VO BOSS

Anne Ganguzza

The VO BOSS podcast blends solid, actionable business advice with a dose of inspiration for today’s voiceover talent. Each week, host Anne Ganguzza focuses on a specific topic to help you grow your #VO Business. Featuring guest interviews with industry movers & shakers, VO BOSS covers every facet of the voice landscape, from creating your business plan to choosing the best marketing tactics & tools. So tune in, listen up, and learn how to further your VO career! read less
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Episodes

Unvoiced Potential: Giving Up
1w ago
Unvoiced Potential: Giving Up
The BOSSES discuss why adapting to an ever-evolving industry is crucial for standing out in a sea of talent. Anne discusses her own expansion into ventures like VO Boss, VO Peeps, and podcasting, illustrating how you can diversify your skillset and find fresh opportunities without losing your creative spark. Plus, the BOSSES spotlight the immense value of networking through conferences and workshops to elevate your voice-acting business to boss-level status. Join us, for an empowering session that promises to reignite your passion and strategic approach to your voice-acting venture. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VEO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Gangusa.  00:19 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I'm your host, Anne Gangusa, and I'm here with the lovely, lovely Lau Lapides.  00:31 - Lau (Guest) Hey Lau. Oh, amazing to see you, as always Amazing. Oh, thank you, Lau.  00:36 - Anne (Host) Wonderful to see you as well.  00:40 - Lau (Guest) What are we talking about today? I can't wait.  00:42 - Anne (Host) Okay, so I always have to open it up with a story. So lately I have heard a lot this year because it's been an interesting year. I've heard a lot from my students that they're frustrated. They have been making investments and they've been doing auditions and they're just not getting any work and they're just like frustrated to the point where they just want to give up. And I'll tell you what. I remember that feeling very well. I want to talk about voice actors who give up too soon, because I really feel like there's something to be said for sticking it out. I mean, building a business is not something that happens overnight. I know we say this all the time but, like my, overnight success took 10 years. I mean truly Lau thoughts on that.  01:32 - Lau (Guest) I'm right there with you and I think that that's a Listen, let's be honest, shall we? It's a very Western philosophy to think I'm opening a business, therefore I'm going to work and be successful right away. I mean, eastern philosophy is like no, at 10 years you're starting your business, right, yeah? So the idea of investment of time and resources and capital and sacrifice has got to be in our vocabulary and that's why we say in the first, three to five years is a typical timeframe, that we're looking at the metrics for what businesses are surviving and what businesses have gone under. We'll give it the three to five years, because you can't do it in a month. No, three to five years is the baseline. Can't do it in a year, can't do it in two years.  02:15 - Anne (Host) I'm constantly saying, oh, but I've spent so much money and I'm like have you? Have you really Like, have you? And again, I think we've spoken about this in many a podcast about the investment aspect of this career I'm like, well, thank goodness you didn't have to open a storefront or buy inventory. I mean honestly, your investment is investing in yourself. Because I constantly, as a coach and a demo producer, I hear this all the time because people are like I just don't have the money. Or I've taken so many lessons and I'm like have you? And I don't mean to be obnoxious here about it, but really, if you think about it and again, I've said this multiple times I always tell people look, we go to school for years. How many years do you go to medical school? How many years, if you want to become a vet, do you go to school? How many hours in a day do you spend at your job? Eight hours a day, maybe.  03:05 And so all of a sudden I'll get people who are like, yeah, but I've taken so many coaching sessions and I just I'm not getting the work and I'm like how many coaching sessions have you taken? And this is how many hours of your life have you actually spent studying the craft of voice acting, and not just for coaching. But let's just say, how many hours have you spent marketing? Like companies have entire marketing departments. They hire multiple people like you know, 20, 50, hundreds of people to generate leads. You are one person, and so you want to know why you haven't gotten work yet. You know what I mean. You're spending your time auditioning, you're spending your time doing a bunch of stuff, but also you've got to spend that time marketing, and so people, I think, are just giving up too soon. Lau.  03:50 - Lau (Guest) Yeah, they're also not paying attention to their environment. They're thinking that I'm in my own private Idaho. I'm going to be successful. This is what I want, and here it comes. You got to look at the world, you got to look at global economics.  04:03 You got to look at the US we're now in a high inflation state right now and how that affects other industries. That's going to make you feel I mean, we don't want injury and suffering of all industry, but you want to pay attention that if all industries are suffering, then it stands to reason that yours will be suffering as well too. And so there's misery. Does like a little bit of company, and so do the work, do the homework. Look around, however, you do that just so you can keep it in perspective, because otherwise we get so isolated and we get out of the bubble times.  04:37 How many times have you heard Anneie, oh, great, I got my demo, I'm ready to work. Okay, how do I work? And you're thinking, no, no, no, this is only the very beginning, the very, very beginning. Right, you're not in the middle, ready to work. No, this is the beginning of like, how do I put a little bit of a footprint out there? How do I get people to know I'm in the world? How do I do that? That's on me, that's all on me to do that.  05:02 - Anne (Host) And people will be very quick to blame people selling the dream, okay. So yes, there are people that sell the dream, but there's people that sell the dream for many an industry, right, and that's part of how they have their business flourish. However, there's a lot to be said for what you just said, and that is pay attention to the world, pay attention to the global market, pay attention to what is it that people are looking for? How is our voice profession being viewed in the marketplace right now? What's in demand, right? What is the going rate? What are people getting paid?  05:38 You cAnneot just say I've practiced, I've got a demo and now I'm ready to work, because there's so many other factors at play. One of the things is that you've got to evolve with the market and you've got to give yourself enough time in the market so that you can get hired. A lot of times, it's people who are established in the market and can show that they're established in the market for a very long time. Clients will tend to gravitate to them. I mean, I know for myself, right? If I'm looking to work with a particular we always use the dentist. It seems like I want a dentist who's got experience?  06:14 I want a doctor who has experience. I needed a breast surgeon right, obviously, for my breast cancer. I shopped for a breast surgeon. Of course, how long they were in business and how many surgeries did they perform it was a factor in who I hired to do such a thing. I think most of the voice actors that get super frustrated and say it's just not working. I put in all this money. I ask you to step back and think about what you just said. Did you really invest a lot of money? Maybe, yes, you thought that you could maybe create a business out of a whole lot less. Maybe it's because somebody sold you the dream. But also do not discount the fact that maybe you didn't look or educate yourself on what this industry is all about. And what investment do you need to make? That's not just monetary investment, it's also-.  07:06 - Lau (Guest) That's exactly right.  07:08 - Anne (Host) What sort of time is invested? What sort of education is invested for you?  07:13 - Lau (Guest) I always think to myself, Anneie, when, even though you may be in inflation, even though it may be hard to get clients at a particular time, I always think, when I'm very low, meaning I'm not getting enough action, I'm not getting enough energy, I always think and again, this is the work ethic of our generation I always think what am I doing wrong?  07:31 - Anne (Host) Did I lay back.  07:32 - Lau (Guest) Am I not working hard enough? Am I not working smart enough? Am I not strategizing enough? I may not be doing anything wrong, but the point is I always put it on myself. I don't look at the universe and say why isn't it coming to me, why isn't it just there for me? Why am I not busy and getting hired? I always think, well, am I putting myself in front of enough people? Do I have the right materials that are suiting the kind of job that they're looking for? Am I missing something? And typically I find it's on me.  08:03 - Anne (Host) Typically, I do find that, yeah, I agree, it is something that you really need to step back and take a look at. If you're not booking number one and I have so many people are like people that are newer to the industry that think, well, I've got a great commercial demo and I think to myself, well, commercial is only a certain percentage of the market. What about the other part of the market? Right, and so maybe you're auditioning, but you're only auditioning for your agents, who are typically commercial. Or maybe you're doing a ton of auditioning on the pay to plays.  08:35 Well, what is the majority of the genre that you are auditioning for? Is it commercial? Because, I guarantee you, there's a ton of competition for the commercials, because that's what all the voice actors tend to gravitate toward, that's what everybody thinks they need to audition for. Well, you can audition for e-learning, you can audition for corporate, you can audition for all different types of jobs. And, ultimately, I think that you need to really again step back and look at and maybe assess right down. Okay, here's what I'm doing on a day to day basis. Right, I'm auditioning for this type of job, I am auditioning for the majority of commercials or e-learning, the majority of whatever corporate, and so now really try to assess what's the demand out there globally right for that product. And are you marketing yourselves, are you writing that?  09:24 - Lau (Guest) letter, especially if it's on a pay to play.  09:27 - Anne (Host) Usually, you can respond with some sort of a hey, would love to be your voice, and make sure to take a look at my additional demos here on my website. Blah, blah, blah, whatever that is. Is that note up to par? Are you writing a novel? Are you quick into the point? Is your auditioning up to snuff? Is your acting skills? What about your audio? Gosh, we've done enough audition demolitions and, by the way, we've got to have another one coming up here soon. Yes, a lot of times audio has something to do with it too. What's your audio like? So there's lots of things that you can take a look at to see where you might evolve, where you might improve.  10:03 And also again, those things don't happen overnight. Great sound, although I will say great sound once you've got it kind of figured out, you shouldn't have to revisit it too much after that, Unless maybe you get new microphones or you move or there's more landscaping going on. I'm not sure.  10:18 - Lau (Guest) Yeah Well, it's inevitable to you and I on the coaching side of things that we'll get so many emails of people that say I don't understand how come I'm not booking what's happening. Could you please do a session with me and give me some feedback? And you and I will do the same thing. We'll give a session and just spend a whole hour with feedback and it looks like a ball, hit them between the eyes like, oh my goodness, I didn't even realize any of that. I didn't think of half of that.  10:45 Thank you for that value, because that value didn't save me and getting a job. That value helped me produce a career potential. Sure, and that's what smart people would say. They wouldn't take offense to it. They'd say, oh wow, this could help me build my career, just knowing one of those things that I would not have thought of. But I somehow feel like and I don't know what it is, I don't know if it's a generational thing, I'm just not sure this idea that, oh, I just know it. I got it all, I learned it all, I trained, I coached with five coaches, I know it all. And I'm thinking I don't think any of the great thinkers, philosophers or religious leaders think they even closely know it all, so chances are you don't know it.  11:26 - Anne (Host) All Right. Isn't that the truth? How about that? Isn't that the truth? I?  11:28 - Lau (Guest) can't imagine someone like Gandhi saying I know it all. It's kind of like the more you don't know.  11:33 - Anne (Host) The more you don't know, right, the more you don't know. Yeah, what was the saying? The more you know, the more you don't know.  11:40 - Lau (Guest) The more you realize you don't know right.  11:41 - Anne (Host) Yeah exactly.  11:42 - Lau (Guest) I think that that's true wisdom.  11:43 - Anne (Host) Can we just stop and say that again? The more you know, the more you realize that you don't know, right? Yes, that, I think, is key to understanding and not giving up Because you can again. We had another episode that we talked about. Well, people just they thought they had it all and they're like well, yeah, no, I sound great and in reality sometimes that is ignorance, is bliss right, or I sound great but in reality do you Like I've invested a lot.  12:11 Well, in reality, have you I market in reality. Do you Like you think about what companies do they spend thousands of? And also, do I spend money? They don't have money to spend on marketing. They don't have money to spend on coaching? Think about the amount of money that companies invest in their marketing departments. First of all, they hire more than one person, most of them, right. They hire a team of people and then that team of people work eight hours a day, maybe more than that, right Trying to generate leads and trying to close sales. And so are you doing that, really so?  12:45 - Lau (Guest) right and it's almost harder when that talent would come to me and they're fabulous and their demo is spick and span and they've got some great credits and they're just not booking the work and I don't have the heart to tell them that I've got 50 people just like that and it's kind of like not insulting. It's so sad for them, it's so doleful for them to have the realization and recognition that it is saturated and there are a lot of talented people and prepared people and people who have spent the investment.  13:20 They're not the only ones, and I think that they might intellectually know that, but put it in the back of their brain. But it's important to know that you have a lot of competitors. You're not so unique. You've got a lot of people.  13:33 - Anne (Host) that are unique too. You bring up a really good point. I'm glad that you said that because, yes, that's the other aspect of this. Do I give up, right? Or should I just give up because now there's just so much competition? Right, and yes, you nailed your demo, you have the acting skills and now, all of a sudden, have you really marketed? I always think, if you really are coming to that point where you've got the demo, you've got the skills, have you truly marketed it as much as you think you have? Or is it possible for you to up that even more again? But you're right, it's a saturated market. There's a lot of competition.  14:10 Now, if that's the case, have you thought about how you might evolve into maybe a different genre, or evolve your business to have another parallel set of skills that you're going to develop or evolve? Now that, I think, Lau is something to keep your business afloat. And I always talk about IBM. Ok, ibm has been around forever, right, and IBM is considered a technology company, but look at how they still are here. They're still relevant. They may not be considered a cool company, but guess what? They're still in business, right, and they've had to evolve their products, they've had to evolve their thinking. They've had to evolve over time, and take a look at any great company that has been around for a long time. They have evolved their brand, they've evolved their products, and so if the market is indeed saturated for, let's say, the genre that you love so dearly, well then maybe you think about how you can evolve into another genre or another aspect of the business that will bring you some income.  15:15 And sometimes only doing voiceover, it's wonderful, yes, but sometimes maybe you do something that's parallel to voiceover. Maybe you do audio editing, maybe you do copywriting, maybe you do virtual assisting right within the industry, maybe you do a podcast. Again, there are so many divisions and, again, I have always said to people that I have multiple divisions of my company, mostly because I love to challenge myself, right. So I've got the VO Boss. I've got this podcast, which I just wanted to learn how to podcast. I've got the VO Peeps. I've always wanted to network. I missed my teaching and then I'm demo producing, and so there's so many different evolutions of my business. I even coach outside of voiceover now, for wellness and healthcare. Why? Because I love it and I'm developing, evolving different aspects of my business that are going to serve me and bring me joy.  16:09 - Lau (Guest) Yes, and, let's be honest, Anneie, those of us that consider ourselves creatives, which most of us are, love doing different things. Yes, absolutely why aren't we sitting at a desk doing the same thing all day long, my God? Yes, exactly Because we're creative minded people. So that idea of multitasking and bringing out different qualities, and skill sets and loves and da-da, and maybe this year I want to try this. Yes, I want to move into that. It's not a cop out, it's not the side hustle that you shouldn't be doing.  16:40 It's an added layer of frosting to the cake, so to speak, that you really want to keep building over your lifetime, because not only can it be a service that you could really offer and make some extra cash, but also it could be really delightfully fun and inspiring and give you new ideas and be very satisfying to you in a way that the current daily situation is not or maybe it is, but it's not in that particular way and also branching out what I always called the divisions or the tendrils of my business.  17:12 - Anne (Host) Branching out allows you to expand your potential client base for voiceover here's an example, I'm going to be presenting at PodFest at a podcasting conference.  17:23 Now, podcasting is not what I do full-time. I am a full-time voice actor, coach, producer, that sort of thing but I certainly have been doing the VioBoss podcast for seven years and it's definitely a division of my business. Now I'm going to go and present and so ultimately that's outside of the voiceover industry, but yet I'm going to present to podcasters to talk to them about how they can utilize their skills in voiceover and also how they can improve their voice on their podcast, and so that is outside of right, and I'm not ashamed to say that it doesn't mean that I'm not doing voiceover anymore. No, it's another avenue that I find challenging and I find intriguing, and I want to pursue that as an additional piece of my business. There's nothing wrong with that.  18:12 - Lau (Guest) There's nothing wrong with that?  18:13 - Anne (Host) You don't have to be eight hours in your studio doing voiceover if that's not where your entrepreneurial brain wants to be, I mean, there's nothing wrong with that, and sometimes it's more healthy for you to branch out into other arenas to function way and refresh your brain and bring in new people, new ideas, new ideas, understand the perspective from a multitude of different perspectives. Right, yes, Really.  18:43 And that I think, is very healthy in terms of developing and growing your business. So if you don't get that national campaign this year, it's okay. I say a good entrepreneur will always evolve and develop their skills in a multitude of places so that they can have a successful business. And does it matter if you're not booking a national commercial every day, because I don't know anybody who is, to be quite honest. And so it really comes down to what is it that brings you joy, that can pay the bills and that you can do day in and day out?  19:18 Because most of the time, people get into this industry because they're super unhappy with what they're doing in their lives. So I always try to remember your why. Why did you get into the industry or want to get into the industry in the first place and then keep that why, especially when you're feeling like giving up, and especially we started this whole conversation about why people give up too soon. Well, I think you absolutely have to define your why and revisit that why over and over again and evolve your why as you grow.  19:48 - Lau (Guest) Yes, I mean you're the princess of pivoting and that pivot that change, that updating and upgrading we have to do it on our computer systems, we have to do it on our bodies. Yeah, you have to do it in our homes. Why wouldn't we have to do that in our businesses? And so that sense of like I have to clean up shop and I have to add something to this element that I don't have, because why? It's going to change the whole space, it's going to change the whole environment. That it's never just one thing, one effect. It really is. It has a whole rolling effect on everything. So if you learn to podcast or you become a producer or you learn how to write copy, that could have a whole riveting effect on your business. Absolutely, absolutely.  20:36 - Anne (Host) I love that, oh man. So let's talk about voice actors right now who are frustrated and want to give up. What is your best advice Lau? What can they do right now?  20:45 - Lau (Guest) I hear it every day. I'm going to throw out a quote. I love a good quote. Eleanor Roosevelt, the great Eleanor Roosevelt.  20:50 Okay, never, never, never give up. Don't mistake that. That does not mean don't give up on voiceover. It means don't give up on yourself and your potential within the business. That may morph into something else, absolutely. It may become something else, but don't throw that baby out with the bathwater and just give up on everything, because then what you're really saying is I'm not worth my time, my patience, my effort, my investment in really investigating my true potential, yeah, yeah.  21:24 - Anne (Host) And giving up is that, oh gosh, you don't feel worthy. And how many episodes have we already dedicated to? You must understand you're worth, you're worth it, you're worth it, you are worth it. And again, there's a reason why you got involved in this industry in the first place, and I think that maybe you're thinking the dream, or somebody sold you the dream, but I think, ultimately, you are responsible for educating yourself about this dream and educating yourself about how to navigate this dream, to turn it into a reality, to turn it into a success, understanding that this does not happen overnight.  22:00 There are constantly changes in the industry and there's a lot of changes. I mean, gosh, ai has thrown a wrench into a lot of this. Then there was a strike and then, every time I turn around, there are things that are throwing wrenches into the industry that you need to know about and you need to then say, all right, how can I evolve, how can I grow with this, if I'm not getting work right now? What can I do to maybe get work? Or can I create a new path for myself?  22:30 or create an alternate an additional path. Not just another, but an additional path.  22:35 It can be done, I mean gosh knows that I have created multiple, multiple divisions of my business just because it's a cool challenge, right, and it always forces me to grow. And I will tell every single boss out there right now that you don't think that I am scared every single day when I decide I'm going to do this and you don't think that scares the bejesus out of me. It still does. It still does, but I try to work through that. I've just been challenging myself constantly and I'm constantly afraid and I just try to work through it. Maybe it gets a little bit easier. I kind of doubt it. I still get just as scared sometimes when I say oh gosh now.  23:13 What do I do, Right?  23:14 - Lau (Guest) What am I going to do now?  23:16 - Anne (Host) Or I know what I want to do. How do I get there? How do I make that happen? Because now it's been what? 16, 17 years I didn't come this far to go work for somebody again. Right, this is my business or I am in charge of my own business. I will not go back. I cAnneot go back.  23:33 - Lau (Guest) Yes, absolutely, and I didn't even know when my dad always taught me you know, if you want to go in business for yourself, just know you're never going to sleep well again. Just know that that's so true, Like in as long as you understand that, you'll understand that you know you're going to set a very high bar. A lot of us that are perfectionists make the mistake of making the bar so high. It's unattainable, and then you're always disappointed. You're always letting yourself down. Really, no one's keeping score.  23:58 It's really about setting the bar at a place that is sensible, you can reach it. You can have small increments of success. Yes, right, yeah, I'll leave you on this quote. One of my favorite quotes is failure is the opportunity to start again more intelligently.  24:16 - Anne (Host) Yeah, love that, love that Love, that Is that good.  24:19 - Lau (Guest) Yeah, I don't believe in failure, really, but I don't either Use whatever word you want to use that I'm not achieving, I'm not attaining, I'm not getting. Allow you to grow. Allow you to grow. Take a step back and learn from it, you know start again Good stuff and don't give up, bosses.  24:34 - Anne (Host) Never, ever, ever give up, don't give up. All right, no Bosses, take a moment. Imagine a world full of passionate, empowered people who are giving back to their communities intentionally to create a world that they want to see. You can find out more at 100voiceswhocareorg. Also, big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. You, too, can network like bosses with awesome technology. Go to IPDTLcom to find out more. Guys, have an amazing week. Don't give up. We're here for you. All right, we'll see you next week. Bye. See you then. Bye.  25:10 - Intro (Anneouncement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host and Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.
Empowering Change: Female Entrepreneurship
Mar 5 2024
Empowering Change: Female Entrepreneurship
Join BOSS Anne Ganguzza, alongside guest co-host, Lau Lapides, as they explore the landscape of female entrepreneurship, including in the voiceover industry. Listen in as they discuss the historical and contemporary hurdles women have faced, from the 1950s through modern times. Lau shares her experiences in juggling motherhood and a professional career, providing a real-life perspective on the intricate dance of working from home with children. Anne discusses her non-traditional path to business success in the tech and VO industries. This conversation celebrates the resilience and creativity of women who are redefining success in their entrepreneurial journeys. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a V-O boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the V-O Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and I'm here with my special, awfully lovely boss guest, co-host Law Lapides.  00:32 - Lau (Co-host) Oh, thank you, Annie, hey Lau. Thank you, hey. I'm excited about our topic today.  00:38 - Anne (Host) Well, yeah, so Law, I've been watching Lessons in Chemistry and that is on Apple Plus for those of you who have not seen it. But basically it takes place in the 1950s and the main character who is Elizabeth Zott? She has a dream of being a scientist and works in a lab, but she is constantly challenged by a society that says women belong in the domestic sphere. And I just watched the episode and I don't want to give away too many spoilers, but I'm going to give away one spoiler here. So, guys, if you want to watch it and you don't want to have a spoiler, just turn this down right now for sure.  01:14 So basically, she gets fired because she's pregnant. So now that I'm going to date myself. But I said to my husband, jerry, that doesn't make sense, they can't fire her for being pregnant. And he goes oh my gosh, back in that day they absolutely could. And I was like whoa, that just blew my mind and I thought, gosh, I think women have it hard now these days. And that's what I want to talk to you about Law, because I just want to talk about what it's like to be a female entrepreneur. And I want to talk to you because you're one of the best entrepreneurs I know. I mean, you run a studio, you're a talent agent, I'm a demo producer things that aren't typically prevalent, I guess, even now in today's day, for women to do so I thought we should talk about that today.  01:58 - Lau (Co-host) I love the leading lady subject. I just think it's one of my favorites Absolutely. And you're right about that Jerry's right about that Because I remember my mom talking a lot about that that even into the 80s, 90s and 2000s in corporate America there was something called the mommy track. So anyone who was training for financial advisor, accountant and such was very careful about what they said about getting married or having children, because they didn't want to be rerouted into the mommy track, meaning they're capped in every way.  02:33 - Anne (Host) They're capped on promotion, they're capped on salary, they're capped on all of this, they won't get their job when they come back. And it's funny because, now that you mentioned that, I do remember that in the 2000s and it's incredible to me. So here we are entrepreneurs, bosses, out there, you're entrepreneurs as well, and I don't think that this needs to be. This is certainly not a discussion where we're just going to be bitter and complaining.  02:55 However, I think we need to talk about some of the hardships of being an entrepreneur. First of all, being an entrepreneur is a hard thing. What sort of hardships have you encountered yourself, Law, and how have you overcome them? Because I think that we can learn a lot from that, from your story.  03:12 - Lau (Co-host) Such a great question, that's such a huge, open-ended question and the first vision Annie that came to my mind was a client that I work with, a coach on Zoom, and she's a mom and she has a couple younger ones, meaning under the age of like 12, a couple young kids, and when I'm coaching her as a voice over talent, the kids are running in and out of her studio, in and out of her booth, in and out of her curtain and one side of it she's a great mom, like she's really patient, she never yells, she's just great. But one side of me I have to be honest with you. I'm going to be honest with your people because they deserve it. One side of me thinks it's awesome because she can work from home, she can multitask, she can save money, she can still be a mom and be a good role model to them so they can see her working and being impassioned. The other side of me is irked, irked to death, because I'm thinking to myself you're not going to do that with a client, right? You're not going to do that if I represent you and send you out, and then your little kid is pulling down the curtain in the booth right, and I lose trust in that situation. I'm going to be honest. Maybe it's a non-PC thing to say, but that's how people think when it comes to running something. So is a fine line, I think, and I was one of those.  04:35 I raised two children. I was one of those moms where I raised them out of my studio. I actually homeschooled them as crazy as that sound. We had a whole village of people working with them and it was out of my studio and I was constantly multitasking the noise level. I'm killing each other, legos everywhere, them under the desk, and there was a beauty to the whole thing that there was this bonding that you could go through with them. And then there was a horror show as well, because it was embarrassing and there were clients there and some clients love the kids and others hate kids.  05:10 So it's like there are all these levels and layers to that kind of parental mindset, at least from my perspective, that you have to go through step by step, year by year, age by age, and it changes, and it changes often dramatically. It never stays the same Absolutely. And women, no matter how progressive the male is, whether they're a husband, a partner, a friend, whoever maybe they're working from home, maybe they're whatever I find more often than not with all my friends, all my female colleagues, it falls on them, the heavy falls on them. There is still this mindset in 2024, that I got to go to work, I got things to do, I got priority tasks, but because you're a female, you're so good, you can handle it all, you can do it. You take the reins while you're trying to run your business.  06:05 - Anne (Host) Sure, that's the thing, and I think that also there are many, I would say, women pioneers of many different things, and I am of the belief that, yes, women sometimes have to work three or four times harder in order to get any type of credit, and a lot of times there are women who pioneer things who never get credit and ultimately that is very frustrating and I find it even today, as progressive as we've become, I mean, there's still a long way to go, I think.  06:34 For number one, just to be an entrepreneur, I think it's looked upon in terms of, like gosh, when I was trying to get a loan when I worked for myself full time, I felt like I suffered a little bit of, I don't know, discrimination. It was very difficult to assure things like loans, where I feel as though a male counterpart would be able to get a loan a heck of a lot easier if they were an entrepreneur. Also, just getting ahead, I'm going to say that right now there's not a ton of demo producers that are females out there in the industry and I feel like it's tough trying to get noticed out there because there's not many of us out there, and then ultimately, it would be nice if there was recognition, maybe more recognition for the female demo producers out there and I'm just talking about demo producers, but just female, any entrepreneur out there and it wasn't that long ago, really, that women couldn't even get loans.  07:30 - Lau (Co-host) They couldn't even open a bank account without permission from their husband. It wasn't that long ago. So, when you think about just the freedom of being able to have credit go into debt, who would call that a freedom? But I mean the point is, it's like it's an independence as a business owner to be able to say, okay, here's what I'm investing in, here's what I'm incurring for debt, here are the accounts I'm going to do, here's my investments for retirement. And, as a woman, there's a tremendous freedom in independence, in being able to do that. It's not to say that you shouldn't have a team or a partner people helping you and working with you. It is to say, though, that you should take that right, and you should run with that ball and enjoy the right of being able to do these things that we could not do even 30 years ago some of those.  08:24 - Anne (Host) Well, I've spoken to people about this. We even had a podcast episode where we talked about what we did prior to our businesses today, and I was a female engineer in the late 1980s. That was kind of a tough road. And then I went into technology as a female and that was also a tough road, and so being a female entrepreneur is even tougher. Sometimes I'm finding certain things are difficult difficult for us to achieve, difficult for us to get recognition, difficult and, like you said, with the loans and all of that, it's just so interesting. So, la, what do you do to progress and move your business forward as a female?  09:04 - Lau (Co-host) entrepreneur. Yeah, it's a hard thing to answer. I mean, there's one technique that I found myself doing just kind of like, in an autonomic kind of way. It wasn't a planned thing, but I noticed there have been situations where I've been with many men or all male like. Let's say, I'm in a conference room or I'm online and I'm in a meeting and there happens to be very male heavy, which I adore, and I have, like you do, many, many male colleagues which I absolutely love working with.  09:30 But I find there's a different dynamic that happens in the way I communicate versus the way this kind of energy communicates, and oftentimes I find that I start to role play, or I'm either seen in a certain light or I start to role play, and usually it's like the role play of the mother, the wife, the sister, the whatever that I know. To some degree they're seeing me in just because of the qualities that I exude, sure, and I kind of role play with that meaning. You know, I don't play a character, but I role play in the sense that I know that they're looking at these qualities and I also know that there are times where they just bulldoze right over me like they literally won't hear what I'm saying because they're in the middle of their communication and I let that happen. I let that ride. I feel actually empowered by that because I know I have no problem.  10:24 This is a technique we always taught live presenters. I've no problem interrupting them culturally, doesn't matter to me whether it's appropriate or not. I have no problem talking right over them. And I found that in order to redirect energy, sometimes you have to be culturally rude as a woman, because you have to have your voice heard Absolutely. And you have to have that without and here's the thing we were talking about in the last podcast without ruining or stomping on their spirit, without making them feel like I'm at them or I'm hurting them or a threat. I think that there's a fine line, there's a strategy in that, like how you strategize, like being heard, inserting what you need to insert into listening attentively, but making sure you're not the daisy on the wall. You're not forgotten Absolutely.  11:15 And that's on us. I mean, it really is, that's on us. I could easily sit back and get really angry at that and say I can't even get a word in edgewise. Are they not listening to what I just said? Or whatever. Instead, I go in and I correct it. I go in and I redirect it. I go in and I do whatever action verb I can come up with, because I always view it as a teaching moment. Sure, it's a teaching moment where I can teach my audience how to communicate with me.  11:40 - Anne (Host) I love the redirection of it. Yeah, like you said, rather than getting angry or stomping on someone's ego, which it really is a lot of ego anyways, I know in the corporate world that's really what it played out to be. It was a lot of ego and a lot of times, if I was in the boardroom and I was the only female, or maybe one of two females first of all, they always wanted me to take notes or be the secretary. People would always say, well, yeah, you can be the secretary.  12:06 You can be the secretary of the board and I'm like actually I'll be the president.  12:10 - Lau (Co-host) I like that.  12:11 - Anne (Host) Right, and that's really how it worked. I was the president of a board and ultimately, they wanted me initially to be the secretary, and I said, well, yeah, no, no, I'm actually not a really good note taker, so I redirected the energy to say, you know, I'm just no.  12:26 I'm not fast. I'd love to be fast, but I'm not. I'm not fast at all. I type with four fingers. That's great, I love that and that's basically what happened. And so I love how you say to redirect it, because, yeah, I mean I don't necessarily want to stomp on anybody because, again, you take that risk of being looked upon as being the difficult one, the difficult one, the angry one, the witchy one, and honestly, you're darned if you do and you're darned if you don't.  12:50 Sometimes with that, that's right. But I like how you say you don't have any problems interrupting and redirecting. I think that's a great tactic. It's a good thing.  12:57 - Lau (Co-host) It's a good thing to learn how to do that. I also think another option for you and again I try to look at it take a step back and look at a strategy, a choice redefine the role. If someone says I want you to play this role in this moment and I'm like I don't want to play that role, or that's a typical role that they'd ask their mother to play, right, I might say yes to that, and the reason I'd say that yes to that is because I can do it. It's not a difficult thing for me to do. I want to be helpful. But then I'm going to redefine what the role is so the role does not become a passive role of like, in your case, a no-take or a stereotypical role, or get me a coffee, or I don't know whatever  13:34 that stereotypical thing is. I would want to play it as many of the female leaders political female leaders in the world, where they don't mind cooking for their colleagues, or maybe they'd get them a coffee, but then they're going to tell them exactly what the strategy is for the company or for the war or for the whatever. So if you do become that omnidynamic kind of person I don't know if you saw a Barbie you know the billion-dollar Barbie movie, right? But Barbie was always known as, at least in our time, was like. Barbie kept re-envisioning and redefining what a woman could be and evolving.  14:12 And evolving, and that's why we really liked Barbie or loved Barbie, because it wasn't just this one thing that you were in.  14:18 - Intro (Announcement) Absolutely.  14:19 - Lau (Co-host) It was really kept going and still today even keeps going, and I see it as that. I see it as I can make the choice to keep redefining the role that others see me in.  14:30 - Anne (Host) Yeah, and I love that. I love that so much, actually, and I think that, as entrepreneurs, right, take on the role and then create your own definition, or redefine the stereotypical definition Now, in terms of being seen right, being seen as a leader, right, being seen as an entrepreneurial leader. What sort of tips do you have for that? Because I like to say, when you redefine the role, you don't necessarily have to lead everyone, but you have to be seen as competent, as being as competent as everyone else within your role, right? Yes, so I am just as competent, if not more competent, as the role of a demo producer or the role of my Angangusa voice production company, as any other person, yes, I mean play to an audience at all times, even if it's an imaginary audience yes, the imaginary jury, so to speak, that I'm always a leader, whether someone is there or not, and I'm alone.  15:29 - Lau (Co-host) Love that I'm still a leader, or at least I perceive myself to be a leader. Sure, I don't want to lose the qualities of the leadership and the leader. I want to continue that role. I want to play it every day, I want to manifest that role. So, in essence, it feels at home to me, but it also keeps me practicing the role. It practices how I would react, how I would behave, how I would make problem-solving choices, how I would do all of these things. Because I know and this is what keeps us up at night, right as entrepreneurs is I know there's going to be difficulties and they're never going to end, and so I have to be able to face with courage and just say listen, I just am not always going to want that or like it or feel comfortable with it, and sometimes I'm going to be scared to death. Oh, yes, I have to feel the fear and do it anyway. I have to practice it.  16:20 - Anne (Host) Well, yeah, that's so wonderful, I mean, and that's just great advice for entrepreneurship in general is face the fear. And I think that, no matter what you're doing and just saying this, and having been in the industry a long time and mostly being in roles that were traditionally not female oriented, I had to, I think, work extra hard to educate myself so that I could prove to myself, first of all, that I could do it. And when I was able to do that, I gained the confidence in order to be able to manifest further progression and advancement. And again, like you said, you're the leader, whether people are looking or not. And so and it is scary my gosh I face fears every day, just as an entrepreneur, and sometimes even more as a female, because I don't know necessarily what I'm doing, when I'm defining a new role.  17:12 And so, therefore, I'm defining a new role. I'm going to educate myself as much as I possibly can about everything that surrounds that role. And if it's a role that hasn't been defined, then I need to educate myself on everything that is around that role that can help me to define it. And, of course, sometimes you just have to manifest it and you just have to take a leap of faith and say here it is, here is how I define it. And there you go and be confident in that, and that's scary as sh**t.  17:44 - Lau (Co-host) Law, and not only that, and as women, at least women from our you're like the fifth friend of mine, colleague of mine that we literally said the same exact thing over and over again the last week. That is, we are from a generation of really hard work ethic. We get up, we work, we do it, keep doing it. Forget about yourself, just do it do it.  18:05 Please, please others, be likable, be amenable. You know all these things which in essence is good. From a spiritual perspective it is good, but from a business perspective it can be very harmful, because when you do that, I want everybody to like me, law, I need your thing. It then becomes about you rather than about them, about the client. So I have to keep check of that all the time.  18:30 That's a fight I have too Pleaser, a very much a host type, and I don't want to lose that quality, but I don't want it to take the place of true grit and leadership and leadership of making sure that what I'm saying and what I'm doing is not being done for the wrong reason.  18:47 - Anne (Host) Yeah, I totally agree with you. There's a lot to be said about leadership and leadership qualities, and what does it take to be a good leader? Yes, to define roles that haven't previously existed. I think it takes definitely a lot of courage, and I think having people on your team, no matter who they are, can be super helpful in this, because it's a scary road, especially when you're doing things for the first time and they've not been done. And so having somebody to bounce off an idea to say, well, what do you think about this, do you think?  19:17 And not worrying, that's tough. Not necessarily worrying so much about what people will think will people like me? Especially because, yeah, I think you and I I'm people pleasers and, of course, I want people to like me and it really upsets me when people don't, and that's just an ingrained part of my personality. But I realized that if I want to be a leader and I want to break new ground and sometimes I will do that and not get any credit for it, and you know what that's okay, I have to figure out. Do I try to spend all my energy trying to get credit for it? Not necessarily, because for me, it's more about the education and the challenge to myself and then, ultimately, I believe, or I want to believe, that at some point people will recognize it, just because I've proven things over and, over and over again. Absolutely.  20:08 - Lau (Co-host) And I think many of us, in many fields, can concur with that, that feeling of like. I just said that, wait, I did that years ago. I actually did that. And this person is, you know, they're acting as if it's a first yes, and so I think that that is a generational thing as well, because it's like it reminds me of the joke of like when a younger generation gets married or they have children, they oftentimes feel like they're the first generation raising children, they're the first ones who understand how to be a good parent, they're the first ones that. And then the joke is always like, you know, by the third child, you can watch them. Yeah, it's fine, I don't even know what I'm doing, it's just so the idea of like, okay, I'll humor you, I'll allow you to think that you're the first one because maybe that's the phase you're in, but the reality is is we know it's never the first.  21:03 There's always so many people going through it in so many different ways. It's just who's discovering it, who's observing it and who's reporting on it.  21:12 - Anne (Host) Oh, that's so true, isn't it Like right? It's so funny because you're absolutely right, like we're all just trying to, we all just want to be loved, don't I always say?  21:21 - Intro (Announcement) that, like we all just want to be loved All of us.  21:23 - Anne (Host) As people, we all want to be given the credit that we feel is due to us, and sometimes it's not worth the effort If you've already been there, done that kind of thing. It's not necessarily the effort to bring it up, because sometimes that will look different to different people. Right, it could look catty, and so for me I try to just again. That's one of those it's mental games where you try just to like okay, you know what. I've done, that educated myself on this, and being angry or being bitter certainly doesn't allow me the energy to progress forward from this point on, and so it doesn't make sense to spend the energy on being bitter or being angry but, simply just using that energy to educate myself and move forward Yet again, to make myself the very best version of myself and my business that I can be.  22:17 Yeah time.  22:18 - Lau (Co-host) I really trust time. Time will teach all, time will definitely teach all. And I think that it's hard to generalize because we're also different in different cultures, different generations. But there is one thing I do believe many females have in common, and that's powerful, powerful instinct. And how we treat instinct. Is it real for us? Do we pay attention to it? Do we listen to it? Whether you think of it as a survival mechanism or you think of it as a spiritual guide, I really do feel strongly. It's a compass for us. Oh, gut instinct.  22:51 - Anne (Host) Absolutely. I love my life. I've got instinct, I know.  22:54 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, to know that something is right, something's wrong, something doesn't feel good, something is unsafe. I do believe a lot of female colleagues I have go very wrong when they don't listen to their instinct or they no longer hear the voice.  23:08 - Anne (Host) I think anybody. If they don't listen to their instinct, they don't trust it. Yeah, I mean anybody, certainly Anybody certainly you know what I mean.  23:15 - Lau (Co-host) But there is that built in thing with women. I totally agree. They're always looking out for the cubs. Even if they don't have cubs, you know, your cub may be your client, yeah.  23:25 - Anne (Host) Yeah, absolutely, Absolutely. That's so interesting that you say that because I think I've always in my lifetime I've always run my business and run my personal life by my instincts. I've always trusted it and it's never failed me so over and over again. And I think if you just trust it, just try it. If you're not used to that, try it and see what happens. And ultimately it's kind of like the first time you say no to a client who wants to not pay you what you're worth, right, and you just learn that negotiation tactic where you're like, yeah, that's great, I'm going to pass on this, and you find that you'll have the time to get a client that will pay you what you're worth and so that first no can be so powerful. Very similar to just having that power as an entrepreneur.  24:07 - Lau (Co-host) And isn't it ironic too that we want people to hire us for our voice, for our vocal delivery, but oftentimes we're not willing to listen to our own voice.  24:19 - Anne (Host) Yeah, so true.  24:20 - Lau (Co-host) Isn't that ironic when you think about that. So true.  24:23 - Anne (Host) So wise, very sage law, ooh, we like it Absolutely.  24:29 Good stuff, wow. So yeah, entrepreneurs, bosses, you've got this and we've got you. So, guys, really reach out to us, let us know what your struggles have been and how you've overcome them. We'd really love to hear that Also. Simple mission, big impact 100 voices one hour, $10,000. Guess what? Four times a year, visit 100voiceswhocareorg to learn more and to join us. Big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. You too can connect and network, like bosses and strong, powerful female entrepreneurs such as Law and myself. You guys have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. See you next week.  25:12 Awesome Bye.  25:15 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL hey Law.  25:43 - Anne (Host) Guess what time of year it is.  25:46 - Lau (Co-host) What time of year is it Ann?  25:48 - Anne (Host) Time for the audition demolition holiday Holiday. We're very jolly, so I can't wait for this edition of the holiday edition of the audition demolition Guys get your auditions in Live shows on December 14th and we've got some great scripts. Of course, they are holiday themes, so you guys are going to have a ton of fun. There is cash, there is swag, there are prizes. You guys get in on the fun, get in on the learning. It's only seven. How much is it? Law Shit? It's only oh. You don't need to say the price, do you? Well, I want to say that it's like. It's like it's the best gift. All right, let's try that again.
