI think it’s I mean it’s really important I mean we’re very proud of it. Um I know the the my brother and my cousins that I work with there’s a lot of pride I mean we grew up in it. So it means a lot to us. You know when we don’t. Do a good job and we hear from our customers take it very seriously. Yeah I think you can you don’t have to own something to you know to care for it that way. But I think it certainly doesn’t hurt. You know that we’re very invested in it. So it’s important to what we do who we are. It’s important to our teammates I think our teammates enjoy and like knowing that we’re here and that we’re involved that we’re not absent owners I think that’s a really important cultural aspect of a family business if you can be ah, a present owner. Think that makes that’s meaningful to the people that are helping you build the thing you know we can’t do this without our teammates and we got over 500 and um I kind of view it for us is that we owe it to them to be present and in the trenches with them as we can as we do this every day. 16:14.36vigorbrandingVery cool I mean you know people always say when you own restaurants and restaurants are volaging in my family and it’s like you’ve got to be there right? And then you know couple that with a brand you know when I put my I’ll say my marketing hat on a brand is a promise right. And you know, many times an’s hired to create that story or try and build that authenticity and what’s beautiful about what you have is. It’s already baked in I mean again, just right there family owned and operated everyone Cares. It started with the restaurants. There’s a story a history a reason for being. And then it just kind of goes from there. It’s just so really a natural ah concept and it’s It’s just it’s just Wonderful. We talk a lot you know about controlled expansion for any brand. Um, what are some of the mistakes that you’ve seen pizza franchises or chains making they’re popping up everywhere. Um, when expanding it to say new markets Or. Maybe a new way of doing the same thing or new Concepts and and maybe hit a little bit about what what are your thoughts on expansion I Mean do you have anything that you’re looking forward to in the future. Is there anything that you have in back your mind or anything you want to share. 17:18.72Dan CostelloYeah I mean I think you know we’ve made plenty of mistakes I mean some of it is. It’s you know the the world’s changing and how people are using restaurants is changing. So I think you have to be in tune with that like I’m not We’re not that interested in open up the 250 see pizzeria anymore like we did back in the 80 s and 90 s right. Have to pay attention to that and sometimes you’re a little slow to to identify that trend I mean even though it’s been coming for a long time like we’re recognizing now for us to grow our restaurants. Um, you know we have to do it differently than what we than where we came from I think you know overall I’ve always been confused. When I talk to people that are in there the the restaurants side of the business particular and they tell me they’re going to a new market and they’re gonna open up 50 stores and I’m like that’s great, but like like in 2 years or 3 years and like but how do you know? they’re gonna work like you know for us, we probably take a much. This might be part of our company culture and history I mean look we’ve been in business since you know the 1947 started making pizzas and then actually the bar business goes back to 1927 so I just will probably take more of a cautious approach like open up, you know 1 to 3 stores and how they work. 18:19.56vigorbrandingI purpose. 18:32.64Dan CostelloYeah, how how you doing I Just I’ve always been fascinated people open up. But again, it’s a it’s the it’s probably most of these are franchise systems are looking old. They have different. They have different desired results than we do and different desired outcomes right? So you know our desired results is when we go to a new market is. 18:38.35vigorbrandingYeah, yeah. 18:50.88Dan CostelloIs this restaurant going to synergistically support and facilitate growing our frozen Cpg brand and if it doesn’t do we need to do it. You know so we have those type of conversations all time because you know the frozen the frozen brand’s growing. 18:59.67vigorbrandingUm, right. 19:08.21Dan CostelloAnd the restaurants we’ve been a little bit more stable in the last couple of years just trying to get through this pandemic and get through hiring but we’re looking at some opportunities where we think we can go to other marketplaces outside of Chicago and do the same thing we did in Chicago by tying our frozen business in our restaurants together. 19:24.87vigorbrandingLove it. 19:27.19Dan CostelloThe the biggest kind of the biggest thing we want accomplish is build I Like how you said it earlier a few minutes ago that you know Brand is a promise right? and so that’s what we want to do we want to make sure that our brand is building trust with our consumers right? It’s a promise to them. So for both the restaurant and the cpg side. So I Think. You know with expansion too like what are you gonna do differently what?? What’s the value proposition for people and what value are you going to serve for them and we want to just be in that Position. We’re one one of the only pizza brands that we can help you whether you want to come out or you want to stay home or can be there for you right. 19:59.88vigorbrandingAnd you nailed it to I obviously your goal is not to slap a sign up in every town in America and just ah pump stuff out. It’s not a franchise. It’s not ah, it’s not you know these are company-owned stores for lack of a better word and. 20:03.60Dan CostelloSomebody else doing that. 20:17.95vigorbrandingAnd I Also think it’s really really smart How you look them out as as Marketing. Ah how how they play off each other for the frozen side I think that’s ah, a really smart way to go about it. I Love that concept. It just makes to me. It makes all the sense in the world. Um, so okay, I’m going to ask you some a couple questions here and hopefully these these answers don’t get you in any trouble. So. There’s very very difficult high level pizza questions. Okay pineapple and pizza. Yes, or no all right. 20:36.19Dan Costello5 20:43.55Dan CostelloNow Warm pineapple This is gross I’m sorry yeah. 20:49.49vigorbrandingAh, ah feels feels a little California doesn’t it all right dipping pizza and ranch dressing. Yes or no I love it. That’s right thoughts on white pizza. Okay. 20:55.21Dan CostelloNow is the cross isn’t any good. Yeah, yeah. 21:07.39vigorbrandingDeep dish pizza is that still pizza tough one. 21:13.12Dan CostelloYeah, sure I think so I’m from Chicago deep dish pizza’s pizza. Yeah yeah, yeah, ah, 2 3 times a week 21:13.53vigorbrandingYeah I was gonna say you could alienate some locals if that one that’s a little tough and how often do you eat pizza. Nice and and show he’s on pizza you know is that something? Yes, yeah. 21:28.50Dan CostelloNot for me, It’s not for me. Yeah, not a lot of people in our market. Do it? Um, but yeah, we we have a little bit of it. But this not much I don’t see a lot of it in our stores. 21:39.80vigorbrandingYeah I think I was like ah more of a big East Coast thing and I felt like it was ah you know, maybe a whole generation ago I remember doing it I remember hearing about it I actually ordered one one time and I love pisa it like 1 of my favorite things in the world was open a box of fresh fresh pie and I did it 1 time and with anov I thought this week exciting. Want to try this. Was god forsaken and I actually like ancho he so I was like no way ever again. Never again. So. 22:00.35Dan CostelloYeah I just I don’t see it a lot I’m not seen it I’m not seeing it come up at that much I mean even when I was you know working in the restaurants every single day small percentage. Yeah. 22:13.43vigorbrandingThat’s funny all right? So my very last question I’m gonna actually take pizzes off the board here I don’t think he should be allowed to say that or answered with that answer. But last question if you had 1 final meal. What would you eat where and why. 22:29.14Dan CostelloOh man, what would I eat where and why? um, she’s I’ve had that’s probably a question I think if you ask me I it probably changes based on my time of year my mood and whatnot. But I think at the end of the day. Unk go with a steak right? You know I’m gonna go with the classic of you know, great steak and steak and fries right? not working I have that I’m not a hundred percent sure we got a lot of choices in Chicago. Um. 22:47.22vigorbrandingThis is. 22:54.12vigorbrandingNice there you go. 23:02.20vigorbrandingOpen. 23:02.74Dan CostelloGibson’s comes to mind is one of those a place that just never disappoints. There’s this place ah down the city called the vets beef just fantastic. Great owner operator there. So I think those would be a couple things that pop in my head about where I might want to spend a last meal soly I don’t have to do that anytime soon. 23:20.49vigorbrandingI Hope not I hope not any last things anything else you want to say anything you want to leave us with. 23:21.36Dan CostelloNight map. Yeah. 23:29.60Dan CostelloAh, well one and this is fun then really appreciate you having me on it. This is I think for anybody listen this first time ever been on podcast. Hopefully I did. Okay so yeah. 23:35.51vigorbrandingHe did. It was fantastic I thought it was great and I I Love you know you one of my favorite people and I always enjoy talking to you So it’s a layup right? It’s just easy. 23:43.49Dan CostelloYeah, this was a lot of fun. But yeah I to anybody listen keep going out to eat right? Restaurants and grory stores need you. So yeah, we’d love to keep love to keep serving it. You got Mike. 23:51.48vigorbrandingIt’s right, very cool. Fantastic Dan. Thank you so much. It was a pleasure.

