The Provocateurs

Thinkers50 & Deloitte

Provocateurs offer fresh insights, novel perspectives and unique ways forward in the face of uncertainty. A collaboration between Thinkers50 and Deloitte, the monthly Provocateurs podcast gives you direct access to the thoughts, experiences, stories and insights of remarkable leaders from around the world. The aim is simple: to provoke you to think and act differently through candid and thought provoking conversations with fantastic leaders.

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Episodes

Episode 23: Neri Karra Sillaman
Apr 16 2024
Episode 23: Neri Karra Sillaman
Neri Karra Sillaman: From Refugee to Fashion Revolutionary At age 11, Neri Karra Sillaman’s world was turned upside down when her Bulgarian-Turkish family was forced to flee their home country. Driven by a hunger for education and a better life, Neri grabbed an opportunity to study business management at the University of Miami, where she became interested in how businesses – in particular, businesses founded by immigrants – are created and sustained.She has subsequently become an expert in international and ethnic entrepreneurship, researching how the unique capabilities and mindset of immigrants create businesses that last. She received her doctorate from the University of Cambridge and her own 25-year-old leather accessories company, staffed by a workforce largely made up of people from disadvantaged backgrounds, has been recognised by B Corp as a social innovator.In this Provocateurs podcast, Neri chats with fellow immigrant Kulleni Gebreyes, the US Consulting Life Sciences and Health Care Industry Leader and US Chief Health Equity Officer at Deloitte, and Thinkers50 co-founder, Stuart Crainer. She explains how she ended up in the fashion industry almost by accident and reveals the secrets behind sustainable companies, from building a resilient workforce to “frying in your own oil.” Neri is a member of the Thinkers50 Radar Class of 2024, a professor of practice and entrepreneurship expert at the University of Oxford, and author of Fashion Entrepreneurship. This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 22: Marcus Collins
Mar 27 2024
Episode 22: Marcus Collins
Culture, Connections, and CommunityMarketer extraordinaire, Marcus Collins is a clinical professor at the Ross School of Business, University of Michigan. A former advertising executive who worked on iTunes + Nike sport music initiatives at Apple, Marcus contends that what we wear, what we eat, where we work, who we date, and just about every facet of our social living is informed by our underlying culture. And the primary goal of all industries is to “get people to move”, whether it is to buy, to click, to watch, vote, or subscribe.In this intriguing conversation with Steve Goldbach of Deloitte and Stuart Crainer of Thinkers50, Marcus discusses his latest book, For the Culture: The Power Behind What We Buy, What We Do, And Who We Want To Be, and explains that his work is really just about connections – “connecting things that are normally disparate, so they come together and create new and novel things.”He also describes how he came to lead digital strategy for Beyoncé, the influence of Émile Durkheim on his ideas, and the power of collective effervescence.Marcus is the recipient of the Thinkers50 2023 Radar Award and his book, For the Culture, features on Thinkers50 2023 Best New Management Booklist.This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 21: Amy Chang
Feb 15 2024
Episode 21: Amy Chang
Amy Chang: Becoming An AI EntrepreneurAmy Chang serves on the board of directors for The Walt Disney Company and Procter & Gamble, and has previously served on the boards of Cisco, Splunk, Marqeta, and Informatica.In 2018, Amy’s start-up business, Accompany, an AI/ML-based relationship intelligence platform serving Fortune 500 companies, was acquired by Cisco for $270 million. Post-acquisition, she led Cisco’s multi-billion-dollar 6000-person Collaboration business.Prior to Accompany, Amy was at Google, where she led the teams for Google Analytics for over seven years, growing Google Analytics to serve over 86% of the entire web. She also fulfilled roles at eBay and McKinsey, having started her career in hardware with Intel, AMD, and Motorola.In this Provocateurs podcast with Des Dearlove from Thinkers50 and Steve Goldbach of Deloitte, Amy reveals what provoked her to leave the comfort zone of Google to start her own company. She shares her insights on leadership – as the founder CEO of a startup you need to be “the everything,” from plumber to custodian to cleaner – and explains the importance of culture, transparency, and hiring the right people.She also offers tips on becoming a new member to a board of directors, and the vital role of cardio exercise in taking care of your brain as well as your heart.This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 20: Reflections
Feb 1 2024
Episode 20: Reflections
What did we learn from our provocateurs in 2023? Who provoked us to think again and act differently? Which stories remain with us?The Provocateurs podcast series gives you direct access to the ideas, experiences, and insights of remarkable leaders from around the world. In 2023, in collaboration with Deloitte, Thinkers50 hosted an inspiring mix of guests in thought-provoking conversations.The topics that were discussed and debated ranged from The Inside Track on Growth with Tiffani Bova to Radical Candor with Kim Scott. Along the way we unpicked branding and the metaverse with Martin Lindstrom, learned how to play our cards right with Annie Duke, and normalised anxiety with Morra Aarons-Mele. Chip Bergh told us his story of rescuing Levi’s, Shelley Zalis gave us the state of play on equality in the workplace, Jim Stengel dived into activating purpose, and we marched to a different drum with Sunny Bonnell and Rare Breeds.In this episode, Stuart Crainer, Des Dearlove, Steve Goldbach, and Geoff Tuff share some of their key take-aways from Provocateurs 2023 and introduce new co-host for 2024, Kulleni Gebreyes.This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 18: Sunny Bonnell