Unions, AI, and You with Tom Dheere
Feb 27 2024
Unions, AI, and You with Tom Dheere
This week Anne and Tom Dheere discussed the landmark agreement between SAG-AFTRA and Replica Studios. They discuss how this deal will shape the compensation, usage rights, and ethical considerations of voice performances in the age of AI. They look at the details of this complex partnership, examining the potential ripple effects for both union and non-union talents. They emphasize hinges on the necessity for voice actors to stay informed and proactive in the face of advancing technology that could redefine our industry. They confront the pressing issues that voice actors encounter, such as leasing AI technology and the critical need to secure royalties and licensing fees. The BOSSES cover the intricacies of fair AI voiceover rate structures and underscores the urgency for collective bargaining and new legal frameworks. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VEO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss Podcast and the Real Bosses series. I'm your host, Ann Ganguzza, and I'm here with my special guest, co-host Tom Dheere. Tom, I'm so excited to have you back, yes thank you so much for having me again this has been so much fun.  00:35 So, tom, there's been some news in the industry and I think all bosses should always be following up and be current on news that's happening in the industry, because it directly affects our businesses and so there has been a groundbreaking agreement between SAG-AFTRA and Replica Studios, which is an AI company, and I think we should talk about this and how it affects us and how it affects our businesses.  01:01 - Tom Dheere (Guest) I agree. Now just to get disclaimers. One I am a SAG-eligible member. I am non-union, so I am not a member of SAG-AFTRA. So I was going to say I don't have a horse in the race. But all voice actors, regardless of union status, has a horse in the race of what's going on in both the union ecosystem and the non-union ecosystem, because they all have a major effect and influence on each other. So I am a member of NAVA, the National Association of Voice Actors.  01:29 - Anne (Host) Myself included Yay.  01:31 - Tom Dheere (Guest) And we know that NAVA, including providing health insurance and education of the industry, is also a major advocate of making sure that voice actors are both safe from predatory AI practices but also are empowered to embrace AI to move our voiceover business forward if we feel that it aligns with our value system and our business model.  01:52 - Anne (Host) And Tom, I know you and I both we have taken time to educate ourselves within the AI industry and about synthetic voices, and I think we are hoping to encourage others to do the same so that they can make smart, educated decisions, and this is going to be part of that very important discussion. So, absolutely, myself, I am non-union. However, things that happen in our industry this can be setting a precedent for how I'm going to say how AI companies work with voice actors, as well as how consumers view AI and synthetic voices, and I think one thing I remember Tim Friedlander mentioning in one of his discussions was that, if nothing else, it's really started to bring awareness to not just our community but everyone out there of what sort of impact synthetic voices and AI can have on our industry, on our voices and our rights, our intellectual rights, our intellectual property. So talk about what you know of the agreement.  02:54 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Okay, so the first thing I'll say in regards to that is about late 2021, I took a meeting with replica studios to talk about their voice cloning process, and I'm pretty sure you've talked to them too.  03:06 - Anne (Host) Yes, I actually interviewed them on the VioBoss podcast. So, bosses, make sure you listen to that one.  03:10 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Exactly, and different AI production companies have different business models. They have different reasons for entering the industry and how they go about their business. What replica studios does is they work, at least right now, in the video game bubble, which is they work with voice actors to create very specific performances. So, like I think I auditioned for the part of, like the crazy old West speculators there's gold in them, not huge Like. I'd submit it to be considered for one of those. So, and if you do get that, you get paid, and that performance can only be used for that performance, both on a technological level, because they can't turn your crazy mining prospector into an astronaut voice or another voice Now.  03:54 - Anne (Host) is that because that's established with the company? Are you talking about all companies?  04:00 - Tom Dheere (Guest) or I'm talking about Replica.  04:01 - Anne (Host) Okay, replica, okay. So Replica has an agreement in place where, if you create a voice with them and it is used for a video game, it can only be used for that particular video game in that particular instance and they cannot make additional dialogue or additional games from that voice or.  04:19 - Tom Dheere (Guest) It is my understanding. Also, I watched the Navas wonderful but two hour long question and answer thing. So forgive me if I misquote.  04:28 - Anne (Host) No, everyone should be watching that as well, oh absolutely.  04:31 - Tom Dheere (Guest) It's on YouTube. Go to the Navas website and there's a link and you should definitely watch it. It was fascinating, Cause you learn not only about AI, you learn a lot about how Sagrafftro works. Cause Zeke talked in severe detail wonderful severe detail about how bargaining works and contracts work and agreement works, and all of that. But historically, replica would use your voice as a placeholder during production of the video game, as opposed to using your voice to be cast in the video game. Smaller roles.  04:57 - Anne (Host) Yes, yes, when I interviewed them, that was their process and you were paid. You were compensated on it. Not a character, a video game character, but a character. How many characters were used? You get paid on a character basis in a monthly contract.  05:11 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Right, and that one character could be used as a placeholder in production in multiple video game production companies making multiple video games and smaller roles could also be used by that and you would get compensated for that. So this agreement Sagrafftro agreement with Replica basically just sets up the relationship how Sagrafftro members can work for Replica studios and they have set up a studio per hour rate you know of the actual performance and then they have set up the usage or licensing of what happens when your voice is used and how long it's used for and what the compensation is. I think it was per 300 lines or something like that and then there's incremental payment. Zeke made some very, very interesting points, because one thing that a lot of people have been saying is like why isn't Sagrafftro fighting AI? Why aren't they trying to ban AI? And he said that. To paraphrase, he said they had a choice they could either try to prohibit AI or they could try to regulate AI.  06:10 - Anne (Host) Absolutely.  06:11 - Tom Dheere (Guest) And he and Tim agreed that they are five to 10 years too late for prohibition of AI, even if they wanted to prohibit it. So, as a result, their only recourse is to get involved with regulation of AI.  06:23 - Anne (Host) I think we should reiterate that, Tom, yes, rather than prohibition of AI, which, look, technology happens with or without us, right? And so prohibition of AI could have been really difficult, really really difficult to enforce and probably would have, I think, destroyed the industry, to be honest with you.  06:38 - Tom Dheere (Guest) That's what he said. That's exactly what he said.  06:40 - Anne (Host) Therefore, again, we don't have a choice as members of the industry, we don't really have a choice. I mean, we either fight back and quit or we evolve and we work with it. And I think that it's admirable of a company because right now I wanna talk to you about there's no regulation for companies right now, and it's interesting because I just interviewed Auskirkowski from DeepDubb AI, another AI company that does dubbing and localization of voices, who are also very much in the fair transparency, compensation to the voice actor, and there's something to be said for companies that say right, that they are fair and transparent and compensatory. Is that a word?  07:21 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Compensatory.  07:22 - Anne (Host) Compensatory. Thank you For voice actors in the industry, but it's also another thing because there's no other regulation. They say it on their website, they say it in their policies, but there's nobody enforcing it. So I think for Replicca to come forward to SEG-AFTRA and make themselves accountable, at least to an organization that directly deals with our industry in such an impactful way, I think that that was great. Now the nitty-gritty of the contract. I've not been privy to see that. However, what makes me a little bit nervous is that, first of all, we're voice actors. We know voice acting.  07:59 Replicca is an AI company. They know AI, and so I know from working in technology for 20 billion years that there's a lot of misunderstanding. People that don't understand the technology can be talked into things. Possibly they can be coerced into agreeing to things that may or may not serve them in a positive light. However, at some point you've just got to put faith in a company that they're going to be ethical and transparent, and I think this was a good move, and I guess possibly there's loopholes in the contract, but I do believe we're working towards something that's positive in the industry.  08:33 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Here's one thing I've been talking to a lot of people about. Is that? Well, for one thing to your point is that there is no federal legislation to hold AI companies accountable for artists IP right now, and Nava has been working with Capitol Hill and there are multiple bills in the works If you go to the Nava website it has links to show you the legislation that they are working on which is great.  08:59 There are a lot of people I've been hearing in the voiceover industry saying all AI companies are, by definition, unethical. These, I think, are also a lot of the same people that have been saying for 20 years that all pay-to-play sites by definition are unethical. Neither of those are true. They're patently false. No matter where you go in any industry, in any sector of any business all over the world, a certain percentage of the people involved are going to be unethical.  09:26 - Anne (Host) Bad actors, bad actors, bad actors.  09:29 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Every industry. The voiceover industry is no different. So that means a certain percentage of people who are voice seekers on pay-to-play sites are going to be predatory and will try to rip you off, and a certain percentage of voice actors on pay-to-play sites will underbid, underbid, undercut, which damages the industry. Same thing with AI. There's no difference. It's just that people are going to be how they're going to be, so all you can do is bring your value system with you. It's like a bad client, yeah, and we all have bad clients.  09:56 - Anne (Host) And it's something that I'm always talking about. Right, it's one of the reasons why I have my voice in AI series, with over like 35 interviews with AI companies is to educate yourself, and that was really the basis for myself. Educating myself about the industry is just talking, and one thing I think that is so important is that we have a dialogue with these AI companies, we make it known and I think Nava is just doing wonderful work in helping that to happen and for really fighting for voice actors on behalf of the organization and I think that all of us just need to educate ourselves on what is happening and, just like a bad client like I educate myself on a client. There are telltale signs when I can get a feeling about a client, if they're going to be a bad client or going to be difficult to work with. And I think AI companies are no different, and I think, first and foremost, companies that are out in the forefront of the industry today and there's a lot of AI companies or a lot of little tiny ones that have popped up and not survived, but the ones that are there in the forefront, the larger companies I think that they are responsible for providing an ethical ground, Because I don't think that consumers first of all will stand for companies that are not ethical in their treatment of humans, because it becomes like this whole thing.  11:16 I mean again, we're also a product of or a slave to the industry in which we work, right? So if consumers are wanting synthetic voices, or if synthetic voices will provide a space in the market, will provide something of value to a market, and Oz said to me the other day he said well, normally there would be all of this content that wouldn't be dubbed, that wouldn't be created, because it's simply the process of doing so takes such a long time and it's kind of like the audiobook genre and the audiobook AI companies that we're trying to make audiobooks with synthetic voices, and so there is a lot of content out there that won't get produced simply because it is a process to do with a voice actor, now that a voice actor isn't desired or better. However, there's some content that it may not be as necessary to have a human voice.  12:08 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Yes, and I'm pretty sure we've had these conversations before in various circles that there is some content, like a product manual, that would never get narrated by a human because of you know, there's just so many of them and it's not cost effective. But an AI can do that. Our good friend, karen, vice president of NAVA, uses the example of no human can narrate the New York Times overnight, and those who are visually impaired have just as much of a right to enjoy the New York Times with their morning cup of coffee than any other sighted person Absolutely.  12:43 - Anne (Host) An.  12:43 - Tom Dheere (Guest) AI can help provide that service. It's where you get into other areas. And actually there are people who because I've had conversations with people who say, nope, that's still not art, that's still taking jobs from people. That is still unethical. There is a certain percentage of the population that there's just going to be no talking to.  13:02 So it's like okay there's going to be no convincing. And if that's their value system and they think AI is an affront to art and an attack on art, and with some of the bad actors and predatory companies, yes, it absolutely is. But this conversation and it's not really about art, it's about technology Technology always wins. It always wins. Now, when I say that that doesn't mean well, we should all surrender and sell out and clone our voices and get paid a nickel, you know five cents on the dollar and just eat dog food and live in a hovel because we can't thrive as artists in the voiceover industry and get paid rates that are commensurate with the industry standard.  13:45 But there are ways to navigate the industry, whether you are pro AI, anti AI or can't be bothered with AI and have the potential to still be able to thrive as a voice actor. And this agreement with SAG-AFTRA and Replica is a major step, major, major step in that direction. Because, as you also know, the rate structure for compensation for AI whether it's to have your voice cloned or some other service where they're gonna synthesize your voice just for their website or just for this bit of software, much less getting it put on a website where anybody can subscribe and use it. It's still the Wild West. Now, with SAG-AFTRA, they are providing, thank goodness, the beginning of some sort of rate structure that we can all start to work with and find out if it's a viable one.  14:31 - Anne (Host) I'm so glad that you brought that up, because that is still we talk about. The Wild West rates have always been a Wild West right, especially for non-union. So what's really wonderful is that, yes, if SAG-AFTRA is getting involved. And of course, I've been telling the GVAA to get on with AI rate structures because, again, how much do you charge or how much should you get paid? And of course, now you're actually doing like a royalty share really with a company that produces that voice, because you cannot produce your own AI voice, I mean literally you have to lease an engine to do that or work with a company for them to produce it, and then ultimately, they're the ones.  15:07 Let's see if they have an interface that allows you to go in there and do a text to speech or a speech to speech generation of those files. You're still leasing that engine that does that, and that is something that you do not have control over. I mean, that is not your studio, and so, in reality, you have to pay for the rights for that studio to produce that audio. That's what I think about it, and I think about it as being it's more than just a studio to produce that synthetic voice or those audio files. It is the studio and it is also pretty much kind of the voice actor in a way.  15:44 It's like a percentage of you that is being used and so we can't possibly get paid what we're probably used to because we were used to controlling that ourselves. And it can only help the more people that get involved in this discussion, because I will tell you that a couple of years ago, when I started interviewing companies and we started talking about rates, there were no rates set and in fact nobody really wanted to like even comment on a rate. There were some people that flung out oh 10%, Voice actors would get 10%. And voice actors heard that and got completely insulted, not understanding the technology.  16:21 Now I say well, who says 10%, why not ask for 50%? Right, it's my voice and their engine, so why not start at 50%? It seems reasonable to me, Any good negotiator, right, If you're going to work with a company and you're going to have an agreement on a rate structure or a fee schedule, you can always negotiate. And so if SAG-AFTRA is working with rates and we've got other companies that are setting the rates, this is the thing when the company set the rates. It's kind of like who says the number first, right, they win right.  16:54 Or you know what I mean. If I ask what's your budget? Right? That's the proper way to negotiate, right? You don't say the number first, but if you set it, I feel like we have some footage. We have some ground to discuss and talk about what would be a fair compensation. Because, again, we want our voices to be valued. And again, this whole agreement with at least replica saying we're willing to step up to the plate and we're willing to be held accountable by an organization right For fairness, transparency and compensation for actors to get paid for their value. But what is that value? That's the question in terms of a synthetic voice.  17:34 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Right, right, voice actors are in the business of licensing our art. That is what we've always done. That's always what we've done. We're the artist in the booth, yeah, which is our session fee, and then, if it's a broadcast commercial, union or non-union, then we license that performance, which is the usage fee. There is zero difference between that and what the SAG-AFTRA replica agreement is. They will get paid a certain amount for being in the booth and then they will get paid for the use of that. So, union or non-union, you're in the business of licensing your art. This is just more of a codification of it in relation to the. I don't know if you'd call AI a genre, or I don't know what you well pay to places in a genre either. It's a portal, I guess, because I've always said there are three portals in the voiceover industry for casting opportunities representation, online casting and self-marketing. Maybe this is the fourth one? Yeah, maybe.  18:30 - Anne (Host) AI.  18:31 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Maybe it's like a three and a half one, but we want to license our art. Look, unless you don't and if you don't, then you work for the seeing eye here in not here in New Jersey, but across the water or you do stuff for learning online. Yeah, and you narrate stuff pro bono, which there is a place for. That that's art too. It's just you're not licensing your art, you're donating your artistic ability to do that.  18:53 - Anne (Host) And when you do that, by the way, it's kind of scary because anytime, like our podcast, like this podcast here, or anytime I put my voice out there, out on the internet, right now there's no regulation of it and so, theoretically, bad actors, companies that are not ethical, could be taking that and making voices, which they probably have, I would assume that.  19:13 I guarantee it I guarantee that, if you're known in the industry at all, you've got your voice out there, that your voice.  19:18 And we've seen that also where there have been some companies, unethical companies that have been producing voices or taking, you know, scrubbing the internet for voices, and that is something that is unfortunate. However, it's something until there are regulations, laws in place, that I mean. Gosh, how many times we talk about it, like with our phone, have they been listening? Have they been recording? Absolutely, and so that data is theirs. They can use that to develop anything. But at least now I think that, yeah, we're kind of backpedaling, but we now need to at least make our voices heard and the more organizations that can help us to do that right SAG-AFTRA, with this agreement with Repuka Nava helping us talking on the podcasts about it, and you and I being open and transparent saying, hey, I have a synthetic voice. I have a synthetic voice partially because I was educating myself on how voices got created, what companies I would want to be working with and really, until I take those risks, I don't know and I'm not educated.  20:21 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Right, and being a voice actor is a risk in itself.  20:23 - Anne (Host) Sure is.  20:23 - Tom Dheere (Guest) Because it's such an unpredictable, chaotic, no guarantee of any income ever kind of industry. And also I've been doing online auditioning since 2006. Right, so I guarantee I've had multiple auditions stolen and I'm sure my voice has been cloned in some capacity many, many times, just like every website you've ever been to or ever will go to has been or will be hacked, and our social security numbers are all over the place, and it's terrible and there's really not much we can do about that. Retroactively moving forward, we do everything we can to protect our intellectual property and engage in safe practices. So auditioning for some text to speech thing on a pay to play site, I think is a terrible idea.  21:05 Scheduling a meeting with a AI production company and asking questions about how do you operate? Sure, what is your compensation structure? Sure, what's your licensing structure? Can I see an example of your agreement so I can take a look at it or send it to an attorney to review it? Even if you don't want to clone your voice, I strongly recommend doing that so you can just have an understanding of what the industry is, because this is going to be more and more a part of the industry and there will eventually come a point where there will be legitimate ethical casting notices on pay to play sites. In regards to AI, which Nava has done a great job with Voice123, for example, to help curb that tidal wave of felonious casting notices that was proliferating the Voice123 site until they had a conversation and said, if okay, so if clients want to post a text-to-speech casting notice, they have to answer these questions and really answer them. And then all those casting notices vanished literally overnight. So that tells you something.  22:01 - Anne (Host) It does.  22:02 - Tom Dheere (Guest) So the VO bosses, the bosses out there, need to know how to protect themselves, while at the same time understanding that this isn't going anywhere. But that's not necessarily a bad thing. Ai is a disruptive force, just like the light bulb disrupted the candle maker industry. And who gave a darn about the candle making industry, except for the candle makers? Yeah, very true, so you know what I mean. This is a part of the industry. You got to learn to embrace, adapt evolve and grow or you're going to get left behind.  22:29 - Anne (Host) Absolutely, and you need to educate yourself about how the industry is evolving and again, you will be left behind if you are not educating yourself. So, bosses, go out there and sign up for Nava. I cannot recommend that anymore. Nava is doing wonderful things. Listen to the VO Boss Voice and AI series. Listen to Tom and I talk about it. We have a couple of episodes We've already talked about it on the VO Boss episode and really just read everything that you can familiarize yourself with, everything that you can, so that we can move forward and have successful businesses along with this disruptive technology.  23:03 Because if it's not AI, it's going to be another disruptive technology, and I'd like to challenge any boss out there and ask them if they are not using some form of AI to help their business right now and being hypocritical and saying, well, you can't use my voice, but yet they might be using I don't know chat, gbt to do something to make their business run more efficiently. So there are multiple AI opportunities out there that you can utilize that I think are wonderful to help your business run more effectively, and Tom and I just made do an episode on those. That's not a bad idea. So, all right, guys. Well, tom, this has been an amazing discussion. I'm sure we could talk about this forever, but thank you so much for joining me again.  23:48 And, bosses, I implore you, if you want to take a moment and imagine a world full of passionate, empowered, diverse individuals giving collectively and intentionally, you too can help to create a world that you would like to see and make a difference. Visit 100voiceshoekerorg to learn more. Big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. You, too, can network and connect like a boss. Find out more at IPDTLcom. Have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. Thanks, guys, bye.  24:21 - Intro (Announcement) Bye yeah.
Special Guest: Oz Krakowski - Deepdub
Feb 20 2024
Special Guest: Oz Krakowski - Deepdub
Anne welcomes Oz Krakowski from DeepDub, a company specializing in dubbing and voiceover end-to-end localization. Oz and Anne discuss the evolving technology and the importance of protecting the integrity and earnings of professional voice actors. They look at the ethical landscape of AI, the significance of artist compensation, and the transformative effect technology is having on voiceover work. With the rise of deepfakes and synthetic voice replication casting shadows of concern, they discuss the pressing need to protect voice artists' identities. They also navigate the intricacies of consent and compensation in voiceover AI models. This episode is a call for trust and clarity in the dynamic dance between technology and the voice talents that bring authenticity to AI-generated content. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VEO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss podcast. I'm your host, Ann Ganguzza, and I am truly excited to be here with a very special guest, Krakowski. Oz is an experienced executive with a rich background in business and technology, especially in the entertainment industry. His current role at DeepDub showcases his deep involvement in the realm of media and film, where he leverages innovative technology to enhance the industry's landscape. His extensive knowledge and insights have made him a sought after figure in film and media conferences. Oz, thank you so much for joining us today. We're so happy to have you here.  00:57 - Tom (Co-host) Hi Anne, so pleased to be here and thank you for inviting me and looking forward to our discussion.  01:02 - Anne (Host) Yeah, absolutely. I'm excited to talk to you about the technology. So, first and foremost, for our listeners, tell us a little bit about DeepDub and your role there and your particular experience in working with voice actors.  01:16 - Tom (Co-host) Absolutely so. Deepdub is a company that is focusing on AI, or generative AI, I should say solutions for audiovisual content, with an aim to democratize the ability to globalize content. We started by focusing on entertainment content, working with big studios small and large, actually and localizing and providing them the capabilities to use synthetic voices and different generative AI tools in order to localize their content. Specifically for me, I'm based in Dallas in the United States. I am responsible for business development, partnerships, strategic accounts, been with the company almost from the beginning. The company started in 2019, so we're pretty young in the world of, in the traditional world of localization. However, in the world of AI, we're among the first.  02:06 - Anne (Host) You're veterans, you're veterans.  02:08 - Tom (Co-host) Exactly, exactly. I always joke that it's like dog years every quarter it's like another leap forward in technology and advancements. We were there before. Generative AI was a common phrase on everyone's discussion. Absolutely this is generally about DeepDub DeepDub is really committed to the entertainment industry and asked about how we work with voice actors. There is a lot and I'm sure we're going to unpack it here in the discussion.  02:33 - Anne (Host) Oh yeah, obviously, as you know, being a voice actor myself and you having worked with voice actors in the industry, I'm sure you understand the concerns of, basically, actors and artists in the creative fields and their concerns about AI. I think that it's important that all of us, voice actors included, we educate ourselves on this evolving technology to figure out how we can work with it, because I don't think we're going to stop it. Number one I've certainly seen lots of evidence of that in the past few years. I mean, it has just been breakneck speed in developing synthetic voices. From your perspective, what would you say are the major concerns surrounding the usage of AI in entertainment? In the entertainment industry?  03:21 - Tom (Co-host) Absolutely. I followed your podcast and I see the work that you've done on AI. I truly respect the will and intention to actually be aware of it. Like you said, I think it's also acknowledged today that this is pretty much unstoppable. The question is, how do we get in front of it? How do we actually address the concerns? How do we work together and not necessarily try to do anything that is one-sided?  03:45 In the end, everyone has fear when it comes to change and changing landscape or changing conditions, especially when it comes to a person level. People have their fears and a deep that we're trying to address them instead of not trying to behind anything. We're addressing them by working with the industry, by adhering to common practices, to the most recent laws or ethical codes that have been published. One of the things that we've just recently announced about a month ago I think it's almost like a month and a half ago, just when the actor strike was concluded we announced what we call the Voice Actors Royalty Program, which is a clear step forward in terms of giving voice actors, specifically professional voice actors, the ability to get compensated for the use of their voice in AI-powered projects.  04:40 That specifically addresses professional voice actors. We did not open it to the public. In fact, when you join the program, we actually ask for proof that you are a professional voice actor. Once we get that proof, we vet it. We actually make sure that this is the right that you are indeed who you claim you are, or with the specific credentials.  05:00 - Anne (Host) You have to do that today, in this age of AI.  05:04 - Tom (Co-host) Because essentially I have a microphone, I can claim that I'm a voice actor. It's not that it's not going to be open ever to everyone, but the intention initially is to ease voice actors that we are not going to use their voice without their full consent and without them getting compensated for it. I think that's very important.  05:23 - Anne (Host) Yes, I agree with you 100%. I think one of the biggest issues now is because it's the Wild West out there I like to use that term all the time in the voice acting industry because it's always been like a Wild West of rates. With new media and digital media, it's the Wild West of synthetic voices in AI. Now there are so many technical things that arise in terms of how can voice actors protect their voice? There are… a lot of companies out there drafting up these ethical policies and agreements that they post on their websites, and I think there is a bigger issue at stake where I think that it's wonderful when companies can proclaim and create policies and ethical guidelines, but what's out there? Who's out there that's enforcing them? Number one, I think really at a federal level or a global scale, there needs to be laws and regulations on that, and I think that's where we're going to be playing catch up, for maybe I don't know, this is my guesstimation the next 10 years, maybe more. What are your thoughts on that?  06:23 - Tom (Co-host) You know what? You're absolutely right and this is, I think, the key challenge that we have, that the legal system is so slow to progress. However, you know, technologically we're advancing fast. So what happens? It leaves the playing field, you know, open for interpretation, and this is where it really matters.  06:42 - Intro (Announcement) And, just like you, said this is the wild west.  06:44 - Tom (Co-host) Exactly, and this is where it's really important when you partner with a company to actually do the background work, make sure that you're working with a company that really cares about not only the output, but also how you achieve that output, because today you can achieve that output in many ways, but it's really important who are the people, what's their track record, how do they do things, and not only what do they achieve in the end and why? Because there is no global enforcement right now.  07:12 I think it's going to get there eventually. There's no way around it.  07:15 - Anne (Host) It's going to have to get there, but it's just going to yeah.  07:18 But what happens in the interim? I think that's the biggest thing. I have so many questions for you and one of them, of course, I wanted to like wait a little bit, but obviously I'm sure you've heard of the groundbreaking agreements between SAG-AFTRA and Replica, another AI company, in terms of working with actors and voice actors to protect them, and I think that that was a step in a positive direction, toward companies wanting to be more accountable, to not just themselves and not just their own ethical guidelines. Like I know, there's so many wonderful organizations out there trying to create guidelines and research, and I think that that's great, but I also think that is a step towards I would say, at least a company solidifying that they are serious about protecting the rights of creatives and actors and voice actors. What are your thoughts on that? Is that something that you have been looking into or a place where you might go in the future?  08:09 - Tom (Co-host) Absolutely. First of all, sag-aftra is in the United States, so I think it's a great step forward for sure Definitely protects and sets the tone for unions and guilds worldwide. We have been discussing for some time with the BFFS, which is like the SAG-AFTRA or the similar union in Germany. I, just for the sake of discussion, I was invited by them last June to talk about AI in the film industry at the Munich Film Festival and we had a very interactive panel discussion there at that event, and I think that goes back to how we started the discussion today, saying that we need to acknowledge that this is coming and let's be in front of it and have the dialogue and talk about how we do things, and I think that agreement with SAG-AFTRA is important and an important step forward.  08:57 I believe we're going to see similar things happening also worldwide, not only in the United States, and I think also from SAG-AFTRA perspective, it will be their intention to have that type of agreement with as many, I would say, ai companies create some kind of standard in a way.  09:11 - Anne (Host) Yeah, let's talk a little bit about in the technical aspect of things, because, again, I don't work in AI, but I try to learn as much as I possibly can so that I can make educated decisions about how I can go about evolving with the industry as we move forward with the rapid advancements of AI technology, specifically generative AI I mean, is it discussed in any other realm anymore as generative AI? How can artists protect themselves from their unauthorized usage of their voice or their likeness or whatever that might be? I mean, right now there has to be technology that can be put in place so that we might be able to find out if our voice is being used without our permission or our likeness.  09:52 - Tom (Co-host) The reality, I would say, is that technology today allows that to be abused. I mean, that's the reality. And it goes back to what I said before If you're a very famous voice, talent or it could be a talent or just a voice, talent or talent of your voice.  10:10 I mean, or a celebrity, for example, and there's enough information about your voice. We actually today we don't even need a lot. Then your voice can be out there. We don't need much. You know it's like a sentence. Basically, your voice could be out there. The thing is, you know what happens. If it does. You can take it, for example, into places where we see non-entertainment related voices, like political people. You know people from politics where you know their voices can be replicated and can be abused. Actually, you know, especially if we're going into an election year in the United States deep fakes are very real very real, exactly I will say that.  10:49 - Anne (Host) That gives me hope, though, that it is a political season, that maybe it'll get more government level. There may be more action taken quicker because of that. I don't know, that's just. That's just my speculation.  11:01 - Intro (Announcement) But in reality.  11:02 - Anne (Host) So, and even this podcast. I mean gosh, I've had a podcast for seven years. I mean, not only have I done thousands of auditions and given my voice freely, after being paid for a job, to my clients, there are so many ways that my voice has probably already been put into a database somehow. And I think that, technologically speaking, how does deep dub? First of all, how do you create voices? I guess the creation of the voice and then usage of the voice. How do you protect your actors, your voice actors, in both of those cases? Can their voices be used for training other models, and what's the usage requirements?  11:40 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah, and that goes back basically I'm connecting my two answers before basically of first, there is no way really, I mean, everyone can use your voice because your voice specifically, you have that podcast with hundreds of hours it can be used without your knowledge. And then it combined it with partnering with the right company that actually you can trust, that is committed to working with you in terms of doing things in a legal way, in an ethical way and also compensation wise. So this is, if you combine it together. Now it goes back to the way we had deep dub require voices.  12:16 There are two ways for us to acquire voices. First, with non-professional voice actors, where we actually pay them for the voice. We approach people that do not use the voice as their profession and ask them in a very consent way to contribute their voice. They're getting paid for it and once their voice is in, we actually use those voices as the baseline for our bank voices. They're not necessarily going to hear their voice in the outcome, because those voices get transformed internally and mixed with other voices, essentially, and the output is different. But this is the baseline for how to acquire voices.  12:54 - Anne (Host) Yeah, so they're being paid for their voice being a training model then, to generate or create new voices, and then do they get paid if that new voice is being used since they were part of the training model or no?  13:06 - Tom (Co-host) No, not necessarily. No, they're contributing their voice and, again, they're not professional voice actors. They're not getting paid. They're getting paid for the work that they did and they're not gonna see their voice in the output. Also, it's not gonna be their exact voice yet.  13:19 - Anne (Host) Okay. So then now the case of a voice actor. If a voice actor wants to be on your roster.  13:24 - Tom (Co-host) So in a voice actor, it's a different case. A voice actor, their voice is actually going to be in the output and they're going to be paid in the same way as they're getting paid today for doing the voice acting, only that they don't need to be in the studio.  13:40 They could pretty much be anywhere else or be involved in a different job. So, essentially, you know, they're basically going to contribute their voice. We're not going to use their voice for training. We're not going to offer their voice as a bank voice. It's going to be offered as a voice that is essentially a royalty based or not royalty based, but a professional voice actors voice, which, every time this voice is being used for a project, they're going to be compensated for it. Now, mind you, like I said, it's very similar to the way their voice actors are getting paid today. When you participate in a production, you're getting paid for the participation. You're not getting paid for every time this is being broadcasted.  14:22 - Anne (Host) Well, it depends on the type of job. I mean, if it were broadcast media, yes, you would get paid each and every time it gets broadcasted.  14:29 - Tom (Co-host) So yeah, so it depends exactly in the end, and we're talking about the similar level of compensation as if you were doing the actual work, only now it's without attending the studio.  14:39 - Anne (Host) Sure, sure. Now, how does that work in terms of when the voice gets chosen, is the actor then contacted, and then are they privy to how the voice is being used in terms of is it only for dubbing or could it be for other purposes as well? I mean, I may or may not want my synthetic voice, if it sounds like me, to be represented in a movie that might be something that I wouldn't consider myself wanting to be in you know what I mean or a production that maybe would be saying something that I wouldn't particularly want my voice reference to, for people to recognize and say, oh, and then assume that I would be of the same opinion.  15:17 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah, listen, it's a great question. I will say that this is a place where that constantly evolves, because there is no enforcement, because the laws, there is no real legal framework. We're kind of like swimming in an open ocean and trying to define the land. Basically, for us right now, the idea is that when you do this, you're concerning to specific types of work. There is right now we didn't really set it up in that way, but the intention is really to give you the ability to try to actually vet yes or no based on types of work, ahead of basically your voice being used.  15:50 So when you sign up to have the ability to actually say alright, this type of genre is I don't want to be in, but essentially we have a producer of the work that sits down. In a similar way that it's done in a real production, a producer will sit down and is casting voices from a list of voices. They can choose a bank voice or they can use a professional voice. If they use a professional voice, in the end there's an output saying this specific voice actor, their voice, has been chosen. It's not in the intermediary output, but the final output has a professional voice, artist voice in it. Then they're going to get compensated for it.  16:26 - Anne (Host) Got it. Is it on a project by project basis? The payment, the compensation, in terms of how am I compensated? If I can get more in depth, because you know, what's so interesting is that I love you telling me that I'm being compensated. Now the question is okay, so what is that royalty share? What is that percentage? And is it varying depending on the project? Or is that something that I would have any input into negotiating with you? Or is that something and I realize because obviously you have created that synthetic voice and you're the one generating the files that yes, there is a certain percentage? Wise, that is obviously it's your work in generating that voice. Is it something that the voice actor can negotiate or is it you have just across the board? This is the royalty fee and it does it very based on, or some actors more, let's say in demand is one more of a custom voice than others.  17:16 - Tom (Co-host) Yes, yes, yes and yes, yes, it can be negotiated. Okay, yes, some are more in demand and basically it's a yes on all of them. There's like a baseline you can negotiate if you have the ability to negotiate it. So yeah, overall, the answer is yes.  17:31 - Anne (Host) What's the turnaround time? Just out of curiosity, if I would say that you're working on a production and I'm going to assume that these would be films that you're working with in terms of the amount of turnaround time and what this means for, let's say, the dubbing industry, like what is the advantage of using the synthetic voices and also I assume it's not just the voicing in order to make this? I guess a good experience for the consumer. You're also doing video effects as well, is that true?  18:00 - Tom (Co-host) or we're not necessarily focused much on the video side, although we can. We figure we first address the challenge with the voices themselves and then move on to the video. That's coming up as well, the ability to actually change the video, to do a perfect lip sync, but at this point, you know, focusing on the audio itself. So there's like multiple ways of actually creating a production to localize a content. And let's step away for a second from a film, let's talk about a show, because the challenges with the show are, I would say to some extent are bigger, because there's just more content. And especially, what we've noticed is that the challenge becomes substantial, especially when we're talking about a big volume. You know when we're trying to scale it. And why is that? Because now everything becomes when you're working traditionally, everything becomes, you know, sequential, it's all serialized and it takes a lot of time, a lot of effort. You know you need a lot of resources. Think about a show that has I don't know 10 episodes, especially again, if we're talking about catalog content. It could be a show that has I don't know 10 seasons and now localizing it would take a lot of time, would take more than a year. And the thing is that without technology, this project becomes irrelevant, meaning it wouldn't be localized at all. So what happens is that we are suddenly enabling and quite frankly, our first focus is to try to address those because there's so much demand for localizing even sometimes older titles that have new markets and have never been localized, and it's impossible always. So what we do is we're enabling to do this very quick. When I say very quick, I mean we've recently dubbed the voiceover. So there is like difference between voiceover or you know, if you address with scripted, but we've done 100 episodes of 30 minutes in about six weeks for a customer, which is pretty fast. Another project that we've done was eight seasons of a show Again, it's catalog content, but it's still high quality scripted content, french to English that we dubbed 85 episodes in four months, which is without technology. It's just impossible to do it. The speed, or you're just taking the quality, really, really low, yeah. So we're looking at it as an enabler, not necessarily. And when you look at it this way, by the way, I have to mention to say that you should actually consider that not as a something that takes jobs, because those jobs would not have been there at all, because our customers would not dub it traditionally otherwise because the turnaround, time and the costs.  20:32 So what happens in our process? It's never fully automatic. There's always people involved, whether a voice actor, sometimes too, a dubbing director. There's a studio sometimes involved in the process. There are linguists, we have translators. There's a lot of curation. That is done because, like you said, we care about the output. We really is done in a way that will actually be in line with the quality standards for streaming, for example. We have to align on that level of quality, otherwise, you know, we don't have a product. So that's very important. This is where we bring in people to be involved in the production itself.  21:08 - Anne (Host) So I assume that after you are using the synthetic voice for the localization, for whatever it might be, you then have a little bit of post production on that, because I know that with the advances in technology things are really great. But how much are you having to also then additionally work on that to kind of get the emotion, Because of course people are all about it's the emotion that's lacking in the synthetic voices. And so what sort of work is involved these days after the synthetic voice is applied to bring that emotion and to bring that scene to life?  21:40 - Tom (Co-host) Well, first, I must say that there is a lot of work that is done before we even apply the synthetic voices because, again, when we look at it, we look at it from an holistic point of view. At least the deep dove were not only a voice company where an end to end dubbing or localization house. We do the transcription, we do the translation, we have professional translators involved, together with the machine translation, to actually create the adaptation that is specific for that content, whether that's only referencing the cultural aspects or even addressing lip sync related issues, for adaptation related issues. Then we can record in two ways, whether we are using voice conversion or speech to speech. The same way I've seen some of the other guests you had here on the podcast talked about it, so we use that in a similar way or we also have the text to speech option.  22:30 We recently launched our emotive text to speech that allows us to control the emotions of the output of the text to speech, which is also something pretty new and I would say to some extent mind blowing, because it gives us the ability to simulate a performance to some extent right on the output, right, right, we create those voices, whether in this method or the other, then we also mix. We always have a sound engineer at the end of the process where they will be able to take that and if we need to create a 5.1 mix, master the output, deliver it. There is some level of mixing that is also done using AI. That can be done automatically, but we always, always have a person in the process to curate and make sure that the output is in the right quality summits that we're aiming for.  23:20 - Anne (Host) Just my own experience with speech to speech and understanding that speech to speech is not necessarily quicker in one respect, you know what I mean, because there's still an actor that's involved for that source acting. But I can absolutely see that the technology to probably put this together and make it realistic is mind-blowing to me and I actually wish I could see the process, just so I could know even more about it. But until that happens, talk to me about how voice actors can get involved, and I guess do you call it being on the roster, being on your roster? And again, you said there's a vetting process. What's involved if a voice actor is interested in having their voice with your company?  23:59 - Tom (Co-host) So, first of all, like I said, we are already working with voice actors in different regions to provide the performance when we use the speech-to-speech. So we've done this over thousands of hours already. But if voice actors professional voice actors want to join our royalty program, it's as simple as going on our website and signing up to the royalty program. We're in a slow process of bringing people in.  24:23 We're not rushing into it just because we are trying to vet everyone in and trying also not to create an oversaturation, Also on our end we're still a small company, so it does create some burden on us to actually make sure to vet everyone, but we're trying to do this in a very clear way that everyone is on the same page, there's no misunderstandings, and make sure that once we have someone on board, they know exactly what the process is. Go on the website, click the button, join the program, be part of this change.  24:55 - Anne (Host) So one of my last questions is kind of a more generalized question about companies in general, because you are one of the handful of companies that I have spoken to that are actively speaking out and saying that you're supporting and wanting fair compensation for the actors and the creatives involved. So, from an organizational level, from a business standpoint, how can companies that develop and utilize AI act responsibly and manage the IP rights and concerns and ensure that they're respecting the rights of both human creators and AI generated content?  25:26 - Tom (Co-host) I think it starts from the ground up. When you build your platforms, when you build your technology, you have to think of it from the ground up. If you did the majority of the way not thinking about, it is going to be very difficult to now reshuffle everything and now decide oh what? Now I want to be, go ethical and go legal, because you've already built, some from the beginning.  25:49 Exactly, and this is the way we looked at it. This is one thing. The second thing is have dialogues, have communication. You know, listen. Part of the things, the reasons that I went to that Munich Film Festival and actually had several discussions with different units is, first of all, listen, empathize, try to understand the other side, try to understand how we can come up with solutions to actually address those concerns and not necessarily go on the highway and don't stop. So I would say this is the second thing. And the third thing is adapt. The landscape continuously evolves. We're just at the beginning of it in terms of the legal frameworks that are being put in place. So be able to adapt and adjust according to those changes. I think all three are important.  26:32 - Anne (Host) What do you see coming in the future, not only for deep dove and yourself, but the future of AI technology. How do you see it evolving even more?  26:40 - Tom (Co-host) Listen, I don't know if you noticed, but Riverside offers AI transcription.  26:46 - Anne (Host) Yes absolutely, absolutely. My whole podcast is probably using AI. I mean, I use it to generate show notes and video clips, so absolutely.  26:56 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah. So I think in the end, what I think it's going to get to, to a point where AI is going to be part of our lives in a very seamless way. Right now we are very judgmental about it, we're thinking about oh that's AI, and we're nitpicking on everything. But when it becomes seamless, you know it's just like. You know, cell phones in the beginning were bucky and huge and you had to carry a bag for it and it was. You had to actually think about it. Today, it's obvious that you go out of your house with a cell phone. You wouldn't do it otherwise.  27:30 I think at some point, looking to the future, maybe a few years from now, ai is going to be more seamless, more integrated in many ways that are not necessarily trivial to us Even today. The simple ones are like transcription right, I mean, you wouldn't put someone right now to go through the podcast to transcribe it. When AI can do 95% of the work pretty good and the rest of the 5% you can do on your own, it becomes manageable. At the same time, I think that there's still going to be a place for us human beings in the process, basically responsible for the creativity. I don't think a lot of the fear is like AI is going to take our place. It's going to take over the world. Yes, absolutely, skynet is taking over. I think that eventually, what we're going to see is that it's just going to change the way we approach things more curating, more directing and guiding the AI, rather than trying to do it around.  28:23 You know, for me, for example, today I want to write a formal email. I'll just go to chat GPD. It's not that I cannot do it. I can't do it myself and I've been doing it for you know, for years myself. But chat GPD, if I just give it a few point of reference, it'll give me something in seconds. And now I'm going to take it not as it is. I'm going to make a lot of changes in it and make it my own. Yeah, but I have the baseline and I think that's an indication of how it's going to be in the future in many other aspects of our lives.  28:52 - Anne (Host) Yeah, I agree, and I think that as we progress forward, as it becomes more seamless hopefully it also becomes more regulation takes place so that we can be protected, so that it's not being used without our permission or knowledge and AI for good.  29:06 I'm a believer, I want AI for good and I have seen where I think AI is so beneficial in so many ways and it's just a little bit scary to see it when it's not being used in great ways. But I press on and I think bosses out there, we need to educate ourselves so that we can evolve along with it and use it for positive. Use it for good. And, Oz, I want to thank you so much for joining me today. It's just been a pleasure talking with you and thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with us.  29:34 - Tom (Co-host) Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me and I look forward to future podcasts.  29:39 - Anne (Host) Absolutely All right. Bosses, here's your chance to use your voice, okay, not only possibly to do dubbing, but also to make an immediate difference in our world and give back to the communities that give to you. Visit 100voiceswhocareorg to commit and big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. You too can connect and network as humans and bosses, as I just did with Oz. Find out more at IPDTLcom. You guys have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. Thank you.  30:08 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host and Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.
Voiceover Virtuosos
Feb 13 2024
Voiceover Virtuosos
Voice acting is more than just a dulcet tone; it's about connecting, taking direction, and sometimes swallowing your pride. In this episode, we explore how frustrations in the booth can mirror challenges in personal and business relationships—choosing success over being right is an art in itself. We underscore the importance of humility and remaining teachable in an industry that demands constant evolution. Whether you're a newcomer to the mic or a veteran seeking to refresh your skills, this episode promises to arm you with insights and strategies to elevate your voiceover career. 00:01 - Intro (Host) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss a VO Boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey, hey everyone. Welcome to the VO Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I'm your host, Ann Gangusa, and I'm here with my very special guest boss co-host Lau Lapides. Hey Lau, hey, Annie, how are you I? Am doing amazing. How about yourself? Wonderful? Happy New Year. Happy New Year to you too.  00:40 - Lau (Host) This is our first podcast since New Year's.  00:42 - Anne (Host) That's right. Right, you know I'm starting off the New Year with some new students and I have come across this before and I want to ask you if this has happened to you.  00:53 There are some students if they're just starting out and I know we've spoken about this before Sometimes you don't know what you don't know, and sometimes it's hard for you to hear what you sound like. And there are many students who come to me thinking that they don't need coaching and that they're fine. They just need to be able to create a demo and they sound fine. And people tell them that they have the best voice, and so I like to call them voiceover virtuosos, and I was just wondering if you've come across that as well, where you've had maybe talent that seemed to think that they don't need coaching, or that they're better than maybe they are, and I don't mean to be so bold to say that, but I'm not quite sure how else to explain it.  01:37 - Lau (Host) And this is a really tough kind of non-PC conversation because we want to be kind and have some etiquette, Absolutely, and be courteous. We're not here to rip people apart and make them feel bad about themselves. That's counterproductive to who we are and what we're here for right.  01:52 - Anne (Host) Right and actually Law. I remember when I first started I did not have an ear and I would think to myself I think I'm delivering what I'm supposed to be delivering. It sounds like what I hear out there in the other commercials, and so I don't hear where my coach is coming from. I don't understand their direction, I don't see what I'm doing wrong.  02:11 - Lau (Host) So I don't think I'm doing anything wrong, and so I understand it from that perspective, because, as a talent, I felt that way a little bit myself, and I think it could be a combination of all sorts of things, whether it's lack of resources, whether it's pure laziness, whether it's not having the ear, or it could even be that I don't know what I don't know.  02:33 - Intro (Host) I don't know what I don't know, like I don't know what I'm missing because I haven't done it yet.  02:37 - Lau (Host) I haven't done the training right.  02:39 - Anne (Host) Yeah, and I don't know what it's supposed to sound like.  02:42 - Lau (Host) And so how do I know if?  02:43 - Anne (Host) it's incorrect. And sometimes it ends up being where you're like I don't understand what my coach is saying, and then sometimes you'll question the coach. Even I've actually had some people question the coach. It's so interesting. It's such an interesting phenomenon.  02:58 - Lau (Host) It is an interesting phenomenon and it happens at all levels too that I observe. I had a coaching session for a client, a brand new client, on Saturday and a working actor a working voice actor clearly booking and booking a good ratio overall was frustrated. She wasn't getting the natural read and getting commercial bookings. Long story short, she's a pro, she's working no-transcript. After we did that hour she confessed. She said I have to be honest, law, my mind is a little blown because I didn't even think of any of this stuff. I didn't work on it. I said well, that's our reality. That's why we're always in professional development. Yeah, yeah, there's new ideas, new techniques, new ways of thinking about things that bring out Something in you that you simply can't do on your own. You're not able to do it on your own right.  03:46 - Anne (Host) Well, I think, when it comes down to it, you are providing a service to someone and you need to be able to be directed To the sound that they would like to have, right? There are lots of performances out there that are simply directed to how the person that's directing here's it in their head. Now, does that mean that it is, I don't know, that natural Conversational read that everybody asked for in the specs, because that just seems what everybody asked for a lot of times. No, I mean what comes out in production. It may not be that.  04:19 However, over and over again, casting directors and agents are looking for that read. And I think when you get to the level where you have an agent and you have casting directors that are asking for that, you need to bump up your acting to that level. And just because you're booking Over and over and over again, first of all, consider the source of where you're booking, consider the source of who you're booking with. It might be an e-learning gig, it might be a corporate gig, and they may not be as how shall I put it as Selective, yeah, of a director that's looking for that natural read. Now, myself as a coach law and you as a talent agent, I am always asking my students to give the most natural engaging acting performance, because that is the only way I know to teach my students to be able to have the Versatility to give a director what they want. No matter what they want, whether they want a commercially sounding read, an Announcement sounding read or a natural read and there's.  05:18 - Lau (Host) You know, you can't skip over the fact that there's a fun factor.  05:21 There's a performative fun factor that when you're working with a director or a coach or an outside party who's giving you suggestion, giving you food for thought, pulling things out of you, there should be a right keyword, should there should be this Excitement, this energy, this yeah, herb about doing that and making discoveries and having that audience with you.  05:42 And I think if you miss out on that, you say I don't need any, that I'm gonna skip over as much training as I can, I'm gonna save money. I think you're really skipping over a pivotal part of what makes us us that when we're in the booth alone and when we're doing our own self-tape or whatever we're doing, we can call upon those experiences. It's like a sense memory thing. I can remember what my coach said to me, I can remember how I was directed and then I hear their voice, like as an actor, I literally hear their voice and I can go with that. If I miss all of that, then I almost have to put a lot of stress on myself to create that, to inspire the creation. Yeah, you know what I mean.  06:25 - Anne (Host) I think there's a lot to be said for really knowing the director, or understanding the director that you're working with too, in terms of there's a lot of things that come into play here. Where is this going to air? Is it local versus regional, versus national? Is it going to be an internal website? And so understanding and being able to supply the read that the director is looking for is so very important, and I think that the more you develop your acting skills, the better you can understand that and be able to give that director what they're looking for and also understand, like, for example, I was just discussing with you earlier that I had a local political spot right, and, of course, they ended up putting a ton of verbiage into a 30 second spot, which is almost impossible at the speed.  07:17 I was going to sound natural and engaging and conversational, because I needed to step up the pace. I kind of knew that. I knew, okay, here's a local spot, I'm going to have to step up the pace a little bit. I'm not going to be able to give this person a natural read. They weren't asking for it either, though, and so they really just wanted certain words that were inflected properly, and just having the experience and understanding what they were looking for, I was able to provide it almost I'm going to say not immediately, because there really were too many words for the scripts that we did have to cut out a couple of words.  07:48 But once that happened I mean I had a good idea in the beginning of what they were looking for. And I think as you get more experienced in this field and you start working with different directors, you'll understand. You'll be able to kind of read a director and figure out what it is that they're looking for and then be able to adjust your performance appropriately. But you need to have those acting skills in order to be able to adjust your performance.  08:12 - Lau (Host) That really is what makes you the pro that you are, because it's not only about the talent and the delivery, it's also about the timing, how quickly you work.  08:21 Are you focused, like all the bad habits that we have as people in the world we have to train ourselves out of, and we need help doing that, because sometimes we're just not aware of them that I'm constantly looking at my cell phone to check messages, or I'm fixing my whatever, or I'm not listening, or I'm not acutely taking notes on what I'm hearing, and so that's really important too, to practice that, that taking direction.  08:48 Really, that could be the kiss of death for you. If you're not good at listening, if you're not accurate about interpretation, asking just the right question and giving them what they need, then you look like a time waster, then you look like someone who's just kind of like flailing around and costing a lot of money on the other end, versus someone who can get right to. You know, one of the bad habits that I have a number of actors that do this and voice over, that do this is they explain, they start to get into explanation mode, they start giving the narrative oh, I'm so sorry, and the apologies unnecessarily. I'm so sorry. I was only doing that because you know I was thinking about my mother and not understanding the difference between what is a coaching session and what is a casting session and what is a booking session and what are really the differences, you know, and not expecting something from the wrong person, like I can't expect feedback from casting, necessarily, or from a client necessarily.  09:44 Sure sure, you're either going to book me or they're not going to book me, right? So clients are busy, right? The coaches should be giving me the feedback that I'm looking for. So if you don't do the process, then you don't get the feedback, then you literally are in the dark. Yeah, what you're giving, right? What you're giving out.  10:00 - Anne (Host) It's also hard to and again, we're not trying to shame anybody or make people feel bad.  10:04 It's just simply when you are first starting out and you're questioning. But here I feel like I sound. I sound better than that commercial, I sound better than that person. Again, developing an ear and I think there's a whole scientific process to it as well is what you hear in your head and what you hear in your headphones. If you have your headphones on and you're delivering something or you're recording something is very different than what somebody else is hearing on the other side of the glass.  10:30 I should say across the pond, across the pond on the other side of the glass, because on the other side of the glass they have their own ideas as to what they are looking for. That sound to be like Right and you always want to assume that if they've given you casting specs where they want it to sound natural, like you're talking to your friend Right? There's so many things to take into consideration. Yes.  10:53 And first of all, I'm going to say there are some clues. If it's probably someone who's been in the business for a long time, I think you can bet on the fact that they're going to be able to tell you if you're sounding natural and authentic. And also sometimes, if all they do is automotive commercials, what is it? Tier 3? Cliff Zellman would know this. Tier 3, tier 1. Tier 3 automotive commercials. That's typically a high powered cell. You'll also be able to tell a little bit by how it's written. So I think there are clues that you can research before you're in the middle of that session and also understand that when you're in a live directed session, just like you said, that can be entirely different than when you're in a coaching session. And so when you're in a coaching session with a trusted coach okay, it has to be a trusted coach, and again, that's hard for people that are just coming into the industry who's a trusted coach? Well, there's lots of ways to find that out and I think we probably have a couple of episodes on that.  11:46 How do you know, like, who to coach with? And a lot of times, word of mouth will be one of your best bets on that, and also testimonials and ask around and talk to potential coaches to see what's their experience level. Do they work in the industry? I'm not saying all coaches need to work in the industry in terms of do they need to do voiceover. There's very few out there that are good that they're not actually voice artists, but they're actors, they're teachers who teach acting as well. But also, if you've got a coach that works in the industry, that's going to be helpful too. And if you're new, just because you're frustrated and that's a big thing law that I see is that people get so frustrated and when they don't understand well, I don't understand what you're asking for, or I don't understand what I'm doing wrong, or you're not.  12:34 - Intro (Host) And they start to argue and they say you are not.  12:36 - Anne (Host) I don't understand your direction, and so they'll start to put the blame on the fact that there's not good direction. Now, sometimes there isn't good direction, right, sometimes there just isn't if you're not with somebody who may have been in the industry for a while and is good, which is why I don't love pure lead workout groups law only because I don't either. When you're listening to direction from another peer, who may not have enough experience.  13:00 - Lau (Host) that may set you on the wrong path, in a way though, annie, isn't it good in the sense that you're going to get bad direction at times? Yes, you really are Like we can't assume that. Oh, they're professional, they're a company, they're going to give us great direction. Sometimes you're being directed by Jim in Cubicle C who knows nothing Absolutely. It's kind of an interesting improv exercise to learn how to say yes and learn how to say oh. That's interesting, okay, let me try that. Oh, how, wow, okay, and you're thinking what? That's ridiculous. I don't even know how he came up with that.  13:32 - Anne (Host) That's half my directed session. That's your whole world.  13:35 - Lau (Host) But the point is that's the reality, right. We have to deal with that Absolutely. We have to be able to tolerate that and you have to be able to deliver and not argue.  13:41 - Anne (Host) Not argue it Not question that you have to be able to deliver what they're asking for and, by the way, anybody that coaches with me, of course you can give me the read that you hear in your head, but that's not the read I'm looking for and even if the script doesn't seem like that's what it's written for. That's the biggest argument I get is people are like but the script isn't written that way and I'm like I don't care.  14:00 The worst thing is that you'll get a script that's written very advertising, very selly, and then you'll get the specs that say give me something like you're talking to your best friend, and then, ultimately, my student will deliver it the way it's written and very advertising and very annoncery and other things. But that's not what I asked you for, but that's not how it's written. I'm like that doesn't matter. I'm asking you to give me a very engaged read and that is a very tough read and one of the reasons why I insist on that is because if you can get yourself to that level, to a very engaged, authentic read, when it's written very advertising, very selly, that's going to get your acting skills Up to the level that I think you need to be able to give versatility.  14:43 - Lau (Host) Yeah. And ask yourself this question, which really we could ask ourselves in a lot of situations like being married. I've been married 23 years. Sometimes I literally have to self direct and say, all right, do you really want to argue that? Do you really? Is it that important to argue that? Do you want to be right, yeah, or do you want to have a happy marriage? So, in terms of your business relationships, do I always want or need to be right, yeah, yeah, absolutely or do I really want to have success in this connection? And I choose the latter. I try very hard to choose the latter. By the way, did you see that catch of the light falling over? That's my theater experience.  15:21 - Anne (Host) I don't know if you caught that. No, I didn't, it was falling right on me.  15:24 - Lau (Host) I was making a point, I put it right there. That's kind of like the metaphor of life. You always have things falling on you, right, but it's just kind of like is it more important to have it perfect or is it more important to have it done? Just get it done, please, the client, have that callback for the next job. It's not that important that I make the point that the script is wrong.  15:46 - Anne (Host) Oh God, absolutely. That's the last thing you want to do.  15:47 - Lau (Host) That's what I'm trying to say we never answered that funny question at the top about how do we deal with all the talent that come in and they really kind of think they're ready for certain things they're not ready for.  16:01 - Anne (Host) Well, and then there's always the difficult position. If they think that they don't need additional coaching or additional sessions, then they think that you're trying to take advantage of them.  16:11 - Lau (Host) Oh, of course, and make money, yeah, to make money, that's right.  16:15 - Anne (Host) I mean, look, I guess you just have to know who you're working with and there is a level of trust you have to have. And again, it's so hard for people that are just starting out in the industry and we always emphasize to see if you click with your coach, Trust your gut instincts as well about your coach. I'm going to say and I'm going to say that, like if you don't know the industry and if you start questioning your coach, then it becomes like is that a relationship that you want to continue? If you're?  16:44 at that level where you're questioning if what they're saying to you is correct, exactly.  16:49 - Lau (Host) And if all else fails, you have to do what we used to do in the theater when we'd go to see our friends in a really bad show and a really bad performance, and they'd always come out backstage and go what did you think of it? Did you like it? I was like great, I worked hard. You have to think diplomatically. What would you really say to them? And we would have a ball coming up with things like. That was interesting. You really challenged yourself. I was moved. I mean, you really surprised me there, right?  17:19 So you have to think about how do you respond to people that really need a lot more. They need more training, they need more time, they need a better demo. And they're like oh, I just spent 3,000 on this demo. You telling me I suck. I'm like no, I'm saying this is your starter demo. This is your first demo. It's a process demo. It's good for what it is. Now you want to get to the next level of things. It's not about yes, no, right, wrong. It's not structurally black and white in that way. It's much shades of gray shades of gray nuance, nuance, nuance. You know what I mean? Absolutely. And the talent has to realize that it's not. You're good and it's done, or you're not good and it's not done.  18:00 - Anne (Host) Gosh, that's so true. It's not like, okay, I'm good, I have my demo, I'm good, I'm ready, I'm ready, I don't need any additional training. I'm constantly telling my students actors spend their lives honing their craft. Yes, I feel as though, like if you're thinking about like Meryl Streep, do you think Meryl Streep achieved her acting from the get-go, from the very beginning? Has she not, over the years, improved, taken on more challenging roles and just really challenged herself?  18:28 And I think that, as voice actors, we all need to do that, whether you're just starting out even if you get booking after booking, after booking after booking and again understand who your client is. If you're doing a lot of e-learning, you may not have a very demanding client. They may just want you to read it nicely and articulately. But when your coach says to you, please do not just read it to me, I want to feel as though you're my teacher, I want to be able to listen to you for the next two hours and be engaged, then understand there's a reason why they're saying that and maybe not question that and say, well, it's good enough, because I think to really get to the upper echelon right, to make it and to be successful, it takes time.  19:12 It does, and I think there should be a whole episode of like how long does it take? I know I've done it before, but I feel like it bears with eating. Yeah, and there has to be. It can take more than a year and honestly, it should take more than five or six sessions with a coach to be a good actor. Goodness gracious. No, it takes much longer than that.  19:31 - Lau (Host) Absolutely, absolutely. And just know that there has to be an element, or there should be an element, of humility and being humble and having some modesty about your work. I always have a red flag If I work with people that they're very egocentric and they're all that. They're great. You should recognize that I feel like the best actors talent colleagues I know are people that have value. They recognize their confidence level, their self-esteem. But there's a lot more to learn.  20:01 There's always there always so humble I think there isn't that sense of like. You're talking to me. You know who you're talking to. I'm a pro. I always have a red flag about that, because I feel like they've stopped their process.  20:13 - Anne (Host) They stopped their learning, they stopped their growth, they stopped their learning.  20:16 - Lau (Host) Yeah, they stopped their growth and they're going to challenge you. They're going to question you, they're going to argue with you, they're going to take it up with you if you don't agree with their mindset, and so I think they're going to be harder to direct harder to work with. Yes, yes, yes. So I think it all goes hand in hand. It's like be kinder, be more open and modest, be a little bit. I'm not saying be insecure about who you are.  20:37 I'm saying have security, have confidence, have joy about who you are and what you're doing, but also leave a lot of space for growth and development and discovery. You have to have humility in order to do that. You can't think you've done it all and know it all and are ready for everything. None of us are ready for everything, yeah.  20:55 - Anne (Host) Yeah, agreed, agreed. And also, when you are challenged from your coach right, and there's something that you're not agreeing with, try to keep an open mind. I think that's the one thing that we can ask of you as an actor try to keep an open mind about what they're saying. So try not to take it so personally, number one, like when somebody is telling you that this is not. I don't think a coach will say, oh, that was horrible. But there are some that might say, oh God, no, no, no, no, no. Let's try that again, and it might be, really fighting with your confidence level.  21:30 So really just try to. When you're being challenged by your coach, try to keep an open mind, try to not take it personally, and I know it's so difficult to do that because to me it's like, oh my God, like you're telling me, I'm not good, and that's the first thing that comes into my head. I'm like, oh my God, I'm not good, I'm not good.  21:47 - Intro (Host) And so then that just ruins the next read.  21:50 - Lau (Host) It's a catapult and don't explain. Yeah, don't narrate, don't explain, don't justify, don't do any of those things, because it's not a blame game. It's a time to give more information and more detail. And then on our side, we promise, annie, and I promise not to say things like don't quit your day job.  22:09 - Anne (Host) Exactly, exactly, unless it's a joke unless it's a complete joke and that you're aware of it, of course.  22:14 - Intro (Host) But yeah, I basically don't say that.  22:16 - Anne (Host) But I am tough, I don't want to waste my student's time and I don't want to waste my time, and so if a read is not going the way that I like it, I will say nope, nope, I'm going to stop you right there and let's pick it up again. I'm not going to have you go through an entire read and then I'll say no, because, first of all, I think that for a lot of the work I do, it's long reads anyways, it's long format, and so it's better if I stop at the point where I can make a teaching moment and the student can learn from it at that particular time. But sometimes people will get discouraged by that and it's such a tough thing it really is Because, again, what we do is so personal.  22:54 And if a coach is continually stopping. Nope, nope, that's not it. Nope, that's not it. Okay, I don't believe you, I don't feel that You're not connected, and that's what you can look for with your coach.  23:04 - Lau (Host) Right, how does your coach respond to you, give you feedback, give you critique? Do they lose their temper? Are they getting angry? Are they getting irritated? Is it taken personally? I mean, just start looking for that.  23:14 - Intro (Host) Right.  23:14 - Lau (Host) Some people love that. I've had people come to me and say look, be tough on me, S&M style, rip me apart. I'm tough and you know, the funny thing is the first thing I say they fall to pieces because I can be really tough and they're like Really, Are you really think that I'm like? I thought I could be tough, so? But I mean, I think that there's a professional barrier there. Yeah, absolutely, that you have to pay attention to just as a best practices protocol. Yeah, you don't want people tearing you down. You don't want people making you feel bad about being a person and what you're doing and the choice that you're making in your career. You want someone to say I'm going to make the leap of faith and assume you want to be doing this, You're going to get good at this and you care about it. Now let me take you to the next level of where you're at.  23:58 - Anne (Host) I work with people all the time because long format narration right, and it's tough. Yeah, I work with people at a very intense level and so it's frustrating. People think they're going to get it by tomorrow and it's one of those things. It's no, it's just really difficult. I really ask a lot of my students and so there are a lot of times my students will get very frustrated and they will start to take things very personally. But it is not that at all for me.  24:22 I mean, I'm an educator and anybody that's worked with me knows my heart of hearts is to educate and that is what I try to do. And even though it is very tough sometimes then it becomes like not only am I educating on the acting part of it, but then there's the whole mentality part of it where you've got the added oh gosh, now I'm hurt, right. Or I've instructed somebody, I've given them direction and they have now taken it personally, and so that then is also affecting their retake or their read again, and so there's a lot of things that can build up. So just know that if you've got a good coach that's working with you, their intent is to really make you a better actor. I think that's something that your gut intuition can really tell you a lot about that.  25:05 - Lau (Host) Yeah, and be honest with yourself.  25:07 Like, take a checkpoint and say how much honesty am I willing to take? Can I put on a little bit of armor and be able to take the truth? I've had a lot of people say law, just be truthful with me. I'd appreciate it, because they're spending money and they're spending time, and so truth does not mean like kick my butt. It does not mean like rip me to shreds. It means be truthful about what your perception is, so that I can get better. That's all it is. You know what I mean. Absolutely. I love this Great conversation.  25:37 - Anne (Host) Yes, law. Oh, my goodness, wonderful conversation. So, bosses out there, we know, we know you can do it, but I want you to just give yourself some grace, listen to your gut and really find a trusted coach that you can work with and work through all of this, because it's not something that's simple and, more than likely, if you haven't been doing this for a few years now, you may not be as good as you think you are, and I mean that in the nicest way possible, I mean that in the most teacher-centric way possible. So give it a shot, guys. All right, yeah. So take a moment and imagine a world full of passionate, empowered, diverse individuals giving collectively and intentionally to create the world that they want to see. You can make a difference and you can find out how at 100voiceswhocareorg. Also, big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. You too, can connect to network like bosses. You guys have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. See you next week, bye, bye.  26:42 - Intro (Host) See you next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.  27:09 - Anne (Host) Hey bosses, woohoo, I'm so excited to announce our third audition demolition coming up live September 27th and our uh, it died. Ugh. Oh, all right, damn it. Good morning, kiss me off. Kiss me off. That was good. I didn't know. F***ing sh**. Audition deadline the 20th. Okay, september 27th, all right, that's my problem. I just don't have it in front of my face, so that'll end up with bloopers.