Joseph is the former host of Forktales and is currently working as the VP of Digital Experience for 3 Owl. He’s also the author of “Stop Blasting My Mama” (a book about effective email marketing) and “The Bullhearted Brand: Building Bullish Restaurant Brands That Charge Ahead of the Herd.” Joseph’s book, “Stop Blasting My Mama,” tackles the topic of email marketing and how modern marketing is overrun with overly aggressive terms – like blast and campaign – to describe what should be a friendly and civil interaction with consumers. Consumers today have more power today and can ignore brands – or cancel brands – whenever they want to. Technology is changing the restaurant industry and restaurants need to get onboard with that technological evolution or risk being left behind.  QUOTES “One day we’ll be able to do a podcast without mentioning the pandemic. Today is not that day.” (Joseph)“I always cringe when I hear the words ‘e-blast’ or things like that because it’s antithetical to behaviors of humans in general. Nobody is walking around saying ‘Gosh, I really hope I get blasted today.’” (Joseph)“I like to think of this world that we’re in as one big party. If you walked into that party alone and you said at top of your lungs, ‘Hey everyone, I just want you to know that I’m really cool.” You’re immediately not and you’re going to have a hard time convincing everyone that you are.” (Joseph)“Restaurants are the backbone of every single economy – from micro local to federal. If you lose restaurants in the city center, you’ve lost the city center.” (Joseph) “The first victims of AI are the ones who phone it in. The mediocre hamburger won’t be there anymore.” (Joseph) “Bro, we are not eating bugs. It’s not happening. Unless there’s some sort of nuclear holocaust, Americans are not eating bugs.” (Joseph)  TRANSCRIPT 00:01.20vigorbrandingWell hey there um some of you watching this may be a little confused right now usually ah Joseph is on ah on the left side of your screen and for those that who are watching ah this podcast. The reason he’s on the right side is because he’s a guest a guest today. And I was honored to be 1 of Joseph’s guests way back when um, the reason we’ve switched sides is Joseph has accepted another position. He’s no longer with vigor or the provone marketing group but he’s off into some wonderful new things that he’s going to talk to us about and we’re excited to to catch up with Joseph. Um. For those don’t know my name is Michael Pavone I’m the Ceo of the provevone group and we have several different agencies in our holding company and we’re excited to talk to Joseph. He’s created 67 fantastic episodes and we’re going to hit a little bit of your. History the the the good old days. Ask you some questions and just just find out what you’re up to. 00:55.28Joseph SzalaAwesome. It’s great to be here. 01:00.95vigorbrandingAh, since you’re in your house. It probably is always great to be there. But anyway, all right? So ah, let’s see let’s it’s talk. Let’s talk about a little bit. What have you been up to talk about your career which you’re heading to now and what you’re excited about as far as the restaurant industry and technology. 01:04.39Joseph SzalaThat’s right. 01:17.37Joseph SzalaYeah, yeah, so um, as you said I forayed out of the advertising and marketing world into more tech forward focus and space I’m currently vice president of digital experience at a transformation company There’s not much detail I can say but. We’ll we’ll say that we’re building an experience management system for restaurant brands. Um, you know what? What really got me excited about the tech space is how much this industry is going through a breakneck speed digital transformation. Um. one day we’ll be able to do a podcast where we don’t mention the pandemic today’s not that day. Um, the pandemic really spurred on any mules that were out there and now everyone is realizing that tech is not the way of the future. It’s now and um, part of that is how how do we get people. Ah, through ordering faster quicker keep them happy. How do we pull some of that share of wallet away from third -party delivery and then more importantly, how do we make sure that brand teams have access to the tools so they can um pivot and make pivots in real-time all through a singular. Portal that brings together an average of 5 to 8 different systems. So very nerdy stuff but that’s the stuff that I get excited about. 02:39.70vigorbrandingIt sounds like you have the secret sauce. It’s awesome I Mean you’re right I mean obviously the whole world’s Changed. You see these lines that drivethroughs the delivery services you see the the clients trying to get their share back because these delivery services have come out and taken you know their hands in their pocket and it’s really been. Ah. Ah, it’s It’s amazing how that how fast that happened It’s certainly the pandemic exacerbated it. So it’s It’s kind of ah, kind of interesting to watch and I’ll be great to watch you and what you’re doing as the time moves On. Um, Okay, so let’s jump back a little bit. Ah you don’t like blasting people with emails. Ah, you want to talk about that. 03:15.85Joseph SzalaI don’t like blessing people in general I think it’s a broader what which started as sort of um, a tongue and cheek thing or not a tonguein cheek thing but like 1 moment I always cringe when I hear the words eblast or anything like that because it’s inethetical to. Behaviors of humans in general. Nobody’s walking around saying gosh I really hope a brand would blast me today. Um, and it sort of harkens to like the old school mentality of advertising and marketing when I say old school I mean like way back in the day where we were just doing billboards and magazine ads where it was push push push push push. Well. The the people have the power they have the power of no no longer just turning the dial as we used to say in the in the tv days um or flipping the page they have the power to completely ignore a brand and shut them out and even more so they have the brand the power to cancel a brand if they get too aggressive and so. Blast then as I pondered it more became ah almost a um I want to say rallying cry but it’s going to be more the same There’s just a lot of violent terminology in our industry and it’s kind of sad because we’re not at war with people. Um, we’re we’re looking to befriend and hopefully get some people to fall in love with our our clients. Um no matter what side of the creative or um, consulting table. You’re on the goal is to get them to love the brand and you’re not going to do that. 04:47.20Joseph SzalaBy blasting them or launching a campaign another war term. Um, it’s it’s more How do you become friends and and I like to think of this world that we’re in as as 1 big party and if you walked into that party alone. And you just at the top of your lungs said hey everyone I just want you to know that I’m really cool. You’re immediately not and you’re going to have a really hard time convincing anyone that you are after that moment yet. That’s how we approach things today we meaning the collective creative advertising industry. Um, and so that really has kind of settled into maybe more of a um personal purpose to 1 identify better terminology. Um, for all these various things. Um, that is a little more in line with what we’re actually trying to do and and that’s that’s why I hate the word blast. 05:50.95vigorbrandingThat’s fantastic. Um, you also wrote a book. Do you want to talk a little bit about that. 05:53.98Joseph SzalaYeah, 2 books. So the first book is stop blasting my mama which is essentially building off of that whole line of thinking. It’s specifically about emails. But I think maybe one day in the near future. It might get expanded into general messaging marketing theory who knows. 05:57.80vigorbrandingRight. 06:13.56Joseph SzalaUm, but what I would call my greatest achievement in in the literary sense to date or not literary because it is nonfiction. But um, it’s called the bullhearted brand which is evocative of more I would say a general thinking and approach to how brands are built. Ah, fostered grown encouraged all the words and then of course marketed and all that other stuff and so the idea is um, boiled down into a bunch of different I would say 10 different um anecdotes that then. Unfurl into Theory. Um I’ve read a lot I’ve done a lot and this just happens to be the culmination of all my knowledge at the time and it’s something I’m pretty proud of. 07:02.60vigorbrandingVery cool and you should be now speaking of proud I know you did 67 episodes this is my first. What’s your advice I mean yeah obviously I’m not as good looking as you so strike one now where do we go from here I mean like what do I do? How give me some advice on. 07:13.58Joseph SzalaOkay, yeah. 07:20.24vigorbrandingAnd how to be an engaging podcaster or. 07:22.15Joseph SzalaYeah, So what’s good is you have a fantastic history of being able to speak So You’re a pretty good Order. So when I when I talk to like a novice or someone who’s looking to start I would say the hardest thing that you’re going to have to do is get rid of the ums and the Us and the other filler words. Um, you’re pretty good at that and so that that doesn’t need to be delved into further. Um I think it’s yeah and I just said um, too. Yeah, so. 07:45.27vigorbrandingBut now that you put that in my head. 07:53.97Joseph SzalaWhat? Ah, That’s usually the toughest thing for people to do. It seems like we’re very uncomfortable with silence and pauses. But you start to get really used to them and it becomes an empowering moment I think is when you just stop and let the silence be what it is um on the other hand. I Think one of the other good things is just letting the guest talk but that actually starts not with the host it starts with the production team and making sure that the kind of guests that are brought on have something valuable to say so when when a guest is rambling on I might be doing that Now. It’s really easy to want to jump in. 08:23.10vigorbrandingVery cool. 08:30.93Joseph SzalaUm, but when a guest has something really powerful to say it’s a lot easier to sit back and let them go. 08:33.75vigorbrandingFantastic. So the thing second thing I learned is it’s all the the production team’s fault if it’s not good. Perfect well done. That’s great. That’s that’s that’s take home value. That’s take home value. Fantastic. So so I want to ask another question on your on on the the blog. 08:42.47Joseph SzalaUm, that’s right, Yeah, you’re the talent you you could just point the finger. That’s okay. 08:53.43vigorbrandingOr the blog I’m sorry the the podcast 67 episodes which one was your favorite. 