Oct 5 2023
Episode 18: Sunny Bonnell
Rare Breeds – Marching To A Different Drum Leadership and brand expert Sunny Bonnell is the bestselling co-author of Rare Breed: A Guide to Success for the Defiant, Dangerous, and Different (with Ashleigh Hansberger, 2019). Sunny and Ashleigh are also the creators of the Rare Breed Leadership Platform, and the hit YouTube show, Rare Breed TV. In this Provocateurs podcast with Thinkers50 co-founder, Des Dearlove, and Geoff Tuff of Deloitte, Sunny outlines seven unconventional traits displayed by ‘rare breeds’ – traits that are traditionally seen as vices, such as being rebellious, audacious, emotional, and hot-blooded. However, she explains that if organisations can see these so-called weaknesses as strengths they can create the cultures that allow rare breeds to thrive – and unleash their potential powers for innovation. Sunny and Ashleigh founded their award-winning branding company Motto in 2005 with just $250, after dropping out of college together. Sunny is now the CEO and Chief Visionary of the company. This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 17: Kim Scott
Aug 30 2023
Episode 17: Kim Scott
The author of New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestseller Radical Candor: Be a Kick-Ass Boss Without Losing Your Humanity, Kim Scott joins Steve Goldbach of Deloitte and Stuart Crainer of Thinkers50 to talk through the politics, practicalities, and purpose of feedback in the workplace. In this discussion, part of The Provocateurs podcast series, Kim explains how her two-by-two framework for radical candor can help create productive feedback by avoiding the two extremes of obnoxious aggression and ruinous sympathy. She also shares her insights on bias, prejudice, and bullying and offers actionable responses for each one that can help eliminate workplace injustice, paving the way for greater engagement, collaboration, and growth.As well as Radical Candor, Kim is also the author of Just Work: How to Root Out Bias, Prejudice, and Bullying to Build a Kick-Ass Culture of Inclusivity and three novels: Virtual Love, The Househusband, and The Measurement Problem. She was CEO coach at Dropbox, Qualtrics, and Twitter, and a member of the faculty at Apple University. Previously, she led AdSense, YouTube and DoubleClick teams at Google, managed a paediatric clinic in Kosovo, and started a diamond cutting factory in Moscow during the dissolution of the Soviet Union. Kim is co-founder of executive education company, Radical Candor.This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 16: Morra Aarons-Mele
Jul 11 2023
Episode 16: Morra Aarons-Mele
Author of The Anxious Achiever and Hiding in the Bathroom, Morra Aarons-Mele is also founder of the award-winning social impact agency Women Online. In this Provocateurs podcast episode, she joins Geoff Tuff of Deloitte and Stuart Crainer of Thinkers50 to set the record straight on normalising anxiety. Data shows that high achievers manage more anxiety and depression, and Morra explains how to rethink the relationship between mental health and success. She describes anxiety as a spectrum, where at one end it can be quite debilitating and at the other, it’s a nervous but motivating energy. Having learned how to manage her own mental health through a career in digital marketing, politics, consulting, and more recently running her own business, Morra set out to learn the stories of other leaders who manage anxiety and depression. Her own podcast, The Anxious Achiever, for LinkedIn Presents, won the 2023 Media Award from Mental Health America, was a 2020 Webby Awards Honoree, 2022 “Best Commute Podcast” Signal Award winner, and is frequently a top 10 management podcast and top 50 business podcast. This podcast episode discusses mental health conditions including anxiety and depression. If you experience any personal mental health concerns, please consult a doctor, mental health professional, or seek help from a recognised mental health organisation. ------Terms in this podcastVUCA: Volatility, Uncertainty, Complexity, and AmbiguityThis podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 15: Annie Duke
Jun 21 2023
Episode 15: Annie Duke
Former professional poker player Annie Duke is a master of decision making. In this Provocateurs podcast, hosted by Stuart Crainer of Thinkers50 and Steve Goldbach of Deloitte, she challenges us to examine our own biases and self-narratives to focus on the things we can control, in order to make better choices. By sharing practical insights and strategies for improving decision making and developing resilience, Annie emphasises the importance of analysing decisions objectively, rather than relying on the outcome to determine their quality.The author of Quit: The Power of Knowing When to Walk Away, released in 2022, and national bestseller Thinking in Bets, Annie draws on her experience as a poker player to demonstrate that by re-evaluating our approaches to quitting we can re-think the way we make decisions in business and in life.Annie is a special partner focused on decision science at First Round Capital Partners, a seed stage venture fund. She is also the co-founder of the Alliance for Decision Education, a nonprofit whose mission is to improve lives by empowering students through decision skills education.This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 14: Martin Lindstrom