Agent Relations
Feb 6 2024
Agent Relations
In this episode, we talk all about relationships with your agents! We provide insightful advice on timing your communications effectively, being respectful of the recipient's time, and staying top of mind by sending short, meaningful messages. Also, we stress the importance of following up and consistently being professional. In the latter part of the episode, we highlight the essence of open communication and mutual trust between voice actors and agents. So, whether you're a voice actor looking to break into the industry or an established talent seeking ways to enhance your networking game, this podcast episode has you covered. Join us as we bring you the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today! 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VO Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and I'm here with my lovely, amazing boss, co-host Lau Lapides. Thank you, ann, awesome to see you today. Hey Law, yes, so awesome to see you too.  00:38 So the other day I was prepping for a new year of my VO Peeps group, where I have guest directors come in once a month to do online workshops, and the very popular ones are typically ones that have agents such as yourself and casting directors. And I was going through the list okay, what casting directors, what agents do I know? And there are some agents that I don't know but I would like to know, and agents that I do know that I've dealt with before, and I thought there has to be a protocol because I need to introduce myself to them. Right, and I know a lot of people when they want to get an agent, they have to introduce themselves to an agent, and so I thought it would be a good time to talk about protocol when working with an agent or reaching out to an agent or casting director and then maintaining a relationship.  01:29 - Lau (Host) That's a great topic. Let's talk about that. Yeah, absolutely.  01:33 - Anne (Host) So I'm going to ask you, because you are an agent, so tell me, what is your preferred method of? Let's say, a new talent wants to be represented by you. What do you recommend, or how do you prefer that someone reaches out to?  01:48 - Lau (Host) you Right, that's a great question.  01:50 I'm one of those people that is out in the world, so I'm not just at the office, I'm also out in the world.  01:55 So I'm speaking at conferences, I'm invited to events, I'm doing online training. I'm like all over the map and partly it's to educate and partly it's to meet new talent, and I make that very clear. I'm very transparent about that and that's a very New York LA sentiment for actors that if they want to meet casting and agents, they oftentimes will take classes, they'll work with those people in the training, in the conference, in the group, so that they can see a little bit of their work or at least get to talk to them, because I feel like a human interface is so much better for me than just getting an email if possible. So I love it when people are in a class, in a group, in a session, and they point themselves out, and that could be as simple as maybe they ask a really smart question or maybe they volunteer to do a read, if they're allowed to do a read, or maybe they put their contact information in the chat if it's online.  02:51 My point is I love proactive people because I know proactive talent are going to be much easier to work with than talent who's passive or shy or just unknowing or newbie and they're waiting for magic to happen. I love people who are partnering with me and creating magic on their own too, so I love when they reach out in person at an event, at a class, at a happening. Number one that's my favorite. If it doesn't happen that way, it's okay to email and submit. I welcome that and I need that because we're still growing our roster. However, I will say one thing Kiss it, keep it short and sweet. I get too many emails and I know you do as well that are three, four, five, six paragraphs long, telling me everything that's going on. Do it Even with someone. I know I can't get through it. I just don't have the time to read through that whole thing. Just one paragraph right and just throw in your links.  03:51 - Anne (Host) I think anytime you send an email these days, the shorter and the sweeter you can make it the better, the better. Every person has time to read a full page of email.  04:03 - Lau (Host) No, and I need to see it right up front, like we call it, above the fold. So if I get to the website for instance, if you have a website that's terrific. Anything you have online I just need to see it quickly. If I have to scroll all the way down or go to another page, it's hard because I don't know what I'm looking for and I don't always want to hear all of the animation, demos or all of the other kinds of work that you do. It's a great reference point to have, but I don't always need that. So targeting the person you are courting is really important. If I'm courting a commercial agent, the commercial agent just isn't going to be as interested oftentimes in your animation work.  04:40 They'll like to know you have it, because they'll consider you're working pro, but they may not represent that kind of work versus an animation production house. You have to have your animation demos with an S, not just one, but more than one, and that's got to be front and center. So I say target your market, know exactly who you're reaching out. To. Keep it short and sweet, kiss it. Keep it short and sweet and give them exactly what they're looking for upfront. If they want more info, they'll ask you.  05:08 - Anne (Host) Oh, I like that. So how do we know what information to send?  05:12 Because here's the thing, right, let's say, if there is an opportunity to meet them in an online workout or at a conference, that's a great way to get in front of an agent and I think that that has worked really well for a multitude of students I know that have gotten taken on a roster after they've appeared in a workout at VOPEAPS and also at conferences. I've seen that work out really well for people. But what if there are some agencies that maybe are not looking to fill their roster just yet, or maybe their roster is full but yet people want to introduce themselves and maybe make an impression? Is that a favorable thing to do and how should they do that?  05:48 - Lau (Host) Absolutely. And you have to remember just because you're in front of someone does not mean they're interested in working with you. It doesn't mean they're even interested in receiving a submission from you. So I do find the more I meet fellow agents and casting and producers, the more articulate they are. If they're on a panel or if they're doing a workshop, they'll tell you oftentimes the very straightforward people and they'll say hey, yeah, I'd like to see your submission, I'd like to see your work, or no, I don't give out my contact information. I'll check in with you in a couple of months if I need anything. So typically they're pretty articulate to say if they're comfortable you contacting them or not.  06:27 And if you do contact them, what exactly are you contacting them for? They don't fool around across the board. They wanna know exactly who you are and what you want. What are you contacting them for? Otherwise you're bothering them. You know what I mean. Like it's a typical letter that you would send out to any prospect in business. Like say don't give me your life story, no one cares. What they care about is why are you coming to me? Sure, what are you looking for?  06:53 - Anne (Host) And I think that it's very important to understand. Just as in direct marketing, I deal with this with the VO, boss Blast, right. I have a lot of clients that are like look, I sent out my marketing materials to all these people on the list but nobody's contacted me. It's very much a timing issue, meaning there has to be a need. It's not like you've submitted auditions right. When somebody's come to you with auditions, right here I've got an audition for the spot. There is a need, right. It's a demonstrated need that I've got a commercial I'm producing or I've got some sort of promotion that I'm going to produce and I need a voice artist or I need a voice actor for that. When you're direct marketing and kind of saying hi, I'm here, can I get on your roster you don't know at what time you're reaching right. Is there a need for you on that roster? And if not, it's gotta be one of those things where it's a gentle sort of inquiry into and, as you said, keep it short and sweet, because otherwise you are bothering them because maybe there is no need.  07:54 And I always go back to my old how do we buy? How do we purchase, how do we acquire things, or how do we get things that we need Right now? It's been a crazy holiday season, right? So I am signed up for all these mailing lists, right? And I get three or four emails a week from the same companies, but yet I don't have a need for anything that they have. But when I do have a need, I'm then looking at that subject line, I'm looking into the email, and that's a very important part of determining whether I'm going to read that email and then purchase or, let's say, entertain the option of having somebody on my roster.  08:34 So the timing has to be right, and so sometimes you could send emails and nothing happens, and that's very true, I think, with reaching out to Asians or casting directors, right. I mean, you may not get any response, and then you might be like, oh gosh, have I done the right thing? And I'll tell you that, the one thing that you want to do, just as in yourself, right? You don't want people to be annoying. You don't want to read a book because I don't have time to get through that book. It needs to be short and to the point and respectful of their time.  09:04 - Lau (Host) I would agree, oh my gosh, totally agree. And I would say, you know, it's the old FOMO thing. It's like keep top of mind. If they see you, enough, you're branding yourself, so you're seeing you they get to psychologically feel that you've been in business forever. Even though you've been in business for two years, they start to say, oh, they've been around, I don't want to miss out on just seeing quickly what John Smith is doing like and then they trash it. Great, that's what you want. So that then when they have the need, they think John Smith, I always get his stuff right. So it's that sort of keeping your finger on the pulse of what is happening in all of their worlds and not falling into that mindset that you and I speak about all the time, the narcissism of, like I'm ready to work, I'm here, why aren't they hiring me? Well, they don't need you.  09:51 - Anne (Host) Right, top of mind is so interesting for an agent, right, like I love that. We said you do need to be top of mind. So that means you reach back out, right. If you don't hear anything, you reach back out. But how often, law? This is the question. How often do we reach out Now for marketing and soliciting voice acting services?  10:09 I think you can reach out to somebody once, twice a month, three times a month, and if you give them the option to unsubscribe right For direct marketing, that's awesome. I personally think we should add that option to unsubscribe if you're reaching out too many times to an agent or a casting director, because that will tell you right away if they have a need or not, or it shows that you're considerate of their time. And I actually just kind of came up with this right now. I'm like gosh, that would be nice, a nice option, if you just threw at the end of your email just say hey, I would love to connect with you. Please let me know I'd like to follow up with you. Maybe not next week, but I'd like to follow up with you in a few months. If you would prefer that I don't, please let me know by hitting reply and that kind of thing.  10:52 - Intro (Announcement) I love it.  10:52 - Anne (Host) I think that would show number one, that you're considerate of their time. Number two, that you know how to conduct yourself professionally and not be a pain in the butt, because I know that when people send me unsolicited emails, I get annoyed. If there's more of them that come in the next day, or what happens in I have Gmail, it shows in a thread. So I see like, oh, you've sent me five emails already pretty much following up and I have not responded to you, so you would think take me off your list, right?  11:19 - Lau (Host) Right and I think that that's honestly. I think it's inferred nowadays that if I don't want to get your stuff, I go to the bottom of your email. I find my preferences, I find my M subscribe me or my assistant can do it in like 15 seconds. It's okay, I'm used to doing that. It's like that's part of our thing that we do these days. But most of the time I actually don't do it, unless it's a big box store or a huge corporation that I have no interest in at all.  11:42 I want to know what my talent's doing. I want to know what prospects are doing, and what we will say is we try to be really kind, both as the studio and an agency. So if someone comes in and they're sending me their stuff and they're not a good fit, we'll write to them, we'll let them know. We won't just let them hang in the balance. We'll say, hey, you're not a good fit for our roster right now. Could you please come back and check in in the next three to six months? Perhaps you'll have updated materials, perhaps you'll have a couple of cool jobs to share with us and we'd like to relook at that later which we would we would, and that's really nice of you, but not all agents will do that.  12:16 No no, they won't, and so if they don't.  12:18 - Anne (Host) I think that it's absolutely a professional thing to actually, in the email at the very end, just say I would like to contact you in three to six months Again, if that would be okay with you. If not, please let me know that kind of thing and that just shows that you are respectful of them and their time. And also don't forget, bosses, to really research the person that you're sending out to, like you should know like what is this agency specialized in? What does their roster look like already? Are you filling a hole in that roster? Because, again, there has to be a need. I have to have a need to buy from Old Navy that pair of shorts or that T-shirt.  12:55 - Lau (Host) I'm glad you said that Because so few people are Googling or going to websites Like you should be. Before you blast anyone, go to the website. Make sure they're legit, see where they're located, see if that's the market you want to cover. See the kinds of voices that they're working with. Now when do you fit in that whole realm? It only takes you five minutes or less to do that. And let's say you're going to paste. What I call pasting is doing a blast of like 50 or 100.  13:20 - Intro (Announcement) So spend a Saturday doing a little bit of research.  13:23 - Lau (Host) It's worth it, because what if they're interested in working with you, then you know nothing about them, right? You want to have some working knowledge if you meet with them or if you go back and forth with them. I also want to say any, too, because so many talent have a lot of reps, which is great if they're freelancing, if they're not signed exclusively, they should. Our agency is freelance, not exclusive, so we know they're going to work with six or eight or 10 different people. Sure, keep them straight, keep them straight. Here's what we found. We found a number of auditions that come in every couple of auditions have the wrong slate on them, with the wrong agency, because agencies, as we all know, on the national front, will get some of the same science and some of the same scripts and be very careful that you don't do.  14:11 We were really offended by that oh gosh, yes, I would be offended because number one, that told us they weren't playing it back and listening to it, but number two, that they would send that in. And number three is, like, have an awareness of like who's sending you what and who's doing what I'm just going to say.  14:27 - Anne (Host) Way to get yourself kind of blacklisted.  14:29 - Intro (Announcement) You know what I mean. We didn't do that, but we were making an impression when you do that.  14:35 - Anne (Host) And that impression sometimes lasts for a long time.  14:38 - Lau (Host) We won't forget that. We know exactly the people that did that and they didn't do it on purpose and we're not going to have any malice towards them, but we're watching them. If they do it again, they could be dropped, because we don't want to not hear that, because we're too busy. Send it out to a client and then it goes to another agency. Okay, so that's one thing. The other thing too is like when you sign a contract and I'm sure most of these places you're going to have you sign a freelance agreement of some kind. Read it. Some of the folks are not reading it.  15:07 And we've had a few people that don't have source connect and they're up for bookings and we're like wait a second, you signed her agreement. It said right, we've dropped a couple people over that, because we're like, we're not going to be at your home doing this for you.  15:21 You got to do it for yourself and that's sad, but it's like that's the nature of the protocol and etiquette scene. Oh, another question. We get to law. I don't want to offend anyone, so if I'm getting the same script from a couple different offices, how should I treat that? For us, it's very simple. For me, it's simple. You do my script. Well, some offices do say that they actually threaten the talent. I've heard that behind the scenes they will threaten the talent to drop them if they don't do theirs, which I don't like that. I don't like scare tactics. I would say it's up to you. You can either go with the first one that sent it to you for time sensitivity, just go with the first. Or, if they're coming in the same time, two or three offices, just choose the one you have the best for them.  16:01 - Anne (Host) I agree, I agree.  16:02 - Lau (Host) It's up to you. We're not going to be offended in any way. Oh, and the other thing I want to say too is please and I'm only talking for us, I'm not talking about every other agency, I'm only talking about MCVL Don't tell us you're passing on a job, just pass, because we could get 20, 30, 40, 60 emails saying sorry on vacation, sorry, I'm passing, sorry I'd be like it's okay, we got plenty of talent. We're going to be submitting for this, it's okay. I think sometimes talent feel like I'm being selected personally for this audition.  16:37 - Anne (Host) I feel like I have an agent who does select personally, and so if I can audition, they will get upset if I don't. But you would know that. See, that's the thing. You should know your agent enough. Exactly, you should know your agent enough.  16:48 - Lau (Host) Yes, we do that too. So if we have a hand selection, we'll say, hey, we chose you for this Exactly, or our producer asked for you and we did it. You would know that. Otherwise, just assume it's coming to a number of people, not just you, right? Unless you hear from them.  17:03 - Anne (Host) Well, I remember when I initially signed with you, I was like, look, if I cannot respond to an audition, you won't be offended, right, because I do have an agent. That will be like, no, why did you not respond? And you were like, no, that's entirely fine, that is up to you, and so it behooves you to understand or have a relationship enough with your agent so that you know about these things.  17:23 - Intro (Announcement) You know if it's appropriate to respond, Just ask Now look.  17:26 - Anne (Host) How do you feel about people keeping up with you on their latest accomplishments? I think new demos are always good. Hey, you know, I just produced a new commercial demo. I wanted to send it to you so you can have an update.  17:39 - Lau (Host) Yeah, they do it, annie, they do it, it's fine, our pros do it. Pros in the roster will do it. That they'll say, hey, we got a new demo or we just did a job for this, or whatever. Tim and I always give really positive feedback and it's really great Just to kind of know what's happening. I don't need that. If you're not represented by us, I really don't need that. What I would need is, clearly you're submitting to the agency. So every couple months, just send a nice little letter and have your website updated and that's enough. We don't need to hear every single thing that you're booking or everything that you're doing, unless it's so huge. Now we kind of have to know about it.  18:13 You know what I mean Just be careful how much time and brain space you try to take up of people that you're working with. Less is always going to be more. I also wanted to talk to you about something that recently happened with one of our roster talent quite by accident, I think, not intentionally and that was this person auditioned for a gig in September and the clients didn't make their decisions. They're now whittling it down and checking availability. So we put it out to the couple talent we're checking.  18:42 - Anne (Host) That's three months bosses. By the way, that can happen, just FYI, over three months. Yes, over three months.  18:47 - Lau (Host) Yes. And this person came back and said, yeah, I'm going to pass on this because it's not up to speed with the rate guidelines that I'm looking at and I'd feel more comfortable and I know this talent and their phenomenal right. And we came back and we said, listen, we have to tell you you already auditioned for it. You forgot about it. Here's the MP3 right here and you have, in essence, agreed to the terms that you auditioned for. That's not to say we're not ready and able and willing to go fight for some more money, which we do, fight for more usage, which we do. That's like innate with us to do that. And that talent came back because they're a fabulous person, and said, oh, I'm so sorry, I literally forgot. It's okay, I'll follow through, I'll execute, I'm available, I got my source connect. That's what we call a mensch in the industry. That's a good person. That's a person that says, okay, I may not move forward on those kinds of jobs in the future, but I already accepted those terms when I auditioned.  19:43 - Anne (Host) That we make really clear, like because we may not be able to get more money on that or more stuff on that, sure and it shows that you're working together in partnership, and I think that that is something that is so important for voice actors to understand that it's not a one way relationship. It really is a give and a take and you are working together in partnership to get this job. I mean, you're both there to satisfy the client and make some money, and I feel that if a voice actor is not gonna follow through or they're gonna all of a sudden become difficult and then start demanding I mean, look, I am all about getting a fair wage and getting fair compensation for our voices, and I think we've been fighting for that all along, and if you don't have belief in your agent that they are also fighting that battle for you right then maybe you shouldn't be together anymore.  20:33 I mean really.  20:34 - Lau (Host) I mean that's the job of the agent. I mean the job is not just to accept the terms and say, oh this is great whatever, but to say, okay, that's what we call leveraging.  20:43 So if we have a great talent that comes on because, remember, the talent is not seeing the relationship in the background that you have to assume there's this whole like a horse with blinders on, there's this whole thing going on that you're not privy to. That is, how well do we know the client? Can we go back and forth with them? Can we shimmy, which we always try to do? Tim is great at it and I try, on my end as well, to say, hey, we got you another 500 bucks and another 1,000 bucks on that one because they saw the logic behind it or they saw it was difficult to get the talent for it. But the truth is I know the truth is non-PC, but the truth is, if this talent decided not to do it, I would still love this talent because they're awesome person and fabulous, but we can replace them in a second. That's just the truth of it.  21:31 I have a hundred people in that category right now, ready to sort of kill nuns to get that job. So it's not something that our agency would be willing to give up. So it's a balance, is what I'm saying? Like, we wanna be fair to the talent, we wanna be fair to the client, we wanna have good working practices, we wanna come back and do more work. So we're pushing. We're always like pushing, pushing, pushing. But sometimes you have to stay and you have to make the decision if you're gonna move forward or not. And it's okay. If you don't, there's other talent who will.  22:02 - Anne (Host) Absolutely Another great discussion. So I think always important to really just get to know your agent, get to know your manager and really educate on the agency. Educate and really be a human being. I think Just be a good human being because that's really when it comes down to it. We are interacting with human beings and we both want a positive experience as a voice actor and as an agent.  22:27 - Lau (Host) And if you do get a manager, I would say make sure the manager knows your agencies and works well with them. You don't wanna hide people under the rug, you wanna have a team, have a team approach. A lot of people feel like if they tell me about their other agencies they're cheating on me in the marriage and I don't treat it that way. I feel like you're making a viable career that makes me happy. That you book something somewhere, it's great. So have that team approach Makes you more marketable for you actually.  22:53 - Anne (Host) So yeah, for sure. All right, bosses, simple mission, big impact, 100 voices, one hour, $10,000 four times a year. Bosses, visit 100voiceshoocareorg to join us and big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. You too can connect and network like bosses, like Law and myself. Find out more at IPDTLcom. You guys have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. Bye.  23:21 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, Ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.  23:51 - Lau (Host) And it's 4th of July. I noticed that I have no idea why.  23:54 - Anne (Host) Move your mouse. Maybe that's so funny. I don't have a mouse.  23:58 - Lau (Host) Oh, my God, that's so funny. I'm back. I don't have any mouse. This is amazing. It's almost like your screen.  24:03 - Anne (Host) It's almost like your screen is going to sleep or you're making it Going to sleep.  24:08 - Lau (Host) Yeah, or you're making it explosive, I'm making it explosive, I love that.
Work From Home
Jan 30 2024
Work From Home
Anne Ganguzza and Tom Dheere, discuss fresh strategies to balance work, health, and personal life while excelling in the voiceover industry. We share our trials and triumphs in navigating the voiceover industry from home. We open up about the challenges we've faced transitioning from a structured office job to the freedom of working remotely, and we discuss the importance of creating our own systems and structures for success. Tapping into our entrepreneurial spirit, we delve into time management strategies that have kept us afloat in the world of self-employment. This episode is chock-full of practical tips and insights. So get comfy and join us as we demystify working from home in the voiceover industry. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VEO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss Podcast and the Real Bosses series. I'm your host, anne Gangusa, and I'm here with my real boss co-host, mr Tom Dheere. Hey, tom.  00:32 - Tom (Co-host) Hello, hello, hello, hello how are you, I'm good, how are you?  00:35 - Anne (Host) I'm excellent. You know, Tom, I dressed up today just a little bit. I still got a little bit of sparkle going on here and if you're just listening to this, bosses, you'll just have to trust me on this. But I did dress up, and you know that's very unusual, tom, because I work from home. And I cannot tell you how many times I'm in the booth here in my sweats and t-shirt and shorts, or whatever it might be.  00:58 And that's one of the advantages that I really love working from home. But I'll tell you what. I've known a lot of people that work from home and it can be a real adjustment. I think we should discuss that and let's talk about what it means really to work from home, because sometimes it's really hard to be productive or sometimes it's hard to stop working.  01:17 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah, that's one of the biggest challenges for people who are transitioning from being in a full-time or part-time environment, possibly for decades, and then coming home and then working from home. One of the biggest challenges is that if you get a job and you someplace you go to whether it's an office or a restaurant or a bank or wherever that you're working you have a set job description with set hours and you're supposed to do this then and that then, and this is when you can have a lunch break and this is when you go home and this is how much vacation you can take.  01:48 - Anne (Host) Yeah 95.  01:49 - Tom (Co-host) And a lot of people are like, oh, I hate it, it's so oppressive, da-da-da. But then they come home and then there's zero structure, there's almost no job description.  01:58 Apart from auditions and bookings, there are no deadlines. So at first the newfound freedom is very liberating and refreshing, but then they're like I have no idea what to do. I have no self-discipline, so I'm kind of all over the place. And to your point, and since I don't have any set hours, some people are working two hours a day, some people are working 14 hours a day, and neither of those are particularly good. Obviously, working not enough is not good, but working too much is not good either.  02:25 - Anne (Host) So, yeah, the struggle is real. I'm in that category, yeah.  02:28 - Tom (Co-host) Where I tend to work those 14 hours?  02:31 - Anne (Host) Yeah, I try not to, but it's very difficult. And there are some people who just it's not conducive to just joy, bringing joy to them, because they find it so hard to either turn off or to focus or to concentrate to get things done or they need that social aspect of being out in an office. I know that my husband was working from home for a good couple of years. He is now again working from home and he's much more attuned to it. He's much more adjusted to it. The first couple of years he was working full time from home he hated it and I know that for me, working full time from home was a big adjustment. I mean, it took me a good year or two to get used to it. I think I was really like okay, so when should I like market? Okay, I've got auditions to do. I know I can do that. Now what do I do?  03:23 I was also still trying to grow my business, and so I think in the beginning I wasn't as happy because I didn't have any direction, I didn't have any guidance, I didn't know what I was supposed to be doing and I thought maybe there is a formula right. Is there a formula for success in working from home?  03:40 - Tom (Co-host) There is. The problem with it is that everybody has to build their own formula. Everybody has to create their own systems and their own structures. I talked to my students about systems of thought how to think about what you're supposed to think about and systems of execution what's the practical application of your systems of thought? And there's so many different parts to it. I basically break it down into time management and workflow how to manage your time and then how to develop systems to do all the things that you need to do. Time management is very, very tough, especially if you're going from a job job a nine to five job where all the time management is taken care of for you for the most part because this is your hours, and you have to do this within this amount of time, and either you get it done or you don't, and if you don't consistently enough, you will no longer have that job.  04:32 That's it.  04:33 - Anne (Host) You know what I mean Exactly.  04:35 - Tom (Co-host) So, understanding how to prioritize and understanding how to focus, those are the two big things. What is more important than other things and how much time should you spend on it? And how to be able to maintain mental, physical, logistical focus on any given subject marketing, billing, audition, booking, balancing your checkbooks, invoicing you know all of that stuff.  04:58 - Anne (Host) Well, let's break it down in terms of your business, Tom. What is your first priority on any given day?  05:03 - Tom (Co-host) Health.  05:04 - Anne (Host) My health. I like that.  05:06 - Tom (Co-host) Understanding that if I am not physically, mentally, spiritually, psychologically, emotionally in good shape, I will not be able to engage in effective time management, and the rest won't matter.  05:17 - Anne (Host) That's actually really an excellent point. Thank you.  05:21 - Tom (Co-host) The third part of it is what are the things that I need to do 24 hours a day to maintain optimal health? Obviously, some days are better than others, some weeks, some months, some years are better than others.  05:31 - Anne (Host) Sure, I got you there, yeah.  05:34 - Tom (Co-host) It starts with and this is a big one, for a lot of people is waking up in the morning. When do you wake up in the morning? Some people are night owl, some people are early risers, and all of that is fine, as long as it's like oh, I'm not an early riser, I'm an night owl. You get out of bed and start working on stuff at like two in the afternoon and then you're done at four.  05:58 - Anne (Host) You know what I mean, unless you had the six hour work week.  06:00 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah, Getting up exercising if that's what you need to do, having a good breakfast for a lot of people, showering, cleaning yourself up getting dressed getting dressed on some level. Making the bed and making the bed, making the bed's big for a lot of people. Our friend Corey Snow, voice actor. He puts on a tie Because it mentally prepares him for his day.  06:20 - Anne (Host) Yeah, absolutely, well getting dressed up and putting makeup on helps me to just, you know, okay, I'm prepared now and I'm ready to go and exercise, of course, now, but that was not the case. As you said, some years are different, right? I mean that was not my priority during the pandemic, which it should have been but it wasn't. But things evolve and change. But now I find that I need to get up and do that Because and sometimes it's exercise after the day is done, because that helps to really relieve stress.  06:47 - Tom (Co-host) Helps you decompress? Yeah.  06:49 - Anne (Host) So it really kind of fluctuates a little bit for me. But yeah, I love that health being number one for you. And what would be your second priority, would you say after that?  06:58 - Tom (Co-host) The structure because, like I said, without the good health you can't operate within a structure. Structuring your time, getting up at roughly the same time every day is extremely important, and then setting up a system like, for example, roughly between 7.30 and 8 am every morning for me is auditions.  07:17 I get as many auditions, as done as I can between 7.30 and 8. That's between the pay-to-play sites, my agents and manager auditions myself, marketing, regular clients auditions. I do as many as I can, so sometimes I sit down, do that and then shower and get dressed and have breakfast.  07:31 - Anne (Host) Sometimes I do it in the inverse, depending on timing of the auditions are all so based on timing. Now I have agents that like to send it around 6, 5 and 6 o'clock and I try to get them done that night if I can, if I'm not too exhausted. Just because if I wait until the morning, I will have a morning voice, which is kind of cool in certain instances.  07:50 But I might need to do some warm-ups to get rid of that voice. But for me right now it's funny because years ago I would never have said this. But right now I am preferring my morning voice. And so I will prioritize my auditions to do the ones that I feel will call for a lower voice first.  08:08 - Intro (Announcement) I do that too Before.  08:08 - Anne (Host) I go ahead and do a series of a bunch of them.  08:12 So, that's very interesting. So, yeah, auditions I think the things that you cannot always depend on being at a consistent time, because auditions for me come in at different times all the time. But I like how you have a period in the morning where you can do those auditions that are not necessarily like I feel like all of my auditions that from my agents I feel are more timely, where I feel like I might have to respond to them within a certain amount of time, and maybe I can't wait an evening or a morning, but certain other ones I can wait, and so I put it in two categories. So I have a specific time, like I like, in the morning, to do auditions, but I also, if anybody needs them right away, I will have to respond right away.  08:51 - Tom (Co-host) Oh, of course, and I tend to batch them. So when I sit down at my desk in the morning at 7.30, I see what I've got, I prioritize and I do the warming up the voice based on what it is.  09:01 But then I'll probably do another batch, like right after lunch, unless there's one, and then maybe I'll do one or two at the end of the day around four-ish but usually by then my voice is kind of like it's not great because I auditioning all day, I've been booking all day, I've been working with students all day, so around four o'clock I'm kind of like on my way out vocally.  09:22 - Anne (Host) That's typically me too, because I've been yapping all day either coaching or doing auditions, and then, yeah, I have to be very careful. Sometimes I choose not to respond to auditions until the following morning when I have more energy because my performance is going to be better.  09:36 - Tom (Co-host) Right and my next priority to actually get around to answering your question. I like to manage my finances.  09:42 - Anne (Host) Next Okay.  09:43 - Tom (Co-host) I like to balance my checkbook, pay my credit card bills, generate any invoices that I need to, reconcile any invoices that I need to. I like to do that first, Like I do my auditions. Then I like to do my finances because, well one, it's the easy to check off boxes, but also I don't want to have those tasks lingering in my head while I'm doing my other things, like my marketing or auditioning or booking or working with students.  10:11 I just like to be like okay, all of my financial stuff for the day is done, it's out of the way it's over here because I know it has a very strict beginning, middle and end balance checkbook, pay credit cards, generate invoices, send invoices, reconcile invoices.  10:26 Sometimes it takes five minutes, sometimes it takes a half an hour, sometimes it takes an hour. But I like having all that done because I want to allocate the creative energy when it's time to get creative or work with students or do the booking. So I like to kind of get that non-creative stuff like done out of the way. You know what I mean.  10:45 - Anne (Host) Now for me I hire an accountant, so my accountant takes care of managing the balancing, which for me is just makes me very happy. She's been working with me for about 10 years so she knows pretty much the categories. But we do meet when we need to and we also have a once a month kind of standing meeting where we make sure everything is synced up and she understands, like if there's any bills that are outstanding and I'll have to check on them and that sort of thing. So my accounting part, for me it takes a little less time, just because that's not one of the things that brings me joy. It brings me joy. I know it does. I know it does I?  11:21 love to do it and I totally get that and it brings my account and joy too, because she loves doing stuff like that. But yeah, and this is a daily thing for you. Do you have to do it every day or no, not every day.  11:32 - Tom (Co-host) I'd say solidly twice a week, once earlier in the week or once later in the week. I mean, I used to say that a project isn't done until the invoice is sent and I used to be very disciplined about sending the invoice as soon as I send the audio files.  11:45 - Intro (Announcement) I don't do that as much.  11:47 - Tom (Co-host) It depends on the gig, obviously. If it's a long form gig or a long term gig, you know if it's an audio book or something like that. But if it's like a quicky explainer video that may require a retake or two that I'm not gonna charge for, I'll just whip it up and send it off. You know what I mean. But sometimes I batch them. Sometimes I'll wait a couple of days and do all the credit cards Because if I'm reconciling invoices, I'm updating my checkbook. You know they're all related to each other. You know what I mean the bills, the checkbook and the invoices. I'd say twice a week I'm probably doing that financial stuff.  12:18 - Anne (Host) Sure, well, the nice thing for me is that I live by my calendar. I live, live, live by my calendar, especially with students and coaching. So I have days that I coach and hours that I coach, and different coaching happens at different times, and so I know when I can set aside time to. You know, I have to go to the doctor or I have to do things like get my hair done or do my nails, and they are in certain days where I'm not working with students. And thankfully I work a lot of non-broadcast stuff so that I have some time, so that if I am in the middle of getting my hair done I don't have to audition or respond right away. I have a few hours.  12:53 I'm always able to like finagle the schedule of when do they need a job done by around my other schedule. But understanding my calendar and having it that consistent is important for me. To have a schedule like what I can make consistent, I think is beneficial If you can make something consistent to make it consistent, because then it starts to emulate, kind of like okay, I can expect to be coaching during this time or I can expect to be doing auditions. For the most part during this time I can expect to be marketing at this time and that makes it easier, I think, to manage the time and focus as well.  13:27 - Tom (Co-host) I agree, I am a huge Google Calendar person, are you? I call her Google.  13:30 - Anne (Host) Calendar Google Calendar.  13:31 - Tom (Co-host) You're a Google Calendar.  13:32 - Anne (Host) Google.  13:33 - Tom (Co-host) Calendar is the best. You want to talk about a great time management skill Like. Here's just a little secret bosses, mm-hmm. Right here. This is my monthly action plan. Everything I know that I'm going to do in November priority tasks broken down into Catch for Tool, technique, marketing and Health. Taught to me by Dan Duckworth of Voiceovers Unlimited, who has since retired one of my teachers.  13:52 - Anne (Host) Dan Duckworth. I remember Dan Duckworth, absolutely Wonderful human being.  13:57 - Tom (Co-host) He taught me so much. So one thing that I do is I take all of these checklist items, I put them on my google calendar. Now, that doesn't mean I have to do that that minute, but the nice thing is that I can kind of slide it around.  14:09 Oh yeah so, like this is a new thing I've been doing lately is like I'll take all of these and I'll schedule them after like 4 pm, so to be like Monday I'll be like, okay, I did my auditions, I did my finances, did whatever. It's like okay, so what do I have Dan here? Okay, I've got these things. So I'll just start oh, I'm like, oh, I'll do this one, I'll drag it up to nine, to nine, thirty, and I'll do it, and it's like done. And then I'll be like, oh, what else can I do? Oh, nine thirty to ten, oh, I'll drag this one up, I'll do it and it's done. I use that to kind of slide everything all over the place.  14:40 Now there's certain things I know like. If my blog comes out on a certain day, I want to promote the blog on social media that stuff does not move.  14:47 It'll definitely get 100% done that day, but I know between nine and noon I'll probably do it, but with the other things that are less time sensitive, it needs to be done at some point during the month. I'll front load my google calendar with all of this stuff and then I'll just start sliding everything around because you never know what your day is going to be like. You never know what auditions are going to come in, or bookings are going to come in, or the cat's going to explode the washing machine is going to break down Absolutely.  15:13 - Anne (Host) And that's what's so different about being your own business, running your own business and being an entrepreneur is that you don't always have like a predictable day, and a lot of times you don't know when is that job coming in and now, how long will it take you to do that job? And then how are you going to rearrange that around the other stuff that you have scheduled. So there's a lot of, I would say, time management. That is, tom, as you mentioned, so very important to do when you are working from home and working for yourself.  15:42 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah, yeah, the other big one is understanding workflow. I break it down into physical workflow, digital workflow and mental workflow.  15:50 A lot of what we just talked about is a lot of the mental workflow. The aforementioned Dan Duckworth taught me. The five categories of my voiceover business are exactly what you saw in the action plan Cash flow tools, technique marketing and health. So when it comes to managing your workflow about all the physical things you need to do through your day, right over here Are five binders and they're labeled cash flow tools, technique marketing All the physical stuff that I need for all of those invoices in cash flow, warranties and manuals and stuff is in tools. All of my acting lessons and stuff the vocal exercises and techniques, so on and so forth Are in those binders. So that helps my physical workflow. Also, having everything in the same physical place On your desk consistently Develops your muscle memory, so my calculator is always right here. Yes, I use a calculator. It's an old school calculator, but it's just like the Like.  16:42 I'm really fast at it and I know my right hand. It's always like right there when I'm bouncing the checkbook or adding stuff up, sure, and making sure that my pen jar is over there and my audio interface is over here. My phone always hangs out over here, my mouse always hangs out over here. Develop muscle memory. Your body likes to do things over and over again. It likes the repetition. So Can you see a? Logically, I don't think that's a word, but like, a big part of your time management and workflow is training your body to know that the same things are in the same place. So every time you're going to do a thing, you reach over here and it's there, sure.  17:15 - Anne (Host) And I'm going to kind of tack on to that, though, is understanding how you can become more efficient in your workflow, and for me, I just discovered dictation I knew dictation existed on the Mac, but I'm having like with auto correct these days.  17:29 Sometimes it completely rearranges my word and it gets very frustrating sometimes when I'm typing and so I'll just hit the function key twice and I'll just start dictating and it's surprisingly accurate and it really really helps me to be quite a bit more efficient and I know we've talked about this before on a podcast, but something simple like chat Gbt can help me to write emails to my clients. It is one of the biggest helpers that I have. Like, I think trying to write a professional email to a client sometimes takes me some time to think of the right words, whereas I can use a chat GPT to help me reframe some bullet points and frame it a little more professionally and, using those tools as they exist to help me become more efficient, it really really helps my time.  18:15 - Tom (Co-host) AI has a lot of benefits when it comes to being sort of a virtual assistant for you. I'm a hyper right fan myself. I actually don't use chat GPT. I discovered hyper right and it's good for all the stuff that you just mentioned. It's also a good like blog assistant. It helps you clean up blogs. So, like I'll record my video strategist blog, I'll record it, videotape it and then I'll use Google's hyper right. Hyper right, yeah, and then I'll use Google's. See, I'm going to write that down now. Hyper right, hyper right.  18:44 - Anne (Host) I use copy AI. Oh, there you go, yeah.  18:46 - Tom (Co-host) So I record my blog and then I use Google's speech to text to transcribe everything that I said, and then I copy and paste that into hyper right to help clean up all the verbiage. And then, once it all gets cleaned up, then I ask it to help me come up with a good title. That's nice, and then I can use it to come up with that short description which we embed inside the blog itself For searchability reasons.  19:08 - Anne (Host) So, yeah, yeah, for SEO, and I use a program for this podcast called Podium, that you can upload the MP3 and it will give you the show notes, it will give you takeaways, it will give you, you can even generate a blog on that.  19:22 - Tom (Co-host) I'm writing that one down.  19:23 - Anne (Host) Yeah, podium is good. It's a paid subscription, but I'll tell you what it works really well. I'm very pleased with it. You can also create video clips if you want, but Riverside, as most of you know that I use to record this video and the separate audio tracks also has a really great built in AI functionality to generate short clips, and so that has really impacted my workflow in a positive manner. Now there's always the and tweak, the and touch Sure, which I find that I still have to put in on the AI generated stuff. But as we speak, the tools are getting better and I'm not a hypocrite thinking oh my God, ai is out to ruin us and ruin our industry. I'm using AI to make my business more efficient and, including Tommy, you and I have talked about this including exploring having our own voices and being able to use those for our clients who may want to use those and make them available so that we can have a passive income stream.  20:19 - Tom (Co-host) We love passive income streams.  20:21 - Anne (Host) That, we do, that, we do, yes, we do.  20:24 - Tom (Co-host) There's another thing I want to talk about regarding workflow, which is digital workflow. Not just what we talked about, but I use Dan Duckworth's five categories of your voiceover business with my email. So I have Outlook and Gmail and they're synced, and I organize all of my emails into cashflow tools, technique, marketing and health.  20:41 - Intro (Announcement) So when I'm done with an email, it goes into one of those five folders with various subfolders.  20:46 - Tom (Co-host) And just looking at my browser right here I'm on Google Chrome.  20:49 - Anne (Host) So do you delete email? That's my question. Do you delete any email?  20:52 - Tom (Co-host) Oh, I delete emails all the time but I also keep an eye on the ones that when I'm like done with it, but I want to keep it, you know it goes into the folder which those five categories Plus. I have a category for the bio strategist, I have a category for clients and all that stuff. Also, I've got my Chrome browser right here and I've got on the top of the bar bookmarks, bookmarks. And guess what they're labeled? Dan Cashflow, tools, technique, marketing, health.  21:14 - Anne (Host) I love it. That makes sense.  21:15 - Tom (Co-host) So all of my social media sites are in marketing All the. Ai stuff is under tools. All of my like pronunciation guide websites are under technique, so on and so forth, and I've got one for my comic book, I've got one for video strategist, I've got one for, like, my hobbies and personal stuff. So I know that, like any time, I'm thinking about any part of my business physical cashflow binder, email cashflow folder browser cashflow bookmark folder, exactly bookmark.  21:41 - Anne (Host) Yep, talk about that muscle memory Email absolutely.  21:44 - Tom (Co-host) It's like creating sort of a digital muscle memory for me, so I don't have to reinvent the wheel.  21:49 - Anne (Host) Yes, and automated for your email as well. I have lots of rules and filters. So if it comes into a particular email address that goes into a particular folder. So, there's lots of ways that you can become more productive with your digital tools Absolutely. Now let's talk about focus, because focus, I think, is a huge stopper of productivity, especially social media.  22:13 - Tom (Co-host) Yes, well, first, everybody just grow up. You know what I mean. Put your big pants on your big pants, people, and you're doing grown-up stuff. Nobody's watching you, so you know. So that's my short, obnoxious answer.  22:25 There's obviously an element of truth in that, but a little more realistically, I know that I have certain things that I need to do and I have a certain amount of time to do them, and cool like the auditions obviously are deadline-driven. You know what I mean. You need to balance your checkbooks, you need to do your gigs and all of that stuff and everything else is kind of like up in the air. So I use Stephen Covey's four quadrants Quadrant one, focusing on that which is important and urgent. Quadrant two, that which is important but not urgent. Quadrant three, that which is urgent but not important. And then my favorite quadrant four, doing things that are neither urgent nor important. I don't think about it anymore. It just kind of happens now because I've developed this mental muscle memory.  23:09 - Anne (Host) Did you used to have to write that? I used to. Okay, okay, gotcha.  23:13 - Tom (Co-host) I used to have to do that. But understanding that what's the most important one, which is quadrant two, that which is important but not urgent, which is all of the long-term investment stuff in relationships in general, and part of that involves marketing. Marketing is always a long-term, non-urgent thing that you need to do and that's a thing that people spend way too much time on in the wrong way wrong, whatever that means, because that's a very individual thing. But understanding that playing around with my accounting software or endlessly organizing my contacts on my CRM are not urgent, they're not important, but I do them, or I used to do them, because it would make me feel productive and feel professional and that's just an abject waste of your time.  24:02 So understanding what's a waste of your time and what isn't a waste of your time, what needs to be done now, what needs to be done later and what never needs to be done at all.  24:10 - Anne (Host) Absolutely. I'm going to say one of the biggest time sucks is social media.  24:15 And I literally will just not open up any Facebook window or any Instagram. My phone is not. I'm not looking at my phone. For that reason, I only have windows open in my browser that I need to have open and I have a dedicated time for social media.  24:32 It don't always stick to it, but I have to be fairly rigid with my social media because I just have too many things in the day to do and I know that before, when it wasn't just such chaos, it used to be a thing that I could oh, let me check my email now. Or let me check my Facebook posts here, or let me check my Instagram here. It used to be something that I could just free form. But I can no longer do that with my schedule and remain effective and remain efficient in my business. So it may seem like I'm not as interactive as I used to be in social media, but I weigh the pros and the cons of that right, like how much is being on social media, engaging in social media? That is a thing that I must do. That is a specific time. Just browsing social media that's something I do after work, in my free time, and typically that happens now while the television is on and I find that I'm looking at my phone more than the television.  25:30 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah, I find myself doing that too. Sometimes I find myself with the television and my phones here, and then I've got my tablet over here on a little tripod stand and. I'm playing a game. It's like, oh geez, I've got three screens in front of me and I'm not paying proper attention to any of them.  25:44 - Anne (Host) To any of them. Yeah, exactly, and then I just fall asleep, because then I'm usually just exhausted.  25:50 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah there are apps where you can limit your social media use. So if you are early in your voiceover journey, you're home for the first time and you just find yourself doom scrolling on Instagram and stuff. You can set it up. So either it'll set a time limit or it won't let you look at it at all at certain times of day and that may be something you need to do. It's sort of the put the padlock on the refrigerator if you're on a diet kind of thing, Like sometimes you need to do that sort of stuff, Set yourself up so you can't do it.  26:21 Yeah yeah, absolutely.  26:23 - Anne (Host) So what is the biggest complaint from your students that say working from home sucks? I mean, has anybody actually come to you and said working home sucks? I guess I just need, I don't know how to manage my time. Or is that a common thing, or is it just? Oh, it's so common, so common.  26:39 - Tom (Co-host) I say it's funny because I have all of these videos that I sell and I have all these speaking engagements, conferences and courses and whatever, and anytime I say the two we're time management someone invariably goes oh my God, I suck at that. I need so much help with that. Please, please, please, help me with that. That is a epidemic in the voiceover community because, most of the time, because they came from a rigid nine to five structured environment. So, yeah, time management is something that people are often sorely lacking. Coming in and I think we just covered a huge amount of tips and tricks and strategies but also understanding mentally the what and the why about it, not just the how. I mean Google Calendar and blocking your social media apps are one thing, but that's only good. As the. I'll put it to you this way Ann Greg Iles, great author. He wrote maturity equals impulse control.  27:33 - Anne (Host) Interesting.  27:35 - Tom (Co-host) So what it really comes down to is how much impulse control you have, and if you lack an impulse control, that means you are, by definition, immature. So if you want to be an effective voice actor, you need to be a mature voice actor, and to be a mature voice actor is to have effective time management and workflow skills.  27:53 - Anne (Host) Well, I have been schooled, dear, I have been schooled. I love that. I love that. You know, tommy, you bring this kind of old school mentality, but I think it's something that we need to really be effective and grow our businesses. Because how many times you're right, I have no control, I'm on social media, I'm not focused, I'm not getting any work. Why? Why? I think really getting yourself disciplined in some fashion, at least during your work day, as you would if you were sitting at a company, is imperative, I think, to really running a successful business at home and making your work at home life suck less. Ha ha, ha ha.  28:30 - Tom (Co-host) Way to bring it home. There you go there you go, good job.  28:34 - Anne (Host) Wonderful conversation. I'll tell you what bosses do you have? A local nonprofit that is close to your heart? If you do, you can visit 100voiceshootcareorg to learn how. And IPDTL. They are our sponsor we love. Ipdtl helps us connect and network like bosses and become efficient work from home, sucking less employees of our own businesses. So find out more at IPDTLcom. You guys have an amazing week and amazing productive, efficient, wonderful work from Home Week and we will see you next week. Bye.  29:09 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission and Coast to Coast connectivity via IPDTL.