08:58.98Joseph SzalaAh, man it’s such like God is so hard to say it’s It’s like when you have friends or or kids or or in your dating life. It’s like every one of them was different and every one of them was amazing and terrible at the same time. Ah. 09:12.22Joseph SzalaNo I think there was generally some great insights coming from people I was really impressed with it’s really hard to to keep them apart. Um Carl oresburn which I think his episode should launch soon and Meredith Sandlin um they’re just so brilliant and they’re at the absolute forefront a digital transformation from a hardware and software side. Um, you know early, you mentioned a lot of the transformation that’s happened on the front end like my drivethroughs and my and my lines and everything it’s easy for people to ah, not know. Unless they were in the industry and forget if they are no longer in the industry. There’s an entire backoffice engine behind the scenes that have to make stuff work. So I mean they’re in the nitty gritty especially Marilyn or Meredith. She’s absolutely crushing it so much insight and it was. 09:48.13vigorbrandingSure. 09:59.28Joseph SzalaBoth of those episodes were episodes where I wish I could have had more of a Joe Rogan format where it would have been three or four hours long um surprising was ah chef Scott Conant one I was surprised that he agreed to come on so that was awesome. Um, for those that don’t know he’s on. Tv Networks he’s very well-known. But what’s so surprising is he his approach his demeanor his intelligence. Um, and just him it was just a really really good talk and one of my prouder moments as well. 10:32.96vigorbrandingVery cool I mean it’s It’s ah it’s interesting to me as you know obviously I’ve seen podcasts and doing this now being on this side is really ah, really interesting because it is all about the the guest and it’s what they have to bring and I sit back and I ask myself too like what do people want to hear. What are they going to want to see and I’m thinking about people that have just great stories entrepreneurs people that have built things from nothing people that have just really you know taken a category if you will and expanded on it that that kind of stuff that excites me I don’t know if that’s something that that everybody else would would would glom onto I mean I know the. Technology I mean obviously all about food and beverage and restaurants and all that but the technology is super important. It’s changing a light speed. Did you you spent most of the time with the technology side of things in the restaurants or did you find that it just hearing people’s personal stories about how they got involved is that do you think that’s intriguing to guess. 11:22.94Joseph SzalaYeah I think it is I mean the reason why I’m so passionate about restaurants is they are the backbone of every single economy from micro-local the wholeway to federal and I think people forget that and that includes franchise systems and franchisees. If you lose restaurants in a city center. You’ve lost the city center. Um, it happened I would say decades ago. Ah, for instance down the street from Harrisburg in York you know York was a ghost town. What brings people back food restaurants. Do. 11:54.67vigorbrandingUm, yeah, yeah. 11:57.28Joseph SzalaGood restaurants and then comes the retail and then comes the businesses because they want their people to be in a bustling location with lots to do and then comes the residences people want to live there but without the restaurants you get none of that. Um, and so that to me is such a powerful thing and. 12:09.30vigorbrandingAh, right. 12:16.90Joseph SzalaI Think in that vein the stories of how people got into that powerful industry are always interesting I think founders. How did you found the concept and grow it is another one. Everyone wants the secret sauce yet? No one wants to realize that there is no secret sauce. 12:31.58vigorbrandingRight? yeah. 12:34.66Joseph SzalaThat the secret sauce from 1980 s is not the secret sauce from today. Um, and that I think how you know how how things are evolving today and how do these leaders continue to grapple wrestle pin down and ultimately win in an ever-changing environment with all these. Shifts that seem to have accelerated so quickly after the the big p. 13:01.76vigorbrandingThat’s Good. So what? What do you? Think’s next for restaurants I mean the technology you’re working on obviously is exciting. Ah, we do marketing of restaurants I mean I’m sure we’ll continue to work together in the future. What What do you see as ah. I Don’t know what’s next. What do? What do you think is going to be the the new thing or the thing that we have to really understand. 13:22.37Joseph SzalaYeah I think some of it is aligned with every other industry mediocrity has no place any longer. There’s no place for it Ai the first victims of Ai are going to be those that phone it in so your mediocre hamburger. It won’t be there anymore or if it is it’s going to be replaced by. Ah. 13:31.65vigorbrandingHe. 13:39.59Joseph SzalaBy robotics and ai in in general I know it’s a really big 2 letters but um, at some point I think we’ll also see a complete shift away from the mindless person punching keys on ah you know on a register. And instead becoming more of a helpful entity to help people actually order from kiosks you kind of see it happening in retail already. Especially if you’ve used the self-checkout at grocery stores or or um, you know like Target or something there are people there whose job is to just help. 14:09.66vigorbrandingM. 14:15.38vigorbrandingYeah, yeah. 14:16.92Joseph SzalaMake sure you know what you’re doing make sure you’re able to get through I think we’re there especially for qsr restaurants. Um, there are restaurants out there that don’t even have those people they just have cubbies and there’s a person that backed that makes the food puts them in the cubby just like the old automat. It’s been rejuvenated and. 14:27.25vigorbrandingOh. 14:36.31Joseph SzalaThere is a time and place where and I think we’re we’re at both right now. Full service I think you’re going to see a divide. You’re going to see a bigger schism between casual dining and fine dining where fine dining gets even higher touch with people who actually not only know the wine menu. But actually know the nuances of the wine If. That’s an option at this particular fake restaurant that are very deeply integrated and are very high touch and most of us have had that experience and when you go to that and then you go to like a sort of fine dining or just full service. Man. 15:04.63vigorbrandingOkay. 15:12.67Joseph SzalaThat’s just going to get so much bigger whereas casual dining I think will become more tech enabled to where you can be more self-service but still have that sitdown moment and then there’s the great frontiers of Self-d delivery or self-driving vehicles and what that means for delivery. Um, can I sit in my. Vehicle of the future and order directly from my screen that’s in the car without getting in an accident of course. Um and then what does virtual Worlds and the metaverse start to look like um in general and that’s where I start to get really weird with you know, ah, 3 D printed food and things like that. But. 15:34.30vigorbrandingOh. 15:48.74vigorbrandingYou. 15:50.90Joseph SzalaEverything that sounds insane today next year probably won’t be insane at all. 15:54.12vigorbrandingYeah, very interesting How about like you you spent a lot of your time branding and helping create Concepts. What do you see? I mean there’s There’s so many out there. I Mean do we have too many.. What do? What do you think is going to happen where is there a genre that you think is going to be prevalent or or place that people are going to head to I mean I don’t think we need another burger joint right? I mean there’s just so many burger joints right? So What do you?? What do you think?? What do you think from branding standpoint what’s going to be What’s What’s next. 16:17.27Joseph SzalaUm. 