May 31 2023
Episode 14: Martin Lindstrom
Self-confessed contrarian thinker and provocateur since childhood, Martin Lindstrom is an international branding expert and one of the world’s leading authorities on the metaverse. Here he joins Geoff Tuff of Deloitte and Des Dearlove of Thinkers50 in a fascinating conversation about branding as an emotional construct, the power of small data, and lying on a bed of Lego.In the 1990s, Lindstrom pioneered how to build brands on the internet and has since coined terms such as clicks & mortar, contextual marketing, and texting. He has published eight New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestsellers, including Buyology (2008), Small Data (2017), and The Ministry of Common Sense (2021).In 2022, Lindstrom launched the “Engineering our Dreams” project – a $22,000,000 metaverse experiment, with the multi-pronged purposes of understanding human behavior, the role of businesses, brands, work environments, and ethical standards in virtual worlds. Co-founder of several multi-billion-dollar startups, including YellowPages.com and Hitwise, Lindstrom is a Thinkers50 Ranked Thinker, listed by TIME magazine as one of the world’s 100 most influential people, and named by LinkedIn as 2021’s most influential business thinker in the USA. He is the founder and chairman of Lindstrom Company.This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 12: Jim Stengel
Mar 3 2023
Episode 12: Jim Stengel
Jim Stengel is the President and CEO of The Jim Stengel Company, which works to build brands and companies by activating their purpose. He has authored the books ‘Grow: How Ideals Power Growth and Profit at the World’s Greatest Companies’ as well as ‘Unleashing the Innovators: How Mature Companies Find New Life with Startups.’ He is also a speaker with the Washington Speakers Bureau, the host of The CMO Podcast, and serves as Dean of the Young Marketers Academy at the Cannes Lions International Festival of Creativity.Jim is the former Global Marketing Officer of Procter & Gamble, the largest marketer in the world, and is known for having personally led the transformation that has firmly established P&G as one of the most admired brand-building companies in the world under the mantra that an activated purpose is what inspires, motivates, and retains employees and customers.In this conversation with Chief Growth Officer at Deloitte, Stacy Janiak, and Thinkers50 co-founder, Des Dearlove, Jim dives into activating purpose, staying curious, asking the right questions, and understanding implicit biases in the room. This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 11: Tiffani Bova
Jan 30 2023
Episode 11: Tiffani Bova
Tiffani Bova: The Inside Track on Growth Tiffani Bova is the global growth evangelist at Salesforce and the author of the Wall Street Journal bestseller GROWTH IQ: Get Smarter About the Choices that Will Make or Break Your Business. Tiffani is a true change maker whose thought-provoking and forward-thinking insights have brought her international attention. She also hosts her own excellent podcast What’s Next!Prior to working with Salesforce, she was a sales, marketing, and customer service executive for startups as well as Fortune 500 companies. After her success in the corporate world, she was also a Distinguished Analyst and Research Fellow with Gartner for many years. In this conversation with Steve Goldbach and Stuart Crainer, Tiffani tells the compelling story of the development of her insights, ranging all the way from running E. K. Fernandez Shows to her time at Salesforce. She also spills exclusive nuggets from her forthcoming book, always with a keen eye on weighing both consumer and employee satisfaction and experiences. This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.
Episode 10: What we have learned so far
Dec 19 2022
Episode 10: What we have learned so far
Stuart Crainer, Des Dearlove, Steve Goldbach, Stacy Janice and Geoff Tuff marshall their thoughts and make sense of our podcast episodes from the year. What have they learned? What has surprised them? Which guests really made them re-think and re-set?  There are plenty of inspiring stories to choose from. We have had some amazing guests: Valerie Rainford, who has championed talent and diversity in the banking world and now for her own company; Debbie Bial, the founder and president of the Posse Foundation; the board member, author, and now member of the UK's House of Lords, Dambisa Moyo; the former CEO of Best Buy, and author of the Heart of Business, Hubert Joly; the trailblazer for Leading for Girls, Julie Carrier; Nobel Laureate, Bob Lefkowitz; astronaut, Charlie Camarda; the Dutch entrepreneur and pioneer of new ways of working, Tom van der Lubbe and the author of The Quit Alternative, Ben Fanning. In this special episode the Provocateurs hosts share their memories, insights and conclusions. And the results are as inspiring as the people who inspired them.  Listen to learn more about flipping failure for learning, the virtues of transparency, humility’s role in leadership and how to really maximize diversity in teams. Be provoked!This podcast is part of an ongoing series of interviews with executives. The executives’ participation in this podcast are solely for educational purposes based on their knowledge of the subject and the views expressed by them are solely their own. This podcast should not be deemed or construed to be for the purpose of soliciting business for any of the companies mentioned, nor does Deloitte advocate or endorse the services or products provided by these companies.