Finance 101
Jan 23 2024
Finance 101
Intimidated by the daunting world of finances, specifically in the voiceover industry? Tag along with the BOSSES as we demystify the intricacies of money management. Our banter-filled conversation is set to shine a light on the critical role of financial discipline, understanding taxes, and the art of investment categorization for your business growth. We provide crucial insights on all things expenses - from domain names and web hosting to the nitty-gritty of audio editing software. We also tackle home studio costs and the relevance of physical inventory for product sellers. And for those lean times, we've got you covered with our practical strategies that ensure you stay on top of your game. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VEO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss Podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I'm here with my superpower boss co-host, Lau Lapides. Hey hey. 00:30 Lau. How are you? Hey, I'm fab. How are you? I need to activate my accounting financial superpowers because it is a new year and I've got a business that I want to grow and I need to make some investments and I need to really, I think, get my finances in order. So I think we should talk. I know people hate talking or even thinking about finances. However, I think we need to discuss what could be on the agenda for your business this year and how can you financially prepare.  01:09 - Lau (Co-host) I love that, and if we don't understand our status with our money and we don't have a good relationship with it and we don't have trust with money and we don't know how to treat it, then we will not have financial discipline and therefore not have the cash for the investments we need to make throughout our year. And I speak about that at every level. I mean, if you're making millions, even more so because I know colleagues of mine that are millionaires that are busted by the end of the year because they don't know how to save, they don't know how to spend, they don't know how to invest.  01:43 They're used to being managed by other people, and I think management is wonderful when you're at a certain level, but it can also be a curse and take a lot of that micro management over you and then you're left with like, wow, how do I live life? How do I earn money? What do I do with it?  02:01 - Anne (Host) Absolutely.  02:02 I've always tried to be so independent, just in my life and financially independent as well, and so it really behooves us as business entrepreneurs to understand even if we do let's say, I always talk about my accountant and the best thing I ever did was outsource my accounting but you also need to have an underlying understanding and concept of financials so that you can direct your accountant or also understand where's your money going, because maybe sometimes your accountant I don't know maybe they're taking it or maybe they're putting it in place is that you're not familiar with. So not that I want to infer that there's anything shady going on, but hey, we want to be educated.  02:43 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, I also want people to think let's talk taxes, baby. Oh yes, I am not an accountant, my husband is.  02:50 I do not get into that, but I will say running businesses, as you know, Annie, everything at the end of the day, whether it's quarterly, whether it's annual, you have to put you know one of the first things we say and we're fairly conservative fiscally my husband and I we joke. We say, oh, we just got a ton of money and that's awesome, what are we going to do with it? Put it away. I'm going to say I'm going to put 50% of that away from taxes for the next quarter and I'll say good move.  03:16 - Anne (Host) And I'm so glad that you brought that up. As a matter of fact, for the next three months I have a certain amount of money that is coming out because it might escort. I need to pay myself, and so I need to pay myself. I need to prep. So by the end of the year I'm not going to be paying tons and tons of money and taxes.  03:32 - Lau (Co-host) And has that ever happened to you? Because that happened to us a couple of times. It's devastating.  03:37 - Anne (Host) Gosh, when I first started off in voiceover and I started making money and I wasn't prepared, right At the end of the year I was just like, yeah, I'll do the taxes at the end of the year, put it off, put it off, put it off. And then, ultimately, at the end of the year I was like, oh, my God, I owe. And then it was like, oh, I don't just owe a little, I owed a lot. And then I was audited one year. I'll be very frank in telling you that?  03:58 Not because I mean, I wasn't doing any funny business, but literally sometimes you're a small business, right, and a lot of times if you are making claims, they want to substantiate those claims and make sure that you're doing your taxes properly.  04:12 So it was a random audit. Actually, I was audited twice. I passed both audits with flying colors. As a matter of fact, the last audit they owed me. So it really goes to show that I was prepared, and thank God I was prepared.  04:24 Again, like I said, I don't wait until the very last minute and I don't know if I was intending for this episode to be talking about taxes the whole time, but it all comes down to the end of the year, right when you got to pay your taxes. And so you have to understand, like, where is your money going, where is your investments going, what costs do you have? And I think that's super important, what are your costs and what is your income coming in? And you should be looking at your profit, your PNL statement. What is a PNL statement? I have people like I'm not even sure what a PNL. It's a profit and loss statement. So that is something that you should be familiar with, and if you're not, we're here to kind of talk to you about the basics at least. I'm not a financial advisor. However, I can share my experiences and I can tell you how important it is to be educated and to understand that there will be investments and you need to categorize those investments and you need to categorize your profits.  05:19 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, and at the end of the day, even though we don't want to talk about taxes the entire time, we're not on a barter system. If IRS comes, they're not going to take a cow right. They want money, they want cash. So, just being honest, having integrity about your business, just doing everything by the book, being very careful, having a bookkeeper, having an accounting team having the people you need on your side couldn't be more worth.  05:43 It just couldn't be. But let's talk about money in terms of, like, fixed costs. Putting together your understanding what are my fixed costs versus my movable, shakeable, flexible, variable costs, which do vary month to month? How do you set it up, Annie? When you set that up?  06:01 - Anne (Host) Well, I don't remember which episode it was, but I did touch upon this at one point. In terms of fixed costs, like for running your business, there is the cost of I'm an S corp, so I have to pay a certain amount of money every year right to maintain that license, and so I also have to make sure that things that it costs for me to run my business so not only the cost of the business itself, which I pay to the state or I pay to the federal government I also am paying things that would be like my website, my web hosting right. That is something I pay on a monthly basis. That happens each and every time. So those recurring costs I found to be well managed, number one by my accountant and it's categorized in my system.  06:46 But also I downloaded an app. I pay for this app on a monthly basis called Rocket Money, and Rocket Money will go out and grab all your subscriptions, cause a lot of times you can be subscribed to things that you forget about. This is the new way of doing businesses those subscription models which I pay monthly for my domain names, for my web hosting, which is the place where I host my websites, kind of think what else, my subscriptions to my audio editing software, twisted Wave or Adobe Audition. I also pay Adobe because I have Adobe Acrobat, the Adobe Suite that I pay for. Goodness gracious, this is so much, and I pay for a lot of things too, like my Riverside subscription. Right, this is what we record our podcast on. I pay for my Zoom connection. I pay for gosh, all these backblades, which is my backup system Right.  07:40 - Lau (Co-host) So here's the key, though, annie, is like we're lumping them all together because that's everything that you do every month and in your mind because you've been doing so long. Those are fixed costs, right To a new person coming in for the first couple of years. Some of those may be more variable in cost because, let's say, let's say hypothetically, you're ready to do a blasting service like Constant Contact or MailChimp or VO Boss or VO Boss, but we're blasting things out to your hundreds or thousands of leads, right, and you're gonna pay for that monthly. Now, we consider that kind of fixed because we've been doing that collectively so long. But someone coming in who's fairly new and say, well, can I spend that $40, $50 a month or $90 a month to do that? That's more of a variable cost, because they may or may not feel like I'm at a point where that's gonna be beneficial. I may not have enough leads to do that too. I'll do that in a year and see where I am in a year, but I can't do that with my rent or my mortgage.  08:39 - Intro (Announcement) I have to do that every month.  08:41 - Lau (Co-host) That's a fixed cost right. So that's really interesting for us to just reevaluate every year or every quarter, like what are our variables that we're thinking of as fixed, Like if I think of Google or I think of like storage on?  08:57 - Anne (Host) Zoom, or I think of this. My mind it's fixed. My iPhone, my phone bill for myself, I'm paying on a monthly basis that to me. I consider that a fixed cost. But you're right, I mean, it all comes down to what is it that is necessary to run your business? But, interestingly enough, because most of us are home-based businesses, now, brick and mortar, brick and mortar. Are you paying Brick and mortar as well as I mean, we gotta consider our offices, our home studios, right? Yes, as part of it. So for me it translates into I've gotta pay the mortgage because if I don't have a house or I don't have my home studio, I don't have my studio in my house.  09:33 - Intro (Announcement) You gotta pay.  09:33 - Anne (Host) Your insurance, gotta pay the water bill, gotta pay the internet, oh my gosh internet.  09:37 - Intro (Announcement) Utilities yes, Gotta pay electricity.  09:39 - Anne (Host) Otherwise I'm not gonna have all of that to be able to run my business at home. And you law have a brick and mortar as well, so there's all of that which is considered fixed for you as well.  09:50 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, it is, and that's not to say it can't shift and change. So if I decide to move to a different place, then the costs would shift and change, but they're always there. In other words, they don't really leave, unless the caveat is I'm 22, I'm trying to save money. I move in with my parents. They're gonna pay a lot of those bills for me for a year. I don't have to worry about that. They're gonna let me save money. Okay, that's your caveat. But other than that, when you're in the world, those are now part of our business, because if we don't take care of those, we literally can't run the business.  10:22 - Anne (Host) And, believe it or not, on a very small scale. Right, I have physical inventory because I sell a vocal throat care line and a vocal spray along with my vocal essentials, right? So there's inventory. I need to purchase inventory so that I can create those sprays, also to run that business.  10:41 - Lau (Co-host) And we would have merchandise Exactly that we may wanna take to a conference or we may wanna do a swag bag giveaway at a networking meeting or whatever. That's the inventory you speak of. That is really variable, it's not really fixed, it's still a variable cost. But for us it's important that we continue to do that to promote the business.  10:59 - Anne (Host) Absolutely absolutely.  11:00 - Lau (Co-host) Right, I love this conversation. This is so good. So what happens? I get in trouble. I find that I'm not doing as much voiceover work this month as I see happen Quite often times. People come in, they start crying, they're upset, they're like I might have to get another job. I might have to pull back on my spending. Where do we go first to pull back on that spending? We go to the variables.  11:24 - Anne (Host) Yep, great question. Yeah, absolutely, the variables. I mean, what can I do to save money, number one, or cut down on costs? And again, as your business evolves and as things evolve, everything, that's really important that we take a look at that, gosh, at least I mean I look at that every month, if not more than that. And I know that, especially when things are lean right, you've got more time right. If you've got more time, you've got more time to. Let's take a look at our marketing. Let's take a look at our investments. What are we spending right and what can we cut back on?  11:59 And I know, for me, some of mine was subscriptions that were no longer serving me, right, I was like, okay, well, I guess I don't need that. And then I've got things like I have a Peloton subscription. Am I using it? Because that's a certain amount of money? Am I watching the Discovery channel? Can I cut back on that? Those subscriptions? And in reality, by the way, my cable, and well, I guess, do you call it cable, my streaming, my streaming subscriptions are part of my business because I am researching the market, right, and I'm listening to commercials, I'm seeing what's out there, I'm educating myself on trending sound, trending voices, educating myself as a coach for my students right. So that is considered a business expense.  12:45 - Lau (Co-host) I would add a personalized list to this. So you have your fixed cost, you have your variable, but then you have your very personal expenses. That could be one or the other but if I'm hurting for money and I gotta go skinny one month, I'm gonna go to that personalized list.  13:01 So a very simple example of that is I'll always ask a client. I'll say listen, what are you doing this weekend? What did you do last weekend? Oh, I went to the movies cool. What did you spend on that? Oh, that was 15 bucks great. Did you get any food or drink there? I did. I think that was about 30 bucks great. Did you go out to dinner Super. I think I spent 25 bucks on fast food great. Did you spend on gasoline? Yeah, I think I spent five or six bucks. Add that up. That is the money that can go into your investment piece when you really need the coaching session.  13:32 - Anne (Host) You really need that event. You really need that. Can I skip the Starbucks? I remember that's the biggest thing. Can I skip the Starbucks? I'm gonna skip the Starbucks.  13:38 - Lau (Co-host) And I have to say, annie, I'm not a financial advisor, so I'm not advising you financially. I'm advising you from a logical perspective of saying be careful of saying to yourself, lying to yourself and saying I don't have the money, when really you should be saying let me find the money or create the money Absolutely.  13:59 We used to go under the cushions to find the change and put it in a big jar. Now we can go to what we're spending, what we're actually spending, and find the change in that jar. A Starbucks which we love five, six bucks. A cup of that that I may need to put into my coaching session.  14:17 - Anne (Host) Absolutely Hands down. One of the smartest things I ever did was create that business savings account. And then where are you going to put that business savings account? I literally just moved my business savings account from my bank to a higher yield interest bank and I'll tell you what it made the difference between oh gosh, I might have made gosh my bank was paying me nothing. I was like 0.001. And I think I was making like maybe $5 a year.  14:42 Well, guess what? I'm 5% APY 5%. And when you invest that now, I've made thousands of dollars for this year and then that can be reinvested in my business. So that savings account also is what saved me from when things get lean, when the jobs aren't coming in, when things slow down and then all of a sudden, oh my goodness, what am I gonna do. And it saves you from that panic where you probably do yourself more harm than good with that guttural like oh my God, I am gonna have to like get a job or I'm gonna have to quit.  15:17 Voiceover it's just not working. It's in that panic that I have a lot of people they come to me. I just I can't. I can't invest in a demo, I can't invest in coaching, because I'm just not making it back. And again, that is something that you really do need to understand that there are investments to be made. If you have the money put aside to make those investments right, that makes you feel a whole lot more comfortable and a lot less panicky, whether you're like oh, I said I gotta get out, I can't do this anymore, or you become discouraged, and then it really becomes a whole mental game. And that, I think, is the toughest part about voice acting right Voice acting the acting we can always practice.  15:55 We can hone our skills, we can become better at what we do. But that business sense that when the business is slow, when all of a sudden it's like, oh my God, this isn't working or how do I survive, you go into that like fight or flight kind of mode and really having that nest egg, having that savings account that can be earning interest, having that passive income, all that good stuff, that can be that little pocket of confidence that's what I say that little pile of financial confidence is huge in, I think, growing and pursuing your voice of our business successfully.  16:32 - Lau (Co-host) Yeah, and we all know those of us who have been in business for a number of years it's never what you make. It is never what you make. It is not about gross, it's about net. So it's about what you take home. That is, showing us how you are spending and investing your money, your gross income. And so having that level of sacrifice, of humility and of modesty to understand that just because I want something does not mean I need it or should have it. So if you're willing to sacrifice and give up something, you probably have more shot of building an actual business, because the business has the needs. You don't have the needs as much as the business has the needs.  17:14 And I wanted to say too what you're talking about, which is so important and we're doing that as well as diversification of your money. So not only if it's not making interest, if it's not building wealth for you, then you move it. But here's the thing there's a couple of really important reasons to move the money. Not only does if your bank goes bust. You don't have everything in one pot.  17:34 - Anne (Host) Exactly.  17:35 - Lau (Co-host) You're only insured, too, for a certain amount, right, but also you're literally setting up accounts for yourself that you hopefully will forget about. So you're not spending it, you're not touching it. It's growing, it's working for you, right? So that you don't have this. Don't think of it as like one clump, one lump of something. It's really different pieces that you're diversifying into the world. You may want to invest, you may want to go into the stocks, you may want to do that kind of thing, right? So the point is is like okay, I've got my business, it's great, it's moving in the direction I wanted to move in, but what am I sacrificing? What am I doing to make money and make it grow for me, and how am I treating it? Like? How do I think of money? I hear a lot of people, especially women, talk about money, talk about negotiation, talk about contracts in a really negative light, like in a very heavy way. They are either fearing it, they don't want to talk about money.  18:30 - Anne (Host) I think most of it is fear absolutely Based in fear, and most of it is fear right.  18:34 It's kind of like I don't want to go there, I don't want to talk about it, I want to kind of just go back to something we were talking about in terms of investing and kind of making sure that you have the money to invest in that next piece of equipment, or do I need that new microphone? Do I need? I'm going to give you an analogy and I'm going to be very frank. I have in my clothes closet. I have these little cubby holes for my shoes.  18:59 Now I bought them gosh a long time ago and I think I I don't know if I got them in IKEA, but they're great. They're little cubby holes and you can fit a pair of shoes in each cubby hole, and so I bought a series of them to put around. We have a walk-in closet to put on the floor and my husband has one of the boxes which holds 12, right, and I literally have probably eight. I have 70 cubby holes Okay, 70. Now I made a deal with myself that I would never buy more shoes than could fit in that cubby hole, and so if I wanted to purchase a new pair of shoes, I had to give up another pair of shoes or donate it or sell it on Poshmark or what.  19:34 - Lau (Co-host) Wait a second, annie, I just did some math. Are you saying you have 98 pairs? If you have 12 and you have eight of those right, or 90,? What is that? 96? All right, so I say 70. Should I call?  19:49 - Anne (Host) you a melda now.  19:50 - Lau (Co-host) Should I really name you a melda?  19:51 - Anne (Host) I'm going to say it's 70. I don't know how many boxes there are, so, whatever right, 70. I have 70 holes. I have 70 cubbies.  19:57 - Lau (Co-host) You just have to stay in that denial, stay at 70. Stay at 70.  20:01 - Anne (Host) Now I can't purchase a new pair of shoes until I decide that I'm going to let another pair of shoes go. And if I can't, I'm going to try to sell those shoes. But if I can't, I'm going to donate them right so that they go to someplace. I'm that kind of person where I have to love my shoes right, do you wear?  20:17 - Lau (Co-host) all those shoes? Be honest, do you wear all?  20:19 - Intro (Announcement) Not anymore.  20:19 - Anne (Host) I don't no but I used to right and so, literally, as I've aged a little bit, I mean the heels got to come down a little bit.  20:27 - Intro (Announcement) I can't quite fit in those.  20:28 - Anne (Host) Well, I can't walk in those higher ones anymore, but I still love to look at them. But that is like I feel like your business needs to operate in that way, right, you cannot make an investment more than you have. Like, you should not spend more than you have. I should not have more shoes than cubby holes, right? Because then it starts to look cluttered, it starts to look like a big mess, and so, therefore, I have put myself on a plan, right, where this helps me to. This helps me to manage my shoes, like I would say, manage your finances in the same way, right, you don't want to make investments with money you don't have, right, and you want to make sure that, if you have, how many microphones do you have? Like, you should not have more microphones than places to put those microphones right, okay, all right, I have a term for that.  21:14 - Lau (Co-host) This is from my husband, jeremy, who is actually a controller CFO type accountant his whole life.  21:19 He says listen, and I always hated this, it always made me cringe, it was cringe worthy, but he's so right. And that is don't live above your means. Absolutely Don't live above your means. And he's not only talking about financially, he's also talking about emotionally and spiritually as well. So I have taught myself. My father, who's an entrepreneur, taught me this too. He said buy something, get rid of something. Yes, oh my God, buy something, yes, yes, and not just kick it to the curve, but give it to the right place.  21:47 Give it to the right place, give it to the right place and boy, did that save my day learning how to do that and really learning to let go and learning to move around it. That's really good.  21:57 - Anne (Host) That's really good, for I mean being frugal and being wise financially and also like mentally, like I feel like you can't have too much clutter, because physical clutter turns to be clutter in your head. And I actually took a feng shui course many, many years ago. It was like a six month course. I mean, it was intense.  22:15 - Intro (Announcement) I love it, I love it, you should never put things under your bed.  22:19 - Anne (Host) Don't store things under your bed. Don't store things because it's kind of like clutter anywhere, really like clear out your corners.  22:26 - Lau (Co-host) Clutter anywhere physically means clutter in your head, right so when it comes to your money, you need to compartmentalize it Absolutely. How do you call that when you label it like we would give away key?  22:38 - Anne (Host) Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. What do you call that? We label it. We're Maria Condoing, right Condoing, but that's what it is.  22:44 - Lau (Co-host) It's like knowing what you want to do with each piece of your life financially. Yeah, it's very freeing. There's a very openness to it, there's a breath in there, you know. Yeah, absolutely I love that. I love clearing the financial space.  22:58 - Anne (Host) That's what I like.  22:59 - Intro (Announcement) Clear the financial space.  23:01 - Anne (Host) Especially in the beginning of the year. It's always a great time to do that, to really sit back, and it may be hard. Right To sit back and take a look at where is the money going. How much are you spending? Are you spending more than you're bringing in? But again, like no more shoes than you have cubby holds.  23:18 - Lau (Co-host) And also test yourself, like once you give it away, like let a month go by and test yourself, say what did I give away? Do I even remember what?  23:26 - Intro (Announcement) it was, and I never remember.  23:28 - Lau (Co-host) I never remember the clothes or whatever.  23:31 - Anne (Host) If I haven't thought about it or used it in a year, it's good to go right.  23:35 - Intro (Announcement) It's good to go right. As much as I love it, that's most things.  23:37 - Anne (Host) I'll kiss it and I'll give it away and I'll say this deserves to go to someone. I'll donate it. This deserves to go to someone who will love it as much as I did. Really.  23:46 - Lau (Co-host) And then you're very Native American about it. It reminds me like, take the shoes to the river and just write a note and let them float away. Absolutely you know To someone else's feet. But that's what we need to do, because it makes us open to what is coming, like if you're so cluttered in your financial portfolio you can't invite anything in and allow the money to flow to you like a river right?  24:10 - Intro (Announcement) Oh, I love that you don't want your river to stagnate.  24:12 - Anne (Host) You don't want to block your river Again. No more shoes than cubby holes. Don't block your river with twigs, Just say allow the river of money to flow, I mean we're out of all here. Let's just imagine that financial flow coming to you and manifesting that.  24:28 - Lau (Co-host) Hallelujah and manifesting that Amen. I feel like doing a song right now, but I mean it's like language. If you're scripting, be careful the language you use to describe your money and your financial status. Don't be cheap, don't be dumb, don't be unknowing.  24:46 - Anne (Host) You're not greedy. If you appreciate money and you invited it, you are not greedy. That's like an old one. People say, oh, you're greedy. Although rich people are greedy, they just want more. Honestly, people who are wealthy are some of the most philanthropic people that give.  25:00 - Intro (Announcement) And we've had that discussion before.  25:01 - Anne (Host) But I mean really being rich isn't rich right Money rich, financially rich and spiritually rich.  25:09 - Lau (Co-host) It's all about you allowing the flow and not blocking it right with clutter and paying attention to details, Don't ignore it and don't act like you don't know how to deal with it. It's like treat it as if it's a person and you have a relationship with it. Would you say some of the things you say about money, about the person like, oh, I don't know how to deal with that, I just ignore it and I just let someone else deal with it? I don't think that relationship would go very far. You know what I mean. It's like treat it like a person, in the sense that there's a lot of potential movement and liberation that can come with that and what it represents. It's just symbolic of the kind of life and lifestyle and mindset that you want to have.  25:52 - Anne (Host) Absolutely.  25:53 - Lau (Co-host) And I always say too, you know, someone says to me Law, why do you want to make a lot of money? I've had the executive coaches ask me that and I said the first thing that comes to my mind is because I want to have more money to pay my team members. Yeah, oh, I love that. Yeah, I think in terms of investment, I always think in terms of what can I do with this money? That empowers even more, versus, oh, I'll buy another thing or I'll have another, whatever, I don't really need it. I would rather see it move in directions that can make a lot of people happy and things going on and that can only help your business, because, honestly, I feel like you're in toys.  26:30 - Anne (Host) I think about myself in the corporate world. What does it makes us miserable in the corporate world? Oh God, we don't like our colleagues, we don't like our boss. We're boss. It's a toxic environment. I don't make enough money. Exactly Like, if you think about it, if you're treated well in your environment, if you have employees that you're paying and you treat them well and you appreciate them, they're only going to work that much harder for you and you have to incentivize them to want to work for your business, and that is one way to do that.  26:58 So I love this conversation. Again, it's probably something we could have. 20 episodes on Law, I think we will somehow. I think we will. But speaking of allowing yourself to allow that money to flow, if you have a local nonprofit that's close to your heart and you would like to keep the cycle and keep paying it forward, if you've ever wished you could do more to help them, you can visit 100voiceswhocareorg to learn how and big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl you too can connect and network like bosses, just like law and I. So you guys have an amazing week and let's keep that river flowing. All right, bye, have a great week, bye.  27:40 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL yeah.  28:07 - Anne (Host) Hey, hey everyone. I don't know why I wasn't ready for that. Take two, Take two, hey everyone. Welcome to the VO Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I am here with my super power.  28:26 - Lau (Co-host) Take three.  28:27 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VO Boss. Hey everyone, welcome. God, take five, yeah, take 105.
Visual Branding
Jan 16 2024
Visual Branding
Get set to embark on a riveting journey into the world of visual branding, specifically tailored for voice actors. In this enlightening discussion, the BOSSES will empower you with a comprehensive understanding of the critical role visuals play in effectively communicating your brand. We unravel the nuances of building a robust visual presence, which extends beyond just your attire and accessories and dives right into the realm of headshots and text titles for demos. Throughout the episode, we impart our own experiences and valuable insights, showing you how to leverage visuals to connect more deeply with your clientele. 00:01 - Introduction (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss a VO Boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VO Boss podcast. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and I'm here with my lovely boss co-host, Lau Lapides. Oh, hey, Annie.  00:31 So good to see you, how are you Fabulous, how are you? I'm great, I have to tell you. All right. So I apologize for being late to our little recording this morning because I was trying to coordinate the outfit law. Now that we are a visual kind of a brand and we've got video, I'm like all right, so now am I going to wear silver jewelry? Which glasses shall I wear? I'm trying to get that visual brand out there and I've got a set of headshots coming up, oh gosh, in a couple of days. And so I have been literally making a list and coordinating outfits because it is such a big part of my brand and I thought, wow, we should really talk about this for voice actors out there. How important are visuals, how important is that branding and those visuals to your brand and your business?  01:19 - Lau (Co-host) I love that topic and I'm so glad we're going to talk about that today, but I have to bring up the fact that you're on the West Coast. I'm in the East Coast, 3,000 miles away, and yet the mental telepathy of like what you chose to wear today and the fact that it's kind of color coordinated with what I chose to wear is like same way.  01:39 They go great, same wave. Like I'm all over the visuals, I do do do think it's important these days, and you and I do remember the days when the voiceover would hide ourselves, we would not be seen we would never have a photo of us out there ever, because we would be worried about a potential client looking at us and saying, wow, they look like this, but they sound like this.  02:02 - Anne (Host) I'm not going to cast them, right, right it was a thing I mean I remember distinctly when I got into voice herers like you know what I don't want to be in a career that's based on what I look like, okay, and I want to be able to be creative, I want to be able to act, but I don't want it to be dependent on me being young looking or beautiful or anything like that or how I look, and so I was very much into the voice acting.  02:25 However, as I've evolved my business throughout the years, I've really kind of settled into the fact that, as people, we need to connect with other people, and so the visual I've changed my mindset so that I don't have to feel like I look perfect or a particular way. However, for my business and for my brand, I take a lot of care and I take a lot of pride in that, and so I actually strategize. I mean gosh if I tell you I literally been making a list, a list of the outfits, the colors, the props that I'm going to use for my headshots, because I'm envisioning my website right, representing me, who I am, knowing that my clients want to connect with the person. Yes, and I want to stress that it's not about necessarily what you look like. It's about conveying who you are as a person, who you are as a brand, who you are as a business Right.  03:20 - Lau (Co-host) Listen, we can't get out of the fact that we live in a world. A lot of it is visual, it's what we see. Most people are visual learners, so when they pick you up, they're picking you up in 10 seconds less than that visually. So when we're meeting a client, when we're meeting a talent, when we're meeting a prospect, they're going to look at you. If they see you, sure, if they visually see you, okay, what's the first thing we see? It may be a website, it may be a social media post. It may be something that is not physically you. So thinking about what that visual brand is from the start, I think is wise and necessary and important in a visual society.  03:57 - Anne (Host) And when you do have those photos right that are showcasing you in action in your studio and again mine aren't just gonna be your typical headshot, like I mean I will have those, but typical, like from here up they're gonna be like lifestyle shots, they're gonna be shots of me, literally law. I am bringing a desktop boom arm with my microphone, with the headphones, with the laptops and the cables by the way, and the cables.  04:23 And I am dragging that all to the studio where I'm going to get my headshots, because I want those shots to represent who I am in my business and how I interact right with clients in my business and showcasing that so that ultimately people get a sense, a visual sense, because if they do come to my website first, right before they connect with me either on the phone or on a video call or even just hear me, they're seeing me in action and they're seeing my business in action and I think it's so very important for voice talent to really understand that. And again, it's not all about like that typical, like headshot, which it can be, but I really want that to show more about who you are. How is that headshot going to reveal your personality, your business? Because, again, our voices are product right, but our visual brand can also showcase that product.  05:17 I always talk to people about their websites and make sure your demos are above the fold. But, like, when you're placing your demos above the fold, put a text title by the spots that you have in that demo, because otherwise they don't know what's in that demo, they can't see it right, they just see that. Oh, there's an audio file that I can click on and listen to, but three quarters of the way into that audio file I don't know that. You have a Toyota spot right, and so if you're listing those spots out visually right, really it's just text that also helps with your SEO, but that can really, at a glance, somebody seeing oh, she's done work for Toyota right, that can make an impression.  05:54 - Lau (Co-host) Now here's my question of the day. I'm seeing a lot more demos that are video-based demos, so I know the people that that's their real jobs. They have a right to show it. That's their actual jobs and they're utilizing that because it's been aired. Others are creating these visual elements to their demo. I wanted to run that by you and see how are you feeling about that these days. Do you like that trend that's happening? Is it fun and exciting, or do you feel like it's a little edgy showing those visuals that they haven't really been a part of? How?  06:27 - Anne (Host) do you look at that? I'm a big fan. I mean, I've read in the forums. Some people are like, well, are they really giving you a return on your investment? I'm here to say, look, our demo is a marketing product, right? And it's kind of the same question Do we put produced spots or do we put sound effects and music behind an e-learning spot? Because typically there isn't. I'm like, well, this is a showcase, this is a marketing piece, this is a demonstration. Yes, there are times that you'll have music behind your e-learning. You may or may not know that. You don't know what the client is doing with it, necessarily afterwards, and so they're very well-could be, and I've actually seen a lot of e-learning modules where it could be character-based, it could be storytelling, video-based, it can be a lot of different ways to get the interactivity or the engagement with the listener. So, yeah, why not? I mean, it is a marketing piece, and so I feel like a video demo is yet another way to showcase your product. It's not the only way, I feel the same way.  07:26 - Lau (Co-host) Yeah, I feel the same way. I think we're living in a day right now where your visuals mean a lot. I oftentimes say to talent listen your voice actors. So don't be surprised if you have people at a showcase that are a producer or an agent type or even just some corporate prospect, say hey, are you an on-camera actor? I would like to use you in a print ad along with your voice. I would like to use you in this and that, and be prepared for that answer whether you welcome doing on-camera commercial work on-camera TV, film work, print work.  07:58 I think that throws a lot of talent off who only identify as a voice over talent. And don't get me wrong, that's fine, you can just do voiceover and specialize that and don't do anything else. But there's a whole bunch of people that are really open to that idea of doing more. Like, if I get signed by an agency and they want to sign me across the board and they say, hey, we're going to submit you for everything theater, tv, film, voice over, whatever I say, why not if you're interested in pursuing that, yeah, I agree, I agree.  08:30 - Anne (Host) Now let me ask you what sort of tips would you give to people who are really trying to figure out their visual brand? Do you have any tips?  08:40 - Lau (Co-host) I love that and I'm so glad we're talking about that today. I just got out of a coaching session looking at a Vio Talent's first headshot shoot and we were talking about what happens in the face, what happens in the eyes, what people are reading very, very quickly out of that.  08:58 So I think that it's very important to talk to people that are specialists in particular areas. So, for instance, a stylist that's really good may wanna provide for you a look book before you go and take your photos of some fashion looks, some professional looks, some business looks, some whatever looks, so that you can start to mimic those looks that would be right for your styling and your branding. It's hard to come up with that yourself.  09:28 - Anne (Host) I don't think I could even come up with it myself. It's so funny that you mentioned that because literally I just spent a weekend with my very good friend. She's always been a style icon. I've always considered her a style icon. In the last year she's gone into the business and I'm gonna give her a plug. Styled by Gianni yes, gianni, g-i-a-n-a-i yes, styled by Gianni. She's amazing. She's got all different types of packages, but she's sustainably conscious. I mean, she's located in LA. She can work with you remotely. She can work with you in any capacity. She's got all sorts of cool things. If you're just open to a consult, she can chat with you and then discuss colors. If nothing else, right, what colors, what color palettes? What's your body type? She'll take your measurements into consideration. I love it. What type of clothing would be best suited for you? And again, it doesn't necessarily just have to be about you and your clothing and your look, but it can also be about colors, colors that reflect who you are.  10:23 Colors that reflect who you want to be or what you want your business to be. And again, I've got multiple colors. We all know that red and black is the color for VO Boss. However, ink and guza is blue, and I've got a different color for VO Peeps, which is a teal blue, and I love those colors and it's one way that the brand is separated. So think of me. Now I'm gonna go to my photographer, my head shot artist. I'm gonna call her and I'm gonna go over there with I've got three different brands to represent. Literally, if I could ever come to my house, you could just like take photos in my closet, because I've got all these options of clothing and all these options of colors.  10:59 And some of the colors may or may not even have to go with my brand, but they go with my personality, right, I also think too, people are not thinking about the fit of things, so your stylist needs to help you with.  11:11 - Lau (Co-host) I might love this color, but how does it fit my body? Is it showing my body off? I know women, especially younger women, have a tough time with this and oftentimes we'll have things that are too big and baggy or have things that are too tight or showing a mid drift or whatever. Whatever the case may be, that may not be appropriate for your particular branding. So you need someone who understands style but also understands the brand that you want in terms of your fit, your color. Are you trending? Are you moving forward? Do you want to do retro?  11:41 A lot of VO's are very retro. They like doing fifties, forties, voguing stuff. Absolutely, I would say you know what, annie, and this is something you do really well. I would have fun. So many people. It's such a drudgery to go through this kind of thing and I'd say wait a second, especially the talent who are animation artists who are having fun. They're being outrageous a little bit. What if you had one shot on your website under your cartoons where you have little bunny ears or you're doing cosplay, anything, right, right? Who am I thinking of?  12:14 - Anne (Host) Jessica Rabbit.  12:15 - Lau (Co-host) No, no, no, the famous singer piano man. He started out wearing costumes Elton John, Elton John.  12:22 - Anne (Host) Elton.  12:23 - Lau (Co-host) John. Who could be more prolific and serious now? Yeah, really serious about everything. Started out wearing bunny suits, oh my gosh.  12:31 - Anne (Host) And now, if you're going to talk about that, you can talk about Lady Gaga and all of her outfits, cher.  12:37 - Introduction (Announcement) It's endless. And all of her I just saw Cher who looks amazing.  12:40 - Anne (Host) By the way, Awesome she does not age, she does not age, she doesn't age at all, barry. Manilow. I just watched the.  12:45 - Lau (Co-host) Holiday Special of the Dream Lighting.  12:48 - Anne (Host) Yeah, all the icons.  12:50 - Lau (Co-host) I'm getting the clem to it that one, barry Manilow, but I was just thinking about, like an Elvis Costello. If anyone knows Elvis Costello, he was very forward thinking by retching back oh, david Bowie, in his cool black and white suits. You know, david Bowie. So the point is, you don't have to be a pop star, you just have to be authentic to you, your personality, the kind of work you do Absolutely, absolutely, and they work that into their brand.  13:15 - Anne (Host) I mean the way they dress, the way they style. I mean even rock bands, if you remember back in I'm showing them age, but you know, like Kiss, right Makeup and platforms, that kind of thing Anyhow, aren't they doing?  13:26 - Lau (Co-host) I just saw them on TV. They're doing their last. What is it? Madison Square Garden, their last concert? Yeah, their last tour and retiring. It's just pretty amazing. But the point yeah, they were in mask for how many years you never saw their real faces. So the point is is like get yourself to start out, wean yourself into it. Get a good headshot. Just start with a good headshot so that for your PR, if someone says hey, mike, susan, jay, I need you to send me a good photo, you have something and you're not going, let me go through my photo camera roll let's see if I have anything Like have something, and I also would have. You and I were talking about props earlier too. I love that idea. It could be your pet it could be your mic, absolutely.  14:07 - Anne (Host) What is it you're passionate about? Whatever, if, I could bring my cats. If I could put them in a car and drive them, I would bring my cats because yeah, Obviously, yeah.  14:16 - Lau (Co-host) So things that define you in your work day, but also in your personal life, that you love, you care about. Remember one of our favorites, betty White, who I love so much. She was known for the animals. Every time you thought of Betty White, you thought of the animals she was. I remember the PSA she did, annie, where she was surrounded by all the animals because she was helping save the animals. That was something she always had in her PR. Where she could was an animal, absolutely, absolutely.  14:43 - Anne (Host) So these are all visuals for you to be thinking about and not only can they go on your website but they can go in your social media campaigns and promotions. Youtube channel, I mean, again, if you are out there creating something visual, like if you are out there doing a podcast, right, I think today if you're doing a podcast and you don't have a video element to it and I'm not saying maybe the whole podcast has to be video, but honestly I mean everybody's kind of going that way, even though I also have an audio version, you and I have an audio version, but we have a YouTube channel right where we have videos, we do shorts, and so if you want to promote your business and you're doing any type of video or YouTube shorts, obviously you're on camera and there is branding to think about. I mean, if you've gone to all the trouble to create a logo, right, and figure out well what colors, what font, why not just extend it to your personal body, your personal self?  15:37 Because, again, our product is so very personal and I'm going to give a tip that gosh I got a long, long time ago when I worked with my business mentor, who was helping to brand me at the time, was that we created a private Pinterest board and she said to me I want you to just create a board and I want you to put everything on that board that's your favorite thing, like favorite places, favorite colors, favorite things, hobbies, activities, and when you put that board together, when you have your favorite since, she said, I'll include your favorite fonts, right? Well, that was a big mistake.  16:12 - Introduction (Announcement) Cause I have like a thousand favorite fonts.  16:14 - Anne (Host) But anyway, I put that board together and shared it with her and it was a great visual representation of who I am and from there she was able to create a website she was able to help me with branding and help me with marketing campaigns and that really came up with my Angangusa brand, because when I was doing it myself, it's so hard to brand yourself. I think we've had episodes where we've talked about branding. It is hard to brand yourself.  16:39 And even now I have ideas because I help people so much with it. But it's always nice to get that second set of eyes, that second set of ears. That is saying you know what I see you in this light, where you think maybe here's what I'm projecting out. But I need to know how do you see me, how do you see my business and what demographic am I speaking to and what does my look? Or what are the colors? What do the images on my website have to do? What feelings? I think you got to go so far as to what feelings are evoked when somebody looks at your website.  17:13 - Lau (Co-host) That's great Very pathos, very visceral. You got to revisit it too. I think that a lot of talent it evolves.  17:20 I don't know why they think, oh, I've done this, I made a demo, I'm done. I said you made a demo. Honey, you're starting, you're not done, you're going to make another thousand demos over your lifetime. Like, this is just the process. So if you choose a logo that may change in a year or two or three, if you've evolved, all companies rebrand. Yeah, I was just going to say I like to think of it. You've got an interior designer for your home, potentially.  17:44 - Anne (Host) Well, this is an exterior designer for the world and VO Boss has already rebranded once and it is a thing I mean. Rebranding is a thing you need to evolve. I know that my husband's company is going through a large rebranding right now and they're a well established company. So you need to evolve your brand. And we've all seen it with products that we buy, like Coca-Cola rebrand you know it's just people rebrand. When it's time to refresh, rebrand, yes, it's time for you to always revisit these things and I always say come at it from a perspective of where's your heart, where are your passions for where your company is going. And I'm evolving. My Anganguza brand will be evolving and broadening out to a larger audience. And even this podcast.  18:28 I've been always wanting to evolve this podcast to a larger audience so that it's not just voiceover artists. However, it's been voiceover for a good seven years. Now I've got a thought do I start a new podcast if I want to venture out of not that I'm venturing out of voice acting, but if I want to also explore right other avenues, like just podcasting in general, entrepreneurship? Like, do I keep this podcast and then add a new one, or do I rebrand this podcast and evolve? It's not something you do by tomorrow. It's something that takes some thought and sometimes the idea just has to sit with you for a while.  19:05 I remember a few years back, law, I went to rebrand and I was trying to consolidate VioPeeps and VioBoss and I had new designs. I actually had my VioPeeps bird and I made him edgy. So I changed the colors from the VioPeeps bird, from the blue, and I put him in black and red and he's like edgy. I had like a leather jacket, he had like some sunglasses and he was very cool and I got some really cool graphics out of that for a complete consolidation of a brand.  19:34 - Introduction (Announcement) And I decided not to do it after that, but it was something like I said.  19:38 - Anne (Host) It doesn't always have to happen. I mean, I decided against it only because my little bird was just too cute to give up and I loved him, and you know what I said. That's it. I'm going to keep a separate brand, but I think it's something that every year, and especially since we're in the beginning of the year now, right, it's something that people can think about. Right, what are you doing for this next year? What are you doing? Are you evolving? Are you growing? How are you doing that and how are you changing things up? I mean, gosh knows that if you change up your website, it can actually put your SEO into high gear, right? Especially?  20:12 - Introduction (Announcement) if you update content.  20:13 - Anne (Host) If you update pages, update looks, maybe update capabilities.  20:17 - Lau (Co-host) Yeah, and there's a functuary in that it's such a refreshment in doing that.  20:21 You know just when you think you know your favorite company's tagline or slogan. Just look it up. You're going to see sometimes hundreds of slogans that they've used over the years because they're reaching out to different demographics of people and they need to have different visuals right that appeal to those demographics. So I love that. I think you should stay really you know you don't want to change things every two seconds because then people get confused as to who you are but keep it fresh and trendy so that you give yourself flexibility and fluidity to say, um, that color scheme isn't me anymore, or it doesn't really represent the people I work with anymore, or the thing itself, the website itself or whatever, just doesn't look like me anymore. Here's one of the things that I discovered, annie, I know you already know this, but I discovered it only about a year ago and that is why was I in the box of thinking I just needed one website.  21:11 Oh yeah, right so people are having the discussion should I get a website? I'm having the discussion how many websites should I have? So now, for every event I have, I want to do? I'm driving my web people crazy because I'm like it's so inexpensive to get it. People don't have to fight through your website to find the thing you're looking for right.  21:33 To me, that's been my personal playground of visual branding and also ease of navigation for the client to say, oh, it's this particular project, it's a big one, I want to represent it visually aside from everything else we're doing. So when you talk about your different brands, in case people don't understand what that means, it could be something as simple yet sophisticated as having separate websites, absolutely, absolutely.  21:58 - Anne (Host) I mean, for years I've had medicalnarrationcom, I've had phonevoicecom and I've had, for each genre that I specialize in, of course, vopeaps and VOBOSS. I mean, I think at one point I owned like 13 domains and I still have domains. I have domains right now because I have ideas. How many sites do you have now? Though I probably have, I've got VOPEAPS, voboss in Gangusa, automotive, annie medical-narration phone-voicecom, e-learning-voicecom. Gosh, I've got a bunch.  22:31 - Lau (Co-host) And those are all actual websites right. Those are landing page websites that you can get to see what it is.  22:38 - Anne (Host) Yeah, I'm going to revisit and see what my SEO value is for those right now. But if you definitely are pointing people towards your website for promotions or for purchasing, it definitely can help to have it just go to a website. And of course I always, always, always recommend people say, and Gangusa or yournamecom, because you are a personal brand and that's the first and foremost domain I think anybody should get. But it's not expensive to purchase domains these days, unless of course you have a very common name or you want, like voiceactingcom, which that's already taken, but your first and lastnamecom. If not, then your first lastname, voicecom or voice acting or voice actor, those things all are viable.  23:22 - Lau (Co-host) I love it, I love it. And one more thing, Annie, I want to bring up. That's what my dad always called ATD attention to detail, which really makes a difference.  23:31 Now maybe more viable in a time where we were meeting people in person more than we are now, but I'm going to say it anyway because I personally like to get out and go to physical events. If you go anywhere to meet someone outside of your office, in your studio, not only worry about the way you look, but be concerned about if you drive watch your car. That's something that we always said oh, do I want to do the deal with this person? Their car is filthy. I just got inside of it. It's a mess, right?  24:02 Real estate agents used to talk about that a lot because they'd get inside other people's car to go look at properties or they'd get in the real estate agents car. So I know it may or may not like pertain to some of the listeners right now, but some that are going out physically to meetings, to networking, to this, to that like how you show up physically to the parking lot, come into the room, whatever, just it all kind of matters, it all matters. Don't think, oh, I'm offstage right now, no one sees me, no one cares. Until I enter the room, they do care, they look at you and they say is this the kind of person that I want to know Is it the person that I want to work with?  24:40 - Anne (Host) potentially, it's just never thought about that. Never thought about that.  24:44 - Lau (Co-host) Right, If you're meeting for a Zoom coffee or a real coffee, you're going to Starbucks or whatever. Like, just think about. Right, Bring your notebook, take notes. That's a visual right, good advice. Wow.  24:57 - Anne (Host) Well, this was a fun topic. I love it. Fun. We could go on and on, we could Bosses. As individuals, it can seem difficult to make a huge impact, but as a group, together we can contribute to the growth of our communities in ways that we never before thought possible. Visit 100voiceswhocareorg to learn how Big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. We love IPDTL because I love talking to law and I love connecting with other bosses. You can find out more at IPDTLcom. You guys have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. Awesome Bye.  25:34 - Lau (Co-host) See you next time. Bye.  25:37 - Introduction (Announcement) Yay. Join us next week for another edition of Vo Boss with your host and Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.  26:08 - Anne (Host) Law you just had, like a series of fireworks.  26:15 - Lau (Co-host) I know what happened there. I should keep that in there. I don't know, I have no idea. Oh my goodness, I thought it might be something on your end. I don't know, I've never, but you and I, we are making fireworks together.  26:28 - Anne (Host) There you go, we are making fireworks.