16:23.86Joseph SzalaYeah I feel like if you ask any anyone of the pundits that talk about Trends and and what’s coming they’re they’re always going to jump to bugs like I swear every year I see a food Trends report. Not um, not on the retail side but maybe on the retail side but when I’m looking at restaurant stuff. It’s like and bugs. Bro We are not eating bugs. It’s not happening unless there’s like some sort of nuclear holocaust like we’re just Americans specifically will not be eating Bugs. Um, but I think I think outside of that there are a number of paths that. 16:45.40vigorbrandingYeah, yeah, yeah. 16:59.20Joseph SzalaThat can happen for concepts I think exploring robotics exploring alternative for wall experiences like I know some folks who are embracing all outdoor where the food is cooked outdoors. Everything’s outdoors. Um. Very gorilla very interesting to me I don’t know if it would have a su but as far as trending we just I think finished up the chicken sandwich wars um I think taco wars are bubbling. Um you know and and we’re seeing it Taco Johns for instance, just released their. Ah. 17:27.16vigorbrandingO. 17:35.27Joseph SzalaTrademark of Taco tuesday along with a call to action from Taco Bell to do something charitable when they use it and donate Taco Bell ignored it completely. But we’ll see if they embrace it? Um, but the fast food tacos are something that I would definitely keep my eye on. And then I think we’re still looking for what’s that next american food staple. You know we have tacos pizza. We have hamburgers like you said what else you know what? what else are we going to embrace. 17:56.33vigorbrandingWho. 18:05.82vigorbrandingYeah, yeah, you know it’s funny I had this idea one of my dreams was ah I wanted to create my own restaurant franchise. So my idea which was a terrible one by the way is I wanted to buy a location near every like single a double a triple a ballpark right. And I wanted to call it baseball hot dogs and apple pie and I just wanted to sell hot dogs and have different hot dogs on the menu named after the players tied into the players and then different like Apple pies like that’s it and a draft beer so you can have it outside the ballpark. It would be a sports bar and everything else I just thought it had enough of a niche and I always wanted to create that business I just thought it would be the most fun thing and anyway. 18:24.37Joseph SzalaUm. 18:30.40Joseph SzalaYep. 18:43.29Joseph SzalaYeah, it’s probably why you still have money? yeah. 18:43.82vigorbrandingI never did it but maybe one day and it probably fail. Yeah, exactly exactly it’d probably fail. So yeah I know I know how to stay in my lane. Ah all right? So so great I mean this has been fantastic now we going to go down through memory lane a little bit here. Ah. 18:50.96Joseph SzalaRight. 18:59.68Joseph SzalaAh. 18:59.87vigorbrandingAnd ask you some questions we’re going to test you on your knowledge of your guests and ah boy I hope no one ever does this to me. Ah, and we’re and and I’ll remember my first guess I’m good I got that one down so that’s 3 things I got nailed down from this this interview. Um, who was your first. Forktails guest. 19:19.50Joseph SzalaOh yeah, so it’s funny. Ah, the first forktales guest was my friend sam slaughter he was also a copywriter at vigor at the time to known for bathing with a bunch of cheese balls. 19:25.71vigorbrandingIt’s correct. Oh. We We won’t dig into that any deeper. But anyway, ah, ah, all right? So which guests did you have on the show more than once. Yes, very good, Very good. 19:34.86Joseph SzalaUm, listen to the episode. 19:44.15Joseph SzalaJustin Bartek yeah 19:49.15vigorbrandingAll right? Let’s see here which guest is described in his episode as let’s see here lover of seafood and honesty. 20:00.10Joseph SzalaThat is chef Andrew gruel. 20:06.80vigorbrandingAnd you’re nailing them here. You might might have someone give you the answers ah finish this quote from your interview with Meredith Sandland if someone comes here and tries to take my blank. It’s going to get really ugly very good. 20:19.42Joseph SzalaMy gas stove I stand by that. 20:23.50vigorbrandingAh, good. Ah all right? which guest beat Bobby Flay 20:32.66Joseph SzalaAh, Kenny Gilbert right yeah oh man, best chicken sandwiches man if you’re ever in Jacksonville chicken sandwiches and champagne. That’s all you need to know. 20:35.12vigorbrandingThat’s correct. Yes, it is very good. Yeah, nice, nice sounds like a perfect combo all right, which guest was born and raised in Hawaii and is now a chef in Denver very good, very good. 20:51.55Joseph SzalaAh, Chef Choy Guard Yeah, all about that Aloha ohanna. 20:59.80vigorbrandingAnd which guest said this is said my job as ah as lead creative is to give everyone creative whiplash. You never know where we’re going to do next. 21:07.76Joseph SzalaThat is the guy from liquid death whose name I’m blanking on Andrew Pearson there it is yep. 21:14.55vigorbrandingAndrew Pearson yep very good and the the folks of liquid death are killing it no pun intended. So right finish this quote from you in your interview with Lauren Fernandez 21:22.62Joseph SzalaUm, yeah. 21:29.75vigorbrandingYou can tell how well a restaurant is managed if you just look at the. 21:35.38Joseph SzalaGod landscaping now. 21:40.14vigorbrandingYou know what? The only thing they wrote down was blank. So I can’t answer it. The only one I don’t have an answer on you don’t have an answer on how about the bathrooms I would say the bathrooms. 21:48.40Joseph SzalaYeah, it could be bathrooms for sure landscaping. Oddly enough is one and then I would say the happiness of the employees but they may all be wrong. 22:00.36vigorbrandingUm, we’ll put all 3 down all right? Oh no, it’s here the vents. 22:05.92Joseph SzalaOh God The vents. Yes, oh next time you’re at a restaurant either do or don’t just look up at the air events man. Oh how can I forget that. 22:13.16vigorbrandingYeah, we’re all looking we’re we’re all looking around my office now at the air events but a bit aren they’re okay, no, no yeah. 22:20.26Joseph SzalaWell, the good news is you’re not making food but there’s something pretty disgusting if you’re making food and those air vens are just just C clopped full of old grease and the. 22:26.65vigorbrandingAh, yeah, that’s funny which which guest was described in her episode title as 1 woman economic engine. 22:36.81Joseph SzalaOh that is Adena Ana Bio she’s absolutely wonderful. 22:43.10vigorbrandingYep, very cool finish this quote from you in your interview with Zach Anderson whenever I have a bad day I think to myself at least I’m not. 22:57.46Joseph SzalaOh god yeah least I’m not working on 1 again. Um, at least I’m not mopping the floor is that what that isn’t it. Oh I’m blanking on that one. 22:59.72vigorbrandingTies into restaurants. 23:10.51vigorbrandingKnow it’s It’s ah it’s honestly it’s how I started my career. It’s busing tables. 23:17.30Joseph SzalaBusing tables. Yeah dude Oh God Although if we ever wanted to know the key to stopping time. That’s it You can literally stop time by either planks doing planks or busing tables. 23:27.49vigorbrandingYeah, yeah, you know I will say though in in all joking side I got one heck of an education from busing tables I worked in a restaurant called hobarts with a gentleman by the name of Hobart Umberger Hobart was this chef. He had a restaurant that sold a lot of quantity food was called ah it was called ummmies in Hershey and he wanted to do. He’s got older. He just wanted to do whatever he wanted to do he wanted to do his thing so as the chef he opened up hobarts named after him white tablec cloth. He made maybe five things a night didn’t care if you liked it or not and that’s what he made. And was as simple as that but he taught me everything I won’t get into what he called me as a nickname I think he actually liked me but I can’t say to anybody what he called me. But anyway I digress he taught me how to pour ah mixed drinks because I’d have to make him mixed drinks at the end of his night. 24:04.58Joseph SzalaYeah. 24:19.30vigorbrandingHe basically taught me everything I knew about food and wine I got an incredible education at age I think it was 14 like I need to worry about wine at 14 and than anybody in my family and most any well all my friends you know, just because Hobart would teach me and it was ah was actually pretty cool. In fact. Ah, 1 thing that was kind of neat was ah he would go in at three o’clock in the afternoon to make his coconut cream emirata pie and no one was allowed in a building and go ah gourmet magazine ah begged him begged him for his recipe and he would never give it to him so he died with it. It was kind of interesting thing. They’d write him. Letters. 24:38.76Joseph SzalaAnd. 24:51.54vigorbrandingBecause a lot of prominent people that came through hershey always ate. There was the best restaurant in Hershey and people would write letters to the magazine and so they kept begging him for this anyway, kind of a neat thing. But yeah, it was cool and I really did truly get a phenomenal education from that from busing tables and working in that restaurant business all right? so. 24:58.90Joseph SzalaI Love that. 25:06.56Joseph SzalaUm, well I think that’s a testament to to the restaurant industry in general, not not to diverge too much. But again not only is it the economic backbone of every every locale. Um, but it’s a hell of a way to get a hard knocks education that is unforgettable. No matter where you go after that I mean you’re. You’re you’re the Principal partner of a very large advertising conglomerate I’d be willing to bet that your your your travel to that layer would have been a little bit more difficult had you not been in the trenches at that at that location. 25:37.82vigorbrandingAh, yeah, look in ah in a restaurant you learn how to hustle you learn how to deal with issues as they pop up because that’s what they do, they just pop up and you get to deal with customers and you make everyone happy. So you you learn a lot about yourself. Ah. You don’t have 5 layers of folks around you to protect you per se and it’s just ah, really kind of an interesting kind of dynamic and you’re just thrown into it especially when you’re young I’ve always wanted my kids to work in a restaurant and also somehow do sales I don’t care if you’re selling girl scout cookies. 25:56.11Joseph SzalaOkay. 26:07.82Joseph SzalaAh. 26:09.34vigorbrandingOr newspapers I mean I’m now I’m really dating myself here but whatever it would be that you’re selling just a sales job. Huge huge education that you don’t even know you’re getting that you don’t even know you getting So anyway, um you had a great thing at the end of every one of your podcasts. You would ask the same questions and I want to continue that tradition. 26:14.76Joseph SzalaAbsolutely yep. 26:28.51vigorbrandingAh, so you have one last meal. What do you eat and why. 26:34.47Joseph SzalaYeah, so for those that have ever listened to all of them back to-back which is literally nobody except for me I’ve answered it and I thought about this again because I did know this question was coming. It hasn’t changed. Um I would have a Thanksgiving dinner. Absolutely hands down. Um, it’s my favorite meal and I have the unique situation where I know that that’s what I would choose because there was a time in my life where I thought I was having my last dinner and um, it was before yeah I mean good good good perspective um 26:52.12vigorbrandingThat’s it. Thanks Jimmy. 27:02.83vigorbrandingNice, Well not nice, but right. 27:10.58Joseph SzalaYou know I was going to have heart I had heart surgery. So although it was fairly so you know safe. It’s still heart surgery you know and so I was like this very well could be the last mail Thanksgiving dinner man. Absolutely. 27:16.67vigorbrandingSure really. Wow now I got a side question would it be just the meal itself because you love like the turkey and the gravy by yourself. Are you talking Thanksgiving dinner with everybody that you normally have a Thanksgiving dinner with and and hopefully none of your family’s going to watch us to know the real answer. So. 27:31.95Joseph SzalaUm, to stay. Yeah, Absolutely um, I’d be I’d be selective with who I broke bread with because there’s some family members that I love them because they’re family but my God I would not want to have my last meal with them. And I think that’s everyone. But for the food sake I could eat alone and be happy for the sake of the moment I Absolutely would love my family to be there. 28:00.95vigorbrandingFantastic Speaking of family you have some ah big news. We love to talk about that. 28:03.36Joseph SzalaYeah, sure yeah number 2 our second baby is on the way evelyn our first is about to turn ten months at this time of this recording and baby boy will be here by the end of the year and we’re ah, really excited and honored and. 28:17.68vigorbrandingFantastic. Are you gonna be the oldest father in the elementary school. 28:21.98Joseph SzalaPraying for Health and happiness. You know Absolutely I’m going to be in there with a walker. Yeah. 28:29.42vigorbrandingAh, that’s awesome Joe so I’ve known you for a long time and I’m happy for you I’m proud of you and I’m congratulations. That’s wonderful. Wonderful. 28:35.46Joseph SzalaAbsolutely well I’ll drop one more piece of news that might get you excited before this is all over in case, you haven’t heard Atlanta has finally been honored by being accepted into consideration for Michelin stars. So we were all. 28:48.93vigorbrandingNice. 28:52.93Joseph SzalaEveryone in the food community here in this city. We’re all, um, hoping and excited to see if one of our many fantastic restaurants will be graced with star stars. Whatever it may be so next time you come down to the city. Hopefully you’ll you’ll have that option. 29:06.41vigorbrandingvery cool. very cool yeah yeah I’ll be down in a couple couple of weeks I’m gonna watch a Braves Phillies game. So looking forward to that and I heard something in the background some’m cheering I think it was are yelling somebody was ah their baby I think was excited about the Michelin star. So that’s awesome. 29:19.53Joseph SzalaYeah, yeah, evelyn it’s perfect. 29:22.54vigorbrandingBut’s awesome. Ah fantastic. Well, it’s thank you so much for this. It’s been great. It’s always good catching up with you and I I know we’ll stay in touch. 29:28.32Joseph SzalaAbsolutely I’m looking forward to seeing hearing the guests and and hearing the interviews and really happy that you’re able to continue continue on with us. 29:35.72vigorbrandingYeah, only hopefully I can fill your shoes. It’ll be tough but I’m gonna do my best. So awesome! Thanks Joseph. 29:42.20Joseph SzalaUm, if they’re not that big. Yup cheers.

Caroline serves as Chief Operating Officer of Tupelo Honey and is a champion of high-growth, employee-centric workplaces. She joined the company as part of the initial senior leadership team in 2013. In Caroline’s nine-year tenure, she has been responsible for Tupelo Honey’s workforce expansion efforts, founding and leading its human resources and training teams and growing the brand from two locations and less than 100 employees to 22 locations and more than 15,000 employees. Tupelo Honey’s goal is to be at the forefront of the employee experience and at the forefront of what can be the new experience for restaurant workers. Sixty percent of Tupelo Honey’s management positions are filled from within the company. .Like a lot of restaurants, many Tupelo Honey managers started as servers or dishwashers, which helps them relate to entry level employees and makes them better managers. Communications methods like text alerts for younger workers (instead of email) work well for Tupelo Honey and its employees. It’s important for companies to initiate conversations with employees about culturally significant events that might impact employees, even if those conversations are difficult to have. Those conversations build trust with employees and show that a company cares.  QUOTES  “The restaurant industry is being required to level up in how we’re looking at the employee experience.” (Caroline)  “We have to add the human element back (in restaurant employment) and care about people holistically. They have a life outside of work and they want support beyond just a paycheck.” (Caroline)“Entry level workers want to stay. They want a path to grow their careers.” (Caroline)“Younger workers and millennial workers learn differently. We’ve had to recognize that there’s a different way to communicate with them.” (Caroline) “Every employee is different and restaurants can’t have a one-size-fits-all program. You have to have options for everyone.” (Caroline) “What we do is simple. At the end of the day, it’s about one guest, one relationship and one experience.” (Caroline)  TRANSCRIPT 00:00.00vigorbrandingEveryone today I’m joined by my new friend Carolyn Skinner she is the Ceo so Ceo oh not yet although Carolyn there has been a history of people on this show getting rapidly promoted. So don’t want to dangle the carrot it could happen. 00:10.69carolineHello that. 00:14.32vigorbrandingCeo of tupalo honey which we’re going to dig into the concept a little bit throughout this episode talk a lot of other things as well for now Carolyn say hello and give a little backstory. 00:24.80carolineYeah, thank you Joseph for having me. Um I am Caroline Skinner chief operating officer I am a native of Asheville North Carolina which is also the home. Um, an original location for Tupelo Honey um and our restaurant brand has been around for about 20 years we really started to grow in the last ten years I’ve been with the company for 10 years and seen pretty much all of the last twenty of our 21 locations launch in open so I’m really happy to be here. 00:53.85vigorbrandingI awesome yeah and I appreciate you taking the time out so we work together put together an awesome production sheet I think there’s so many great things to talk about and then Harvard b

JUICER is bringing dynamic pricing to the restaurant industry. Together with their customers who operate more than 4,000 restaurants across the globe, JUICER is applying machine learning algorithms to help restaurants optimize their digital menu pricing. Carl is also the co-author of “Delivering the Digital Restaurant,” a book that explores the world of off premise food and the massive disruption facing American restaurants through first-hand accounts of restaurateurs, food industry veterans, and start up entrepreneurs.Dynamic pricing in the restaurant industry can mean lowering prices to increase traffic during slow hours, increasing prices for specific menu items to reflect changes in ingredient costs, or increasing prices for all menu items during peak hours, peak days or peak seasons. The result is a pricing model that ensures the right time for each sales channel to optimize a restaurant’s profitability and the guest experience.JUICER’s focus – for now – is on off-premise dynamic pricing, where the adjustment of prices is easler. On-premise dynamic pricing is more difficult (because of menus with fixed, printed prices) but will be more likely in the future.   