Receiving
Jan 9 2024
Receiving
Prepare yourself to delve into the beautiful dance of giving and receiving - a balance, when maintained, that can have profound impacts on both your work and personal life. We’ll explore the joy of giving and the ripple effects it carries for both the giver and recipient, as well as the importance of receiving recognition in the business world. As we navigate this conversation, we'll also challenge the constant need for validation and discuss how rewarding achievements can foster healthier self-esteem. Join us as we explore the complexities of acknowledging one's worth and the importance of fair compensation. Essential listening for anyone who struggles with receiving, this episode promises to enlighten and inspire. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VEO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:19 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, along with my amazing, awesome, most wonderful boss, co -host Lau Lapides. Hey, Lau, hi, hi, Annie. Happy Saturday, yes, happy Saturday, Lau. You know, Lau, it's a new year and I am full of promise and full of motivation and inspiration and we've just come off the season of. I like to call it the season of giving, because I love to give gifts and I love to donate to my favorite charities. And you know what? I also like to receive gifts, but we don't always talk about that. We talk about giving, but what about receiving? And sometimes Lau those gifts, they're not in a box. So let's talk about the gift of receiving, shall we?  01:14 - Lau (Host) It's so interesting to me. I love this topic and because there's so many cultural differences of how we receive. There's gender differences, there's age and generational differences and I don't hear anyone really talking about how do we get something, receive something, take something, and how do we behaviorally deal with that. Yeah, like something is simple. I'll tell you what's in my brain right now. When someone comes into my home or my studio, the first thing I do and this was in my training was to offer them something. I offer them a hot drink.  01:51 - Anne (Host) I offer them a warm beverage.  01:52 - Lau (Host) I offer them a warm beverage of their choice, right, and that is definitely generational, but it's also cultural because that's the background Eastern European background. We are gift givers. We give a lot to others, right, and there's different schools of thought business-wise as to how you receive that, and how I train my clients is take it, take it. You don't have to drink it, you don't have to want it, but take it because it's giving a message to the person who's giving it to you that you are cordially receiving something that they're offering to you.  02:29 That's part of their protocol and they're etiquette right.  02:32 - Anne (Host) Well, I'll tell you one thing that's always been hard for me to receive and I think a lot of maybe women, maybe a lot of people share. This is a compliment I'm just saying that is so difficult for me, without downplaying it, and honestly, the best thing you can do to receive that compliment is to receive it with gratitude even if you don't feel it right.  02:55 I mean, how many times do people send a compliment your way and you're like, oh no, it was nothing. Or, and especially, though, when it comes to our businesses too though, isn't it funny. When it comes to our businesses, I am more than happy to take a compliment from a client. Do you know what I mean? If a client's like, oh my God, great job, right, I'm very happy about that. Inside, I'm bursting with pride and joy and hopefully that's every boss out there when they get a compliment or good feedback from their client, and I think that you must receive that. And if you receive that, that really speaks volumes to professionalism, right and courtesy, and understanding what it means to the other person when they're giving you something such as a compliment doesn't have to have monetary value, of course.  03:37 Well, like to have gifts of gold but in addition to that, gift of a kind word is really something I think that is truly like giving of the other person, and if you reject it, then that's a little insulting and hurtful.  03:53 - Lau (Host) I think you hit the nail on the head too when you said, especially with women, how we're not always in the mood to receive that or expecting that or even deserving of that. In our mindset, it's a little bit of that imposter syndrome that comes in when someone gives you that compliment and that moment of like oh, how do I take that? Do I deserve that? Oftentimes we'll say, oh no, I just got this dumb outfit.  04:19 - Anne (Host) You know it was on sale. Anyway, you look terrific, you look great and I throw it.  04:22 - Lau (Host) This old thing, yeah, this old thing, it's been hanging in my closet Doesn't mean but you look terrific, you look amazing. We'll throw it right back at the other person, which they don't realize oftentimes. That is a passive aggressive non accepting value, because it's not just a compliment, it's showcasing your value.  04:43 - Anne (Host) It's almost like when you throw it back and it's not that you don't mean it, but sometimes when you throw it back immediately, it's almost like you don't accept what they're giving to you and you're like, oh no, you look great. And so then it becomes that kind of a battle of maybe, well, who's giving here and who's the gracious receiver right?  05:00 - Intro (Announcement) There's gracious giving and there's gracious receiving.  05:03 - Anne (Host) And I truly believe that it needs to be within our boss superpowers to be able to receive and something that's we're talking a little more on maybe a loftier level in terms of nothing that has monetary value, but definitely has value like a compliment right, an act of kindness, that sort of thing. What about money Lau? I mean, how hard is it sometimes for us to accept for a job Well done, I'm happy to accept money, but thinking about, am I worth the money, am I asking for enough money? And what if I get more money? And is that hard for me to receive? Because, again, we have some of these mental issues sometimes with accepting money and that really kind of, I think, goes back to our value or our feelings of self worth.  05:47 - Lau (Host) Yes, yes, yes, yes. And you know what that money may be in money form and it may go towards an actual gift right. And I recently received. One of the gifts in the mail I literally just got within a week ago was from a client of mine who sent me one of those beautiful boxes for a holiday for. Thanksgiving that was chock full of coffee, beans and caramel and just everything under the sun.  06:09 - Anne (Host) And.  06:09 - Lau (Host) I was so surprised when I opened it up. I was so amazed that someone was thinking of me in that way, but how I reacted to it now, on retrospect, when I look at that, what did I do immediately? I thanked her, I loved it, and then I immediately started to give it away. I immediately started to offering to my clients coming through that.  06:29 - Anne (Host) I see to my family.  06:30 - Lau (Host) Oh, here, let me share, let me, here, let me give this to you. Let me share this to you. And I oftentimes wonder is a gift really meant for you when it's given to you, or is it meant for you to do what you see fit with that gift? So, if you get the monetary cash and you want to give it to charity, how would that person, how would the giver actually feel about that if they really wanted to give it to you? That's an interesting question.  06:56 - Anne (Host) Yeah, that is an interesting question. Well, you know what I think? That if a gift is given, it is because or at least for me, the person that is giving it wants to extend a gift for the other person to experience joy, I would think, and appreciation, and I feel like for me, whatever they choose to do with it, I mean, unless I feel like they secretly hate it and they gave it away and they're like, oh gosh, this is like what is it called?  07:21 - Intro (Announcement) An elephant gift. An elephant gift yes exactly.  07:24 - Anne (Host) And so then I would be a little hurt if I knew. But I think my intentions are to provide a token of appreciation, a token of here's how I feel about you. And if the other person doesn't accept it for themselves graciously at first, and then I realize, oh, maybe they've immediately given it away or something, then I would be hurt. I would be hurt by that Feeling like they've rejected my gift.  07:45 - Lau (Host) But, annie, let's be honest, we've all done that. Haven't we all gotten that scarf? Or those gloves that are just the ugliest thing in the world, do you think? Oh, they're itchy, they don't really fit me. Well, let me, elephant, gift that to someone who will appreciate it. And if not, you notice people are starting to say if you don't want it, it's okay, pass it on. I'm like a donate.  08:05 - Anne (Host) The other thing would be like here's one things that people have made for me. Now, this could be homemade food. This could be homemade gifts. This could be my grandmother knitting me a sweater, or my mother knitted me.  08:18 I'm gonna get me all teary, but my mother, she knitted me afghans and blankets, and my aunt used to so close for me, and it reminds me of the bunny suit on a Christmas story with Ralphie, and so you accept that and you're grateful for it, because there was thought and love put into the gift and so receiving that means that you're receiving that love. You're receiving that gift.  08:41 - Lau (Host) You're receiving it, you're suck it up. You do you do. You're totally, because it's not the color of your bedroom and it just is not the feel that you wanna put on your body, but you love it. You put it on display somewhere. You just have to appreciate that, right. What about this one? What about from a philosophical point of view? As we live our lives every day around the holiday season, how are we viewing gifts that are given by others or by the universe? Are we recognizing any gifts, gifts?  09:09 - Anne (Host) from the universe Locke. Let's delve deeper into that. So what gifts from the universe? What would be some examples? I like that.  09:16 - Lau (Host) Well, I'm a New Englander, so on the New England track. I think all of us can relate that come from cold weather climates and when I have more, temperate weather or. I have a winter where we're not like snowed in and killing ourselves with the slush. To me, I recognize that as an immense gift.  09:35 - Anne (Host) Nice and Californians are very grateful for rain.  09:38 - Lau (Host) Yes, oh yes, yes, yes, yes. How about the gift of looking in the mirror and seeing yourself for what you actually see, not for what you want to see? So that is, as you age, seeing the wrinkles, seeing the imperfections, seeing the scars, but then feeling like, wow, there's a gift in there for me of understanding.  10:02 - Anne (Host) That represents my life, my heart. Here I have to tell you because my own personal experience. I have lost a little bit of weight and so I look at my body, which is now kind of a wrinkly because I got some skin, and I look at that and I'm like, ok, that could be considered by some to not be attractive, but for me it's almost like it's a battle scar. It's like you know what I'm proud of?  10:23 my body I am proud, I am grateful. I am actually so grateful for my body, for being resilient and for the things that my body has been through, and I think that we can apply this to our businesses as well right, our journey as our businesses. But, like my body has been through a journey, my mentality, my entrepreneurship has been through a journey, and I'm grateful for all of it because I've survived it and I've been able to come out the other side more joyful and educated and more motivated to do even more. And so I really try to take a look at that and be grateful for that gift from the universe right that I have received. And I love that we kind of brought the gifts from the universe into this discussion, because I think we have them every day and we don't always recognize them for what they are and we aren't always receiving them or acknowledging them with the amount of gratitude or thought that I think we should.  11:23 - Lau (Host) Right, or even just mindfulness, conscientiousness of seeing it and observing. We talk about it from an actor's point of view, but from a human point of view, are you really seeing what is in front of you? What are you uncovering? And since we're diving deep, I'll go one deeper, because you're not only surviving and you're thriving in the gratefulness and recognition, in the gift of that, and that's what makes you so beautiful, both aesthetically but also inside. There's a beauty and a light that happens in you. To me that's very recognizable and I'm going to dive even deeper. I'm going to say I have someone very close to my family suffering from a very deadly illness and eating it and I watch it every day go into remission and I watch it turn around and I watch it Now, from the outside, this person is somewhat suffering and all of that. From the inside, I see that little soul, that little spirit winning and I'm like a gift a gift, a gift, a gift every day.  12:28 - Anne (Host) It's so true.  12:29 - Lau (Host) If I lose the job, if I don't look good one day, whatever, this is the gift that I'm going to keep coming back to, of course, and I totally identify with that.  12:38 - Anne (Host) I mean it is, and we've talked about this before.  12:41 I mean, yeah, when someone that you love or someone you're close to is going through a challenge mental challenge, health challenge, whatever that might be I mean, in reality, it really points us towards knowing and understanding what those gifts are. And I've said it before, when I was going through my own health challenge, I mean, once I got back in the studio, I was like gosh, what was I ever worried about? You know, here I was thinking, oh, my voice doesn't sound in a particular way or I'd worry about those things, and I'm like my gosh, I have just been given this immense gift and I'm here to be able to experience and here to be able to just do what I love in this booth and just be, just be and be grateful. And well, I'll tell you what that comes through in our voices, doesn't it? It emanates from us and, as performers, I think that it behooves us to be good receivers, right Of the gifts that are being given to us, because it just absorbs into our energy and just radiates out from our performances.  13:39 - Lau (Host) It so does, and I mean the gift of knowledge of how to give as well, so like, for instance, when it comes to philanthropy and charity. I love that. I'm big in that. I'll give a quick plug to our 100 voices who care.  13:54 - Intro (Announcement) We love.  13:54 - Lau (Host) Claire and the gang we love so much. I'm a member and to me it's such a relief, it's such a relief gift to me to figure out how to give in a very safe and impactful and thought away. And as long as I make money, I'm going to give forever because I don't have to think about it. It's one less thing I have to think about because I know it's vetted, I know it's legit and I know the people come from their heart and soul. Wow, to me that's a gift.  14:23 - Anne (Host) Exactly, and you know, the cool thing about 100 Voices who Care is, honestly, it does not take a lot of money, and that's really what the big thing is, and it's literally $100, four times a year, and that's it. And ultimately that, combined with the community, the togetherness that is also in kind, donating that, that is $10,000 that can be given to people in need or organizations in need, and I think that that's absolutely wonderful and I think, really, whatever giving charity that you want, again giving that and then expecting that the people who are in need are receiving that and they're grateful for it right, that's what makes the world go round and that's what I think really giving is so easy to talk about, because I love to give myself and I mean I consider the VoBoss we're giving of ourselves joyfully, because it's something that we both love to do, we love to share, we love to be a resource, we love to help if we can, and that's what we're here for.  15:19 But I really really also want bosses out there to understand the importance of being able to see and acknowledge and receive in kind and be okay, it is for you, it doesn't have to be for anybody else, you don't have to feel compelled to turn around and give it somewhere else.  15:36 I fully believe that if a gift is meant for you and you love it and you keep it for yourself, you give in other ways, right? I mean it doesn't have to be that you have to turn around and feel like, oh, I either need to give that gift or give a portion of that gift, or you can keep it. I mean it's okay, it was meant for you and love, and that is something that I think is really wonderful. And, of course, I mean let's make it more from a business perspective, right, being able to ask for the money that you deserve for a job that has been well done is, first of all, when you do that yes, do that but when you get that actual money and you receive that money, then you'll notice that I feel like the cycle or the circle has been completed.  16:18 - Lau (Host) Yes, absolutely. And here's another one that is amazing but can be tricky in how it's received. You and I, I know I'm grateful and fortunate that we're nominated.  16:27 You and I and our companies for SOVA's nominations, which I'm thrilled I'm over the moon. So when I learned that now you've been nominated for years now that was my first time around being nominated when I learned that it challenged me a little I'll be honest with you. It challenged me. I had to sit there and go, well, okay, do I deserve that? Is that okay, do I deserve that? Was there anyone that deserves it more than me? Or, like it challenged me in a way, I was over the moon, thrilled. I love to be a part of it, the community be recognized. But at the end of the day, you have to sit alone with yourself and say I did this, we did this, I did this and I accept the good things coming my way, along with the challenging things as well.  17:14 It's like you have to have a little conversation with yourself about that and I'm very careful, like I don't want my head to be big. I don't want to be gloaty about it, I don't want to hold it over anyone else. I want to be very humane about the recognition that I slash we as the company get because I feel so grateful for it. I don't feel like, oh, of course I deserved it, I'm the best. I feel like that's going in a direction of morality that is not of high integrity. The highest integrity people are people who are humble and they're modest and they have humility about themselves and their work. Those are the people that I always have admiration for yeah, absolutely, I love that.  17:54 - Anne (Host) And receiving acknowledgement right Receiving acknowledgement is absolutely another important, very important, I think, factor in really having fulfilling and successful entrepreneurial journeys and businesses right.  18:08 I think a lot of times what happens? We get a lot of people coming into this industry that are so unhappy and there are jobs, because I always tell people in the corporate world all we really want is love. All we want is love and acknowledgement right Like validation. It helps to make money right so you can pay the bills. Absolutely, I mean that's first and foremost.  18:26 But I think a lot of times when people are dissatisfied with their work, it's because they've really put their heart and soul into it and nobody's acknowledged that and nobody has really recognized that or given them a compliment or credited them for that, and so that, I think, is one source of people really wanting to come into business for themselves. And so now when we're entrepreneurs feedback that we get and it's rare that we get feedback from clients right, unless we go out and ask for it, which I'm the biggest fan of, going out and getting testimonials right Get yourself that acknowledgement. But also, when it comes unexpectedly, it's something that I think we need to be prepared to just receive it and be grateful for it and really know that you're worth it, because there's something to be said about people who are constantly degrading or downplaying or shunning those compliments or acknowledgments or awards, and we did a podcast on awards. There's just there's lots of different opinions about awards. Do people need an award to do their business? Not necessarily.  19:26 But I'll tell you sometimes that recognition very similar to being in a corporate job or whatever it might be getting a little bit of recognition can really help emotionally. Mental I mean. I feel like everything in life it all stems mentally and then it kind of I'm going to say, pushes out physically, right. Like I feel like everything is in our head, like that's what is controlling the earth, right? Our thoughts, right, I feel it's our thoughts and how we feel about ourselves and how we feel about others and how we treat it. It just directly affects the physical everything and I think that it's so important.  19:59 - Lau (Host) I just rambled off on this kind of tangent, but I think it's all related, right, it's all related because if think of any relationship we have, like I love acknowledging, I love validating, I love giving compliments, I love that it doesn't only make me feel good, it's necessary, it's like, okay, we're going to be tough on someone, we're going to give honest feedback, we're going to say no to someone, we're going to be harsh at times, but it's really important to have those moments where you go you know what, I'm really proud of you. Or hey, you did it, Nicely done. I'm so excited for you.  20:34 Because otherwise I find people in general get really down on themselves very fast and then lose steam, lose energy, lose motivation, because they ultimately start to want to please or be liked by the casting, producer, coach, whatever, and it becomes personalized in that way. So it's like a fine line. I of course, want to have that no-like and trust factor. Of course I want to have that in the business world. But there's a fine line Like we don't want to be motivated to only be liked and only be validated, right.  21:11 Otherwise you're seeking to receive things all the time which are not earned they're not always well earned. They're just that little honor, that little star, for no reason. I want to live in a meritocracy. Still, I want to be rewarded when I'm earned.  21:27 - Anne (Host) Yeah, I love that you brought that up because you're right, Seeking to receive all the time is not good either. Being able to receive is one thing, but seeking to always have likes or stuff like that is also not healthy and doesn't create for a healthy business either. Right, when you're constantly seeking approval and I think that really kind of stems from other issues, like when you're seeking approval all the time, and that could be a whole other podcast Lau.  21:51 - Lau (Host) That is a whole other podcast approval. Yeah, how do we respond to all of the things that happen in our world that are not what we want or not what we're expecting to come back to us? How do we respond to those things Like not being nominated, not getting the award, not getting? How do we respond to that?  22:13 - Anne (Host) That always is a little pain, oh, always a pain, even when you know better, like myself, and we know we've been on both sides right when we want that acknowledgement, we want that award, we want that feedback, and sometimes it just doesn't come back to us the way that we want. And so how do we deal with that right? Again, that's not necessarily a rejection right of something that you're receiving, it's that you haven't received it. And so now, what? Now, what do you do with that longing, that desire, that hope? How do you get yourself back in balance?  22:44 - Lau (Host) That's right. That's right. Balance is really the key because the more balanced we are, the more we can easily give and offer and receive and take. And not do it from an ego point of view, not do it from this heavy ego centric, really do it from a place that's very balanced and very open and very like. It's like a give and take of Feng Shui. You know what I mean. Like you're cleansing Every time you give something away. I find when I Feng Shui my office or my studio and I give things away, if it's received well, I feel cleansed right, and if I'm receiving something, well, I feel cleansed.  23:19 There's like a cathartic thing that happens, a purification that happens if it's not coming from pure ego which. I love. I think it's fabulous.  23:27 - Anne (Host) I can talk Clear the clutter, clear the clutter, clear the clutter, physically clear the clutter in your brain. I mean it can really do a lot to propel you and your business forward. Absolutely, absolutely. What a really cool conversation Lau. I love it, I love it Beautiful I love it, guys.  23:43 And, as we spoke about before, 100 Voices who Care, simple Mission, big Impact 100 Voices, 1 hour, $10,000,. Guys, you can really make an impact. Visit 100voiceswhocareorg to find out more and big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. Gosh, I love IPDTL, I just love IPDTL. They give us the opportunity to give and receive Lau at UNI back and forth for this podcast, and I absolutely love the fact that we can connect and do so. Find out more at IPDTLcom. You guys have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. Bye.  24:19 - Lau (Host) See you next time.  24:21 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VoBoss with your host, Ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution, with permission. Coast-to-coast connectivity via IPDTL.
Something New
Jan 2 2024
Something New
Are you ready to become the architect of your own success? This episode is a catalyst for inspiring business transformations. Anne and Lau uncover exciting possibilities that come with starting something new, and guide you on how to kindle creativity for innovative ideas. Discover how the power of writing can become a game-changer for your creativity and personal development. Delve into how expressing your thoughts and ideas on paper encourages new, innovative ideas. Learn why feedback is crucial, and the profound impacts a business mentor can have on your business. The BOSSES emphasize patience, persistence, and maintaining an abundant mindset when investing in yourself and your business. From successful direct marketing strategies to the creation of tangible proofs of concept, we've got you covered. Let's level up your business together! Transcript 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss Podcast and the Boss Superpower Series. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, along with my amazing special guest co-host Lau Laupides. 00:33 - Lau (Host) And how are you? Welcome to be back. I'm fabulous. How are you?  00:37 - Anne (Host) It's a brand new day. Lau, it's a brand new day. It's a new year. I am excited, Speaking of new. I think it's time for us to maybe talk about setting goals, starting something new. I always get a great thrill, a great anticipation and excitement when I start something new, and I think it's something that can really help bosses to grow their businesses, to be continually moving forward and progressing, and I think it's wonderful to challenge ourselves. What about you? I?  01:06 - Lau (Host) love it. I would love to do some tips on how we can start something new, because it's that feng shui of your soul, your spirit, your closet, your studio, your whatever, your car, your relationship. It's like how do I not only cleanse and clean things out, but how do I make the fire happen, how do I create it? And do it on a reguLaur basis as a soloprenor, as an entrepreneur? That's what our job is. It's really to constantly create things. Create, that's why we're creatives. That's why we're creatives.  01:37 - Anne (Host) Yes, and we really need to embrace. Embrace the creativeness, even if you feel that you're not creative, right, and you feel, and it's scary, I'll tell you a lot it's scary to start new things, because what if we fail? Right.  01:49 - Intro (Announcement) What if it doesn't work?  01:51 - Anne (Host) What are we going to do? And so I think that there's a lot of anguish that happens before we start something new, or goodness gracious knows that I can procrastinate along with the best of them right, but once I get a focus right.  02:04 I'm focused, but I'll tell you what. Getting started and starting something new A lot of times I know that bosses will be like I don't even know where to start. So what are some tips on? How can we generate new ideas right? I mean, some of them can come from within ourselves, but I'll tell you what. There's technology out there that can help us to maybe spur some new ideas for how to grow our business right.  02:26 - Lau (Host) I would have a little something, a little trinket, a mechanism, a toy or whatever. That is your reset button, that's your little thing that you go to. I used to have staples button.  02:35 - Anne (Host) When I worked with staples. Yes, that was easy.  02:37 - Lau (Host) I literally hit it on my desk and go boom, that was easy, so you need something physical in your environment whether it's a stuffed  02:46 animal, whether it's a little bell, a little bell or something. It sounds ridiculous, but I'm telling you your brain takes recording really well. Ironically, we're in the business of recording everything. We do, everything we say, every move we make. We're being recorded. So every time you do that little Pavlovian dog behavioral thing, your brain goes something good is coming, something new is happening. I'm going to accept it into the reality that I want safety, I want comfort and I want to know exactly what's coming up. So it's going to reset that for you, so that you've got a mindset focus reset before you do anything. I think that's really important.  03:26 - Anne (Host) I feel like we could do a search on Amazon or something and something like a reset button or a new button or something that will help us. So if you're looking for that physical thing, that button to push, or there's always the staple, that's easy button, which I love.  03:39 - Intro (Announcement) I had a bell and that kind of thing.  03:40 - Anne (Host) But, yeah, I like that. That's a good start now. So what? What are we going to do? That's new. How are we going to come up with ideas? I think a lot of us have ideas on what we'd like to do to move our business forward. Oh, build a new studio. Maybe there's roadblocks, right, but these roadblocks can actually, I think, motivate us to get started on something new, because we can then work towards achieving our goal, and I don't want this to necessarily turn into the goal achieving episode but it's very simiLaur.  04:07 Because what if? Okay, I want to start something new, I want to go into a different genre of voiceover, or I want to build a new studio, or I want to rearrange my office space right so it's more conducive to working more efficiently? Whatever it might be, I think it starts with the idea and it starts with that little thing. Here we go Right now. What are the steps that it's going to take to get there right, To start this, to actually accomplish this?  04:35 - Lau (Host) By the way, you could go very Eastern philosophy. You could do either a gong or you could do some chimes. I love the chimes. The chimes is really cool to my ear. I have tincture bells.  04:44 - Anne (Host) I don't know if those of you out there.  04:45 - Intro (Announcement) I love tincture bells.  04:47 - Anne (Host) Tincture bells are, I think, very good vibrations and good energy, and tincture bells are just a beautiful sounding bell.  04:53 - Lau (Host) All right, I have a really cool exercise, annie, that I use for a number of the soloprenore cLausses that I teach, that I myself love doing, and that is we put on some really cool music. My favorite is bonobo. We put on some fabulous music and we do like a timed brain dump, and the timed brain dump usually for me is six minutes, but it could be whatever you choose, and it's a time where we put on that music. We focus our pen or pencil on the paper. Now we are not allowed to pick the pen or pencil up for six minutes, meaning I don't allow critiquing, I don't allow editing, I don't allow review. It's not grammatically correct. It is a creative writing exercise for you to dump out everything in your brain, refocus. But, most importantly, Wait.  05:41 - Anne (Host) You don't pick up the pen until six minutes, and then, after six minutes, you pick up the pen.  05:46 - Lau (Host) No, it doesn't matter what you're writing. You're allowing your subconscious to drain itself. So that you and your intellect have nothing to do with it. It's really about so you're not writing. You're dumping, You're writing. You're actually writing what you're dumping.  06:00 - Anne (Host) Oh, I thought you said you don't pick up the pen.  06:02 - Lau (Host) Well meaning, you don't pick up the pen to stop writing, you keep your pen to the paper.  06:06 Oh, I see, I see, I see and you write and it can be tiring, it can be physically demanding for people who are not used to writing, but it's important because we get in the way so much of the ideas Like we got to get ideas out there before we can dissect them or critique them and sometimes nothing comes of it. But oftentimes there are things lodged in our brain that are either exciting us, bothering us, sticking, coming back, that we need to awaken and pay attention to, for that new idea.  06:37 - Anne (Host) Now, during this exercise, you're writing everything that's coming into your brain Everything, Even if it's not a new idea right, even if it's like oh my gosh. What are we going to have for dinner tonight? Or I'm hungry. Or okay, even that.  06:48 - Lau (Host) Okay, it's a total stream of consciousness. They used to use this in psychotherapy, where you would speak it out loud, but I like the privacy of being able to write it because you're not necessarily sharing it with anyone, absolutely Unless you choose to. It's really for your own purpose of writing everything out, so it might look like oh, I'm hot right now and I need a banana and that coffee hurts me. And he sucked. And why did he break?  07:12 - Anne (Host) up with me and I don't have money for a microphone. I need a banana. I need a banana right now.  07:18 - Lau (Host) Right, but see, notice that banana jumped out at you. That may be my next creative idea about the banana, about the banana.  07:26 - Anne (Host) I love it. No, I love that. Okay, and so after six minutes, then what happens? We've got a bunch of writings on our paper.  07:32 - Lau (Host) Well, that's up to us how we want to facilitate that. We can either leave it alone, put it in our corner where we put our writing and just feel like we've been drained a little bit, we've been fungshuated a little bit, or we can look at that in my coaching. I'll look at that a lot, circle and have people pick out yes. Emphasize the words, the ideas that resonate to them in that moment.  07:54 - Anne (Host) I love that.  07:55 - Lau (Host) And usually there's a couple in there. I love that. Usually there's like hate my mother oh, that's interesting. Hate your mother Okay. So let's look at that right. And then that can go in many, many directions. It could be anything. It could be comedy, sure. It could be absurd. It could be not even a reality in your mind. It could be a podcast on your mother Right. It could be something. It could be the evolution of a podcast on your mother.  08:17 - Anne (Host) It could be a film.  08:18 - Lau (Host) I saw that was called Hate my Mother, and I can't get it out of my head because I love how they shot something or I love the sound of the film.  08:26 - Anne (Host) See, as you go deeper into that, right, did you love about it? It sparked something creative, like you could do this. Yes, or we should do something like this, or, you know, it would be cool if this were developed. I have so many good ideas. How many times bosses out there have you had an idea and you're like, oh man, or you'll see a new thing that comes out, a new gadget, and you'd be like man, I had that idea, that was my idea, like years ago, right, and we never really kind of took action on it. And a lot of times it's because it is something new.  08:56 There's not a lot of things out there to reference it. We don't know quite how to wrap our heads around it. We don't know how to get started, we don't know how to maybe put it into action. And I'll tell you what. I think that those circled words or whatever those things that are in your brain. You can then start to say, all right, how can I make this happen?  09:15 And if this is going to be something, hopefully it's something that will move you ahead in your business. And I'm a big believer that if you're moving ahead in your personal development, you're also moving ahead in your business Because, again, our business is so much connected to who we are and ourselves and so really that can be motivational to really moving forward. So, yeah, you've got those ideas. Now what is it going to take to put those ideas in motion? What is it going to take? And a lot of times people might say, well, money, okay, all right, money might be what you consider to be your barrier, right, but we can figure out what are ways to overcome that barrier of money. How can we make more money? How can we put some money aside every month to be able to continually add to the budget to make this happen?  10:01 - Lau (Host) Mm-hmm. I also find, annie, that when you write something down, it becomes more real when you pull it out of your head. I agree it's not real in your head. I mean just because this is what neurosurgeon had famous talks. Just because you're thinking it doesn't mean it's real. It doesn't mean it's true right, like I need to hear that from a neurosurgeon. But it's true because when I think it, I think that it's actually true.  10:24 But when I put it on paper, all of a sudden I can clean that shop, I can decipher it differently, like what I want to be tackling, what I don't want to be tackling, right. So when I tackle it, when I say I'm gonna emphasize that I'm gonna tackle that I and this is just my process I like to start sharing that with confidence. I like to start coming together and colLauborating and brainstorming before I even get to money and budgets and all that stuff. I like to come with someone and say am I crazy? Am I sane? Is this worth time? What do you think? And if I hear this common response of ooh, that's interesting, yeah, that's cool.  11:00 - Anne (Host) It inspires me, or would you buy this, or would this be something that you would like, or that kind of thing?  11:06 - Lau (Host) Absolutely, absolutely cuz it's not real yet in my mind it's not even real if I believe in it yet. I want to see what our community response is. I don't share it with a million people, but I share with a few confidants to see what their gauges. I'm gonna tell you.  11:19 - Anne (Host) For years now for oh gosh, probably 15 years I have had a business mentor, somebody that I meet with, and I used to meet with her a whole lot more when I was first Initially starting in the business. But we could brainstorm together right, how can I grow my business, what do I see for myself in the future and what does it gonna take to get there? And we still do that to this day. It was, again, outside of my account and I always love my account, but one of the best investments I ever made in my business was hiring her to be that and she's not necessarily in the business, right, so somebody that can help me to figure out. Okay, what's new? Right, and we actively talk about things at the end of the year or at the beginning of the year like what's new. But I think, more importantly, it's not just end of year, beginning of year, it is every month. Right, I have a standing appointment with her every month and we talk about okay, what are we gonna do now? What are we heading towards? What are we evolving towards? And we talk about having a pLaun B for your business or a parallel paths of passive income. I love that parallel path of passive income. We've got a lot of peas in there, and good thing I'm not too close to my mic, but those things are always Evolved and developed during those monthly meetings.  12:29 Now I think it's something that you can absolutely start every month yourself or put yourself on.  12:34 I think every month is good to be able to come up with new ideas, come up with new things to try. It doesn't have to be an entirely new idea, but it can be a new offshoot Based upon, let's say, a long-term goal you have of oh, I want to be able to do animation, and so that may be a long term goal. So then, what's a new goal for next month? Well, let's decide on a coach, right, let's start working with a coach. Let's call a series of coaches and let's see who I click with, right, and then let's do one session with each coach and then really find out who I jive, who I meld with, and then we can then start training. So it can be something new every single month, and I think that really helps you to gosh. Stagnation for me is the worst. That is when I think nothing moves forward. Their businesses don't move forward, and then people end up maybe not being in business anymore, or quitting or being discouraged.  13:27 - Lau (Host) Exactly that's when you start getting down on yourself and you become a saboteur and you sabotage things. So yes, I'm all for that, and I'll even say to piggyback onto that find groups or find specific moments of events that you can sit in on or be a part of that. You can conjure ideas up as you listen to the group. Be careful of not spending your whole time, your whole week, in groups, because then that can confuse you because you're going to hear a lot of ideas and a lot of different thoughts.  13:55 A lot of opinions, but pick and choose yeah, pick and choose your group really, really well and wisely, so that what you hear, you know, is coming from a very high level and that will help inspire ideas. That, oh, I never thought of that. I never thought that they would view me in that way. I never thought of that kind of project that can be an inspirational force as well.  14:14 - Anne (Host) Now there can be times when I feel like you can have so many ideas that it's overwhelming right, and then it's like no ideas at all get developed right.  14:22 So you want to be careful of overwhelming yourself with new ideas, and I'm going to say that goals are wonderful.  14:28 I'm thinking ideas, they evolve into goals.  14:30 But I think ideas are wonderful because it's just a great like inspirational spot to start from and then I think it can turn into a goal based upon the market, based upon realism, based upon okay, I've got an idea for an extension of my business, but then maybe when you talk it over with some people, you find that maybe there isn't a ton of demand out there for it, because it can be a cool idea, but in order to turn a profit, it has to appeal to other people too. So there's got to be time spent in researching those ideas to make sure. Are you going to spend the time and effort in developing them further? And so try not to overwhelm. I love that you said be careful with being part of too many accountability groups or too many groups, because, yes, you can get too many opinions, you can get too many ideas. Here you should do it this way. Here you should work with this coach, here you should get this demo and then you're confused and then you're like, oh God, I just don't even know what to do.  15:26 I think, honestly, if we sit down, I love the brain dump on the paper. I think that is really amazing because that is starting with you. It's starting with your desires, your passions, whatever you're feeling, and I feel like, rather than somebody telling you this is what you should do, here's what you have a gut feeling about. I'm a big believer in your gut right. This is what I'm passionate about, and if you're passionate about it, you're going to have the motivation to go and get it.  15:52 - Lau (Host) Yes, and here's a role pLauy for you. I do this with myself all the time and it makes me feel so good, something neutralizing about it. I'll refer to myself as a creative agency or the idea person of an advertising agency. Those are the people who would sit around drinking soda, hitting hoops in their offices and just shooting the Dick Van Dyke ideas all night long.  16:17 - Intro (Announcement) Absolutely.  16:18 - Lau (Host) Being unafraid to do that, but I would structure it. I would say, okay, we can do this day and night. I know I can do a day and night structure. Say, listen, one week out of the month or three days out of the month are my idea days. Those are days that I'm brain dumping. I'm talking to people, I'm sitting in on groups and I'm coming up with my top three prioritized ideas so that it doesn't become but I have 50. What do I do with the 50?  16:43 No, let me see if I can come up with three and then choose the one that I actually might want to take action on so that I'm structuring my time and I'm structuring through priority as well, and then I'm also giving a deadline too and saying if this doesn't materialize in three months in some real way, I'm going to shelf it until Lauter.  17:03 - Anne (Host) I like that I kind of reLaute it to when people come to me and they say, well, I don't know what genre I should study voiceover, and we'll talk about okay. So what do you do now? Do you have a corporate job? Are you an actor? Do you have a side hustle? However, that is, and a lot of times it'll come down to okay, it'll be easy for you to step into this genre because you've got experience in it. Let's say I'm talking to a teacher. I'm like well, look, you already teach. You already have a concept of what it takes to be a good teacher. So stepping into the e-learning genre might work really well for you. However, you might have another loftier idea that you want to get into animation, right, Well, you can develop the one that you step into a little bit easier so that that will help you to then make some money while you're also pursuing the other goal, and I think that that usually works out really well.  17:49 And I like to equate the whole doing something new and the inspiration to my demo creation process, because for every student right, that end goal of a demo to me is a creative process. It is a creation, it's a song, it is something that is completely unique for each and every student, and for me the process is the same. To get there, there's a lot of work that is involved, but there's a lot of time where, yeah, I sit there and throw the crumpled paper into the basket because there's the creative inspiration that's happening to really just bring it all together and to make it amazing, and so I can really appreciate that part. And each and every time and each and every demo becomes like one of those new things that I'm accomplishing, and I cannot tell you how satisfying that is, because at the end, I'm like yes.  18:39 And I can see it. When I'm getting towards the end of creating the demo for the student, I'm like, oh, oh, oh, it's coming together. It's oh my God, yes, and now I'm going to do that. Oh, yes, oh, now, okay, now I'm seeing it come together and that, to me, is exhiLaurating. It's exhiLaurating.  18:53 It's kind of like the way I attribute starting something new in your business. Right, you get that idea, you're like this could be really cool and now, how am I going to get there? And then you do steps to work to get there, to get there, to get there, you sit there, you shoot a few crumpled pieces of paper and you think about it.  19:08 You sleep on it and then the next morning you get up and you go oh, let me try that Right. And then, when it starts to come together, that's the most amazing thing.  19:17 - Lau (Host) See, that's really the thing, because I find that, with creatives, one of the sticking points for most creatives, no matter how successful they are, is the execution of things. It's getting through what I call the theater days technical rehearsal.  19:31 That's the worst, dirtiest, muddiest, ugliest, disgusting. Like what have we worked on? It looks like yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, and then it just comes together, right. So you have to be able in your business, you can see it right. Yeah, you have to be able to move through that disgusting kind of uncomfortable kind of like, but I worked on this for months. Why does it look this way or feel this way? Right, I was going to give another tip too, annie. I was thinking you know, if you get together with that confidant, with that person, with that creative buddy, make use of that time by doing a structured business improv with them saying I'm going to take 20 minutes with you, 30 minutes, here's my goal. If you want to work on yours, work on yours. But I want to talk out. I want to talk out this idea I have, that I'm looking to execute, and you ask me questions and you shoot, you fire, you do things to make me think about it and give you more real response.  20:25 Cause it takes it off the paper and makes it even more real when you have to speak about it to someone.  20:31 - Anne (Host) Absolutely, absolutely. I mean it's not just on the paper and you looking at it, going okay, and then you don't look at the paper. That's kind of like when you do write things down right and you have goals. I'm a big believer in putting them somewhere where you can keep looking at them. I mean, they can't just stick in your brain.  20:46 If they stick in your brain. It's easy for them to just, oh, I lost it when to go and you can forget about it. But having those in front of you and also talking it out with somebody, like I said, when I come back to meet with my business mentor in another month, she'll be saying to me okay, so what did you do about this? Or how are we moving on? And I'm in the process of that right now. I'm making a shift to another cool part of the business that I want to open and I don't quite know what I'm doing, and it's one of those things where it's going to take me some time. But it's okay, I'm patient with myself because it's going to be kind of a cool path that I've not explored before.  21:20 - Lau (Host) So I'm patient with myself.  21:22 - Anne (Host) So I think you need to be patient with yourself. So many of us are not patient when it comes to oh my God, I want to be a voiceover actor and how come I'm not making money. All of a sudden, it becomes like well, okay. And the same thing with marketing. I'll tell you, I have people that we offer the boss. Bless. That we've talked about multiple times and and I always talked to people about direct marketing right, marketing yourself is one thing. Again, you're putting things out into the universe and again, when are you going to be able to collect on them? So I made an investment. It could be a financial investment, a time investment, whatever that is Well, all of a sudden. Well, it's been three months, why haven't I gotten anything? It's been 12 months, why haven't I gotten anything? And again, one of those things we know, I mean Lauw. We've talked about this. I did an audition two years ago and all of a sudden, I got a contact by the casting director saying hey, we think your voice would be great for this.  22:14 The same thing for your ideas, right your ideas to develop. Just don't give up and be patient. It is one of those things You're marketing. Direct marketing is huge in that convincing an actor to spend a certain amount of money or invest money on a reguLaur basis for marketing is, gosh, pretty much close to impossible, and I know you know that right. Everybody's like I don't have the money, I'm broke, I'm not getting a return on my investment. People are so quick to say that I am not getting a return on my investment. But well, they have to think about.  22:43 - Lau (Host) Are they coming from a full, rich, abundant pLauce? Are they coming from a cheap, overly frugal, not willing to invest pLauce? Because people want to invest in you if they see that you're willing to invest in yourself first. So in essence, you are the proof of concept If you're willing to invest, then you give someone else permission to invest in you, so that abundant versus a fearful, cheap pLauce is really, really important. There's one other thing I was going to say, annie too. Now, maybe this is pushing it a little too far, but I'm that kind of gal If you want to start something new, create something real. Upfront. I'll give you an idea. I used to teach in a very competitive entrepreneurial program in a business college and in the freshman year think about this, 18 years old the project was they take the whole first year, annie. They would create in teams a product that at the end of the year they pitch in a real way at the end of the year right, so it was whatever, it was a shirt a clock, this or that.  23:44 I never forgot, 18, 19 years old. I never forgot because they said we don't care if you make money or not. This is about making money. This is about you learning that when you create a process, there has to be something real and executionary about it, and something that you perform. It's performative. It's not in your head. So at the end of the year, they had to physically manufacture the product Sure absolutely.  24:06 Yeah, and then they'd have to pitch it to see if they could get money, I love that love. I think here's the thought. Here's the thought. We create something, whatever it is, it could be anything. Create something that is a sticker of it that makes it real. So, for instance, let's say you have an idea for a new service in your business, or I have an idea for a business, create a logo, pay money for that logo. It could be 50 bucks, it could be 200, whatever, but it becomes real in a different way.  24:35 - Anne (Host) Absolutely, I love that you said that because, honestly, like when I worked at the academies the Bergen academies, I mean every student had a year long project, literally where they formed a company, they created a product and they actually were all part of here's the marketing department.  24:48 Here's the engineering department and honestly, it gave them a reason to learn engineering. It gave them a reason to learn marketing. It gave them a reason to learn SAP software. It gave them a reason to learn they just had to create the prototype and then they had to, like, market it and sell it, and then they had to present it. And we're talking about ninth graders. Okay, back in the day. That's amazing. Now, if you start them at ninth grade thinking in that way, thinking in that entrepreneurial, corporate way, where they ultimately have to create something and then present it, they end up learning all of the things they need to learn in order to accomplish that goal, and that becomes a really wonderful education for the students as well, as I cannot tell you how many of those students are blossoming like amazing successes today.  25:34 - Lau (Host) Amazing.  25:35 - Anne (Host) They started off early knowing that and doing that, and so I think that's a wonderful idea for you bosses out there to go and create something, make your initial investment, something that doesn't have to take like a billion dolLaurs. No, but something that represents that and is part of your goal to getting there, and I think that that is amazing.  25:54 - Lau (Host) If someone says but Anne, I'm worried. What if I spend $100 on this and I don't like the way it looks or it doesn't come out the way I want? Here's my answer to that. You made an investment in your education, absolutely so. It's not the logo that you created, it's the educational process to know what do you want at the end of the day to represent your company. You don't know until it's actually happening. It can't sit in your head and come to perfection. It's got to be that like, done, done, done every moment in your process. Done. It's not about perfection, it's about done. Now move on. What did I learn?  26:30 - Anne (Host) Right, I'm going to tie that to the logo to even. You know, go further website, start a website. And so many people are like, yeah, but I shouldn't start it yet until I know what my brand is. Okay, yeah, here's a little piece of advice. Your brand evolves right. It's not like your website can't be changed.  26:42 It's not like your logo can't be changed or evolve along with you. As a matter of fact, I just went to the Way Back archive and I saw my very first website where I was Anne Speak. By the way, you guys can look at that, Anne Speak.  26:52 - Intro (Announcement) A&E Speak.  26:54 - Anne (Host) And you'll see that my logo was a microphone, right, with little flourishing things coming out of it, because I love flourishes right. And the thing is is that I've evolved, I mean, and our business has evolved, and so it's okay. Make that investment, the education you're going to get by hiring somebody to create a logo, forcing yourself to think about who am I, what does my logo represent? Or what does my website represent, what are my colors, what is my brand that education is going to be invaluable. Yes, love, what a wonderful conversation Yet again.  27:21 I say this at the end of every podcast. It doesn't seem like.  27:24 - Intro (Announcement) Anne is like a broken record but honestly we have such great conversations.  27:29 - Anne (Host) And you know what I just love, love, love having you as my co-host, and bosses love you too, and we love the bosses. And so, with that in mind, bosses, I want you to take a moment and imagine a world full of passionate and powered, diverse individuals, like we are, but we're giving collectively and intentionally to create the world that we want to see. You can make a difference. Visit 100voiceshoocareorg to learn more, and big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. You, too, can connect and network like bosses. Find out more at IPDTLcom. Have an amazing week, guys, and go start something new. We'll see you next week. See you next week. Bye.  28:09 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, Anne Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.  28:31 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VO Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I'm your host, anne Gangusa, along with my very awesome, amazing lost co-host, Lauw Laupita. Hello, happy Saturday. Uh oh.  28:57 - Lau (Host) Uh oh, Lauw, where'd you go? Lauw, you're frozen. I know you were frozen. So we lost transmission for a second Transmission lost. It might have been lost Alright.  29:06 - Anne (Host) Yes, it might have been lost. Alright, let's try that one more time. I'm going to stop it and pause for a bit.
Coping Strategies
Dec 26 2023
Coping Strategies
Get ready to redefine your understanding of the voiceover industry as host Anne Ganguzza and special guest co-host Tom Deere, pull back the curtain on the reality of the business and its inherent struggles. We dive deep into the pivotal SAG-AFTRA strike and how it's much more than just a Hollywood issue. It isn't about the glitz and glamour - it's about the hard truth of what it means to be a part of this industry, as a union or non-union voice actor. We'll tackle the misconception that all actors are high earners and shine a spotlight on the majority who are fighting for fair pay and intellectual property protection, especially with the advent of AI technology. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss a VO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey, hey everyone. Welcome to the VO Boss Podcast and the Real Bosses series. I'm your host, Ann Gangusa, here with special guest co-host Mr Tom DHeere. Hello, Tom.  00:31 - Tom (Co-host) Hello Ann, so great to see you.  00:33 - Anne (Host) Yes, wonderful to be chatting with you again and you know, at the time of this recording we just had kind of a major industry event happen the SAG After Strike ended and I thought it would be a good time to talk about external factors that affect our industry and how we can prepare ourselves as bosses to really handle events that happen like that, that are sometimes not even within our control, and what do we do to sustain our businesses.  01:04 - Tom (Co-host) Yes, absolutely Off the top of my head. Keeping up with industry trends is extremely important, which is why, being subscribed to Hollywood Reporter, variety, backstage Magazine publications like that, our friend John Florian's VO Extra, which is sort of an online magazine just being aware of what's going on in the industry, because seeing the highlights on the nightly news can only get you so far, absolutely. Because just a little B-roll and a little this, that and the other thing is see Fran Drescher for five seconds blah and then like going on to the next subject.  01:36 - Anne (Host) Well, yeah, and we should know that Fran Drescher what her role.  01:39 - Tom (Co-host) Yes, as president of SAG After.  01:42 - Anne (Host) Yeah, know who the people are, know how it's impacting the industry and even if you are not a member, that was the whole thing. Even if you were not a member of SAG After and you felt that it didn't affect you, in reality it affected our entire industry as they were vying for fair pay and rights for creatives and actors and voice actors in regards to synthetic voices and AI out there Absolutely and streaming.  02:09 - Tom (Co-host) And streaming. Yeah, everything that SAG After does, all of their collectively bargained agreements and the rate structures and the minimums and all of that stuff, all of that has obviously a major impact on all the SAG After members. But it also has a huge effect on the non-union members, because non-union voice actors most tend to use SAG After CBAs collectively bargained agreements, if not a baseline, a guideline as to, in generally, how genres of voiceover charge, both in the structure of it and then the actual dollars and cents of it, and it will trickle down into the non-union world directly and indirectly. So, yeah, absolutely Everything affects everything in our industry.  02:48 - Anne (Host) And it's something to consider again I say this over and over again that it absolutely affects even though, as you mentioned, if you're not even a member, it affects the industry. It affects the perception of creatives and their value and their worth, and one of the reasons why we are in this as a business is to make money. In order to sustain our businesses and to do what we love for a living, we need to make money and we need to be able to pay the bills. We need to be able to have essential things like healthcare and, even if you're not a member of the union the perception of the market who has services or purchases our voice or hires us and pays us money. It's very important that that perception is one of value and one of worth, so that we can have this as a career, and have it as a sustainable career, so that we can survive.  03:44 - Tom (Co-host) It's interesting because most of the time when you watch the news or you're talking to people in other industries and there's a strike of some kind, it's usually we just want more money and then very things here and there. What was interesting about the SAG After Strike is that it was obviously nationally. Everybody was watching what was going on, because everybody who watches movies and television shows and streaming are impacted by this. This fall lineup and then in the spring we're really going to be feeling it because it's going to be rerun city. But what was interesting about this is that, yes, they wanted like a 7% increase and they wanted certain things, but the fact that they were talking about protection of our livelihood.  04:26 Ai has the potential to take away our intellectual property, our IP, for on camera actors for their image, voice actors for their voice and then in other industries, musicians for their music, artists for their art, writers for their writing those five image, voice, music, art and writing. Ai is causing a lot of disruption, some of it in a good way, but most of it in a not good way, because of lack of understanding of it, lack of regulation and oversight on a federal level, and which was a big part of the SAG After Strike is that AI wasn't really taken into consideration in any of the collectively bargained agreements, so all of that needs to get back in there to protect actors from their IP being stolen. I think a lot of people didn't understand that if you're an extra and you get scanned and you get paid one fee and then they use you your likeness forever in a movie you just destroyed your extra career and so on and so on and so forth.  05:26 So what was going on with AI in many ways is an existential threat to voice actors, so that's a big part of what this wasn't just about. Oh, those actors, they just want more money to be, to be movie stars. No, this was. If we don't do something about this, we won't be able to act anymore.  05:40 - Anne (Host) Well, yeah, and it brought awareness, I think, to the general public about our careers and the perception that, oh, they're just celebrities and more money and they're greedy. In reality, what was the percentage of people that make enough money, that are the high earners? There are only like 1% of actors in the union, and so the rest of them, the rest of us, the struggling actors, the starving artists, so to speak this is something that I think really was a good thing, so that we could have artists still pursuing this career feeling like, oh, I can possibly make it, I can possibly sustain this as a career, and so I think that's a good thing. Otherwise, you just end up with maybe just the high paid, high earning actors.  06:27 And what happens to the creative process? What happens to movies, what happens to voice, what happens to music, what happens to the writing, when you just don't have the wide I would say broad spectrum of people vying to do this because they're passionate and they love it and they're good at it, but yet they need to be able to make a living at it. So, I think, bringing public awareness to the craft, public awareness of just how much that creatives are dependent upon, especially I go back to the pandemic. When? What do we do during the pandemic?  07:02 We watch streaming, we watched movies, we listen to music and all of that was so important to help keep our I guess I want to say our- spirit and our sanity and our mental health that really was something that was crucial, I think, and of course, it goes back to support the arts, support the arts and our educational institutions, and really I think that this was just another wonderful example of bringing public awareness to what it is that we do and appreciation to it, yeah, I have a story with that in mind.  07:34 - Tom (Co-host) Just a week or two ago I live here in Midtown Manhattan. I went around the corner to the grocery store and I see some SAG Afterhab members striking and I noticed that the strike captain was an old friend of mine I've been friends with her for 30 years and actors hey, how are you doing? And we were talking and she explained to me that the reason why she's been able to keep her SAG After Health and pension benefits for the past few years is because of extra work. Not because starring or a supporting role or some Netflix thing, it was just being a New York working actor and just doing extra work. And she also does theater and other things. But like I don't think a lot of people realize that, just that relatively innocuous, almost unseen extra work pays her medical bills and goes towards her retirement. Because that's what the strike was about. It wasn't about the big movie stars. They're fine.  08:23 I mean protecting their intellectual property from predatory AI practices is obviously a very big deal, and we're seeing deep fakes and all that stuff all the time and video game actors getting their voices harvested. But yeah, this is a blue collar strike if that makes sense Not unlike the auto worker strike that has been recently. I think it's mostly over now, but yeah, it's not unlike that. It wasn't about the movie stars, yeah.  08:44 - Anne (Host) And during the strike, because it was a it was a fairly lengthy strike I know that there was lots of speculation. You know Hollywood is dead, that kind of stuff or is that going to happen? And in reality, I mean understanding the people that hire us and pay us for our services and understanding like what it is that we deserve as a contributing asset to their products, to large streaming companies. Of course, without movies and actors and actresses, the streaming companies won't have anything to stream. And so I think also it brought to life a little more of an understanding of corporate mentality and how it can be, and it was kind of a wake up call, I think, to a lot of voice actors understanding that there is a beast out there that ultimately, when you are contributing to a product with your voice or with your likeness or with your music or whatever that is, that there is a fair way to be compensated for that and that it should be compensated. And I think that that was a major win for the union and for us as an industry.  09:50 - Tom (Co-host) Absolutely. Sometimes it's hard to understand, to reconcile the fact that we're trying to be expressive artists but at the same time, we have volunteered to be commoditized. You know what I mean. You're commoditized for how you look, you're commoditized for how you sound, and so there's a literal contract and a social contract which is okay, based on how you sound, we will give you this money. We understand that.  10:11 Your training, your experience, your talent, all of those things the aggregate of that is you being able to do this Metro PCS commercial or be in this video game or narrate this audio book. So it's hard to sometimes separate the art from the commerce part of it. I like talking for money, but I'm an artist too and my AI voice is part of the commoditization. Commerce part over here. And then I go over here and I'm narrating this audio book or I'm being Inspector Gadget or I'm doing that sort of thing. It's complicated. It's very, very complicated. I think that the SAG After Strike brought to the surface exactly how complicated our industry is, and it's not just a matter of pretty face movie money or pretty voice radio spot money.  10:56 There's just a lot more to it, and our IP is what we are.  11:01 - Anne (Host) Exactly, that is who we are.  11:02 - Tom (Co-host) I mean, that is who we are and what we are.  11:04 - Anne (Host) Yeah, our product is our voice and who we are, and that really is different from a product. Here's my physical product and so protecting our personal product, I think, becomes paramount. In doing that Now, when the strike was happening, there was, I would say, a definite impact to the market, to the voice over market in certain genres, specifically broadcast, and I think there was a lot of people who originally purchased likeness, voice music that were really like, ooh, we're going to step back to see what happens, to see how this plays out. So, tom, what are your recommendations for, let's say, anybody in the creative industry when these things happen? Because I'm not going to say that every strike is different, but there are things that happen in industries that we really don't have a lot of control over, for example, the synthetic voice. Right, we don't have control over technology that's coming.  12:00 So, what do you suggest to voice actors and creatives when something impacts the industry, like this how to survive and how to maintain? What sort of tips or tricks do you have to encourage their business to continue growing? Or smart strategies to maybe pick alternate paths?  12:19 - Tom (Co-host) Well, in addition to my suggestion that I said earlier about reading the trades and understanding what's going on and I was witnessing this directly throughout the strike on social media there was a lot of hysteria, there was a lot of fear, there was a lot of judgment on various sizes, and you could see who didn't really understand what was going on, both union and non-union voice actors.  12:41 Why it was happening and then they were just putting everybody in a bucket and labeling that bucket, so it definitely had a cultural and psychics not the right word but a psychological impact. So one of my biggest tips is yes, the AI and other things and what the AMPTP were doing and their offers was posing, in various ways, existential threats to our industry. However, you need to keep your eyes open, you need to remain objective, you need to collect facts and you need to make thoughtful, informed decisions about what to do to move your business forward.  13:20 - Anne (Host) Yes, amen, amen. That was just wonderful advice. Yes, absolutely Education. Education is so, so important. I say it Gosh. I feel like I say it almost every podcast Like what do we do? How do we handle things? Educate yourself, educate yourself.  13:35 - Tom (Co-host) And be objective whilst educating yourself. Don't prejudge the information that you're getting. Don't bias yourself while you're doing your research by listening to the loudest jerk in the Facebook group you know, or listening to your own FOMO imposter syndrome whatever's going on in your head that could get in your way.  13:54 - Anne (Host) It's always sensible to have a plan B. We've spoken about this briefly before, but, like having multiple income paths, and passive income paths too. I think I'm a big fan of passive income.  14:06 I love having passive income and something that can help sustain you while maybe things are slow in your business and the market is reacting Again. We are slaves to the market in reality. If people don't value our product, they are not going to purchase our products. So therefore, we need to keep our eyes on the market and find out how we can provide a valuable product.  14:28 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah, developing voiceover adjacent skills, I think, is a really good way to do it. A lot of people develop their audio engineering skills because to be an effective voice actor, especially in the 21st century, you need to be competent when it comes to recording, editing and delivering audio files. Then there's other things that people do virtual assistants, proofreaders, translators if you're a bilingual voice talent virtual assistants, social media managers.  14:56 So I mean what I just named five or six or seven things. So like, if you're early in your voiceover journey and you want to do this for the long run but you still need to sustain yourself and you maybe don't want to or can't, for whatever reason, have that full-time job, developing skills that will ultimately help you and complement and enhance your voiceover career and make money at at the same time can be a really great way to go.  15:18 - Anne (Host) And I always recommend that. I think we all bring our real world experience to the voiceover career. Like, I mean, I had a previous experience in teaching and in engineering and so those things and working in the healthcare industry, so those things I could bring to my voiceover career. But I could also consult, I could also continue to do those things, and I don't think there's anything shameful in pursuing multiple paths for generating income, especially when this is such an entrepreneurial endeavor. I mean, it is one of the things that most people, if they come from the corporate world, they're just used to I'm going to work and I'm going to get paid. Well, this is a completely different flip the switch kind of thing where, oh gosh, where's my next job coming from? That's where, I think, a lot of people who are not necessarily prepared or have never experienced being an entrepreneur before or being a business owner before this is new to them.  16:14 So you need to really prepare yourself as much as you possibly can for fluctuations in the market.  16:20 - Tom (Co-host) One thing I teach my students is that your last gig isn't necessarily your lowest paying gig and your next gig isn't necessarily your highest paying gig, because people think it's this like vertical, incrementally thing that next big gig will be bigger, bigger, more money, bigger, bigger, more money, and that is not remotely true.  16:39 - Anne (Host) And I will ultimately make six figures. You know that I feel like they have climbed. I've made six figures. Now I'm going to make six figures for the rest of my career. That doesn't always happen. That does not always happen Again. Fluctuations in the market. There's a lot of factors in play. What are you investing in? What money is going out versus what money is coming in?  16:56 - Tom (Co-host) Also, is your voice trending, yeah?  16:58 - Anne (Host) Yeah, absolutely.  16:59 - Tom (Co-host) Oh gosh, yeah, I would like to think you're getting better and better at your craft, but if your voice becomes less and less demand I mean all the guys that sound like this when, 25 years ago, when I decided I wanted to be a voice actor and I was like hi, I want to be a voice actor. You know what I mean and you know all these basic bearded guys with Hawaiian shirts and you know what I mean.  17:19 And now I mean is there still a demand for that kind of voice actor? Yes, exponentially less of a demand for that type of voice actor. But if you didn't develop your abilities as a storyteller? And develop your genre awareness and the ability to do different things than just this one announcer read, then your income will go down.  17:38 - Anne (Host) I talked about this with Law in a previous episode about casting. When it comes down to demographics, right the company's product that they want to reach a particular demographic. So it may not be that you didn't perform or you didn't nail that audition. It just might be that you're in the wrong demographic for the effective sale. I mean, if they're targeting a younger audience and you have a more mature voice, that may not make sense and vice versa. So again, it really it has to do with understanding the market and understanding where your product fits in that market. I cannot stress that enough. I mean that just to me is like you must think of that.  18:17 - Tom (Co-host) And your product will change.  18:18 - Anne (Host) Yes, exactly. And so if you have, let's say, a mature voice right, understand where you can fit in the industry so that you can get in front of people who are going to purchase that sound, that more mature voice, versus, let's say, I have a really young, millennial voice, or I have maybe a voice that is very trending with, let's say, non-binary and other types of genres that people are looking to fill in those voids. So, and don't be put off or set back or feel like, oh my goodness, I don't know if I'm going to be successful in this industry. You just have to find your niche.  18:55 - Tom (Co-host) Yes, let the industry tell you. Listen to the industry. People come in oh, I want to do this, I want to sound like that. Sometimes that works, but usually it's watch your auditions. If you're on pay to plays, who's liking your auditions? Why are they liking your auditions? What are the keywords in those casting notices that you keep seeing over and over again? I did that exercise not too long ago and, for example, I found that my number one online casting site buzzword for me was upbeat.  19:21 I'm like oh because I kept getting booking and getting liking those it's like, oh okay, well then that's something I can put over here. But then I've also found out recently Ryan Reynolds is a keyword.  19:30 - Anne (Host) Oh yeah, I totally can hear that.  19:32 - Tom (Co-host) Yeah, that I've been getting. I literally just booked a commercial just last week because they wanted a Ryan Reynolds sound?  19:39 - Anne (Host) Absolutely, yeah, it's always good to know who your doppelganger is and who your sound of like is, and putting that as part of your marketing campaign can really help. Absolutely, seo keyword. Any other tips on what you can do when, let's say, the market is not necessarily looking for your particular product outside? Of education what else?  20:00 - Tom (Co-host) I was gonna say the easy one is get coaching. Talk to you, fabulous voiceover coach, but also talk to casting directors, talk to a Mary Lynn Wissner or someone else and say, okay, my sound seems to be out. Can you help me find a voice within my range and demographics that I can do and invest in some education, some training to kind of adapt, because your money voice isn't always gonna be your money voice? I know mine's definitely changed over the past few years. My Tom Plus has now gotten into more of this Ryan Reynolds, more sassy conversational kind of thing, and once I stopped fighting against that I started booking a lot more. Especially, I've been booking more commercial work.  20:42 Yes because I'm bringing a lot more just plain old Tom to it.  20:45 - Anne (Host) Well, isn't that funny Because?  20:47 as we progress and as my career advanced as well, becoming more of myself and understanding who I am and understanding my product and how I can bring more of who I am to the read always has gotten me more work. I mean it just progressively has gotten more work. So and again I say this on a lot of podcasts but it is so important more than ever now to be that actor, to bring your own unique point of view to the read, because that's what's gonna get you noticed and that's what's gonna get you hired.  21:16 - Tom (Co-host) As a demo producer, how many times have you worked with a student and you're talking before the demo record and they're just da-da-da, da-da-da-da, and you're like, okay, take one, and they go blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah like how many times does that happen?  21:28 - Anne (Host) Oh, yeah, a lot of times, a lot of times, and it doesn't take much to put you out of the moment, in the acting moment, and go into a read. It really doesn't, and sometimes it just takes a note or a loss of focus for like one second and it brings you right out of the read. So if you are not consistently in that scene, acting, reacting, doing that, you can just lose the read, which is why in long format, like narration stuff that I specialize in, a lot of corporate and e-learning to just lose your focus for even just a second can take you right out of that, and that's noticeable to the ear, it's noticeable to casting directors, but it's also noticeable to the people that are listening and the intended audience, which is something that you just don't want. So if the market is slow or you're wondering, what can I do?  22:14 Yeah, education and coaching. I think, and again, I say that as an educator, I say that as a coach, but not just because I'm a coach. I mean, really, what else is there when you want to refine and upgrade and everybody's always trying to improve their products, right? Any company is trying to create a better product and that is not just a one step one and done process. I mean, that is something that if you're a company that wants to remain competitive and have competitive products, then you will continually evolve and improve that product.  22:44 - Tom (Co-host) Yes, marketing is also the thing to do when things are slow, always, always, always. The more you can demonstrate your humanity when it's slow, just to let people know that you're still here, you're still working in the voiceover realms and, even though you may not have a big gig to talk about, always be demonstrating your value and your progress.  23:05 - Anne (Host) I attended this conference.  23:07 - Tom (Co-host) I just got out of a session with this coach. I had such a wonderful time. I learned so much. Those are the things that are part of your longterm investment in your social media strategy, your online presence, your search engine optimization, and for people to know that, no matter what's going on, you are consistently there, you are consistently positive, you are consistently learning and you are consistently growing, and that helps keep you top of mind.  23:29 - Anne (Host) Absolutely top of mind is important. Well, what a great discussion, Tom. I feel like we could talk about this all day.  23:35 - Tom (Co-host) We could.  23:35 - Anne (Host) But I want to keep this top of mind because I think it's important. Bosses, here is your chance to use your voice, not only to get hired, but to make an immediate difference in our world and give back to the communities that give to you. You can visit 100voiceshoocareorg to commit and big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. I love IPDTL. Ipdtl gives me connections with wonderful bosses like Tom Deere here and many, many other clients. You can find out more at ipdtocom. Bosses, have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. Bye.  24:10 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.