QUOTES “What JUICER is trying to do is become a full-service solution. We take 12 months of transactional data, put that through our algorithm, come up with recommended prices based on different times of day, and then our team will implement those price changes.” (Carl) “Consumers today are already experiencing dynamic pricing on DoorDash and Uber Eats. The delivery prices will change. The challenge is, restaurants aren’t getting any of the upside of that dynamism.” (Carl) “The challenge of dynamic pricing as a term can be somewhat divisive. What we’re doing at JUICER is completely avoiding anything related to surge pricing. We’re talking about relatively small changes in prices that don’t cause a negative reaction. In many ways, the customer doesn’t even notice many of the price changes.” (Carl) “There’s only one Taylor Swift. In a marketplace, there are hundreds of other pizza places that you can go to.” (Carl) “The whole idea of delivering the digital restaurant is to help restaurants understand that they have to optimize their off-premise channel. It’s far more than just turning yourself on DoorDash or Uber Eats and letting those channels run themselves.” (Carl)  TRANSCRIPT 00:00.41vigorbrandingEveryone today I am joined by my new friend Carl Orsburn it’s oars burn or born say with me everyone um, all joking aside Carl. Thanks for taking time out of your day and your week hang out with me while you say hello and for those that don’t know you give a little bit of backstory. 00:17.53Carl OrsbournThanks! Thanks! Jo really good to be here and glad we get to spend a few few minutes together today. Um yes, I’m Carl Osborne I’m the co co-founder at juicer a dynamic pricing company for restaurants. But so. A lot of people know me from my first book that I wrote with Meredith Sandland delivering the digital restaurant that book became a bit of a bests selller and really um, cemented I think my kind of presence

The first Dog Haus opened in Pasadena, California in 2010. Since then, Dog Haus has expanded to include 91 locations throughout southern California.  Dog Haus has garnered critical acclaim and national attention for its signature all beef Haus Dogs and handcrafted proprietary Haus Sausages, as well as its 100% genetically tested, humanely raised, hormone- and antibiotic-free Black Angus beef.  Many start-up restaurants rely on a celebrity name to drive consumer interest, which calls into question the quality of the food and expertise of the celebrity when it comes to the offering.  Consistency of quality is important. Some restaurant brands don’t have standards – or don’t clearly define the standards – which means different dining experiences between each location or even at the same location.   QUOTES “Our advantage is the quality of the food. It’s the product itself.” (Justin)  “We are created by people who are very much into food. That’s been our goal since day one.” (Justin)  “Zeroing in on the quality of the product. That’s not a different story. So many brands think their product is ‘the best.’ What (Dog Haus provides) is reasons to believe why that’s true.” (Joseph)  “How do you get someone to pay $8 for a hot dog when Costco sells it for $1.50. That’s a unique challenge for us. We do that with high quality ingredients. It’s not just a hot dog and you know that when you see it.” (Justin)  “Quality matters, especially on delivery.” (Justin)  “(Some restaurants) make it as cheap as possible and maximize profitability, get the money and go. I think now more than ever, the delivery game has changed that. After I’ve paid for delivery fees and that (meal) comes back tasting like garbage, that’s horrible.” (Joseph)  TRANSCRIPT 00:00.00vigorbrandingEveryone and today I’m joined by Justin Bartek you probably remember our episode from early on in the fork tales days I had to have him back because so much has changed since then Justin won’t you say hello and ah give us a little update on where you’ve been and where you are now. 00:16.68Justin BartekYeah, man, it’s good to see you Joseph as always in the past few months about five months ago now I joined doghouse worldwide which is a hot dog brand but we do smash burgers hot dogs, gourmet sausages breakfast burritos that are actually killing it. Um. And more so it’s very exciting to be over here I’ve sort of been put in a position to help with those virtual brands that they have called the absolute brands. But I’m also you know there’s always so much to do that I’ve been helping with my own connections and background to all across the organization. So. It’s been great. 00:50.71vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. So um, for those don’t remember you you used to be at the Ramen company Jinnya I Still go there. Still love their ramen. 00:56.60Justin BartekI’m correct. 00:58.38vigorbrandingUm, and as you said now you’re in this new position. Jinnya is a brick and mortar. It’s full service. Well it’s actually fast casual technically there’s counters service. You sit do

Troy was born in Hawaii. His family goes back five generations in Hawaii and was among some of the first missionaries to arrive on the islands. He started as a 14-year-old dishwasher in Maui and eventually worked his way up to a sous chef working with his mentor, Chef Roy Yamaguchi. Hawaiian culture emphasizes “ohana” which means family. Troy has worked hard to embrace that same family atmosphere in his restaurants. It’s difficult to maintain a restaurant culture as a restaurant grows. Owners often find themselves having to choose between managers who are a good cultural fit but underperform as managers or vice versa. Taking care of guests is critical and is the foundation of any restaurant’s success. Troy’s vision for TAG Restaurant Group changed during COVID. His new steak restaurant in Houston opened three months before COVID and struggled in 2020 and 2021, but rebounded in 2022 to become a successful location today.  Quotes “(When it comes to ingredients), I was taught early on working in California, Hawaii, New York and Hong Kong that you utilize what you can from where you’re from.” (Troy)“Authentic and real. I think everyone can see when something is genuine. We try to hire people who are genuinely hospitable. Even if they don’t know how to cook but they have a good attitude and want to, we like those types of people.” (Troy) “The days of people staying for 10 plus years are probably long gone.” (Troy) “Pay is, of course, one factor, but it’s not THE factor.” (Joseph) “Our core values are passion, imagination, courage, caring, humility, harmony and ownership. That’s what I want to see in people. I want to give them ownership to do what they think is best.” (Troy) “It’s really tough to foster a culture when you spread out (to multiple locations).” (Joseph) “Two weeks in (at my first restaurant), we were $40,000 in the hole. My investors said if you don’t change we’ll have to close. The second month we lost $20,000. The third we broke even. And the fourth – I swear to God – we made $40,000. We made an $80,000 swing in four months by just focusing and working together. ” (Troy) “Marketing can get people to visit once. It’s the restaurant’s job to get them to come back.” (Joseph) Transcript 00:00.81vigorbrandingEveryone today I’m joined by chef troy guard from tag restaurant group which you’re going to learn all about if you’re not already familiar. Um Troy say hello give a little bit of backstory.00:11.84Chef Troy Guardgood morning good afternoon good evening whatever time we’re listening to here. It’s March Seventeenth St Patrick’s day and I’m just chilling in my marketing’s ah my marketers’ room right now. So talking to Joseph in the. Excited to be on board. Thanks for having me.00:29.77vigorbrandingAwesome! Well Troy so you grew up in Hawaii um, which it’s islands that I absolutely love and now you find yourself imp possibly the complete opposite. You’re a mile up in the air in Denver.00:35.91Chef Troy GuardUm, you know.00:42.93vigorbrandingUm, what led you to Denver from Hawaii and and how have those roots from the islands influenced your cooking and your outlook on life.00:50.48Chef Troy GuardYeah, thank you so yup board on the islands we’re 5 generations of being in Hawaii even though we’re white where you know some of the first missionaries to come over there which is kind of cool. Um, great stories back there. Um I left when I was. You know, 21 and just kind of just went all over the place and it’s funny n

Chowly is a cloud-based solution that helps restaurants of all sizes integrate third-party online ordering systems into point-of-sale (POS) systems to manage orders, payments, billing, and more.The end result is a technology that saves restaurants time and money.Earlier this year, Chowly launched its Restaurant Control Center, which serves as a centralized hub for integrations and empowers restaurants with consolidated data and business insights. Sterling found that a lot of online ordering systems had great consumer experiences or great operations and back-end experiences for restaurants, but not both. Chowly’s acquisition of Koala allowed them to offer superior experiences to both consumers and restaurants.Sterling predicts that dynamic pricing will take off in 2023, with companies like Sauce, Pricing and Juicer leading the way. Apps need to provide an intrinsic value. They can’t just be used to check a box. Dynamic pricing will be a shaky system at first, but after 18-24 months, it will have found its footing and be widely accepted by consumers.  Quotes “Co-opetition is wild in the restaurant space. The amount of overlap of features from point-of-sale to online ordering companies to loyalty systems to marketing systems – everyone’s got overlap of features.” (Sterling)“I feel like the restaurant industry is going through a bundling cycle right now. It’s not uncommon to see industries go through bundling and unbundling cycles.” (Sterling)“The consolidation has to make sense. It has to pair well together. Consolidation for consolidation’s sake isn’t helpful to anyone.” (Sterling) “The first question to ask is, ‘Do I need another app on my phone?’ I’m at the point now where the only time an app really matters is if it’s completely built with the customer in mind.” (Joseph)“Half of the restaurant industry is small operators and independents. We don’t have the same big-player mentality (as the travel industry).” (Sterling) “You can’t commoditize a really great burger. The airlines are very much commoditized. The experiences are very similar. In a restaurant, they’re completely different.” (Sterling) “As digital threatens the viability of restaurant dining rooms, the question becomes, ‘What makes my dining room worth sitting in?’” (Joseph)“Restaurants need to meet consumers where they are. I don’t think on-premise is going away, no matter how much I love the convenience of getting my food delivered to me.” (Sterling) Quotes 00:00.55vigorbrandingHey guys today I’m joined by my new friend sterling Douglas he’s the co-founder and Ceo of Chali which we’re gonna dive into a lot so many things happening over there and just so you know we’ve been chatting for about 10 minutes on all things. So I think it’s gonna be great episode. Ah. Sterling say hello and give up a backstory.00:17.83Sterling _Chowly_Hey Joseph thanks for having me on I’m excited to kind of dive into a bunch of these topics that we were getting into yeah cofounder Ceo Chali where digital platform that enables restaurants to expand their off-prem capabilities before. Chaey I used to be an actuary deep into data analytics and just found that data really wasn’t moving cleanly between restaurants and you know that really prompted kind of the founding for chaey so that we could take data from you know uber eats grubhubs of the world and help restaurants kind

David is a performance excellence coach focused on teaching, consulting and executive coaching for small to medium sized businesses, including many restaurants. David spent six years as a business/excellence coach for Pal’s Excellence Institute. Pal’s – or Pal’s Suddenly Service – is a drive-through only 31-location restaurant chain located in northeast Tennessee and southwestern Virginia. The restaurant is known for its speed, hospitality, cleanliness and people. Pal’s relies heavily on word-of-mouth marketing. That word-of-mouth allows Pal’s to spend roughly half as much on marketing as some of its similar competitors. According to David, COVID gave restaurants a second chance to make a first impression. Restaurants that were struggling before the pandemic were struggling after the pandemic, pointing to an internal flaw that contributes to that struggle. Some restaurants used the pandemic as a chance to reset and improve themselves to make a second first impression and win over new customers after the pandemic ended.  Quotes “What we see now is a lot of sculptures and spokescharacters have been discontinued. Architecturally speaking, we’re getting modern boxes that don’t have much life.” (Joseph)“If you look at the new (restaurant) designs, they’re all basically the same. You really want to stand out in a sea of sameness.” (David) “How often in life do you get a second chance to make a first impression? If customers are coming back (after the pandemic), we have a chance to win them over and leave all that past behind.” (David) “If people aren’t buying it, it’s because they don’t want it.” (Joseph) “If you think about a restaurant and what it does, it’s really a manufacturing operation. You’re manufacturing food in real time for a specific order based on your menu.” (David) “Systems are one thing, but activating them tends to be where the rubber meets the road and where most people hit the road.” (Joseph) “Twenty percent of the effort is putting a system in place and 80% of the effort is sustaining it. You have to make it a habit. You have to change in a way that it’s harder to go back than it is to go forward.” (David)  Transcript 00:00.91vigorbrandingEveryone today I’m joined by my friend David Jones he’s the president of a company called the excellence advisory which we’ll get into in a little bit. Um, but before we do David why don’t you say hello and give a little bit of backstory.00:11.50David M_ JonesWell hello joseph and thanks for having me on today I considered a personal and professional honor to be here with you speaking to your audience and I’m actually an engineer by training 25 years in corporate America and then I had the great blessing and ability to work with. Pals through their business excellence institute which I hope we get to talk about and did that for 7 years and ah and today I do teaching consulting and coaching executive coaching for small to medium sized businesses including a lot of restaurants.00:49.83vigorbrandingThat’s awesome. Yeah, so pals is um, essentially what prompted our connection on Linkedin. Um, and honestly it’s a concept I had never heard of they’re they’re not here in Georgia or in Central Pennsylvania so I just never come across them. But what really grabbed my attention and prompted our discussion was. Um, pal’s sudden service is what it’s called has these amazing huge sculptures on their buildings sculptures of their food like hamburgers and drinks and all kinds of things and this just struck me as such an amazing t

Meredith is the CEO of Empower Delivery. The company’s software combines the consumer journey, the product journey, and the logistics journey into one integrated piece of software. The software enables all restaurants to profitably and sustainably serve the growing consumer demand for delivered meals.Meredith is also the co-author of “Delivering the Digital Restaurant,” a book that explores the world of off-premise food and the massive disruption facing American restaurants through first-hand accounts of restaurateurs, food industry veterans and start-up entrepreneurs.Many restaurants face complexity in the number of tools and apps they use to manage their day-to-day operations. The restaurant industry is showing unprecedented levels of technological innovation – particularly when it comes to ordering – which makes third-party apps and aggregators important for streamlining incoming orders. Innovation is also being seen in restaurant loyalty programs, which have come a long way since the Subway punch cards of the past. Quotes “A lot of restaurant brands were forced into adopting delivery (during the pandemic) when maybe they otherwise didn’t want to.” (Meredith)“For operations, it’s really about eliminating complexity. There are so many channels and consumers are coming in so many different ways that it creates complexity. As you eliminate complexity, you will find that you have better financial outcomes.” (Meredith) “Every facet of the restaurant industry is being revolutionized by technology.” (Joseph) “Not every server can be the best, but technology can take the elements of that best server and make them consistent across every server. Technology used well in that setting should make the experience better.” (Meredith) “The restaurant industry is one of the only industries where all five senses are engaged.” (Joseph) “A really sophisticated digital restaurant is using 15-20 pieces of software.” (Meredith) Transcript 00:00.00vigorbrandingEveryone today I’m joined by my friend Meredith Sandlin she’s the Ceo of empowered delivery and the co-author of delivering the digital restaurant if you are on Linkedin Chances are you have seen her or heard from her because she is out there rocking it. In the media talking about digital or delivery digital. All that stuff. So Marilyn before we hop in while you say hello and give a little bit of backstory.00:24.58MeredithHi there. Well so good to be on the show. Um I’ve been listening and it is such a good podcast. So I’m excited to be part of it. Um, so yeah, my name is Meredith Sandland and I am the Ceo of empower delivery as well as the co-author of. Delivering the digital restaurant. Ah, your roadmap to the future of food and also the forthcoming delivering the digital restaurant the path to digital maturity which will be out in a couple of weeks here maybe by the time this podcast hears I don’t know we’ll find out.00:54.94vigorbrandingDad’s awesome if it is. We’ll definitely have a link to it or at the very least have a link to pre-order I’m excited to get my hands on it. Um, you probably can’t really see it folks but right back here and on my bookshelf is the book and so um I’m excited to read the new one. Um.01:08.90MeredithUm, if you think awesome.01:12.15vigorbrandingSo delivery. It’s acing it is just like a really big challenge for restaurant brands large and small. So I think before the pandemic a lot were sort of adverse to it because they didn’t really see the value. Ah their format wasn’