Money
Dec 19 2023
Money
Ready to confront the cold, hard truth about the financial investments necessary to forge a successful career in the voiceover industry? Tune into today's episode, where we pull back the curtain on the often glossed-over monetary aspects and break down the costs associated with making your voiceover dreams a reality. We tackle the burning question of how much it truly costs to get started in this competitive field, and underscore the commitment required to make it a sustainable career. Get ready for an honest exploration of the give and take required to make it in voiceover, including the virtue of frugality, the benefits of community involvement, and the necessity of budgeting for risks and technological advancements. Let's get real about the dolLaurs and sense of voiceover. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss a VO Boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VO Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss a VO Boss. Now let's welcome your host, anne Gangusa.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the VO Boss podcast and the Boss Superpower series. I'm here with my amazing boss co-host, la La Peters. Hey La, hey Annie, welcome back, I'm excited. Yay, oh La, let's talk this week about money, money, money, money, money money. How much does voiceover cost? Oh, you mean, I get that question. How much is it going to cost me? How much do I have to invest? How much does it cost? I think we should have a discussion on the financial side of things, because that's something that most people don't want to think about it. They don't want to talk about it A lot of times. They don't want to spend it or invest it. Yes, yes, yes.  01:09 - Lau (Co-host) I like to liken it to any other profession out there, and preferably the most expensive professions to get into. For instance, if I want to be a financial advisor and I'm going to go through college and then graduate school, and then I'm going to invest my money, my tuition, in my education, and then I'm going to invest my money to purchase my tools, then I'm going to invest money to get my either brick and mortar or online presence. Guess what? I've spent a lot of money for that type of profession, and not just a few hundred bucks.  01:44 - Anne (Host) No.  01:45 - Lau (Co-host) Not just a few thousand either.  01:47 - Intro (Announcement) Exactly, exactly.  01:49 - Lau (Co-host) I always set it up that way and just to give perspective to people that this is really a profession, it's a viable career. But also the truth is and I can say this because I live this myself it's a drop in the bucket compared to becoming a doctor or becoming a banker or becoming even SCPA a drop in the bucket.  02:12 So just to kind of keep that in mind up front. It's not an overnight success career. It's not a I don't have to spend any money but I can make a ton of money out of it. It's not that kind of career at all, and it's good we kind of put it out there, annie, and be honest about it, right?  02:30 - Anne (Host) Okay, so what are the popular topics to talk about in voiceover? Well, how can I be a character actor? How can I get my demo and start making money? But, in reality, all the other aspects of being a voice actor and having a business are going to require financial investment one way or the other, and we really shouldn't expect that it's going to be cheap. I don't have a lot of money, but I want to be a voice actor, so can you help me? Well, I think that we really just need to sit back and have a dose of reality where, as you mentioned before, voice acting is a career, and for many other careers, we invest our money. We've invested our money in education, we invest our money in inventory, in storefronts, in product, whatever that is. We invest our money, and the same is true for voiceover. And so if you are coming into voiceover without any money to spend, I think you need to rethink that decision.  03:31 - Lau (Co-host) Yeah, I would say that money should go along, in your mind, with the other types of investment that you're going to be giving to this Family time. What is the time investment? What are the sacrifices that you will be making in order to launch your career and keep it viable and keep it sustainable? I mean, what are you investing into this? How about just energy? How about talking about energy investment? It all goes along with your money. So don't think, oh, if I throw 50,000 at this, I'm going to be rich and famous. No, it's not just about money. It's about my level of commitment and what commitment actually means. Money symbolizes my commitment and it also is a monetary dispensation for someone to give me a service.  04:20 - Anne (Host) I love that you said, oh, if I throw $50,000 into this, because I'll tell you what not one person that has approached me in the last year or so, ever probably that it could cost up to that. But I'll tell you what, over the years, law I mean in reality. I mean there are thousands of dollars that are invested in my career, in my equipment, in my studio, in coaching, just in running the business. I mean absolutely, and I love that you just said that off the top because I think it will hit our bosses like a little bit of reality.  04:49 I mean, if any of you bosses that are out there have been listening to the VEOBOSS podcast, we've been going for seven years and so if you think about what have you really spent in seven years and you looked at your accounting, you looked at your books, I'd like to know what that number is, because 50,000 is actually small compared to what I've invested for equipment and websites and subscriptions and coaching and demos and conferences and all of these things that I have invested my money into.  05:17 That is really nothing. And so I really want you to kind of take a hard look at your numbers and I know a lot of people don't like to do that because it's scary. It brings, I think, a reality to people's lives. That voiceover isn't just this oh, I can do it from home and it's so simple and I don't have to invest anything. And I love how you also mentioned it really is a time commitment as well. It's a commitment to really make this a serious commitment and a serious career, because if you're not serious about it, well then I don't know how much money will you be making. You know?  05:55 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, and I know for a fact you and I come from the same background, the same training methodology and work ethic and generation that you come into it. Not every happening or event is a monetary compensation, this idea that, oh, if I spend time doing this or that, I'm gonna get paid for it. It's just not always true. There is a building block time and even when you've built your studio or you've built your company over five years or seven years, you're still wanting to get to the next level. Well, how do you get to the next level? Well, you are doing sacrifice all the time. Look at you and I, like you're doing this incredible podcast for seven years. I've been in it with you for a year and a half. Right, and one could say, well, we're not sitting here having dollars flying at our head on a Saturday afternoon for taking two, three hours of our time unpaid relatively unpaid to do this.  06:52 - Anne (Host) then you have to pay an engineer and an editor, whatever, so what's?  06:57 - Lau (Co-host) the return then? Well, the return becomes the belief system that what we're offering is educational value to our people we love and adore and care about our client base, our audience, new people coming in and that of course, to some degree you're going to close a number of new clients that come in that hear your project, but guess what? You may not.  07:20 - Intro (Announcement) And if you may not, if you may not.  07:22 - Lau (Co-host) That's the risk reward that you take in saying I'm going to take every Saturday to record, I'm going to pay that editor, no matter what, I'm going to hire that engineer, no matter what. It's that sense of jumping off the cliff and saying my career is worth doing, that I may not always see a dollar per dollar of time spent and energy spent, so it's not a tit for tat that way. I think too many people are looking at it in that way, like, well, what am I going to get paid for? Every single moment I work and think about this, I said, well, nothing. You're going to get paid in education, in value, in relationship, whatever. You're not going to always get the dollar bills. Baby, right, just remember that payment is not always about Money. It's about different value of forces in your life that come together that sustain a whole career. We don't want jobs, we want a career. Yeah.  08:20 - Anne (Host) And I think a lot of assumptions come from the fact if this is the first time you are getting into voice, acting and creating a business, it is all about creating a business, which is different than working for people, where you do tasks and then you get paid for that. When you are setting up and creating a business, there are investments that you need to make, and this is a completely different mindset than oh, okay, I did work and I expect money for it. Now you're going to have to put work in. You're going to also invest money. You're going to have to invest money into it. So most people they have a job. They're not investing money in that job, they're just receiving money. But here you have to understand that this is now something that will require an investment of your money and of your time and of your commitment really to make it work, and it's not just a one-time thing. I don't want people to think that as well.  09:11 It's not like oh, I can sink in $10,000 and then I'll have my career. No, that is something that you need to maintain. You need to continually invest and reinvest in that business to have growth, to have any kind of growth, and I think if you sat there with your business and never invested another cent in it, you're probably not going to have a business for very long. Right? I like to think of it as gambling.  09:35 - Lau (Co-host) It is a gamble. It's a gamble we can do the research, we can do our homework, we can make ourselves knowledgeable and we can hone our skills and talent, but it's still a gamble because you're dealing with a lot of variables that are not in your control. So I like to say, all right, if you have a pocket and let's say you're going to stash in, you know you're going to Vegas or something you're going to stash in $1,000 in that pocket on the left-hand side, that $1,000, I'm willing to spend and lose, because I know I'm going to Vegas and I know I'm gambling it and I know that there's a good chance the house will win and I'll lose it. Then in my other pocket I've got like $5,000, I'm not spending that, I'm saving that. I have that as a safety net, I have that as my backup, okay, for my life.  10:22 Let's say that and I'm not going to spend it unless I absolutely am up against a wall and would have to. So, from a gambling perspective, your business is one big gamble. Sure is, you know, sure is, and I'm only using $1,000 as just a number. It could be $100,000, but I'm not using $1,000 as a number. I know I'm spending that, will I get it back into my right pocket? Sure, that's the question, right? That's the gamble, right.  10:49 - Anne (Host) That's the gamble. That's the gamble, that's the gamble.  10:52 And that's where I think the investment in commitment right, commitment to making that business a success right Really comes into play as well, because it's not just a one-shot deal Let me just do this because I can do this from home. No, you're going to make an investment and, of course, we hope that, as bosses, you enjoy that investment or you're enjoying that creation of a business and also enjoying the performance aspect of your voice, acting career. So it's not just performance, it is business, probably more so almost, than performance. However, performance affects your product, right. So it then becomes a business because people are buying your product. Well then, you need to invest in your product. Your product would be your voice, that would be your coaching, that'll be your demos, that'll be your marketing, that'll be your website, anything that's going to get your product out in front of prospective clients. And again, that becomes investment and money that needs to be spent by you.  11:48 I'm not quite sure where it's coming from If it doesn't come. Oh, maybe it could come from other people. If you're lucky enough to have somebody invest in your business, that is wonderful, but it's still going to take some cold, hard cash and a lot of you that are just getting into this need to take a look at your investments and need to start tracking your finances. And again, I've always said that the best thing that I've always ever done for my business was to hire an accountant to help me do that on a day to day basis. So every bit of money that goes out is accounted for and all the money that comes in is accounted for, so I can do a P&L statement and then find out how is my business doing. Do I need to cut back spending on certain things? Do I need to? Maybe I don't need that new mic, even though I might want it.  12:34 You don't need that other color pair of headphones, although that's an investment.  12:38 - Lau (Co-host) I did you one better, annie, I actually married one.  12:44 - Anne (Host) There you go, but you got to have a great accountant.  12:46 - Lau (Co-host) An in-house accountant on your side. You have to have it, it's so important to say have a great attorney, have a great doctor have a great accountant.  12:55 It's really important, I would say. Wouldn't you say it's fair to to say that every year of your business, for however long you own your business, you are going to have fixed costs always and you are going to have variable costs always. And to just kind of understand the difference between the two, so that I hear a lot of talent get very upset about the fact that their fixed costs are not doable for them. And I said, well, I can't even talk about the variable cost to you yet, because you haven't understood and been honest about your mortgage or your rent or your food or your car, whatever that fixed every month cost is for you. That's unavoidable. You must deal with that.  13:40 Then you can deal with the microphones and the demos and all of that stuff and you're going to have a very peaceful state of mind to know the most important things are taken care of. Like you and I have a team, so we hire people all the time, so we have to be able to pay those people right, absolutely. So if we can't pay those people, then we can't talk about the upgrade of the microphone or taking a trip around the world or whatever, because we've got a certain fixed cost that we are responsible for and that's really the ownership of a business is really understanding what your financial, fiscal, health and responsibilities are of your business on a daily, weekly, monthly, yearly basis really are?  14:24 - Anne (Host) Absolutely, absolutely. It really comes down to knowing those numbers and then understanding are you able to handle those numbers? And if you cannot handle those numbers with the voice of a career, yet there's nothing wrong. We did a whole episode on side hustles. There is nothing wrong with a side hustle, or even a full-time job, until you can get yourself to the point where you are able to support those fixed costs on a voiceover income and that is getting increasingly difficult to do in these times, I'm going to say but not impossible, not impossible. Number one I'm encouraged by the strike being over and encouraged that I feel that there's now life being breathed back into the career and the recognition that we're getting to be compensated fairly for what we do, and so I'm very encouraged by that.  15:13 And I think that for a while there there was some people that were scared in the business that we didn't have the influx of newbies that we typically do for a few months because of it, and I think what's nice about it is that the cream rises to the top right, because it's so important now, more than ever that our product right is something viable and something amazing that people will pay us for, and so you must, for your business, make that investment.  15:40 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, you do. You know, one thing that comes to mind I had conversation with a couple of colleagues of mine recently kind of an argument, a friendly argument, about this and it kind of is all in this mix, annie, of what we're talking about, and that is because there is so much for free now. Everything is so much accessible on the internet for free right now. Sometimes talent can fall into the spiraling rabbit hole, slippery slope of I'm going to spend my whole day going to free webinars, free zooms, free this, free funnels, free that, free this, free that, and not get to my work, not get to actually my business.  16:17 And so I think that when it comes to how you're spending your money, how you're investing your money, again that goes directly with your time. Your time is valuable, time is money, time is money. So be very careful not to over satiate yourself with oh, I'll just sit and be a professional student and get knowledge all day long and do the, but not really get to the hard, dirty part of running the business. Right, I see that is a problem for a lot of people. They spend every day in accountability groups. They spend every day in webinars.  16:51 They spend every day because it's so easy, it's so accessible and it's kind of fun too. You know you're learning and it's fun, but then their day is blown. Their day is blown and they never really get to the actual and they don't get to that marketing.  17:05 - Anne (Host) I'm going to say that's the biggest thing. People like they don't get to the direct marketing.  17:09 They don't get to their marketing, and marketing encompasses so much. Marketing is so darn important. In law it's everything, and I wish that it really is everything. I wish that everybody could really just appreciate that from the get-go. I mean, I would say that probably the majority of people that come into this industry and study for a little bit, get their demo and then don't succeed are because they have not been effective marketers, and that is really Like nobody can hire you if they don't know about you.  17:40 And so that marketing part which nobody likes. It's always the classes that nobody will take at a conference. They're like the last ones that are filled, because they're just not fun, right? I'd much rather take an animation class or one of those classes rather than figure out how can I run my business better. And it really is so, so important that you understand the marketing of your business, because you've got to be able to sell, you do. In order to be able to recoup and get a return on investment right you need to sell.  18:16 - Lau (Co-host) And let's be honest, especially as we get older. I can only speak for myself, but I know my colleagues feel the same way. I love sitting in on classes.  18:25 When I go to a conference and I'm a speaker all that other time I'm not speaking. I'm sitting in on classes and workshops and meeting and learning and growing and da-da-da, but it becomes addictive. You have to be careful. We are not a professional student. We are a professional voiceover, talent or voice over business owner, producer what have you? We can be studious, we can be educated and we can be in professional development, but we're not a professional full-time student.  18:54 - Anne (Host) Exactly. But again, I also don't want you guys out there to think that it's not important to be a student either.  19:00 No, we're always a student or a continual, always learning student just not one that spends their entire day sitting in on free webinars or I would say, investment in your demos, investment in your coaching because, again, something that's going to enhance your product okay is something that is always worthwhile. It's just that when you kind of are like, oh no, I'll just sit in on this and you're not really you're doing it more for the social aspect rather than the enhancement of your product, I would say, be careful of that.  19:32 - Lau (Co-host) And that gossipy water cooler let me be in the in-clicky group is listen, you're too old for that. I don't care if you're 25 or 55, you got to get past that. You want to have friends and colleagues? Of course you do, but it's really got to be. You are a solopreneur. Until you build your team, you're a solopreneur. The buck stops there. You know what I'm saying. You said it earlier. You said about tracking have a tracking system where everything you do, every webinar you take, every group you join, every membership what is the return on that?  20:04 - Anne (Host) at the end of a month or six months, what is?  20:07 - Lau (Co-host) the return. Are you getting return? I don't necessarily just mean a financial return. Are you getting an actual return of relationships that have been built, of connections that have been built, of producers that now know you, or is it just for fun, is it just for social value? Is it for oh, I'm learning some new tips and tricks, which I love, but is it applicable to what I'm doing? Is the question that's.  20:32 - Anne (Host) The fine line again. You and I both run online groups and we know the value and the power of having a group. There's a power in socializing with people with like minds, because we are solopreneurs and we need that. But also it's kind of like if you were in an office and you were socializing in your office the whole day, your boss probably wouldn't be very happy with you.  20:52 - Lau (Co-host) That's a great analogy.  20:55 - Anne (Host) There's no productive work being done, so just keep that in mind. I mean, I think every group has value. Accountability has value, watercooler has value. My VOPEAPs, my VIPs in your group as well the Inner Circle they all have their value, but just not necessarily 24-7, where you're now neglecting the fact that you probably need to market your business and get some jobs that will help you to get a return on your investment.  21:21 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, and understand your budget at the beginning of your quarter. Set up your budget, however, is comfortable for you, whether it's quarterly, annually, whatever it is. Set it up and have some advisory on that, based on what your fixed costs are, so that you don't feel like you're scrounging for under-the-seat cushions for the coins by the end of the month. You want to come from a place of abundance and wealth and fullness.  21:46 You don't want to come from a place of I'm scratching out of desperation and I'm on my last dollar. It's very hard to have a healthy, successful business coming from a mindset like that.  21:58 - Anne (Host) Oh gosh, yes, and I will say that my business didn't really fully take off I've said this before until I really started to feel comfortable having that little nest egg, that kind of savings account.  22:09 So when I was able to, I mean, I put away money every single month, right, and so it's just a consistent thing, so that I have a business savings account, and when that business savings account has a certain amount of money in it, I feel confident that I can take risks, that I can invest in coaching, I can spend money on things that will help me to get my business known better, and also I can take some chances and try new technologies.  22:33 I want to emphasize that it's important for bosses to evolve with the times and evolve with the technologies to help run their businesses faster and more efficient, because if you're just doing things still in an Excel spreadsheet or it really depends on what makes you the most efficient. But there's lots of wonderful technologies out there that can help you to run your business and market your business more effectively. And take some time, maybe learn those, maybe not. Let's not sit in the water cooler right now, but let's learn how to utilize new technologies that will help me automate my billing right, or how do I learn QuickBooks, or how do I learn a new CRM, that kind of a thing. So think of those things that will also help you to be more efficient in running your business as well as saving money, so that you're not having to spend maybe hiring somebody to do that. Maybe you can hire and, if you are hiring out, make those people more efficient.  23:28 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, and don't be cheap. Be frugal and economical, but don't be cheap. You know, when you have your circle considering you and thinking about you, and thinking about you as a person and also you as a brand, you want them to feel this richness that there's a giving to what you do, there isn't a holding back or a holding on to or being a miser. You have to be very careful of that, because if we always say this, annie, you and I say this the more you give, the more potential you have of getting back in return. Yeah, absolutely. So just give wisely, give wisely, invest wisely. There you go.  24:03 - Anne (Host) Wow, love it. All right, guys. Well, bosses, money. Take a cold hard, look at it and don't be afraid. Don't be afraid of it. Don't be afraid to invest and strategize. I think the more that you can educate yourself, the easier it is to make those investments and the smarter and more efficient your business will be. So, love that, bosses. Take a moment and imagine a world full of passionate. Because we are passionate, right, empowered, diverse individuals giving collectively, as Law was just talking about, and intentionally to create the world that they want to see. You can make a difference. Visit 100voiceswhocareorg to learn more. Big shout out to IPDTL, our sponsor. We love IPDTL. You can learn more at IPDTLcom. Bosses, have an amazing week. We love you. We'll see you next week. Bye, bye, have a good break.  24:58 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.  25:26 - Lau (Co-host) How about this? You really, you really moved, that was interesting. I just need time to process that.  a series. I'm here with my amazing boss co-host, Lau Laupides. Hey Lau, hey Annie, welcome back, I'm excited. Yay, oh Lau, let's talk this week about money, money, money, money, money money. How much does voiceover cost? Oh, you mean, I get that question. How much is it going to cost me? How much do I have to invest? How much does it cost? I think we should have a discussion on the financial side of things, because that's something that most people don't want to think about it. They don't want to talk about it A lot of times. They don't want to spend it or invest it. Yes, yes, yes.  01:09 - Lau (Co-host) I like to liken it to any other profession out there, and preferably the most expensive professions to get into. For instance, if I want to be a financial advisor and I'm going to go through college and then graduate school, and then I'm going to invest my money, my tuition, in my education, and then I'm going to invest my money to purchase my tools, then I'm going to invest money to get my either brick and mortar or online presence. Guess what? I've spent a lot of money for that type of profession, and not just a few hundred bucks.  01:44 - Anne (Host) No.  01:45 - Lau (Co-host) Not just a few thousand either.  01:47 - Intro (Announcement) Exactly, exactly.  01:49 - Lau (Co-host) I always set it up that way and just to give perspective to people that this is really a profession, it's a viable career. But also the truth is and I can say this because I live this myself it's a drop in the bucket compared to becoming a doctor or becoming a banker or becoming even SCPA a drop in the bucket.  02:12 So just to kind of keep that in mind up front. It's not an overnight success career. It's not a I don't have to spend any money but I can make a ton of money out of it. It's not that kind of career at all, and it's good we kind of put it out there, annie, and be honest about it, right?  02:30 - Anne (Host) Okay, so what are the popuLaur topics to talk about in voiceover? Well, how can I be a character actor? How can I get my demo and start making money? But, in reality, all the other aspects of being a voice actor and having a business are going to require financial investment one way or the other, and we really shouldn't expect that it's going to be cheap. I don't have a lot of money, but I want to be a voice actor, so can you help me? Well, I think that we really just need to sit back and have a dose of reality where, as you mentioned before, voice acting is a career, and for many other careers, we invest our money. We've invested our money in education, we invest our money in inventory, in storefronts, in product, whatever that is. We invest our money, and the same is true for voiceover. And so if you are coming into voiceover without any money to spend, I think you need to rethink that decision.  03:31 - Lau (Co-host) Yeah, I would say that money should go along, in your mind, with the other types of investment that you're going to be giving to this Family time. What is the time investment? What are the sacrifices that you will be making in order to Launch your career and keep it viable and keep it sustainable? I mean, what are you investing into this? How about just energy? How about talking about energy investment? It all goes along with your money. So don't think, oh, if I throw 50,000 at this, I'm going to be rich and famous. No, it's not just about money. It's about my level of commitment and what commitment actually means. Money symbolizes my commitment and it also is a monetary dispensation for someone to give me a service.  04:20 - Anne (Host) I love that you said, oh, if I throw $50,000 into this, because I'll tell you what not one person that has approached me in the Laust year or so, ever probably that it could cost up to that. But I'll tell you what, over the years, Lauw I mean in reality. I mean there are thousands of dolLaurs that are invested in my career, in my equipment, in my studio, in coaching, just in running the business. I mean absolutely, and I love that you just said that off the top because I think it will hit our bosses like a little bit of reality.  04:49 I mean, if any of you bosses that are out there have been listening to the VEOBOSS podcast, we've been going for seven years and so if you think about what have you really spent in seven years and you looked at your accounting, you looked at your books, I'd like to know what that number is, because 50,000 is actually small compared to what I've invested for equipment and websites and subscriptions and coaching and demos and conferences and all of these things that I have invested my money into.  05:17 That is really nothing. And so I really want you to kind of take a hard look at your numbers and I know a lot of people don't like to do that because it's scary. It brings, I think, a reality to people's lives. That voiceover isn't just this oh, I can do it from home and it's so simple and I don't have to invest anything. And I love how you also mentioned it really is a time commitment as well. It's a commitment to really make this a serious commitment and a serious career, because if you're not serious about it, well then I don't know how much money will you be making. You know?  05:55 - Lau (Co-host) Yes, and I know for a fact you and I come from the same background, the same training methodology and work ethic and generation that you come into it. Not every happening or event is a monetary compensation, this idea that, oh, if I spend time doing this or that, I'm gonna get paid for it. It's just not always true. There is a building block time and even when you've built your studio or you've built your company over five years or seven years, you're still wanting to get to the next level. Well, how do you get to the next level? Well, you are doing sacrifice all the time. Look at you and I, like you're doing this incredible podcast for seven years. I've been in it with you for a year and a half. Right, and one could say, well, we're not sitting here having dolLaurs flying at our head on a Saturday afternoon for taking two, three hours of our time unpaid reLautively unpaid to do this.  06:52 - Anne (Host) then you have to pay an engineer and an editor, whatever, so what's?  06:57 - Lau (Co-host) the return then? Well, the return becomes the belief system that what we're offering is educational value to our people we love and adore and care about our client base, our audience, new people coming in and that of course, to some degree you're going to close a number of new clients that come in that hear your project, but guess what? You may not.  07:20 - Intro (Announcement) And if you may not, if you may not.  07:22 - Lau (Co-host) That's the risk reward that you take in saying I'm going to take every Saturday to record, I'm going to pay that editor, no matter what, I'm going to hire that engineer, no matter what. It's that sense of jumping off the cliff and saying my career is worth doing, that I may not always see a dolLaur per dolLaur of time spent and energy spent, so it's not a tit for tat that way. I think too many people are looking at it in that way, like, well, what am I going to get paid for? Every single moment I work and think about this, I said, well, nothing. You're going to get paid in education, in value, in reLautionship, whatever. You're not going to always get the dolLaur bills. Baby, right, just remember that payment is not always about Money. It's about different value of forces in your life that come together that sustain a whole career. We don't want jobs, we want a career. Yeah.  08:20 - Anne (Host) And I think a lot of assumptions come from the fact if this is the first time you are getting into voice, acting and creating a business, it is all about creating a business, which is different than working for people, where you do tasks and then you get paid for that. When you are setting up and creating a business, there are investments that you need to make, and this is a completely different mindset than oh, okay, I did work and I expect money for it. Now you're going to have to put work in. You're going to also invest money. You're going to have to invest money into it. So most people they have a job. They're not investing money in that job, they're just receiving money. But here you have to understand that this is now something that will require an investment of your money and of your time and of your commitment really to make it work, and it's not just a one-time thing. I don't want people to think that as well.  09:11 It's not like oh, I can sink in $10,000 and then I'll have my career. No, that is something that you need to maintain. You need to continually invest and reinvest in that business to have growth, to have any kind of growth, and I think if you sat there with your business and never invested another cent in it, you're probably not going to have a business for very long. Right? I like to think of it as gambling.  09:35 - Lau (Co-host) It is a gamble. It's a gamble we can do the research, we can do our homework, we can make ourselves knowledgeable and we can hone our skills and talent, but it's still a gamble because you're dealing with a lot of variables that are not in your control. So I like to say, all right, if you have a pocket and let's say you're going to stash in, you know you're going to Vegas or something you're going to stash in $1,000 in that pocket on the left-hand side, that $1,000, I'm willing to spend and lose, because I know I'm going to Vegas and I know I'm gambling it and I know that there's a good chance the house will win and I'll lose it. Then in my other pocket I've got like $5,000, I'm not spending that, I'm saving that. I have that as a safety net, I have that as my backup, okay, for my life.  10:22 Let's say that and I'm not going to spend it unless I absolutely am up against a wall and would have to. So, from a gambling perspective, your business is one big gamble. Sure is, you know, sure is, and I'm only using $1,000 as just a number. It could be $100,000, but I'm not using $1,000 as a number. I know I'm spending that, will I get it back into my right pocket? Sure, that's the question, right? That's the gamble, right.  10:49 - Anne (Host) That's the gamble. That's the gamble, that's the gamble.  10:52 And that's where I think the investment in commitment right, commitment to making that business a success right Really comes into pLauy as well, because it's not just a one-shot deal Let me just do this because I can do this from home. No, you're going to make an investment and, of course, we hope that, as bosses, you enjoy that investment or you're enjoying that creation of a business and also enjoying the performance aspect of your voice, acting
Confused
Dec 12 2023
Confused
Get set for an enlightening journey into the world of voice acting as we promise to help you crush confusion and self-doubt. Prepare to discover the significance of being in the present, letting your improvisation skills shine, and understanding how overthinking can interfere with your ability to take instructions and deliver exceptional performances for your clients. We also delve into the realm of imposter syndrome and how script comprehension can drastically boost your confidence. Listen closely as we walk you through techniques on warming up, shattering negative thought patterns, and building the courage to ask those essential questions that could transform your voice-acting career. 00:01 - Intro (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a V-O boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the V-O Boss Podcast and the business superpower series. I am here with my wonderful, awesome bossy co-host, law Lapidus. Hey Lau, how are you?  00:33 - Lau (Host) Hey Annie, how are you?  00:35 - Anne (Host) I'm great, it's so good to be back chatting with you. I mean, I feel like it's been forever. It's been forever.  00:41 - Lau (Host) I know, before we start, I have to give you just a quick direction. I hope you don't mind. We're on Riverside right now Okay. I just need you to hit button one so I can hear you a little clearly which button.  00:53 - Anne (Host) I'm sorry, which button?  00:54 - Lau (Host) There's a button there and it says one. Could you just hit it One?  00:58 - Anne (Host) But wait, there's multiple buttons, there's like three buttons.  01:03 - Lau (Host) Okay, your sound confused, I know, but I'm asking for one. Okay, but why not?  01:07 - Anne (Host) So if you could find the one and hit it, that would be great. Okay, but two, isn't two supposed to be the one that starts it, are you sure?  01:13 - Lau (Host) you don't want two. What If you do two? You're going to find that it's not the right button.  01:18 - Anne (Host) So if you could hit one, that would be great, okay, so should I press it now? Anne, you sound really confused, I am.  01:27 - Lau (Host) Law. I know it sounds like you need to be a member of our new Confucius Club.  01:33 - Anne (Host) The Confucius Club. I love it. Oh Law, you know, I'll tell you what we should talk about the Confucius Club. And when, let's say, your clients or students kind of challenge your direction and ask you and are very confused and are not necessarily listening, I would say to direction from.  01:56 - Lau (Host) It's frustrating. It is, I'll tell you, it's very frustrating for the onlooker, the listener, the audience, the director, whoever you're working with is very frustrating process and I want to talk to you today about maybe some of the reasons behind why that is happening and how to troubleshoot that, and why some people seem confused all the time about everything.  02:17 - Anne (Host) Yes, let's talk about that. Let's talk about that. First of all, I want to talk about the confusion, and I'll also talk. Part of the confusion is when you've got somebody that you're directing and they'll say but that's not the way I hear it in the commercials, or I don't hear it that way online, and so therefore it turns into almost like a challenge to the director. And I think number one we are artists, we are actors and we are paid to do a job that essentially is for our client right, and the client is giving us direction, so why would we not follow direction?  02:55 - Lau (Host) Well, it brings us back to the old skill that we talk about incessantly, and that is the skill of improv, which is really the skill of living life moment to moment and being able to accept suggestion of stimuli around you that we don't always understand. Like we go into the natural world, we go into the technical world, we go into the human world. Do we always know what's happening around us?  03:21 - Anne (Host) No, of course not.  03:22 - Lau (Host) Right, but there's that element of moment to moment problem solving it, figuring it out, trying things, taking risks. So I think one of these areas that we're really hitting head on is, if you find you're that person that is confused constantly and just doesn't get it, are you stuck in your head? Analysis is paralysis zone.  03:46 - Anne (Host) That's a great point. Are you stuck in your head? Are you stuck with the sound that you hear in your head that you think it should sound like really, and not able to get that out of your ears so that you can be in the story and immersed in the story? And I will say that for a director or for a coach it's almost like but why? It's like those questions, but why? But I don't hear it that way and I think there's a whole scientific reason as to why we hear things differently.  04:17 When we're voicing something, then, let's say, the person that's directing us. Right, because we have to develop an ear. And what does that mean? To develop an ear for knowing when you're sounding the same or sounding like, you know, a commercial, or sounding not when you're immersed in a story. I think if you have the time to evaluate whether you sound a particular way, then you've spent way too much time thinking about your sound and not enough time thinking about the story that you're in or the character you're playing, or how you're going to be immersed in that, to story, tell or educate the listener.  04:50 - Lau (Host) Right and just basic biz 101 that we've covered a million times is who is this all about? Anyway, it's about your client, it's about your audience, it's about your target demographic, it's about the person you're speaking to. Thank you, the scenario that you're in is really about helping solve a problem, fill a need from an actor's point of view, but also from a business owner's point of view. If I'm stuck in my head and I'm in that confusion state, I'm literally not problem-solving for that client because I'm not actively listening, I'm not picking up cues and I'm not asking really important questions that need to be asked in order to serve them. It's really about who am I serving. Am I serving me? Am I serving my intellect, my ego, so I can understand what's going on, or am I serving you by clarifying it and giving you exactly what you?  05:45 - Anne (Host) want. And I think there comes a time too, when actors are in the moment they're being directed, live directed where they become so in their head determined to give a sound right that they can't get out of their head. How is it? Because I know my students have been like well, how do you get out of your head? How do you step outside of your head and get into the story? And I'm going to say, I'm going to ask you that question, but I'm going to preempt it with saying, from my point of view, you've got to do your research before. If you can research that script, analyze that copy, figure out who you are, who you're talking to, I think that's a good start. What sort of tips do you have? Law, when you're in the middle of a live session, how do you get out of the way? How do you get out of your head?  06:28 - Lau (Host) Yeah, it's so funny. It's reminding me about actor technique and having either an inside, locked in, psychological approach to the work or having more externalized, outside, communicative and oftentimes physicalized approach to the work. I find that both can work hand in hand. I don't think one is right or wrong, but I do think American actors it is a North American thing that we have been trained in the methodology of method for generations now to lock inside from here up and so all the stress, all the tension, all the worry, all the Confucius concern is here and really just not trusting the rest of your sphere that your brain is in your whole body, your heart is in your whole body, everything is flowing and connected. So if I'm locked in here then I'm shutting you out, but I'm also shutting out the lower hemisphere of my being.  07:25 - Anne (Host) Oh, I love that Law. That's wonderful. Your being is all a part of telling that story and being the actor and immersing yourself in that character I love that.  07:35 You're right, getting locked in your head. So are there some techniques that you have to? When you're in the middle of a session and I think you're right you're locked in your head and you get frantic. You're like, okay, this is not working, I'm not able to provide what the director is asking for. And then I think what happens is it just escalates, right, and then it just becomes worse. Until you can get yourself out of that. Oh my God, oh my God, oh my God. Okay, that didn't work. Okay, so now what do I do? And so tips, techniques.  08:03 - Lau (Host) Law. Yes, one tip I have is a very old and dear broadcasting friend of mine, who did very well in the broadcasting field, who's a major newscaster, actually suffered from anxiety and depression for many years, especially after she retired, before she started her company. And one of the tips she talked about that seems so simple and yet to do it is magic is, she would say, when I wake up in the morning and I get out of bed and I'm a busy person, I always have things cooking and lined up I get up and I move and I physically do tasks. I don't stay in my head, I don't think about things, I don't sit in a chair, I get up and, whether it's making my bed or making my breakfast or showering, whatever, I physically move, and then somewhere in there I reach out to someone else. When I reach out to someone else, it breaks the negative energy that I have already recorded in my head, patterned after years and years and years of getting locked in my head, my brain. It breaks that energy and it forces me to think about the other person.  09:10 So one of the tips I have is get up and do tasks and then go connect to another person. It could be your mom or your best friend or your child or whoever it is, or your cat, and find out if they have. Or your cat, your dog? I was going to say that Do they have what they need? Do they have what they want? Are they happy? Did they have a walk? Did they get their bone? Has their water changed? Right, because it breaks that negative cycle of being locked in and getting confused, because then, all of a sudden, a lot of people talk about imposter syndrome and feeling like I don't know if I should be doing this. I'm all confused because you're locked in the negative recording pattern in your brain that is tricking you into thinking this is wrong, this is incorrect, You're not doing it right, you're not doing it right.  09:56 - Anne (Host) You're not good enough and all of that. Yeah, I love that.  09:59 Those are two tips I love that because that gives me a good excuse. I mean, lately I've been really working on it, but I've been working on getting up and as soon as I get up and just have oh, I have to have a couple of sips of coffee, but I try to get out and exercise for just 30 minutes to kind of just blow off the steam and to just get everything going and warmed up. And I think not only does that help me warm up my voice, because I think it's not just about your vocal cords, it's warming up your entire body, I mean every your head, your neck, your body, as you said, your whole being to allow that to flow. And I think, if you are just getting up and running into your studio and locking yourself into your head and then trying to deliver what you think the director wants and this is not easy bosses I mean we understand this that it's not easy to get out of your head sometimes it really really isn't, and it's just something that I think takes practice.  10:52 And again, it's one of those things that I think that sometimes we are just so impatient with ourselves and we think that it should just be easy, and it should, we should just be able to do it, and then, if we can't, we get frustrated and then we just keep that vicious cycle in our head, and so I think you just have to give yourself some grace as well to know that you're not going to be able to accomplish this by tomorrow.  11:14 I mean, if you're just starting out today, it is one of those things that evolves.  11:18 I mean, as humans, we are constantly growing, evolving and being, and I think that this is again one of those things where we have to allow ourselves to evolve, allow ourselves to really become the character, understand the scene and really just try to. If you're in the middle of a session, let's say, after you've gone out and I love the tips that you gave law got your body moving and then connected with somebody else and then came into the studio, and I think almost always well, I shouldn't say that, but a lot of times we do have the script a little bit in advance I think there's a lot you can do in five minutes with a script to really familiarize yourself and try to create a scene. Or even if you're not creating a scene, you're there and you're being live directed. You can certainly ask about the scene right, and that can help you to be in the scene versus to be in the sound. Like be in the scene, don't be in the sound. I love that.  12:16 - Lau (Host) I also would say too, when you're in those moments, give yourself one necessary question to ask If there's one necessary question that you cannot answer on your own. Your coach, your husband, whatever, cannot answer it for you. Give yourself the necessary question and write down the answer. When you hear what that answer is, but don't allow it to go into a slippery slope of questions. Allow it to sink in and, just like you would try any risk taking, move, like you would step off a cliff to go hair-sailing right. Well, you jump off the cliff and you float and you fly. Just understand. There is going to be that nuanced period for you of literally not understanding fully what someone is saying to you, but trying hard to problem solve it on your own. Yeah, yeah, because they're hiring you. They're hiring you to figure it out. They're not hiring you to have them figure it out for you. Yeah, absolutely, they really are, and I also think to.  13:15 - Anne (Host) I've had a few students that have said this. Where I'll be directing them. I'll say but I don't hear it that way. On TV when I watch the commercial, it doesn't sound like that. A lot of times I'll give references to, let's say, youtube videos of like real world, let's say corporate narration or real world commercials. And my student will say to me but I don't hear it that way.  13:37 And I always say to them well, that doesn't necessarily mean that I think it's well done or I think it's telling a story, or it really is how the director at the time wanted the piece to sound or to come out. And so it doesn't necessarily mean that you have to compare sounds and then say, well, because my sound doesn't equal that. Therefore, I don't understand what you're asking me to do. Why do I have to be in a scene I don't understand? Why do I have to ask questions? Why do I have to react? Well, essentially, because that's what's going to be giving your unique point of view, is going to be your interpretation on behalf of the company or the product. And again, as you mentioned before a lot, it's not about you or your sound, it's about how you're serving the listener and the client that you're also performing for.  14:22 - Lau (Host) Right, you're not an automaton, you're not an inanimate object. People want to work with you because they like you or you, they like your voice or they like what you're delivering. So they are running on assumption, a professional assumption that you know what you're doing. So the more you give it away that you are absolutely clueless yes, you're in the Confucius Club, you have no idea what you're doing the more they doubt your product and your value. You have to be careful. There's like a fine line there between investigating really smart questions to get the answers and then applying them and then just asking questions for attention or because you feel insecure, because you're unsure. You have to be really careful of that. They're hiring you for an expertise, of knowledge that they themselves oftentimes don't have. They don't have that craft. They're not an actor, they're not a voice talent, they're not oftentimes right.  15:16 - Anne (Host) You have to know what you're doing, and you certainly don't want those questions to be challenges to them. I mean, you're there to make their lives easier and to hopefully give them the performance that they're looking for, and maybe something that they don't even know that they want, right, exactly.  15:33 I think, if we start to really think that we're not being hired because of our voice and our sound and I keep going back to that, I feel like I'm harping on it but in reality they didn't hire us necessarily for the fact that we can sound a particular way, but mostly interpret the script and bring it to life yes, and that is really what we're being hired to do. So don't go in a session thinking that I want to make it sound a particular way. They're looking for a particular sound. No, you need to be immersed in the acting, to deliver the performance that makes it believable, authentic, and that is what you're being paid to do.  16:11 - Lau (Host) You took the words Annie out of my mouth, because how many times throughout the years that we've been in a session and we heard someone say something like I want you to sound like a rhinoceros, okay. And the talent says or maybe we're the talent, you and I were talent for many years and I'm thinking I have no idea what a rhinoceros sounds like. But instead of saying what does a rhinoceros sound like, I rely on my expertise and my vocabulary to say I don't know what that sounds like, but I know what they look like. I get a sense of them. So I'm gonna go with a really big animal. I'm gonna do my best elephant. See how they feel about that and they go. That's awesome, I love that great rhinoceros.  16:51 - Anne (Host) Yeah right, but you didn't tell them it was an elephant.  16:53 - Lau (Host) No, because right because they don't care about your process. They're not asking you for that. They're asking you for what you're outputting to them and they're gonna decide on that. But if I brought them in to my confusion, process of problem solving the difference between an elephant and rhinoceros, they'd be very irked by that. They'd be very annoyed by that. To say we're hiring you, we're paying you 500 bucks or 1,000 bucks or 2,000 bucks. You can't make it up, you can't figure it out right. So I mean, I'm using a simple example. But that could be a medical textbook, that could be an educational portal question that I've never heard before. That could be any kind of esoteric language that is not in my sphere. That I now have to quickly do my research, of course, do my research. But I'm not gonna learn a whole industry. I'm just gonna get some cues and clues and then I'm gonna create it, because that's what we do we create.  17:50 - Anne (Host) That's what they call us creatives.  17:52 - Lau (Host) We have to be creative in nature, right, In order to make people feel like that's what we're doing. And then one more tip I wanna give, and this is a toughie because it's a very non-PC tip. Sometimes you have to give in the old razzle dazzle. And that is you're an actor Act Exactly, act like you know what you're doing.  18:11 - Anne (Host) You may not know at all, but just try, just try.  18:15 What's the worst? That happens Absolutely. Now we've just spoken about okay, this is during a live session, right? And you're feeling like challenged and maybe panicked and not being able to deliver what they're asking for, and so how are you getting out of your own way? Now let's talk about you're in your studio and you're by yourself and nobody's live directing you and you are self-directing.  18:36 How do you get out of your own way when you're self-directing? Right, I have a lot of experience with that. I do a lot of non-broadcast, I do a lot of stuff that isn't directed and it's self-directed, and a lot of times I'll give my students homework, right, that is not live directed. So how are you, in your studio, all by yourself, getting out of your own way? That, I think, can sometimes be tougher. You're not necessarily under the gun, so much to do it under a certain amount of time, but now you might have all the time in the world and then you'll second guess yourself to death, right? So tips for when you are self-directing how to get out of your head and allow yourself your being to be.  19:14 - Lau (Host) Well, I got two right off the top of my head. The first one is like you, annie, are to me. I have a professional network of very close people that I love, adore, trust and work with. I don't want to drive them crazy and I don't want to call them every day because they don't want to hear from me every day, but when I get in that mode I can pick up the phone or jump on Zoom. I will have one of those people there who go Law. What are you talking about?  19:40 Just get out of your head try this, do this and I'm like thank you, that's all I needed. Thank you, that's all I needed. I also will jump on Google or Bing or DuckDuckGo whatever you're using and have some visual and soundscape inspiration. I like that, again, to get me out of what I think it is. I'm going to go to the library, go to the museum, go to the reservoir so that I can start choosing images visual, vocal that I can pull from. That'll help me get out of the paralysis that I'm in.  20:12 - Anne (Host) Absolutely Visual and audio. I love that Law because visual and audio external references are going to get you out of your head, because you'll be focused on something else other than just sitting there looking at your microphone and your head going oh my god, okay, I got it. Oh, that didn't sound good. And the soundscape, too, is very interesting, because a lot of times people can play music softly in their headphones and really get a different read depending on the type of music that's being played underneath, and so that, I think, is some really good hints. Go to Google research, research, research that product, that company, and you can get a lot of hints and clues from understanding what their brand is like and getting a visual look at their brand, because that might evoke oh, I'm a busy mom, or it's bright and happy, or maybe it's more serious, or whatever that is. It can get you into a different mood and that mood can affect your performance.  21:05 Right, going to be channeling a different character. I'm going to say I don't want to say voice. You're going to be channeling a different character, and as long as that character makes sense, right for the product and for the company, I think that that will give you that rather than let's make it a different sounding take. Let's make it a different take where you're in a different scene, you're in a different emotion, you're not busy and harried and hectic. You are now thoughtful and reflective. That can give you a couple of really different reads.  21:33 And then, ultimately, when you can showcase that to any casting director or talent agent that understands oh, there's an actor, that's what's going to get you hired. And then law I say this all the time you don't need me to teach you how to read pretty or to sound a particular way, because we all have that in our head. It's funny because I always say let me read it to you the way that everybody pretty much hears it in their head. And whenever I do that, my student will be like oh yeah, that's exactly how I recorded it. And I'm like good, I want you to give me something different, right? So how?  22:01 - Intro (Announcement) are you going to give me something different, right? I don't want it to be predictable.  22:05 - Anne (Host) I want you to bring your eating spin on it. And how is that going to happen? Change your scene, channel a different character. I love the whole getting out of your head and that was such a visual thing, law, that you did getting out of your head and allowing the whole being, because that just brings into play your whole body, getting into the character right, and that will have so much to do with a good performance.  22:27 - Lau (Host) Yeah, and what you're doing should be in a three dimensional sphere in your world. Unfortunately, it's all one dimensional if you're in a box and you're on a piece of paper. Hopefully, gone are not the days but when you had like actors, like Johnny Depp, who is trained in method technique, would go into the culture, into the scenario, into the environment, to live in the environment for a little while in order to figure out who the character is. Well, you may or may not have time to do it, but if you do have time to do it, go to the store and look at Play-Doh again. Get Play-Doh.  23:00 Go to the movies and remember what AMC is. Go to the company and see what the company culture is Like. It could only take you 30 minutes or an hour to enrich your whole reservoir to pull from when you're doing this kind of work and say, oh, I know what that is, I know what their attitude is, I know how they dress, I know how they talk to each other. I'm going to start to feel that and embody that so I can connect with you in a slightly more authentic way. Versus how do I sound.  23:29 Do I sound good? Do I sound like? One more thing, annie, I wanted to point out. This drives me crazy. This is one of my pet peeves that I've heard several clients say over and over and over again over the course of a long period of time Say I don't know what you're saying to me. I don't understand your feedback law. I'm not an actor. You're treating me as if I know what you're talking about in regards to acting or being a voiceover talent. I'm not really that and I said well, why are you standing here with a credit card asking me or others to work with you and become that? So this comes from my dear friend, joanne Yarrow. One of the great tips that she gives and exercises she does which I love is, even if you're just starting out, like just starting out, you're listening to this and you're going I haven't done anything. Call yourself what you envision yourself to be yes amen.  24:22 Today, say I am a business owner. Today, I am a voice over talent.  24:25 - Anne (Host) today, I am an actor. I am an actor, I am an entrepreneur and I run a voice over business.  24:31 - Lau (Host) Right, because it's not about making money or how many jobs you've had or who you know, yet it's about embodying the psychology of belief systems and manifesting you have limiting belief values. Yeah, if you're not manifesting an abundant belief system in yourself, then you're not playing in the sandbox yet. You're just not in the sandbox. You've got to get in there and play with the dolls and the trucks and the sand and figure out what it all is. But if you say, oh, I don't get dirty, I don't play in sand, I don't like trucks, I don't know why you're asking me about dolls. And I'll say, well then, why do you want to be a talent? Because talent loves getting dirty. Talent loves playing.  25:14 - Anne (Host) Yeah, I love that and I'm not even interested in that. I want to bring up a point that, no matter what genre you're studying these days so, so important these days no matter what genre, you need to be a voice actor. I don't care if you're doing e-learning, if you're doing like everybody that thinks well for corporate narration, you don't need to be an actor. I mean, oh my gosh, yes, even more so I think.  25:34 Because, corporate narration. You've got to hold somebody's attention for longer than a minute and so, literally no matter what you're doing, you need to be the actor and you need to study how you can be an actor in all different scenarios, all different pieces of copy. How can you bring those words, whether it's an e-learning module, a corporate manifesto or a medical pharmaceutical? How can you make those words sound authentic and believable and be in a world that can engage your listener? You have to, no matter what. So when you're studying with any coach, that's what you should be focusing on on the acting part of it, not just okay, I just want to get my demo and I want it to sound great so I can get work and that's it. In reality, no matter what genre you're studying, you should be studying to be an actor, and then those acting skills will carry over into every genre. Then you just have to the differences between the genres, understand the market, understand the nuances between the genres, but the acting is still acting, no matter what genre you're in.  26:40 - Lau (Host) And understanding that nothing you do is real, nothing. It's like I remember years ago when I was in the theater and the director would say you guys realize that you're standing in a box and people are paying a ticket to see you on a lifted stage and there's nothing that's real here and just that acknowledgement that, oh yeah, nothing in media is real. Nothing is real. It's the facsimile of life, but it is not actual real life. So what I'm doing is the old truth under imaginary circumstances it really is. I have to bring the authentic reservoir from my heart, my head, my body, my soul, my spirit, my history to a very artificial place. I can't mistake this artificial place as saying oh well, this is real, it's a real thing, I'm, I'm being. No, it's not a real thing. Right, the audience thinks it's real because they're suspending their disbelief. You're setting a really profound convention for them where they can believe it. But you know, it's technical, it's all technical, right, If you don't do that groundwork and you're confused all the time about it.  27:51 Then how can you bring any kind of truth into a technical, artificial, imaginary circumstance? Well said.  27:58 - Anne (Host) Well said, woo Woo, my bossy co -host. I love it, I'll tell you Good stuff.  28:04 - Lau (Host) I think we said it all and after all that, I'm still confused. Are you confused? Which button did you want me? To push, I think, a one. Can you press one? Yeah, you know what Law.  28:14 - Anne (Host) I'm going to push one now. After that, all right, awesome, yeah, just push one. Oh goodness, bosses, as individuals it can seem difficult to make a huge impact, but as a group and together, we can contribute to the growth of our communities in ways that we never thought possible. Get 100 VoicesWhoCareorg to find out more. Big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. I love IPDTL and the fact that I get to connect up with bosses like my awesome, amazing friend, law Lapitas, and all my clients. You guys can find out more at IPDTLcom. You guys, bosses, have an amazing week and we'll see you next week. See you next week, enjoy, bye.  28:59 - Intro (Announcement) Join us next week for another edition of VoBoss with your host, ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Pre-distribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.  29:48 - Lau (Host) That was interesting.
Boss Online
Dec 5 2023
Boss Online
Anne and Lau share a valuable discussion about the pivotal role websites play in any business, and how they can be a driving force behind attracting potential clients. In this episode, The Bosses discuss how a well-presented, professional, and easy-to-navigate website has a crucial role in enhancing online shopping experiences, increasing sales, and building trust with potential customers. Learn how to ensure your website is professional, easy to navigate, and trustworthy to drive potential customers to your content. Transcript: Anne Ganguzza: Hey, hey, everyone. Welcome to the V.O. Boss podcast and the V.O. Boss Superpower Series. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and I have today with me the effervescent, lovely, amazing Lau Lapides. Lau Lapides: Keep going Annie, keep going. You don't need to stop. Anne Ganguzza: She Lau Lapides: Ha ha Anne Ganguzza: is everything. She is everything, bosses. Lau Lapides: ha. Aw, thank you. Anne Ganguzza: And we love her, and we Lau Lapides: We Anne Ganguzza: love her. Lau Lapides: love you too. So awesome to be here, always. Anne Ganguzza: Well, it's awesome to have you as usual. So Lau Lapides: Thank you. Anne Ganguzza: today, or I shouldn't say today, but this week, Law, I had a very exciting thing happen to me. I got an email from a potential client that said they had been researching quietly in the background, looking for a new voice for their brand. And they found me. And they listened to my d- demos. They found me like on a Google search and found my website and listened to my demos. And then apparently narrowed down that search to about, I don't know, a handful of people. And they said that they would like me to audition for this very cool possibility for a major brand. And I was so ecstatic because... I didn't do a thing. Like they found me. They found me on a Google search and they found my website and they were able to listen to my demos and they were able to assess, right, my voice, obviously, and decide yes, she's going on a short list. All because I had a really great website that had things laid out easily, easy to find my demos, easily played. and easy to contact me. And so I thought it was important. I thought it would be an important topic to discuss websites. And I know I talk about it incessantly, but I thought let's dedicate an entire episode to websites and how they are so important to your business bosses. Lau Lapides: Oh, that's so fabulous. I'm so happy for you. Anne Ganguzza: Thank Lau Lapides: Congratulations. Anne Ganguzza: you. Yay, thank you. Lau Lapides: Big yay. I love that you got my jazz hands. Whoo. Anne Ganguzza: Thank Lau Lapides: It's really Anne Ganguzza: you. Lau Lapides: awesome. I do have to qualify one thing you said for Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: the listeners and that you said you did nothing. Anne Ganguzza: Oh, well. Lau Lapides: You actually have 25 years behind you that Anne Ganguzza: You're right. Lau Lapides: led up to that moment that made that prospect. clients life really fast and easy Anne Ganguzza: Yes. Lau Lapides: so that they didn't move on to the next person. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: So I just wanted to catch you on Anne Ganguzza: Thank Lau Lapides: that because Anne Ganguzza: you, thank you Lau Lapides: you're Anne Ganguzza: for Lau Lapides: so Anne Ganguzza: that. Lau Lapides: used to Anne Ganguzza: Yes, Lau Lapides: being fabulous Anne Ganguzza: I know. Lau Lapides: that you think you're doing nothing when really you've done all the work leading Anne Ganguzza: Well, Lau Lapides: up to that moment. Anne Ganguzza: and I'll Lau Lapides: Right? Anne Ganguzza: tell you, and I did do the work on my website, my storefront that made that available, right? I'm always saying that you can have the best voice in the world, but it doesn't do you any good if people don't know about you. And one of the easiest Lau Lapides: That's right. Anne Ganguzza: and quickest ways that people can find out information about you and your product and contact you is that website. And so many people put that website on the back burner. Or they're like, I don't have the money to invest. Guys, I'm here to tell you, you have to do that. If you are a business in 2023 or for the past 10 years, if you've been a business, you really need to have that storefront. You need to have that website. It is critical. And I always tell people, don't skimp on it. We talk about investing in our business all the time. And it is one area I think you need to invest. And I've invested over the years, thousands of dollars. I don't want to say that it's super, super expensive. It can be. I'm a big believer in presentation. Really matters. Presentation matters. And so yes, can you do your own website? Sure. Are you a website designer by trade? Maybe not. So I tend to. try to make it as presentable and as professional as possible so that it really makes an impression. Lau Lapides: Yeah, it pops. Yours always pops and it just comes right out at you. So I'm not surprised that you have this huge brand that's looking at you now because you look like a huge brand. You have to you have to Anne Ganguzza: Mm. Lau Lapides: project exactly Anne Ganguzza: Yes. Lau Lapides: the karma and the boomerang that you want to get back. You have to really be honest about that. And when someone says what you just said, Annie, like, oh, I don't have the money for that. Well, make the money. Go Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: go Anne Ganguzza: Oh, Lau Lapides: do Anne Ganguzza: please. Lau Lapides: whatever you need. Wash cars. take care of puppies and Anne Ganguzza: Yes, Lau Lapides: flip pancakes Anne Ganguzza: yes, Lau Lapides: to make the money Anne Ganguzza: wash Lau Lapides: so that you Anne Ganguzza: cars, Lau Lapides: look Anne Ganguzza: clean Lau Lapides: like Anne Ganguzza: houses, Lau Lapides: that. Anne Ganguzza: do whatever you gotta Lau Lapides: Whatever, Anne Ganguzza: do, but get Lau Lapides: we all Anne Ganguzza: that Lau Lapides: did Anne Ganguzza: money, Lau Lapides: it. Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: right? Yes, exactly, and I love that you said that because again, we all did that, right? I mean, Lau Lapides: We all did that. Anne Ganguzza: you'd be amazed at what I do for money, but that's another topic. But, Lau Lapides: By Anne Ganguzza: but. Lau Lapides: the way, websites are cheaper and quicker and Anne Ganguzza: Hmm Lau Lapides: easier to create now than ever. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: I remember the days Anne Ganguzza: and Lau Lapides: where it would take $10,000, Anne Ganguzza: yeah Lau Lapides: $15,000 Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: to make a website. Anne Ganguzza: and well, and I'm gonna mention this I'm gonna qualify this because I have a website that's very functional Okay, I have multiple websites number one I don't think you need to be held to just one website. Although, you know for my voiceover, right? I've got one website, but remember I've got multiple multiple divisions of my business, right? I've got the VO Boss, that's a completely different brand. I've got the VO Peeps, that's a different brand. I've got Nganguza Coaching, that's a different brand. I've got my Studio Cats, that's a different brand. So literally, for each of my brands, I have a separate website. And I, for, depending on what you wanna do with that website, especially because I sell products, I sell physical products, I sell digital products, I sell memberships. And so because of the extensive selling that I do on my website, and I think, hey, every VO needs to be able to sell on their website. You have to make it easy for people to pay you, right? Who wants to step through hoops to make a payment? I mean, Lau Lapides: No Anne Ganguzza: just Lau Lapides: friction. Anne Ganguzza: click, click and pay. Yeah, and same thing with all aspects of your website, right? People should be able to find what they need and buy as quick as possible. Right? Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: So my websites, and you know you were talking about, they used to cost a whole lot more money. You're right. Any voice actor can get a one page website, and I'm gonna talk a little bit more about that Lau Lapides: Hmm. Anne Ganguzza: a little later, but for not a tremendous amount of money. And I think there are templates out there that can make it look very professional. Lots of great people out there as well. For my websites, because of the extensive functionality, I have memberships, I have multiple ways to pay me, I have calendar appointments, scheduling going on, then that's gonna cost you a little bit more on the back end, but again, it is an investment in your business. Lau Lapides: Mm hmm. Yes. And I want to caution listeners, too, that as much as you want one and need one and eventually will have one, if not more than one, be careful of doing it prematurely. Because I know, Anne Ganguzza: Mm. Lau Lapides: Annie, you go through this. I go through this as on the coaching end. that will get a lot of newbie starters, like within the first month or Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: two, they're just literally investigating VO, they're just starting training, and already they're thinking about, oh, I need a website, I need Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: marketing, I need this. I'm like, wait a second, you don't even know if you like it. Anne Ganguzza: Well, Lau Lapides: You Anne Ganguzza: wait, Lau Lapides: don't even know if you wanna Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: do it yet. Anne Ganguzza: And wait till you get the product to market first, right? Because the whole idea of a website is that you have, well, I should say the whole idea of a voiceover website is that you have a product that you can market. Well, you want to make sure that you have the product first. That means get your coaching. Get your demo, because the demo's going to showcase that product, right? Make sure that you've got those things in place. But I would say it's never too late to start thinking about your website. Start thinking about a brand. But again, that's something that you'll discover as you go. And so I think a lot of times, if you start too early with that website, your branding is not quite finalized. And then that could be costly for you later on, because you could be thinking, oh, I really like this way to brand me. I'm going to use this tagline, or I'm going to use these colors. And then as you evolve in developing your voiceover product, you might say, oh, well, maybe that doesn't fit me as well as this one does. And then you're going to have to rebrand, and that's going to probably cost you more money. So absolutely start planning for it. But there's lots of development work you can do on the back end before it is out there and present on the web, on the interwebs, where people go to your website and they say, but I don't have, there's no demos. How do I hear you? Right? Lau Lapides: And be careful too, that once you do this, or at least the beginning stages of doing this, of saying, I see this all the time. Well, I have my website is up and out, I got my demos on there, I've got some training, I'm ready to go. I'm ready for the jobs, where's my work? Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: Be careful of that way of thinking, because on average, a business that's a startup business in any industry, takes a good three to five years to get Anne Ganguzza: Oh Lau Lapides: off Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: the ground, it just does. Anne Ganguzza: Oh yeah. Lau Lapides: So be careful of this, I'm ready to go. Where's my work kind Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: of mentality? Like you have to work at getting work. You have to earn it. You have Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: to reach out. You have to do the hard work labor of directing traffic to the website. Anne Ganguzza: Yes, Lau Lapides: The Anne Ganguzza: yes. Lau Lapides: website doesn't necessarily do it for you. You Anne Ganguzza: Exactly, Lau Lapides: have to direct Anne Ganguzza: exactly. Lau Lapides: people to the website, right? And... Anne Ganguzza: Exactly. Your content, right, that's out there is what helps to generate the SEO where people are searching for a specific, you know, product or a specific voice that hopefully, you know, it's getting increasingly. difficult that you show up on those pages, right? So if you're not getting good SEO with people finding you through the search engines, you can absolutely put content out there that is of interest to your potential clients. And that can mean social media. You can be entertaining on social media. You can put out blog articles on social media or on your website. You can then drive people to that website so that they can then have access to your demos, to a button where they can click and contact you and say, hey, I have this script, how much would it cost? And of course, I always like to make it easy Lau Lapides: Right. Anne Ganguzza: to pay as well. So absolutely driving. Lau Lapides: I always love to, I'll tell you, speaking as an agent, one of the big things that I'm asked is, how do I deal with driving someone to see my website? I say, easy, give me one link. It should be one link Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: navigation and drive me exactly, point me in exactly what you want me to see. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: right away. So Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: let's say I'm an agent. I am an agent. I don't want to go through all your pages. I don't want to scroll way down. I don't want to find the Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: demos. Anne Ganguzza: mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: For me, it's the commercial demo. Send me exactly to where the commercial demo Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: is. And then Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: if I have time and I want to scroll down, and oftentimes I do, I'll scroll, I'll Anne Ganguzza: Right. Lau Lapides: see what it looks like. It's kind of cool. But I'm not frustrated trying to find that particular item that I'm looking for. So really point. the people that you're driving in exactly Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: where they need to go so they're not kind of looking around figuring Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: it out, having trouble with navigation. Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Having trouble with navigation. Yeah, that's a big plus, is to be able to have concise information quickly available to the shopper. Now, I always make this comparison that when I shop online, and I love to shop online, I'm a shopper, okay? Lau Lapides: You're a shopaholic. Anne Ganguzza: So the free I kind of am so the first thing I do think about when you shop online, right? What is it that makes you click and buy right Lau Lapides: Mmm, Anne Ganguzza: number one? Lau Lapides: I Anne Ganguzza: It Lau Lapides: like Anne Ganguzza: has Lau Lapides: that. Anne Ganguzza: to be right for me. It has to be a professional looking website It has to really speak to me that this is what okay old Navy sells clothing and accessories And so therefore I was used old Navy, but it could be anything Nordstrom rag It could be all of my favorite places, Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: right? They have to absolutely when I get to that first page have to look professional. They can't be, you know, they have to be with the Lau Lapides: Right. Anne Ganguzza: current, they kind of have to be current trends, you know. It can't be like anything screaming, you know, blinking graphics like from the 90s or, you know, when websites were first made. It can't just be one big long, long page. It has to look professional. I have to be able to access the products that I want right away. I need to be able to find out information right away and I need to be able to maybe read, get more information, or look at pictures of it. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: And so for a voiceover, I listen to demos, listen to samples, maybe watch videos. And then I need to be able to do, OK, if I have questions, how am I going to get those questions answered? Is there an FAQ? Is there somebody I can contact that I can talk to? Is there a phone number, believe it or not? There are people who still like to talk on the phone, just saying. You know, I like to talk on the phone. When I need to find out information, like I literally. I bought a pair of glasses, there's a big surprise, and I needed to return them so that I could get a new pair of lenses, and I went to the website, they're like, well, we're sorry, we don't make those anymore, right? So you're gonna have to pick out new lenses, or you're gonna have to pick out new glasses, and I'm like, wait a minute, okay, now this is getting complex. So I literally was like, where's the phone number, right? So I got the phone number, I called customer service. So. Things like that, right? So for me, when I buy, what's important for you when you buy, when you go to a website? It looks professional, it's trustworthy, I feel as though I could put my credit card information in there and it wouldn't be stolen or compromised. And so you have to work on creating a business storefront on that website that is trustworthy, professional. and just easy to access and navigate. Lau Lapides: I love that word easy. Easy is the word we wanna keep in mind because as creatives, we wanna go into a lot of content, a lot of information, a lot of different directions because it's a nature of a lot of what we do, but yet the audience does not want that. The audience wants super quick, 10 second, find what I need, look it over fast, Anne Ganguzza: Or Lau Lapides: or, Anne Ganguzza: after that, if they Lau Lapides: or. Anne Ganguzza: want to find out more information, like how experienced are they? How have they been doing this a long time? Now I'm gonna ask you a lot as an agent, and for me also for casting people, a lot of times I will go to their website because it tells me a bunch about their brand. Just like when I research companies, when I'm researching companies so that I can voice their brand more effectively, I look at what is their website saying to me? What is their brand? Who is their audience? Do you, when it comes time to deciding who you might want to put on your roster, let's say, okay, you hear the commercial demo, but don't you also, if you've got, maybe you've got a similar voice, or maybe you're trying to find out if they have versatility in maybe another area, do you not continue to go through their website and or even their social media, right? I think your social media links got to be on there as well to kind of find out more about the person because before I let you speak, we always buy from people we know, like and trust. And that website is going to be the storefront of that in providing that information. Lau Lapides: Yes, I would say yes, and yes, and be Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: careful. Anything that's leading you to anything else, you've got the tentacles out there. So whatever you put on your website may lead you to other places, Anne Ganguzza: Sure. Lau Lapides: whether they're socials or articles or stories, whatever. I would just be careful. Just go through all of that. So play the role of someone who is landing on you and maybe looking at you for a job. Just put yourself Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: in their shoes and say, okay. Joe Smith, great. Let me go and investigate Joe Smith because Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: maybe I want to represent them. What are all the places that I'm led to? Anne Ganguzza: Sure. Lau Lapides: And are they good places? Are they Anne Ganguzza: Sure, Lau Lapides: not Anne Ganguzza: absolutely. Lau Lapides: good places? How do they represent you? Like, you have to be really careful about that. The panel that I was on at the conference that we just attended, one of the agents brought up, one of the casting brought up, you know, be careful of what's on your social media. Anne Ganguzza: Oh, gosh Lau Lapides: Be very Anne Ganguzza: yes. Lau Lapides: careful, Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: right? You may need a You may need, well, you can control that yourself, but you may need a reputation defender type Anne Ganguzza: Absolutely, Lau Lapides: of a service Anne Ganguzza: absolutely. Lau Lapides: to wipe out all your crap that you've done for 10 years, pay Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: him a thousand bucks or whatever it is, and clean your slate. Just like you and Anne Ganguzza: Well... Lau Lapides: I clean our closets and our, right? Clean your online Anne Ganguzza: Wait, Lau Lapides: slate, right? Anne Ganguzza: we are, look, we are celebrities, okay? I'm just saying, right? First of all, I'm manifesting, I'm manifesting. We are celebrities, right? We are Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: celebrities. And how many celebrities do you know have tarnished their brand, right, by something they've said or something that's gotten out on social media, right, that wasn't appropriate, okay? And so when a brand is going to hire you, a company's going to hire you to represent them, That is of concern to them, right? They don't wanna Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: be hiring people that are talking, talking badly or poorly Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: on social media or representing themselves poorly because then it's gonna represent the brand poorly. So it starts with your website, because again, if people don't know how to hire you, if they can't find you Lau Lapides: Yep. Anne Ganguzza: and they don't know, it's never going to happen. So that website is... a very, very worthwhile investment. And I'm gonna say, I wouldn't go for the cheapest website developer out there. I just wouldn't. There are some reasonably priced websites that you can, and so I guess the question to me would be, okay, is it good enough? Lau Lapides: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Anne Ganguzza: Well, okay, so for me, right, I don't know. Look at my websites. I spend the money. And I'm just saying, I'm not saying that my websites are the. well, I'm very proud of my websites. I made sure, it took me a long time to find my website designer, and I make sure that I'm refreshing, and I'm trying to update them, so that it is a professional-looking website, and I constantly get complimented on it. And I'm thinking to myself, well, I think that's wonderful, but you could have it too, right? It really comes down to Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: researching. you know, a good website designer, understanding who you are, what your brand is, what you want to put out there, right, in your storefront. And that requires a lot of work, guys. It's not a, oh, let's do this overnight. Let's get this, and let's just write a quick paragraph bio. Lau Lapides: No. Anne Ganguzza: No, this is something that really has to evolve. And like I said, if you can plan and you can start that planning sooner, I would recommend that, right? Because there's a lot of thought that goes into how you present yourself. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: And again, I am that type, I will spend the money, I will make the investment to present myself in the very best light possible, right? I wanna be better than every other website out there because I want there to be that little something that people say, you know what, I just, I'm gonna go with her. And again, I cannot tell you how many people who have found me on my website and said, wow, you are so impressed, and they go on about, you are so impressed, and I'm thinking to myself, okay, I'm in. And you know, I've been doing this for a while, thank you. And but in my head, I'm going, okay, but they're going on about it because of the presence, right, that I project. And every one of you can project that presence and manifest that celebrity, right, on your website, because that is going to make such a statement about who you are and what kind of work you're going to be doing for that company. And of course, I am a celebrity, so I manifest it. I'm just saying, Lau Lapides: I'm all Anne Ganguzza: right? Lau Lapides: over that. Anne Ganguzza: Right, Lau Lapides: And Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: I do think there is something to you get what you pay for. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: I think, Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: you know, but be careful in Anne Ganguzza: Yes. Lau Lapides: who you pay and who you entrust. Like you really have to look at their work, look at their portfolio, see Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: if they're someone that you want to trust with your brand and are they capable? Are they competent? Are they fast, the designer? Are they someone who's gonna stay with you? Or are they just wham bam, done, here, pay Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: me, I'm gone and you never Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: find them again? I would suggest you go with someone who, to some degree, can help you manage it, even though Anne Ganguzza: Yes, Lau Lapides: you're gonna manage Anne Ganguzza: I Lau Lapides: your Anne Ganguzza: agree. Lau Lapides: own site. You Anne Ganguzza: I agree. Lau Lapides: do need an assistant Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: manager, someone who you can connect with, who has that artist mentality and say, Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: yeah, I'm gonna be available to you for help with plugins or help with the backend Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: or Anne Ganguzza: mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: help with stuff that you're just not. capable or competent to do. I also wanted to make mention to any that in regards to like your different websites Be Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: be aware that if you're doing more than one website or even on your one website Don't confuse us that you're in different careers Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: different vocations So what you're talking about is all under the umbrella of your company. Anne Ganguzza: A voiceover. Lau Lapides: It all Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: works hand-in-hand It all is services that make sense to being a voiceover coach and on Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: and on. But don't tell me you're a nurse, don't tell Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: me you're a Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: landscaper, and Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: be careful Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: of talking about your bartending site. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: Because that Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: side hustles that are quiet and Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: underground and for you to have. And I see that a lot with talent actually. Sometimes on the same website, they'll be telling me something that confuses me. Like, I'm like, hmm, are they career? Is this Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: something Anne Ganguzza: Is this Lau Lapides: that Anne Ganguzza: their Lau Lapides: they're Anne Ganguzza: full Lau Lapides: serious Anne Ganguzza: time? Lau Lapides: about? Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, exactly. That's Lau Lapides: Right? Anne Ganguzza: a really wonderful point. Yeah. So you want to make it, you want to make it, you know, that this is your... professional, this is your vocation, this is what you do. Even if you're doing it part time, right? You don't necessarily have to mention that you're doing it part time, but what you showcase to the world is that you are a professional and that you can turn things around within a certain amount of time and that there is no question about that, right? So Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: if you're going to put content on your website that makes us question that, then I might go to another talent. Now, if I had to choose, right? from one talent and I like their voices and I'm like, oh, I like, I love this voice and I love this voice. What's the next thing you're gonna do? Law, look at social media, look at websites, see what they've done before, right? Do they Lau Lapides: Yep. Anne Ganguzza: have other experience that might be, especially if you don't know, right? When I don't know a product and I've never purchased from a store before, I'm looking at testimonials. I am looking at reviews. And of course, that's something that I think is super helpful to have on your website, right? Testimonials, reviews, you know, of your work, because how do I trust, right? And not just reviews on the website. Oh, I think that's a great place to start, because I think a lot of people can actually, you know, put reviews and make them up. But I certainly don't. I don't, but I'm a testimonial. I don't even know what the word is for it, but I am constantly asking for testimonials. But not just putting it on my website, but putting them in blog articles, putting them out there on social media so that they kind of just become all over the place where it becomes a good word of mouth. And also I want to back that up, right, with performance so that people are actually talking about me. And talking about me, that's probably the best, I think one of the best things. that you can do for your career is get people talking about you in a good way, of course. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: And talking about, God, she's so talented, or I love her voice, she just executed for me and I would hire her again and again and again. And that is people talking, right? In groups and forums, you know, good word of mouth, I'm going to say word of mouth. But to get to the word of mouth, people have to know you, right? And so you have to put yourself out there. first and foremost on a website, right? And then social media, and then back that up with good performance, with reliable, solid work. And then, then after a certain amount of time, hopefully people start talking about you, right? And then that becomes one of the best referrals and best ways of getting the gig ever. Lau Lapides: I love that. I love that. I mean, as an agent, the first thing I'm going to go to Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: on your website are jobs. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: So Anne Ganguzza: mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: if I see visuals, I'll always go to the visuals first. Actually, before your Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: demo, sometimes I'm a very visual person. So if I see videos, I'm going to run on the assumption those are actual jobs of some kind. I'm going to poke on one or two videos and see if they look like they're professionally produced. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: If they do, then I'm like, oh, this guy, he's selling to you. OK, all right, perfect. Then I Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: kind of listen to the demo, but I already know. He's a top pro, he's already Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: in the Anne Ganguzza: yeah, Lau Lapides: market, on the national market, and he's Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: doing stuff. I just think that's the nature of what we do, moving fast, Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: working at a business level, and working with top notch Anne Ganguzza: And visuals. Lau Lapides: customers and clients, and visuals, yes, Anne Ganguzza: I love that you said Lau Lapides: visuals Anne Ganguzza: visuals because, Lau Lapides: are really important. Cleanliness, Anne Ganguzza: yeah, yes. Lau Lapides: space, structure. A lot of times I'll see the designer put the content in, but it looks messy. It looks... Anne Ganguzza: Mm. Lau Lapides: it looks like it's not formatted well, it looks like it's hard to read, Anne Ganguzza: Mm. Lau Lapides: the font is too small or the colors are wrong. Things like that sort of get in the way of the messaging. So Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: I think one of the more important things is, yes, visuals, but keep it clean, keep it fresh, keep it streamlined, keep it open, keep it easy to read. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: Above the fold is good. It doesn't mean I won't scroll, I'll scroll, but keep the most important stuff. boom Anne Ganguzza: above Lau Lapides: when I Anne Ganguzza: the Lau Lapides: land Anne Ganguzza: fold. Lau Lapides: on it, it's right there. Your Toyota commercial is right there. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: I Anne Ganguzza: mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: don't have to look for it, you Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: know? Anne Ganguzza: And again, I like the, like you said, visual. I think visual is so important these days, because again, most of Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: us have less than a seven second attention span, and that Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: includes people who are looking for people to hire. And so if you can put the most important stuff above the fold, make it visual. If you just have commercial demo and it's a one, gosh, I'm a big fan of breaking up your demos into each spot and then labeling those spots with, let's say, Ford F-150, Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: powerful, motivational, that kind of thing. Hogue Hospital, compassionate, warm. So putting those descriptors on the individual spots as well, because people don't click to listen. Sometimes we're not in a spot where we can listen, although you hope that people that are hiring you are going to be listening. But sometimes visually, right? Or they'll see a video of a Ford commercial that you did. And so that alone, and then they'll click and go to the YouTube of it, right? And then maybe on your YouTube channel, you'll have a playlist of all of the work that you've completed. So that kind of just helps and lends itself to your professional credibility. And visual, visual. And Lau Lapides: Peace Anne Ganguzza: again, Lau Lapides: out. Anne Ganguzza: visual, not just in visual videos, but also visual words saying, Ford F-150. They know, oh, she does automotive, right? Or a Hogue hospital, oh, she does health care. Or, you know, I don't know, Dominion Energy. You know, oh, there's an energy spot. I'm an energy company, so I'm gonna click and listen to that spot. Or Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: fast food, right? So people can just get to what they need to quicker, and visually it's there, boom, when it shows up. And then also, you've got the media behind it. And absolutely, I'd say, put everything above the fold that's important, and yeah, make it clean. And I'm gonna say that... Oh gosh, you can think that you can do it yourself. I don't know how many people are like, well, I'm just gonna do it myself because I don't have the money. I'm gonna Lau Lapides: Right. Anne Ganguzza: do it, I'm gonna make my own website. There's a template, I can, you know, Wix has got time. First of all, I'm just gonna say, like, okay,
Mythbusters Part 2
Nov 28 2023
Mythbusters Part 2
In part 2 of our Mythbusters series, we delve deep into why investing in a professional demo producer and voice coach makes a significant difference in your VO success. We highlight the essence of genre proficiency, self-direction, and social media, and why it's a better choice to develop these skills with professional guidance rather than attempting to do it yourself. We also dive into the nitty-gritty of essential voiceover artist's tools, shedding light on the need for a quality home recording set-up and a good noise floor over splurging on an expensive microphone.  0:00:01 - Intro It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VEO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza  0:00:20 - Anne Hey, hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss podcast and the real boss series. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, along with my real boss co -host, Mr. Tom Dheere. Hey, tom, welcome to the show.  0:00:32 - TOm Hello Ann, Thanks for having me back.  0:00:34 - Anne Oh, Tom, we had the best episode last week on mythbusters busting the myths about voiceover and telling the real truth. So we did part one, we're back for part two, and boy do we have a lot of great stuff to talk about. Yeah, I would like to start off with oh gosh, it's just such a big topic these days Social media and voice seekers. Is it going to get us work by posting on social media, Tom? What do you think?  0:01:05 - TOm Okay, there's like 15 qualifiers I gotta have when I'm gonna say this. I hear you. So at the beginning, I'm gonna say that, for the most part, voice seekers are paying absolutely no attention to anything that any of us are doing on social media. Now, with that in mind, that's a very broad brush stroke and for the most part, they are not paying attention to your hey listen, check out this explainer video I just did. Aren't I awesome? They're not paying attention to any of that stuff. For the most part, if a voice seeker is vetting you via your social media presence, it's to either see if you're an NDA violator, to see if you're a client basher oh, can you believe this stupid sentence they made me pronounce, which I see every day on social media or if you're some form of political or religious whack job that has the potential to damage their reputation. Yes, exactly.  0:01:58 - Anne Oh, absolutely, tom. And I'm gonna say, first of all, why don't we step back and say how do you engage on social media? Like, for me, it's all about entertainment, right? Yes, at this point there's so much out there. If I'm going to social media, it's going to be looking for an influencer that might be showing me about the brand that I'm interested in. I might be looking at clothes or makeup or curling irons and I want to find out how they work and if they work great.  Now, I'm not saying that a voice actor can't be on social media and demonstrate that you have a great voice. However, I think that whole direct sale method which doesn't work for voiceover, right, whenever it's supposed to be sellier or an answery also pertains to social media. So that means just provide entertainment and as a hashtag maybe, or in the notes maybe, throw in that you're a voice actor, because people buy from people they know, like and trust, and that, I think, is what you use social media for and so entertain people, give them something of value, and then they'll pay attention and then maybe they'll say, oh, you know what she's got? A great voice. I love her personality. I bet you sound great doing this campaign.  0:03:07 - TOm Yeah, so there's my social media presence as a voice actor and there's my social media presence as the video strategist. So, putting the video strategist over there, which is a different animal, as a voice actor, I feel that my job is to just to demonstrate my humanity.  I like that because I always tell my students be a good human, collect good humans, demonstrate your humanity online, which has a lot of virtue on multiple fronts. Well, one right now and this is something we could talk about is that I think more and more voice aegers are going to look to see that, when someone submits an audition, that they're actually not an AI, that they're an actual human being.  0:03:39 - Anne Oh, I agree.  0:03:39 - TOm So looking around and going okay, this person is a human. Okay, cool. Yeah, that's a small percentage, but I think that percentage will grow.  0:03:45 - Anne That's how I've met my clients actually right and are they real? Now see, I've got another idea for an episode. It's like have you ever not gotten paid right? Well, I've met my clients in a lot of ways and that's one way make sure they're human. I might actually pick up a phone. Just saying I might pick up a phone to see if there's a human on the other end of it.  0:04:02 - TOm Right. So demonstrating my humanity as a voice actor is just people work with people that they like people work with people that they trust people work with people that aren't putting on airs.  0:04:14 - Anne And are authentic.  0:04:15 - TOm Yeah, so I'm a geek. I like comic books. I talk about comic books and superheroes. I like comic book movies and stuff. So a lot of my content is talking about that. I live in New York City, I walk around New York City with my wife, I take pictures of interesting things I see in New York City and, yes, I do occasionally do a social media post pertaining to some voiceover work that I've done, but it's never about me. It's always about the product or the service, the client or whatever. So, for example, I got a one voice award nomination. Didn't win, but that's okay. I was in honor to be nominated about it's a public service announcement I did for the Humane Society of America that talked about the 4000 Beagles they rescued from that lab in Virginia last year.  This PSA announced that all 4000 Beagles got adopted, so I got cast to do that and what I said in social media is that I have owned two Beagles. I'm a dog lover, I've owned two Beagles, so being given the honor and privilege of narrating that spot meant a lot for me as Tom Dheere human being Not about don't I sound wonderful in this and I got engagement through that. I got positive responses through both voice seekers and fellow voice actors, and just friends and family that are also following me on social media. So that's a way to do it.  0:05:32 - Anne I think it just is not one of those things where you're going to create an ad that says, hey, I'm a voice actor, let me voice your copy and then run that out on social media. It doesn't work that way. I think there's more of the relationship. I mean. To me, social media has become all about relationship building and really just entertainment, because we are just inundated with content and chaos, online material, and so I think, for me, I go to social media to kind of just get away from it all in a way, and I seek out those things that entertain me or provide value for what I'm looking for.  Again, for me, I'm a big shopper, I'm a big online shopper, so now I'm looking for influencers and I'm looking for video of influencers, and I will say that my example of somebody who's so effective at really creating business for himself is Stefan Johnson, who does a series on TikTok and Instagram where he talks about food and he does like food reviews and he's funny as hell and just the fact that he's entertaining he's funny as hell.  He's got maybe that hashtag voice actor. Everybody has come to know and love him because he's sent thousands of videos and he's got like a billion followers, and so, yes, that works amazingly well. And, tom, I know that we had discussed this earlier, but let's say you are the voice in a video game or the voice of a national brand, and the other thing, you want to make sure that you are on social media, that you're being careful that you're not, like crazy, bashing other people or doing something that would risk the brand integrity of the company that you work for. I mean, one of those famous cases back in the day when I think the first thing was, oh gosh, it was the Aflac. Was that the Aflac commercial?  the duck and people that just in a minute you can ruin a brand by saying the wrong thing or doing the wrong thing on social media. So I think you have to be very careful.  0:07:27 - TOm I'll give you a name. Dropy example, because I'm very excited about it, is that in a few weeks the Inspector Gadget video game releases and I am Inspector Gadget.  0:07:35 - Anne Yeah, you congrats which.  0:07:36 - TOm I'm very thank you. I'm very excited about that and I had been talking to my business.  0:07:40 - Anne You are such an Inspector Gadget, I can totally, totally see that Go go Gadget roller skates. Well cast, well cast.  0:07:48 - TOm Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, and so, as I was trying to plot out a marketing campaign, I quickly realized it's not a good idea, because I don't want to interfere with the brand that is, inspector gadget and I don't want to interfere with the video game production company that did it and I don't want to cause any potential issues with my manager got me that audition that cast me so I will piggyback retweet.  Yes, yes, absolutely, whatever they do very smart and say, and again, it won't be about me, it'll be. I watched inspector gadget when I was a kid and it was such an honor to be able to be the voice of a character that I loved listening.  0:08:29 - Anne Tom, that's so awesome. I'm so happy for you. I mean thank you. They don't call you the strategist for nothing. I'm just saying that's a really wise strategy to retreat, retreat. Well, it is a treat reacts now, I think yeah, reax what is it?  0:08:42 - TOm yeah, what is that? Or?  0:08:43 - Anne thread, re, thread it forward, that repost, all that stuff is really wonderful, okay. So now I've got another myth. Okay, that I hear all the time. Okay, coaches and demo producers, can we just make our own demos? Can we just DIY? I can do it. You don't have to spend all the money. Don't fall prey to the predators and look full disclaimer here. I am a coach and I am a demo producer, so we are talking about this. However, I do want to address that you know a lot of people Will be crucified for doing their own demo. I can certainly throw in my opinion as to why. I think maybe that's for some people, maybe that's okay, but I'm gonna say the vast majority. There's a good reason why we are out here producing demos right.  0:09:28 - TOm So most of the time when a person decides they're gonna record their own demos because they can't afford to hire somebody to do yes Percentage of those it's out of just arrogance. I can just do this myself. I'll just go in my bathroom and close the door and just do it, and I will have no training and I will be recording in a not good environment and I'm just gonna direct myself because I can do this.  0:09:49 - Anne Yeah, I have the technology.  0:09:54 - TOm This is what I tell my students and when I do speaking engagements and conferences. The virtue of a demo producer is the virtue of a demo producer like an Is not necessarily the finished product of the shiny demo in your hand. I think it's three things. Number one and or other quality demo producers is going to teach you genre proficiency, how to narrate e-learning as opposed to video games, as opposed to audio books as opposed to medical. So what muscles do you need to flex to be able to do this particular genre well? And there are always tips and tricks and nuances and subtleties for every genre, and an experience coach and demo producer like and can teach you that.  The second thing and this is a big reason why you shouldn't record your own is what I call ism detection. Everybody has their own ism. Some people talk fast, some people talk slow, some people upward and flex, some downward and flex. Some have regionalism and has not your ears so she can hear your isms, identify your isms, talk to you about why do you have those isms and is it a problem that you need to eliminate? Is it something that you need to learn how to toggle on and off like a switch, or is it something that you can use to enhance your performance and possibly enhance your brand. Sure, good demo coach like and, can do that.  And the third one is the art and science of self direction. Yes, oh yes, you have to learn how to self direct. It is practically impossible to teach yourself how to self direct in a vacuum. Yeah, and and other quality demo producers can teach you how to do that. So it's not the finished product, it's all the things that you learn. That gets you to that finished product or makes working with a demo producer important.  save your money, be patient. That's another thing, ann, about most voice actors coming into the industry is that they are distressingly impatient and they make big mistakes by spending all this money on products and services and coaches that will not move their voiceover business for because they're so desperate to do it.  0:11:51 - Anne Or I'm going to say they come in and they don't have any money to spend and I don't look. I'm not here to shame people who are financially you know what I mean looking for a new resource or revenue stream. But like in any good business, tom and I say this over and over again you do have to invest, and one of the reasons why you would save to make an investment, tom, you said everything so eloquently and so well that really you don't have ears yet, and so while technically you may be able to go, even if you had a nice studio and you bought the best equipment and you have a good sound and you're a musician right and you have the capability to put things together, you know the software you don't necessarily have the ear and you don't necessarily have the experience or understand what content is driving this demo. How are you telling that story? How is that being put together to really showcase your acting in its very best light?  Because if you're new to the industry, you don't know right, you don't know what that is yet, and it's hard for you to hear that or have an ear for that, and so that's one of the best reasons to hire a professional. It's kind of like look, I worked in technology and I worked in computers and running our computer department and I did a website for years for the school district that I worked for. But do I make pretty websites? I know functionally what I want to do, but I cannot do the graphics. It's not what I was trained to do and so, therefore, hire somebody that's trained and then that's what they do all day, every day.  They work in the industry. They know what's trending, they know what's current, and that's why it really helps to have a vetted coach and demo producer, not just one that's going to take your money and give you a demo after a weekend. Again, that's the big misnomer is that I can do a couple of sessions and then get a great demo after a weekend. Well, if you've not spent any time actually studying and practicing to be a professional voiceover actor, you really don't have any business making a demo, because that demo, as Cliff Zelman always likes to say I always like to quote Cliff is a promise right that you're going to be able to recreate that sound any given day or night when you're being requested to. And so, if? Well, I guess if you do your own, you could probably reproduce that sound, but still I feel like without the coaching you're not going to be able to get to the sound. That is probably what most clients want without the work without the work involved.  right, you got to spend more than four hours of your life on voiceover to be professional, right, I'm just saying Nobody thinks they can pick up a violin immediately and start playing at a concert level.  0:14:25 - TOm But everybody that has an interesting voice thinks they can start doing voiceovers professionally immediately.  0:14:30 - Anne And the other thing is self-study right, like coaching. Like you can buy these online workshops and programs and I'm all for online education. I have a VO peeps group. I have my own introduction to voiceover kind of web series. I know, tom, you've got videos that you sell and I'm not saying that you cannot do that to just buy that and learn voiceover on your own. However, I'm going to say there's great value in having a coach, work with you one-on-one, so that they can really assess your voice vocally, brand your voice and have that set of ears that can tell you oh I hear this regionalism here. Oh, I hear this, I don't believe you. I need you to make that script more believable. So there's a lot to be said for having a valuable extra set of ears on the other end of that and to help coach you through the things that you don't know yet.  0:15:18 - Tom Yeah.  0:15:19 - Anne All right, and speaking of which, when we want to sell ourselves, right Tom, there's something called a website which, for most people, most of my students, is like an afterthought. They're like, oh yeah, I got to get a website. Well, I can make my own website. I can do a template on, I don't know, weebly or Wix or whatever that is. What are your?  0:15:36 - TOm thoughts. Well, it's funny because people have these assumptions coming into the industry I need an agent, I need to join the union and for many of them, it's I need a website, or it's I don't need a website because I'm going to get a big honking agent immediately and they'll just do all the work for me. The problem is is that most voice actors don't understand why they need a website.  0:15:59 - Anne And why a voice actor needs a website is for a couple of reasons.  0:16:03 - TOm One is for just credibility. Just so if someone looks you up or if you market to them and there's a website to go to, it's like, oh okay, this is a human, possibly, hopefully, human being, and here's their website and here's their demos and here's their verbiage and there's a picture of them maybe or not, or a little about page or something, or something like that, and it's like, oh okay, this is who they are. So credibility is one thing. And then, if they get that website, there's another myth, which is people are going to find me through my website. They're just going to look stuff up on Google, bing, yahoo or whatever and find you. And that is, 99% of the time, patently false, because there are literally tens of thousands of voiceover websites out there. So your job as a voice actor is to build the website and then drive traffic to the website through your direct and indirect marketing strategy.  0:16:55 - Anne And make it functional so that people can actually find you, contact you and hire you and pay you. Yes, that's it, yes, and to that end your website.  0:17:05 - TOm The most important thing that your website needs to do is one thing have downloadable demos.  0:17:10 - Anne Yes, I'm the big believer in first impressions Really make a difference.  You know, if I go to a website and I feel like, oh God, this is just like every other website I've seen, and it's a little bit like antiquated or if I cannot access the information I need right away and functionally be able to navigate it easily, and also it has to be pleasant to look at For me. I mean, gosh, I worked in technology for so many years and I actually ran the web servers Back in the day. I knew Jumala and I used to put content into our websites, but I certainly am not a graphic designer by design at all. I mean, I didn't go to school for it. I know what I like, I know what looks pretty, and so for me to think that I could make it look beautiful, I'm gonna hire somebody that does that as a full-time gig and that I believe first impressions are everything, because when I go to a website, it immediately establishes an idea of the brand right, of who I'm dealing with, who I'm talking to. They're human, like you said, and I get a sense of who they are, and it also gives me a sense of trust. Will I trust this person to click the button to pay them or click the button to contact them? And that's what I want Because, again, I'm a big online shopper just saying God, people are gonna have this idea about me, but all I do?  I mean, gosh, the pandemic didn't help at all, right? So all I did was click, click, click, bye, bye, bye, because we weren't going anywhere, right? So online shopping is a big thing for people. And again, convenience, and also like, okay, should I? What do I feel about this product? How do I feel about this product? Is it good? Am I gonna buy something that's worth it, that's gonna be worth my money, and that is something that your website is a showcase of your brand, your value, your worth. And if you don't wanna invest in that, in that look, in that first impression, well, you might be losing business.  0:18:59 - TOm Right. Everything, ann, you said is 1,000% correct and I'm gonna give all you VO bosses out there a little bit of a break. So think about this the vast majority of the work that you're gonna get when you're early in your voiceover career is online casting sites. Right, you join online casting sites, you do auditions, which is short term. It's not short term because I'm still on them, but I'm saying is it's the easiest way to get casting opportunities is through online casting sites. While you are developing your auditioning abilities, your rate negotiation abilities, your DAW abilities, your project management skills on online casting sites, you can start with a Wix or a Weebly or a Squarespace free site. For starters, this is a basic, basic landing page and as you are slowly building your direct and indirect marketing skills, and evolving your brand and your brand and your portfolio.  Now you can start to take those gigs that you've booked, the brand that you have developed and slowly layer and build that website. So this isn't something that you should feel pressure to have perfectly right out of the gate, because once you get that shiny demo in your hand, you probably have no idea what your brand is and you have no idea what the industry is going to say to you I thought I needed to do commercials when I started the industry and then I found out that my niche is primarily e-learning, so it's okay.  Start with a basic website Wix and Weebly, squarespace, whatever and then, as you are developing yourself, do everything that Ann just said to get your website to a point. When you are ready to really hit the ground with direct and indirect marketing strategies and driving traffic to your website, it will be ready.  0:20:39 - Anne Yeah, totally agree, totally agree. And people always say, well, should I do my website? I'm just beginning voiceover. I always say it's a good idea to start thinking about it because a website evolves over time. I mean it's not like you're going to have a perfect website overnight. God, if I were to show you pictures of my initial websites, whew mine is the worst. And how it's evolved.  0:20:57 - TOm You know the Internet Archive. You can go to Internet Archive. Yes, yes, yes, yes, once in a while for fun, I'll go and look at mine, because tomdeercom was first created 2002. So my website is 20, it's going to be 21 years old in a couple of weeks and it is a dumpster fire.  0:21:11 - Anne I had a microphone. I had a microphone as a logo, of course, with a flourishy thing coming out of it, and I'm not saying hey look some people have microphones for logos or built into the logo. I'm not bashing it, but it was. Every other website that was a voice actor had that microphone.  And yeah but that's okay. I mean, we learn, we evolve, and we evolve along with our brand. So, yes, all right, here's another one, and the last one I think that we'll have time for, and that is I need a 416. I need a U87. I need a TLM 103. I need really good equipment. Now I am speaking on a 416, but I will tell you that it took me 10 years to get that. So do I need great equipment, especially now because everybody says, since the pandemic, our home studios have to be like perfect, we have to have good sound for our additions, otherwise we may not get cast. What are your thoughts, tom?  0:21:59 - TOm I think it's a parallel between developing that website and developing your home recording setup. I started home recording in 2006 and I'm only on my third microphone.  0:22:09 - Anne Oh my God, me too. Oh my God, oh my God, really that is crazy.  0:22:12 - TOm Wow, that's so weird, okay, okay.  0:22:14 - Anne Wow, at2020, rode NT1A and then TLM 103 and then 416.  0:22:20 - TOm My first one was a Samson something I don't even remember what it was. And then my second one. It's an AKG perception 420. It's in my closet because it's my backup mic. And then my third mic is the 416 I'm talking to right now, which I got this in 2016. So I've had this microphone for about seven and a half years. Yeah, so I worked up to it. It's crazy, because you can't spend too much money on a microphone. You want to spend $10,000 on a microphone. You can, but how many people?  0:22:50 - Anne need that no.  0:22:50 - TOm You can start with just a basic functional microphone.  0:22:54 - Anne I have recommendations on my video strategy, just your page.  0:22:56 - TOm And I know Ann has recommendations, so I suggest you check out both of them to check out some options, because there's a price range. But the other side of that is that, yes, when a voice seeker is listening to your audition, they're not just listening to your performance, they're listening to your home recording setup, because almost 90, almost 100% of the time these days you're going to be booking your gigs at home, so it's important to have a good sounding studio.  It's important to have a good standing, but your microphone is not as important as the treatment of where the microphone is, because if you buy a microphone, that's too good upfront and you have a lousy recording environment it's going to pick up every single flaw in your setup.  0:23:39 - Anne I like how you really specified that, because I completely agree with you. Your environment, I think is, even is the most important.  0:23:45 - TOm Absolutely, because your microphone is only as good or bad as the environment that the microphone is in.  0:23:50 - Anne So that could take a little pressure off you so invest in that first is what I said, because then you can get a cheap microphone and it'll sound great for the most part. Well, maybe not complete, but it'll sound a whole lot better. It'll work.  0:24:02 - TOm The output will be more comparable, because all you really need is just clean audio with a decent noise floor, no major buzzes or hums. And also, you know, on a sidebar, don't worry about EQ processing, mastering and all that stuff. I don't know what you do for your signal chain and stuff, ann, but I have almost nothing on mine. My clients want raw audio.  0:24:25 - Anne I have an Apollo and literally and just my 416.  0:24:29 - TOm Yeah, I got my 416 and my Mo2, m2 and that's it no crazy stuff.  0:24:33 - Anne I mean, I do have a stack. I think it's important to have you know a stack that you can run to kind of clean up your audio a little bit.  0:24:39 - TOm I do too.  0:24:40 - Anne But yeah, I mean absolutely. But I will say that in this studio, right, I love my studio, Tim Tippets, love, love, love, love my studio.  Custom built by Tim, custom built by Tim. I literally could bring any mic I have. As a matter of fact, I have a USB AT2020 in here that I use for other applications because it only works with a USB mic. It sounds great in here and so, like I'm saying, is that you don't want to have a completely cheap mic? I mean you can tell the difference, but I will say that it took me almost 10 years before I worked up to a TNL103, but I had to have the environment first and then I could hear the actual difference between my NT1A, which was great, which worked for me for six years. I made a lot of money with that microphone in a decent environment, and that's a really reasonable priced mic, as well as your audio interface, which I'm not a big fan of. The Scarlett Focusrite just because for a while they had cheap components, they were introducing hissing and weird noises. I love the UR22, it's 169 bucks.  0:25:40 - TOm That's the Steinberg.  0:25:41 - Anne The Steinberg yeah.  0:25:42 - TOm Yeah, I had the UR12, it was great.  0:25:44 - Anne It worked for years and then I just upgraded to an Apollo, which I love it, but it's also flighty and a little bit it's a little bit flighty with my operating system, but that's okay. I mean I love it. But I think that you can absolutely get away with a reasonably priced microphone, as long as your environment is good and other equipment.  0:26:03 - TOm Right, and as you get more work, you will be reinvesting in your training, you'll be reinvesting in your website and you'll be reinvesting in your gear and specifically your microphone. So, it's okay to start with a cost-effective microphone. You'll get better once down the road.  0:26:15 - Anne Absolutely, absolutely Well. And then, once you do have I've traded right you have a good microphone. It lasts for years. Like gosh, I've had my 416 for I don't know how many years and it goes traveling with me too. I mean, I pull it out, it goes traveling for years, so it's not like you need a new microphone every year, although if you're a tech geek, I mean.  0:26:35 - TOm Well, some people collect microphones just because it's fun, and if you wanna do that, you can afford it.  0:26:38 - Anne great it's like me, I have lipstick color clothes, boots, shoes, handbags. Yeah, I need the new handbag. I need the new mic.  0:26:45 - TOm You need two. Yeah, you need one to talk into and you need a backup in case something horrible happens Exactly backup's great, Some have more than one if there's genre reasons, but the majority of people only really need one microphone and then have one as a backup in case something goes wrong.  0:26:59 - Anne All right, I love this conversation, tom. Thank you again for busting the mists via bosses. Don't believe everything you hear and come to the source. Come to the real boss source. And that's with Tom and I for this series. You guys, as individuals, you can have a big impact, and as a group, you can have even more of an impact and contribute to the growth of our communities in ways never before possible. Find out more at 100voiceshoocareorg to learn how and big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl you too can connect and network like bosses. Find out more at IPDTLcom. You guys have an amazing week, be real and we'll see you next week. Bye.  0:27:44 - OUtro Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, ann Gangusa, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to Coast connectivity via IPDTL.  Transcribed by https://podium.page