Seasoned is the only social community exclusively for service industry workers. The app allows hospitality workers to connect and share insights and experiences. It’s also a job listing resource that connects restaurants looking for staff members with potential employees looking for work. Traditional hiring websites aren’t well suited for hourly jobs and careers in the hospitality industry. Seasoned solves that. When it comes to hiring, the hospitality industry faces challenges from other hourly sectors, which often offer jobs that are less stressful than restaurant work. It’s essential for restaurants to focus on the benefits that they can provide to their employees in order to attract and retain quality workers. Centralized ownership, not franchise ownership, often does a better job of creating a successful HR and hiring model.  Quotes “The pandemic had a historic impact. It slingshotted all of us past the laziness and apprehension and forced us to change and one big change is the labor market.” (Joseph)“If you look at the actual things that you gain from working in a restaurant, there’s an incredible number of attractive qualities that you gain from working in a restaurant. The skills that you build in a restaurant are going to help you wherever you go.” (Zach)“I was a busser for six months, and to this day whenever I have a bad day I think to myself, ‘At least I’m not bussing tables.’” (Joseph) “With younger workers, what you’re hiring for is attitude, reliability and coachability. You can teach anyone to do the job within the restaurant, but having those attributes […] you can teach anyone to be great.” (Zach) “Instead of ‘You work for us,’ it’s ‘We work for you.’ That shift is really impactful (when hiring and retaining talent).” (Zach) Transcript 00:00.00vigorbrandingEveryone today I’m joined by my friend Zach Anderson he’s brand partner at seasoned a system that we’re going to dive into here in a bit but before we do Zach say hello give a little bit of backstory on yourself.00:11.91Zach AndersonThanks Joseph hi next meet everyone. My name’s Zach Anderson my like Joseph mentioned I’m a brand partner over it seasoned I’ve been in the restaurant space for about 15 years across a mix of both operations as well as on the vendor and supplier side working in. Various capacities across things like ad media to voice ai kiosk hardware and most recently I’ve been over here at season working on our mission to help bring the service industry together by offering a community-based product for restaurant workers to engage each other and find great jobs.00:45.49vigorbrandingThat’s amazing. Yeah I’m really excited to pry in I’m I’m kind of holding myself back because we will get to it but I do want to talk about the the big l word right now which is the labor issues that we’re challenged with in the industry. Um, from my point of view. It’s kind of a long time coming. Um, anybody that thought we you know restaurants could continue to operate the the way that they had for as long as they have just really was blinding themselves in a lot of ways. So I’m going to use the pw word now I’m getting sick of saying it. But since the pandemic you know the pandemic had this historic impact I think it’s slingshot at all of us. Ah. Past the laziness or apprehension and just forced us to change and 1 big change is the labor market not just the availability of people but the people willingness to work the work ethic and the passion for the industry that used to be

Thanx is a leading loyalty and guest engagement platform for restaurants. The company, founded by Zach Goldstein in 2011, helps businesses embrace digital purchasing, capture greater customer data, and take action on that information to personalize guest engagement.Restaurants can take a page from the Delta playbook – which includes the potential for free first class upgrades (a perk that costs nothing to Delta) – including the use of secret menu items. Loyalty programs should not be dependent upon an app because most consumers won’t download the app. Instead, the loyalty program should be embedded in the web ordering experience. The app is still useful, as users of a restaurant’s app have high lifetime value. Consumers respond to non-discount offers quite effectively. For example, a restaurant can offer loyal customers a VIP experience that allows those customers to try new menu items (along with a non-VIP friend) before the items are available publicly. The entry point into a loyalty program shouldn’t be by downloading an app. What Thanx does is builds the loyalty enrollment into the digital ordering experience because 70% of online ordering comes via the restaurant’s website, not via an app. Quotes “The playbook is pretty simple. You need to own the relationship with your customer, because if you sacrifice that to the third party, then you have no control over their lifetime value.” (Zach)“Loyalty is no longer about just rote rewards programs and discounts and more around personalization. That really matters, because as you deliver more personalization, you become less dependent on discounts as your loyalty mechanism and can still be effective.” (Zach)“Can you imagine what McDonald’s top one percent customers would do if they had year round McRibs? That’s the type of thing people care about.” (Zach) “There are a lot of restaurant leaders who have been convinced that the app is the answer. It’s actually not the answer. It’s one answer to a bigger need.” (Joseph) “Data is king. At the end of the day, you have to have data. And there’s no other way in the restaurant business to capture that data unless you have a loyalty program.” (Zach) “It’s really hard to drive repeat purchasing if you don’t know who your best customers are. That’s the value of data. It’s a risk to not have it and it’s an opportunity when you have it.” (Zach) Transcript 00:00.00vigorbrandingEveryone today I am joineded by my friend Zach Goldstein he is the Ceo and founder of thanks a system that we are going to dig into but we’re going to talk about a lot of other things today too before we do Zach say hello give a little bit of backstory.00:15.63Zach GoldsteinYeah, pleasure. Really happy to be with you. My background started before thanks and working with restaurants and retailers to to really build customer lifetime value and that has become a passion of mine. Ah, That’s really what thanks does targeted at Restaurants. How do we help them identify where their best customers are and make more of their customers. Those best customers.00:38.65vigorbrandingI Love it. So a few years ago you you penned an article and I think this this is what really struck me and um, you know serves as a basis for the episode a little bit but that article is called the 4 horsemen of the restaurant apocalypse which of course is a very doom gloom. It’s very like whoa. Um, what does that mean and I think the article centers on taking some lessons from the travel industry and the effect that online travel agencies otas for short had on evolving our experiences as travelers

Native Foods is a fast-casual vegan restaurant chain that operates in California, Oregon, Colorado, and Illinois. Carin has held leadership positions at Red Robin, Applebee’s and Wendy’s. Dealing with an unpredictable supply chain is the biggest challenge for Native Foods Native Foods is careful to only use healthy ingredients and avoid ingredients found on many “do not eat” lists. Native Foods locations gravitate toward the coasts where vegan and plant-based trends are more popular. The Native Foods team tests ads targeted to vegans and ads targeted to flexitarians but marketing targeted to vegans still performs best in driving traffic.  Quotes “Every organization out there – whether it’s plant-based or meat-based – is struggling with supply chain issues. One of the advantages for plant-based restaurants is that we can make anything (we need). We can make any of our products in-house.” (Carin)“One of the first things I did when I came onboard was reduce sodium levels by 25%. And honestly, they taste better!” (Carin)“One thing that I’ve been notably ignorant about is that veganism is huge in the African American community.” (Joseph) “Vegans are much more adventurous and willing to try new things on the menu.” (Carin) “Since you have such a plant-forward concept, the consistency of ingredients has to be a priority.” (Joseph) “The innovation that we’ve seen in our chicken substitutes (is amazing). We’ve had guests come across the counter and say ‘This is supposed to be a vegan restaurant! You are serving me real chicken!” (Carin)  “When the pandemic hit, everyone in the restaurant industry started working well together.” (Carin) Transcript 00:00.00vigorbrandingEveryone today I’m joined by my friend Karen Stutz she’s the president and Ceo of native foods and if you are not familiar with native foods yet you’re about to get very familiar. It’s an interesting concept and we’re going to dive into that and so much more on today’s episode before we do Karen say hello and give a little bit of backstory.00:17.90Carin StutzHey Joseph it’s fun to spent a little time together and thanks for the opportunity to talk about native foods about the industry native foods. We always say we’re kind of the og of vegan restaurants right? We we started back in 9094 long before anybody was really thinking about plant-based food. So. The brand has really stood the test of time we have 12 locations. We’re in 3 states. We’re in California Colorado in Illinois and it’s just the boy what a time to be in plant based dining right now you know any kind of trend that you look you know at what’s going on in the industry top trends top ideas. Plant based this if it’s not number one. It’s usually number 2 so we’re having a lot of fun in this cute little innovative brand.01:03.93vigorbrandingI love it. So speaking about you first a little bit here. Um you this isn’t your first rodeo and I’m not very convinced that 1 rodeo would be enough to make you a pro anyway. Um, but you’ve held a number of leadership positions. You’ve been at the helm of red Robin Applebee’s wendy’s.01:09.94Carin StutzUm, true.01:14.38Carin StutzA.01:21.70vigorbrandingHow how do you make the transition from brands of that size to a brand that is scrappy growing and the size I think you said 12 Um, and then how do you make the shift from brands that are selling an um, omnivorous offering.01:23.94Carin StutzNo.01:40.53vigorbranding