Custom Boss Website with Jim Fronk
Nov 21 2023
Custom Boss Website with Jim Fronk
How do you turn a lifelong passion for music, radio, and video games into a successful career in voice acting? Join me as I chat with Jim Fronk, a seasoned radio veteran who transitioned into voice acting, entertaining people with his dynamic performances and engaging characters.  But that's not all, Jim’s talents extend beyond the microphone. He's also a whizz in website development, skills he's utilized to build successful websites for fellow voice actors. He delves deep into the magic of website creation, including the critical elements of a voiceover website and how you can create a one-page website in record time. Get ready to be inspired, entertained, and better yet, educated by Jim's wealth of knowledge and experience in the voice acting industry. Don't miss out! About Jim Jim has always been creative and secretively a tech geek. While working at radio stations, he gravitated towards graphic arts and webmaster duties. Through the years he created websites, not only for some of his ventures but for other radio friends and their DJ/entertainment side hustles. When Jim entered the VO world, he was amazed at how much it cost to have a basic cookie-cutter website built for a voice actor. So Jim created his 3-Hour Learn-By-Doing Website Creation Class. For a fraction of the cost, he teaches you how to create, update, and expand your own VO website as your business expands. Check out www.WebsitesForVO.com for more details. 00:01 - Intro (Other) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a V-O boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.  00:20 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Hey everyone, welcome to the V-O Boss podcast. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and today I am very excited to be here with a very special guest, our 20-plus year radio vet turned voice actor, Jim Fronk. Oh, thanks for having me. Oh, jim, jim, jim, let me just tell the listeners a little bit about you, oh by all means.  00:40 I'm glad that you were so excited. Thank you for being here, jim. Let me tell our listeners a little bit about you. You've been behind the microphone in your happy place since you were 10, the tender age of 10. And since then, jim has been acting and singing his way into our hearts, doing improv, stand-up comedy, live, announcing, djing on air, and now he's in his very own 5x8 padded closet capturing our hearts. So, jim, thank you, thank you, thank you for being here with us today.  01:10 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Well, thank you, I'm glad that I'm padded, because the funny thing is I got out of radio because it got so impersonal. I started voice tracking and I was on nine different stations, six different states, at the same time, and I was just in a 10x10 room recording and I'm sick of that, so I ended up in a 5x8 room.  01:28 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Now a 5x8. Yeah, somehow that's smaller, so okay, but it's padded, so that's better.  01:33 - Jim Fronk (Guest) And this is my happy place. I love being here, I love playing behind the microphone. So I started at 10 years old singing. My dad always said that I would either be a politician or a radio disc jockey. Because of my gift of gab and the way that I like to spin the truth now and then, what would you sing?  01:50 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) That's my question. What genre would you sing? Jazz, you sing in classic rock.  01:54 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Classic rock for the most part.  01:56 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Classic rock yeah.  01:58 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Actually back in 2000,. I was Ed McMahon's nextbigstarcom winner of the rock category. What did you sing? I sang Better Roses by Bon Jovi.  02:07 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Oh, my God. Of course, at least she sang Bon Jovi. I was just going to say I'm thinking, bob Seeger, I don't know why. I've done some Bob. Yeah, I've done some Bob Seeger, I like the doors, yeah.  02:16 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I like the doors, my go-to when the bands are playing and they're like hey, come on up and sing. My go-to is Roadhouse Blues.  02:22 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Oh God, if we are lucky bosses, we might get to hear, I don't know, a bar or two.  02:27 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Maybe if you go to Uncle Roy's this year or maybe actually if you went to Uncle. Roy's next year. I'll talk to them.  02:33 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Next year. Oh yeah, hey, I personally have never heard you sing and I would absolutely love to hear you sing.  02:39 - Jim Fronk (Guest) You might be able to YouTube something Just saying there might be some poison out there.  02:44 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Before we talk a little bit more about your journey into voiceover, because you've had such a long history behind the mic, I need to ask you about the 7.36 pounds of shelled blue peanut M&Ms that you requested from me in my little inquiry into hey, you want to be a podcast guest? What do you require? And so you asked me for shelled blue peanut M&Ms, and I could only find the brown ones.  03:08 - Jim Fronk (Guest) And yet they're still not here.  03:10 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Somehow, oh, but they're virtually here.  03:11 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Oh, virtually Okay, great, I don't know. I was just trying to think of something weird to put on there that I need, because I really don't need anything.  03:20 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) I'm actually kind of hungry for some M&Ms. But, Jim, it's already been a wonderful five minutes chatting with you. I can't wait to dive deeper into your journey. So share with our listeners how your journey kind of got to be 20 plus years behind the mic doing radio. How did you get there? As a small child you were singing, right. Were you singing classic rock at the age of 10?  03:43 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Well, I was singing what was considered just normal pop music, I guess, yeah, and then classic rock was just music, but I did that. But when I got into school I really got into mixing things and I was making mixtapes before mixtapes were a thing.  03:59 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) I made mixtapes. I remember them.  04:01 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I was scratching records so things would skip at a certain point and you put a quarter on top, make a knot skip. No-transcript, Mr Jaws, Dr Demento.  04:11 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Oh God, yes, I might be dating myself here, but I listen to Dr Demento every Sunday evening. Love Dr.  04:16 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Demento oh my God my favorite show. But they always had Mr Jaws. It was kind of like Mr Jaws, so why are you here? Right now, and then it'd be a song, so I used to try to do those myself.  04:27 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) And Delilah. I listened to Delilah too. Delilah yes, yeah, delilah's on the air forever. But then I got into radio.  04:33 - Jim Fronk (Guest) When I was in high school, I was at a party.  04:35 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Okay.  04:36 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I was a senior, it was a junior's party. He was trying to be class president and I was just there being me. I mean, I am your extrovert, you know I talk to everybody, I say hi to everybody. It gets me in trouble sometimes, but whatever. But I was just being me and this guy walked up and said hey, listen, I'm the lawyer of this small little cable radio station downtown Woburn, which is my hometown. He goes do you want to try out? Okay, so I went home the next day. I got my Peter Brady tape recorder. We have to hold down the record and you know what I'm talking about.  05:04 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) I know exactly. I used one of those in college when I was recording textbooks on tape. Oh, there you go. I know the realistic. Or it was a Panasonic, I can't remember.  05:13 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I think it was realistic because I did have a radio shack within walking distance and my transistor was in there. Everybody did.  05:19 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Wait, I'm sorry, but we're just going all over the place. So my brothers are very much into Heath Kits, heath Kits, heath Kits. Yeah, building electronics Like we did that from Radio Show. Oh my God, they would just build their own little like transistor radios and stuff.  05:29 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I never got into that but I mean, as I got into radio I did get my engineering junior engineering badge from the engineering people, but whatever. So I went home the next day I had my Peter Brady tape recorder and I had my Precorp eight track player, my stereo system at home, and yes, I'm name dropping here. With Precorp I put in Led Zeppelin and you know I talked out of a Led Zeppelin song and I had to wait because you couldn't rewind eight tracks so you only had one take. Well, you had to wait for the next song. It took me all afternoon to get like three intros and three outros and I ended up getting the gig, which was kind of cool. They made me change my name. They didn't want anybody to know that a high school kid was working at school, but yet they gave me like one of those shiny, flashy 80s type of radio jackets with my name on it and the call letters and I did J at all the high school functions and things. So everybody knew.  06:21 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Can I ask what name they gave you? I was Jumping.  06:23 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Jim Jacobs.  06:25 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) All right, Jumping Jim. This just came to me. Jumping Jim.  06:27 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Jacobs, 935-3378, wlhg. Wow, larry Habar Enterprises. I love it. Larry lives two towns away from me right now. We had lunch about a month ago. The owner of the station.  06:39 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Now explain to me. So you just were fascinated. Did you listen to the radio all the time? I loved radio. And then you were just mimicking all the DJs because the DJs got all the chicks. Apparently that's what it was back in the 80s anyways.  06:51 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Yeah, have you heard of Dale Dorman? He's a Boston guy from KISS, but Dale Dorman and one other guy I forget his name, but they invented top 40 radio. They were at a bar one night and they watched people put quarters in to hear the same 15, 20 songs all night long Sure.  07:05 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) That makes sense, so they made that format.  07:07 - Jim Fronk (Guest) And Dale Dorman was also on the local TV station as hey, kiddies, that after school type of thing, and I just loved the guy and I just wanted to be him, I wanted to do what he did and I just set focus on it and I ended up doing it. I met Dale Dorman. The program director of the small station I worked for was the assistant PD of KISS 108 Boston and that's where Dale Dorman was, and she brought us in for a program meeting and God, my mind was just blown at that point and I said this is what I need to do. Got out of high school, I went to college for it, went to school for it, interned, did many, many years, and it was like here.  07:43 I am learning from these people that I think are phenomenal but, they're teaching because they can't make ends meet. So I got out of radio for about 10 years 15 years, and I did stand up comedy and I always talked about getting on the air again, because if I'm doing morning radio, I can't hear them not laughing when. I tell jokes, I just play a soundtrack. So I turned 35 and I said, you know, what Everybody laughs then yeah, exactly.  08:08 I turned 35 and said I have to do this, so I just put everything else aside and I did it.  08:14 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Now let me ask you, because you said most of the people couldn't afford working in radio, so they were teachers. Is that always been the case in radio? Is it always been? Maybe not the best paying gig, but the people in radio love radio. I mean, it's just.  08:27 - Jim Fronk (Guest) It's like being in an abusive relationship. It really is.  08:31 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) It slaps you around and I'll tell you. It's like podcasting I'm gonna say because for me, I'm gonna tell you that podcasting is my radio show. In a way it really is.  08:41 - Jim Fronk (Guest) The only difference is I was waking up at 2.30 quarter of 3 every morning to get my butt whipped every day.  08:46 - Intro (Other) But yeah, it's definitely a passion.  08:48 - Jim Fronk (Guest) You hear that word passion with VO. It's the same thing with radio. It was just something that I needed to do. I needed to have that live interaction and as far as the money goes, it's kind of like VO.  08:58 - Intro (Other) It depends what market that you're being planned in.  09:01 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I was doing mornings in Nashua, new Hampshire, which is about 30 miles away from Boston, as the crow flies, about a 40 minute trip. My salary compared to somebody doing the exact same thing on the exact same type of station, they probably were about five or six times more than I was making Just the average guy. Now if you became a star then you're up in the quarter of a million dollars in Boston market but not in Nashua. But I loved it and you got the perks I mean I'd go to concerts, I'd be backstage, at concerts.  09:30 My favorite thing was going on stage and throwing t-shirts out at people and saying, hey, I'm frog from Frank 106 or from 104.9 the Hawk, and people scream and they know me and I just love that. I really love that.  09:43 Just being a part of the community. I was very fortunate that the morning show I did for 106, 3 Frank FM I was part of the community. I would announce football games. My daughter did cheerleading but I would announce the popcorn of football games and I would go and people would know who I was. But I was very active in the community and I'd love that. I love being known.  10:01 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) You were like a local celebrity.  10:03 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Yeah, but I was able to take that celebrityism and put it to good work as opposed to evil Like I did back in the 90s. Oh sorry.  10:12 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) And that's another podcast.  10:14 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Yeah, I don't think the ever straining owners are up yet for that one, so we really can't talk about it.  10:18 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Well, now 20 years in radio, 20 years 20 plus, yeah Now did you say you were doing synonyms, that you were doing radio, and then you went into comedy, or how did that work?  10:28 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I was doing comedy. First I was a wedding DJ, function DJ, when karaoke was all the buzz. I got my own karaoke company. I had like 35 shows.  10:38 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Look at you being a boss entrepreneur at a young age. I mean bosses, and why you to listen to this? All of the people that come on the show, I mean they're entrepreneurs in so many ways, and that was so creative. I mean, jim, first of all, just being in high school right, and going after your dreams and having the bravery to go try out for the radio station and get the gig right At such a young age. And then you've got to be brave. Did you stand up comedy? That's for sure.  11:03 - Jim Fronk (Guest) You know stand up comedy. Five minutes can seem like 20 minutes. Yes, 20 minutes can seem like five minutes. It all depends on the energy of the crowd. But I tell you that first time I got up on stage, the very first time I was hosting a pretty big deal. It was at Berkeley, 5,000 seats. I was hosting it Not really hosting telling jokes, just kind of introducing people.  11:24 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) But I had a couple of jokes. I'm seeing kind of, yeah, I had a couple of jokes.  11:26 - Jim Fronk (Guest) That first joke I told, and when they laughed, that wave that hit me, that became my drug.  11:33 - Intro (Other) That became what I craved.  11:35 - Jim Fronk (Guest) That became what I had to accomplish on a Monday night up in Vermont for a slice of pizza, or a Tuesday doing an open mic night at the KFC in Volrica Mass. I mean, it's just, you did what you had to do, but it was again a passion for it.  11:49 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Now okay. So, passion aside, I'm sure there were some jokes that probably didn't make it, and so did you experience like imposter syndrome. I mean I can only imagine Like I think stand up comedy's got to be one of the hardest skills. I mean it's like improv too. I feel like we all need it and it just really builds our character, because there's just so many things we have to be quick on our feet about. I'm sure that all of this is leading up to a really fabulous career in voiceover, because all of those skills have led up to who you are as an actor today.  12:21 - Jim Fronk (Guest) And as far as jokes bombing, I'm looking for a reaction. You can oh or boo or yeah. Hey, I got a reaction, and if something just didn't work, I really didn't care you laughed at it.  12:31 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Oh well, that didn't work.  12:32 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Pretty much, yeah, I mean sometimes I'd make a joke about it and take a paper out of my pocket and say our fake paper and say okay, scratch that one off the list.  12:40 Yeah, that didn't work, whatever, yeah, okay, that doesn't work in Poughkeepsie, all right, fine. But yes, everything I've done coming up to this has helped me in VO. You know, the radio, yeah, has contributed the live stuff, the comedy, the improv and all that. I got out of radio back in 2018 because it was just impersonal to me. I wasn't doing mornings, I wasn't doing a talk show. I craved that interaction. I didn't like just talking up 15 seconds of a song coming out, absolutely. I mean, I'm great at trivia, music trivia. You know, you give me 10 seconds of any song from 1960 to 1992 and I can probably tell you what it is, but it just wasn't fulfilling. It wasn't satisfying. I did get into flying drones for a bit believe it or not, a friend of mine, that's random, it really is, but it was a passion, I flew a drone.  13:28 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Radio VO drones.  13:29 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Yeah, well, I flew the drones and I loved it. I got a passion for it. I was making some great money doing cell tower inspections and infrared. At one point I had more money invested in drones than I did in Harley-Davidson's.  13:42 Or in your microphone maybe, or in my microphones. I'm even close. I'm completely. You know how many U87s Like. I sold one of my drones in two cameras and I bought my daughter a brand new Jeep. They were up there but it just wasn't what I wanted to do. I wanted to be behind the microphone. Okay, and a buddy of mine, AJ Duquette Actually I think you were on the show, a buddy of mine, aj Duquette, a radio guy. He's doing VO, and he told me about J Michael Collins and I was driving home year ago, april. I was driving home from New York City on Clubhouse and I think you were on it, j Michael, and I want to say Liz Atherton.  14:18 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Oh, we've done yeah, we've done a bunch of yeah. And I asked the question.  14:21 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I just got my demos back and I was like, well, how do I know if I have a good demo? Yeah, and J Michael we talked afterwards and he went over it and gave me the good, the bad and the ugly and that just got me on the path of okay. So I'm going to talk to these people. I'm not going to be afraid to approach anybody. I'm very approachable and I'm going to approach as many people in this business that are where I want to be and it's been great. And that's my advice to everybody Don't be afraid to approach anybody, because if somebody's not approachable to you or if somebody doesn't want you to approach them, you don't want them in your circle. Why would you want them in your circle? You know, I like going to Dallas and seeing Ann Ganguza from down the hall and going Ann, and she's like jam. I mean, that's what it's all about Making connections, having some fun.  15:09 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) It's all about the relationships, really Absolutely about the relationships. So let's kind of continue on with the voice acting. So you got into voice acting around. You're saying around 2018?.  15:21 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Oh, no, no, no, I got into drones in 2018. Oh okay, excuse me, I actually celebrated two years in VO from when I started in September this past September. So it's been about two years, a month or two, but I got into it. I got some training. I did about five or six months with the training with a great coach, tim Powers, you've met.  15:38 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Tim, actually I know Tim absolutely.  15:40 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Tim has become a great mentor and even a better friend. But from there I got my demos and, like I said, how do I know they're good? And I just started doing the marketing thing. I've since redone my demos. I'm a different animal now, different everything. I kind of went feet first and I thank my wife so much for that. We talk about not making money in radio.  16:01 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) We all know the struggles that actors have, and we are actors Not making money in voiceover.  16:06 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Yeah, I mean just acting alone.  16:08 God bless my wife. She's very successful in the pharmaceutical business. So when the time came, we sat down and talked and she said, when we first met, I was making $5,000 a year less than you and you were in radio. And I'm like I know, but we have flipped the switch. She's gone so far. So she said do what you want to do. Invest what you need to invest. Get the right equipment. You know what you need. You've been in the business. You can build radio stations. Get what you need. So I did. And here I am two years later and I'm getting clients, I'm booking gigs, I'm doing animation, video games, e-learning. It's been great.  16:42 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) What would you say your favorite genre to work in is Because I'm always a big proponent of people bring their experience to behind the mic and I feel like maybe your stand-up comedy, your DJing, your networking I feel like that all works for you in specific genres Well, animation, I love.  17:01 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I love playing in animation. Right now I've got the allergies going on so my voice is kind of right now, but I love being able to just pop into a character and be like my mind is now melted, I'm with 3.0 and I will reveal the world. I mean, just have some fun. Word, of course I will. I am the evil. I am Ludo the evil one. I just love having fun with that. Video games I love the acting.  17:23 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) I love the cinematography and the acting.  17:26 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I trained with Dave.  17:27 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Fornoy yes he's amazing.  17:29 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Yes, and once again people say how'd you train with Dave Fornoy? Yeah, I asked, I asked, I went to his website and I booked some sessions. And there we are. Dave's a great friend now, I mean he's become such a great mentor.  17:43 So I love video games. You know what I really love doing and I hate to say it because I have spent, I'm gonna say, $10,000 in training, maybe over the past couple of years, maybe even more. I hate to look at the numbers, but to beat the DJ out of me Every time that I step back into that DJ voice, my coach would say and now up here's the dealbies, just to snap me back. But I love doing tier three automotive.  18:03 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Well, yeah, tier three, automotive, yeah, and tier of DJ, it's radio DJ delivery.  18:07 - Jim Fronk (Guest) It's what I do in my sleep, so I'm really loving doing that. Absolutely. I've been training with Chris Zellman. He's been great.  18:15 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Yeah, tier three, automotive. I do a little bit of that myself, and it's not as easy as we want it to be, because they're really trying to cram a lot of words.  18:22 - Jim Fronk (Guest) But I was also production director of a six station cluster for many years. I was given the commercials away, so you know, so I know, and most of those were that type of delivery, yeah absolutely that sales delivery that hype. You know, no money down and you can. You know it's. Which is so 80s DJ. It's just ingrained in me so I do love that.  18:43 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) And so now we all have to be authentic, and maybe not for tier three auto still. However, talk to me about authenticity and how. Maybe your background having a radio show I feel like having a radio show, you know, maybe not by just announcing commercials or announcing what the next song is, but I think if you're doing like talk radio and you're really getting down in personal with your listeners, I feel like that helps you to be authentic and you can kind of call upon that experience to really help you be authentic in your commercial delivery or even narration delivery or e-learning delivery.  19:16 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Before I was doing morning radio it was just that hype. Morning radio was kind of hype but it was a lot more comedy. We did bits. It was always like Frank's place with Jim and so-and-so or you know the Jim and so-and-so morning show. So it was always my animal to drive my vehicle and just to have that interaction was very conversational. And I did talk radio for the last three or four years of my career with radio and that became very conversational. That's just raw me. So when I was able to unlock that again, because we all know talking conversational and just talking like we're talking now is natural.  19:54 You should be able to do that. It's easy. Yeah, it's easy.  19:57 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) But it's not easy when there's a piece of paper.  19:59 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Yeah, when it's a piece of paper in front of you and it's somebody else's words. You have to learn how to do that Absolutely. One of the things that helped and hindered me was my ability for live read. I love being the first guy in workshops. I love reading stuff cold. I can't tell you how many times I'd be on the air and somebody would give me a piece of paper and say, read this.  20:18 And I have the ability to read about five or six seconds ahead of what I'm saying, which was good for that, but I was disconnected from my words. I was on autopilot.  20:28 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Any cold read is you're executing from left to right and you don't know what the story is.  20:33 - Jim Fronk (Guest) But even after I read it once or twice, I would still be reading ahead which hindered me to get that connectivity with the listener, with the client, with the audience. So when I learned to put that behind me and I'm gonna say live in the moment but read in the moment, be in the moment, my conversational game went up considerably and I think that I have a very conversational read when it is asked for that.  20:59 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) No sales, no announcers. That's right, no announcers. And that's getting the DJ and getting the radio beaten out of you.  21:05 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Yeah, but then I get to go back to tier three and have some fun with it. Yeah, and have your fun. Then, exactly, come on down. The price is really.  21:12 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) And I have roles in telephony that I can be as. Thank you for calling your call's important to us. I can be that fun, smooth, promo-y sound.  21:22 - Jim Fronk (Guest) That's a lot of fun, sometimes absolutely.  21:24 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Yeah, for the most part, we're all about the authenticity. Speaking of authenticity, from a few of the things that you've already talked about, you were so into drones, you were into, like, video games I get this feeling, and from talking to you previously, that you are kind of a geek. You are a tech geek, and so that kind of leads you into yet another talent of yours, which is websites, and I wanna make sure that we have time to get into websites for voice actors and talk to us a little bit about your expertise number one and what got you into web development first of all. Then let's talk about what's important in a voice actor website.  22:02 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Well, for the most part with the radio stations. You wear many hats and I was brand manager and web guru and graphic artist. I know enough about Photoshop to get you and I in a lot of trouble, but not enough to really make any money at it. As far as-.  22:16 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Except nobody uses Photoshop anymore. It's all Canva, Both yes. But yeah, no, I get it Photoshop was definitely a skill, I mean for sure, and when I was deciding.  22:26 - Jim Fronk (Guest) When I was getting out of the drones, I was actually going back and forth between VO and maybe going to school for graphic arts.  22:33 I really enjoy that. But I was thinking to myself you know, it's a three-year program, $36,000. I'll be 58 when I graduate. Do I really want to enter that type of field where I'm so far behind technology wise than the kids are these days? I said, you know, my happy place is behind the microphone. So that's what I did. Gotcha, every business that I've had, I've designed my own websites. I've used Wix my whole life. So when I say I'm a website builder, I'm a Wix master, is what I go by. There's just so much that's come along with website development. It's actually very user-friendly, but people need to be taught how to use it.  23:10 - Intro (Other) So when you say I'm a website developer.  23:12 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I'm more of a website instructor.  23:15 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) What.  23:15 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I like to do is I have something. It's a three-hour website. Do it yourself, learn by doing creation class, where we'll sit down together, you'll watch me on the screen and you'll mimic what I'm doing. I'll show you where I'm getting things. I'll teach you how to do things. So by the end of the three hours you should have a one-page voiceover specific website ready to go, ready to be hosted, and I'll go in there afterwards, because I'm always like an admin and I'll go in and I'll tighten things up and I'll put a little couple extra spinny effects and different things to make them happy. But I found that so many people didn't have the crucial items for a website, for a VO website and other people are charging 15, 16, $1,700 to build a website.  24:01 We're in a business. We're not making any money, but you have to have your online you know.  24:05 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) so Sure, absolutely, that's who you're marketing to.  24:07 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Exactly so. I try to help people learn how to do that so that they don't come back to me and say, hey, can you upload my new demos? No, they're gonna know how to upload their own demos. If they have a problem, I'm always here. I will build a website for somebody. It's twice the money, and when I'm done, if you need help, there'll be an hourly stipend to be your web guy.  24:30 I'd rather give you something that's cheaper, that takes me more time, but to teach you something. So that's what I'm doing. You can find that at websitesforvocom. It's very easy. I've designed other sites and gotten really deep, like Dave Fanoy, for instance. Dave has become a great friend, but his website was terrible no downloadable demos granted, he's Dave Fanoy, but still links that went to things that were expired event page that the latest event was 2019, it just wasn't conducive for somebody that's in the business. So I kind of owed him a favor. Dave became a really good friend. He helped me out. We started off by coaching. He helped me out directing my demo. He's helped me out with a lot of coaching. That was unexpected. So instead of sending him a bottle, what's a friend of mine said? Just send him a bottle and say thank you. I decided to a deep dive into his website and I completely revamped it. On Wix all of his scheduling You're a Wix person, I am a Wix person.  25:26 - Intro (Other) I've seen your schedule.  25:28 - Jim Fronk (Guest) I see, don't you love how it's all in the back?  25:30 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) door there. I love my Wix website your scheduling your payments, your tickets your events everything.  25:35 - Jim Fronk (Guest) So, Dave being a techie guy, a web guy, when I went to book my first gig with Dave it took me about 20 minutes to figure out and it was like email me.  25:44 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) There are some coaches out there that like well, email me for pricing or email me to get set up, and that to me is like why would you do that?  25:51 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Go to Venmo and do this here, and then I'll send you my Calendly link.  25:54 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Yeah, exactly.  25:56 - Jim Fronk (Guest) So I went in, I took care of Dave's and I taught him how to do it. He's now putting on his own events and he's doing all the ticketing and all the ticket sales and all the marketing, all the social marketing, all in the back door of Wix. So I taught him that. I try to teach everybody that, because there are things you need of your website.  26:12 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Yes, what are those things? Let's talk about those critical things.  26:16 - Jim Fronk (Guest) Number one downloadable demos Above the fold. Everything I'm talking about right now is above the fold. I've talked to a lot of agents, casting directors. They don't want to click, they don't want to scroll.  26:29 They don't want to look so right there, front and center, downloadable demos, ready to go. Your name, obviously, something that shows your personality. It's a logo, a picture, something that shows who you are and if we have some fun with it, have some fun with it. Your contact info should always be in the header so when they scroll, if they scroll, your contact info is always there.  26:52 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) It stays there it stays there.  26:54 - Jim Fronk (Guest) One of the main things that a lot of people don't have is a call to action button. Okay, I'm on your website, I'm the customer. Look at your website as a customer. I'm a customer, I found your website. I like your demos. What do I do? Now? There's a button there that says request a free audition. What's that all about? I mean, you and I, we all know auditions are free, of course. Well, all audition. You know we're not paying to audition. We're not getting paid to audition, but they don't know that.  27:21 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Well, sometimes we do, sometimes we do, but they don't know that.  27:23 - Jim Fronk (Guest) But they're getting a complimentary free audition. Send me a 30-second snippet of your script and I'll send you back an audio sample of what it will sound like, performed by me, and I can't tell you six. I've gotten six jobs off of that, so far.  27:39 Contact me is not a call to action. Maybe you offer some other service. I think it was Mark Scott said something about. These are six ways to book me. You know, give them something, something that has some information, whether it's directly related to booking you or VO related, but have that call to action button. Those are the basic things. Everything else after that is fluff. You go to my website. I probably have 15, 16 pages.  28:05 - Intro (Other) I have some people actually write the SEO for me.  28:07 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) It's all fluff. It really is. There's nothing there. Let's talk about SEO.  28:12 - Jim Fronk (Guest) It's for SEO. What about SEO lately?  28:14 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Is SEO worth anything at this point? Still, because of, let's say, generative AI, which is generating content in seconds. Now, all of a sudden, it used to mean something with our websites. Right, that we had identifying words and words that could be found, but I feel like that whole SEO pony might be changing a little bit as things start to evolve.  28:35 - Jim Fronk (Guest) It is changing, it's getting simpler for people.  28:38 - Intro (Other) And with a program like Wix.  28:39 - Jim Fronk (Guest) They actually have an SEO and, by the way, I don't get paid by Wix. I'm not endorsed by Wix, it's just what I know. I've tried Squarespace play buttons, a play button, rewinds, rewind, pictures, picture, but I just didn't like how the whole system worked together. Wix was very user friendly. If you can do Canva, you can create a website.  29:00 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Canva changed the game.  29:01 - Jim Fronk (Guest) They really did. They made it.  29:03 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Wix is changing the game and some people might say well, what in VO is changing the game? I mean, we could talk about that if we wanted to.  29:11 - Jim Fronk (Guest) How about that? So much in VO has changed the game.  29:13 - Anne Ganguzza (Host) Tell me about a VO actor. How can they
And the Winner Is
Nov 14 2023
And the Winner Is
Get ready to unravel the intricate world of awards in business! We promise, you'll walk away with a fresh perspective on the role and impact of awards in business - the good, the bad, and the downright stressful. We kick off our lively discussion by peeling back the glitzy curtain to expose the challenges and rewards of organizing an awards ceremony. From the high stakes of selecting winners to the joyous recognition of one's hard work, it's a rollercoaster journey. We open up about our own awards experiences and how it can often feel like a numbers game. Plus, we'll delve into the emotional side too, sharing some insights on how to handle not winning or being nominated, and why it's important to savor any recognition you do receive. 0:00:01 - Announcer It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss, a VEO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Ann Ganguzza.  0:00:20 - Anne Hey everyone, welcome to the VEO Boss Podcast and the Boss Superpower Series. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and I am here with the lovely Lau Lapides. Hey everyone. Hey Lau.  0:00:31 - Lau Hey, beautiful, beautiful, right back at ya.  0:00:34 - Anne How are you today?  0:00:36 - Lau Oh, I'm fabulous. I feel like this is going to be a very rewarding show, or maybe a rewarding show oh oh hey. See what I did.  0:00:45 - Anne I see what you did there. It's funny Lau. We just attended an award ceremony and there's a lot of different opinions out there on do we like awards, do we not like awards? Maybe we should have a talk about that Lau. What do you think I?  0:00:58 - Lau love it. I haven't heard anyone really talk about discussing awards like the process, not just the winning of the award, but also like what goes into the entire process. It's really a huge thing. Sometimes takes six months or a year to prep that kind of thing. Yeah.  0:01:16 - Anne Well, I will tell you that. First of all, I guess bosses out there we want to hear how you feel about awards too. I mean, there's so much discussion happening out there, oh gosh, on the Facebook groups and in social media about awards, and are they worth it? Because some awards cost money to enter, some awards don't. In our industry right now, I know of two distinct award shows that go on. However, they are not the only awards that you can certainly enter if you feel the desire to do that.  Lau. I have been a supporter of award shows since the beginning. However, there are many pros and there are many cons to it. Pros is that if you win an award, it's validation. Sometimes it's so difficult to be validated while we sit here in our studios all by ourselves and we don't get a lot of feedback all the time. Gosh, I'm always telling my corporate students we just want to be loved. When you work for a company and you feel underappreciated, I mean, gosh, that's really all we long for is to be loved. I think awards can be a verification of that. But then again, sometimes they may not be, because maybe you didn't win, and then that enters in a whole new mental aspect of. Oh my gosh, I wasn't good enough to win this award. Why did I not win this award? Somebody else is better than me. What are your thoughts about that Lau?  0:02:42 - Lau I think that when you go into this kind of a process, if you're entering into it and really submitting yourself for it intentionally, you have to set your mindset and your psychology to the fact that it is competitive. It is a competition. You may or may not feel like it is, but it really is. It should be based on merit. It should be based on your progress, your process and your product. And sometimes we only have so much control over that right. We manage it. We only have so much control right, that's the big thing.  0:03:16 - Anne And I just said it should be based on merit, and, right there, we could probably spend an entire podcast talking about that. It should be based on merit. However, there is the other side of the coin where, yes, it should be based on merit, but then you have the people who judge the awards right, and we don't always know, first of all, who those people are. Sometimes we do. I'm not a big fan of knowing who judges are. I feel like maybe there's too much possibility for people to maybe try to talk to the judges and influence them, so I'd rather not have judges be known. And then you have to really think about what are the judges qualifications? Because within voice over, we have so many different categories right, and so many different categories of awards.  If you're going to, I would say, present these categories of awards, I think you want to have very vetted judges right Judging the entries. And I am not sure, since we don't know who the judges are all the time, or even if we do know who the judges are, what is the criteria for me, a demo award versus a performance award, and in all different genres, I think it's super important that the people judging those are very specialized in those genres or in that category. So if you're judging animation, I would hope that judges are all experienced either working in animation or doing animation day in, day out and they really know the industry, and so I really would hope that that's the case. I don't know Lau if that's the case with all the judges, because, again, we don't always know who the judges are and we don't know what their credentials are.  0:04:50 - Lau Right, and I can say just from my personal point of view that it's not always the case.  Because at times I've been asked to judge categories which I feel like I can judge them. I can judge them, but am I way off base? No, I don't think so. I think there's a general industry knowledge that you have for years in the industry, but is it my absolute forte? No, not always it's not my forte. We try to get that matching process, but sometimes it's a numbers game, just like the competitors. It's like do we have enough judges? Do we have enough judges in a particular category? Are we getting them in time? Can they get the work done?  0:05:24 - Anne That's right in time, and that's the other thing. I mean, my goodness, judging some of these awards, because I have been a judge myself. First of all, when there's a lot of categories and a lot of entries, who, it becomes like a casting process and right then, and there bosses. I want that to tell you one thing. That means that sometimes right and I'm not going to speak for myself, but sometimes if you've asked a busy person to be a judge and then they have to listen to a thousand entries, they're probably only going to get the first part of your entry listened to before they have to continue on.  So that is something to consider. I mean, if there's a nuance or an acting moment that is at the end of your performance, maybe you want to try to create that clip so that all that great stuff is right at the beginning, because it is a job. It can be a lengthy and timely job, and if judges are not given an appropriate amount of time to do that, or they don't have a lot of time to do that, and they think like, yeah, I can judge that, and then all of a sudden it becomes overwhelming, well, then you get, the judging process becomes a little skewed to be quite honest because either I don't have time or I've heard too many entries.  I'm now overwhelmed. But yeah, there's so many things that go into it, my goodness. And then are the entries anonymous. We hope they are right, because we don't want the judges to be influenced by names or celebrity or that type of thing. But our voice is our product, right? So sometimes I'll tell you what it's hard to hide, because I know a lot of voices out there and I can pick them out like this I would agree.  0:07:01 - Lau And you know this last time, one of the last ones, you and I judged we were under an NDA, which I actually really appreciated I did too Right. It took a lot of stress, because not that I would be necessarily blabbing about that, I wouldn't but it reminded my brain like, separate it, compartmentalize it, because you and I we were a lot of hats, you know casting an agent and coach, and this and that, and so there is sometimes that one or two talent that we know. We do know them, and then could we recuse ourselves?  Sometimes we can sometimes we can't, because they can't move us into another category. So it's great to have that compartmentalization and that relaxation to know, okay, if there is someone in front of me that I know that's a client or a client of a friend of mine, that I am separating that from this hat, that I'm wearing, and then I'm not going to talk about that. I'm not going to speak about that and I have.  I wonder what you think about this. And I had mixed feelings. I have mixed feelings about the awards being given and then the judge's names coming out. It sort of makes me feel like a jury that all of a sudden is being. You hear the names of the jury who's on a criminal case. It makes me feel uncomfortable. It's like why do I need to know that information? What do you think about that?  0:08:21 - Anne That's very interesting and I appreciate that you brought that up because, as I mentioned, I always have been a fan of keeping anonymous I mean for the longest time and this isn't anything that's being judged. For example, I have done the VO Peeps scholarships for gosh 12 years already and when we judge those entries I don't disclose the names of the judges and I don't even disclose the names of the judges after the fact. Because again, what if I want to use those judges, maybe again, and I don't want to have anybody influenced and I don't want the judges, I feel like I don't need credit If I'm a judge. I don't need credit in being a judge. I just want to be able to judge fairly. And I happen to agree with you.  I don't think that judges' names should ever be disclosed really, and I'm not quite sure why the reason is and it might just be that they want to be thanked properly, but it's like when I give a donation, I don't always have to put my name on that. You know it can be an anonymous donation because I did it out of the goodness of my heart. If I'm judging something, I want it to just be the most fair that it can possibly be.  0:09:24 - Lau I'm glad you brought that up, Because when I see that at a ceremony someone who's kind enough to give money towards a scholarship or towards an award. I kind of feel bad for them Because I'm like as much as you are. Oh aren't they wonderful. They don't always want that recognition. They don't always feel comfortable knowing that. It's well-known knowledge that anyone who wins a lottery like they have to be very careful about releasing their name, because then they become a target and people go after them.  So you have to wonder if you're in an award ceremony, could you then become some sort of target that people are either trying to embellish themselves?  0:10:01 - Anne to you or they're trying to knock you down, similar to being an agent Lau. I'm just saying I know nothing about that.  0:10:09 - Lau It's so true.  0:10:10 - Anne It's like they're prostrate themselves to you day and night right.  0:10:13 - Lau I'm not one to really appreciate that. Honestly, I'm very private in that way. Like, if I'm going to give a bunch of money, I'd rather it not have my name in there. But that's just me. Other people do want that recognition. That's fine. That's totally fine.  0:10:28 - Anne I'm going to say I'm not here to shame anybody saying if you put your name on a donation that it's shameful.  I just think there are times when I don't think it's necessary and sometimes, yeah, I mean I'll put my name on a donation if I can add a note to it, to the recipient in wishing them good will, that kind of a thing, and that will be a reason for that.  But I think La one thing I want to really make a point of about awards is when you enter awards. Having experienced both sides of it being a judge and then also entering into awards myself I think you just have to really be made of Teflon number one, because the process is very subjective, right, and we're starting to kind of address all the things that go into the awards submitting and then the judging process and if you know who the judges are, are they qualified and that process. But I think one thing I want to stress to the bosses out there is please do not ever belittle yourself If you do not win an award or if you don't get nominated for an award. I think that, especially in our business, because it's very much a personal part of us, it's our voice, right, it is so personal and if you ever don't feel as though we've succeeded, it can be really, really damaging to our psyche.  0:11:44 - Lau I would agree, I would agree. Do not give a ton of weight to that process. And it's very funny, it's almost like auditioning.  It's like don't give a ton of weight to anyone audition brush it off and leave and go on to the next thing. But yet, when you're actually auditioning, give it the 100% it deserves, completely, commit to it completely, invest in it, completely, appreciate it. So, if you're awarded something or nominated, completely be present, be appreciative, love the moments, enjoy your community, love the attention. But then when you walk away, I really do believe you have the award. You're not going to forget about the award, you're going to utilize it as well in your marketing.  0:12:23 - Anne Oh, absolutely, but don't hang your hat on it. That's another positive.  0:12:27 - Lau Absolutely, don't hang your hat on it Like I'm the best, I'm the expert, I'm finished. No, it's a recognition that your work is at an industry standard that people want to appreciate, but there's a lot more to go.  0:12:40 - Anne Absolutely, absolutely. And I think that it's wonderful to get an award and it's wonderful to get nominated. I mean, if I want to make a distinction between being nominated and winning an award, I feel that the nomination is an award in and of itself because, listen to this award nominated, award winning, I mean honestly, they still start with award and so if you're going to use that to market, I mean gosh, just to be like sometimes narrowed down and be put on the shortlist, you can be proud of that to be nominated, and I really, really do believe that that can be celebrated as a win. And again, even if you're not nominated, understand that your work has value, you have worth, you have value and just because you didn't get the nomination or get a win doesn't mean that you are any less of a professional or accomplished and successful individual. I agree totally agree.  0:13:30 - Lau I'd love to talk, too, about the length of awards ceremonies. I think that that is either thought about or it's not thought about, maybe it's thought about, maybe it's not thought about, but they could run three, four hours in length, sometimes Absolutely, and I wonder how the audience feels about going through that kind of process and sitting through that process. We did an awards not long ago, you and I, where we literally sat in a chair for three hours.  There was no break. There was no moment to take a breath, walk around, nothing, and I thought that that was a very strange choice on the part of the organizers to keep people in a seat for that length of time and expect that focus to really stay there and be there late at night. What do you think about that?  0:14:20 - Anne I'm just thinking about all the awards ceremonies that we've become accustomed to on television. If you watch the Emmys or the Golden Globes, and there's always either food or drink at the table. Number one that helps If you're going to have to be planted or seated in an audience. I think that that works. And what if you have to leave to use the restroom right?  And then they announce your award. Hopefully you want to have like a series of events and when are they going to announce this category? I happen to know a very good friend of mine who was caught in the bathroom when they won and, yeah, it was not able to come to the stage and give their acceptance speech. But I think that sometimes sitting through the awards ceremony can be laborious if there's not any kind of entertainment kind of interspersed in there and or some sort of a schedule of events. And I know that that's difficult and sometimes they want to keep it a surprise for the people, they want to keep people in their seats. But yeah, it can get tiring. I will say that my tushy got a little bit sore and I've been to longer ones Okay, I have been to longer ones than the one that you and I were at, which we're really excruciating just because of the length and not all categories were called up to the stage.  0:15:30 - Lau So no, no, they need to sell cushions like they do it at the stadiums.  0:15:34 - Lau Buy a cushion.  0:15:36 - Lau you have to sit on the cushion and that would make a lot of sense, though I did think of a shortcut because I'm an organizer myself events, and one of the shortcuts I don't think anyone would ever do, but I think makes total sense. There were a handful of people at a few of the ceremonies that you and I intended that one more than one award One in particular. I can remember he won three. Okay, lovely, good for him. Why did they spread that out and why did he need to come up three times, have three spills in which he ran out of things to say? He was telling jokes by the end of it. Why not house those categories One, two, three. They have a sense. Maybe he's gonna win, maybe.  0:16:16 - Lau I don't know I mean they're preparing?  0:16:18 - Anne No, I don't know who's preparing the envelopes, remember they?  0:16:20 - Lau well, yeah, they're preparing the envelopes.  0:16:22 - Anne It's under lock and key right. So nobody knows. So that's theoretically. Somebody knows.  0:16:27 - Lau That's theoretically. Somebody knows Theoretically?  0:16:28 - Anne somebody knows. But again, but then I don't think Lau you'd want the audience to expect right that the next category he would be the winner as well. So there'd be no right. No, but if you think about it that way, right, if they know he won in multiple categories and then they called the second category once they did a series of right, the audience would expect it so. I don't think you can do it that way, and I think he handled it well.  0:16:50 - Lau Personally, listen, I think theoretically, it's true, but you and I know most of the audience was dying to get out and get a hamburger. You know what I mean. Like if I could get some french fries and cut this a little bit shorter, I'm all over the nuggets. You know what I mean. Like I'm ready to go. I don't need it to be that extra hour.  0:17:07 - Anne Well, I think that it could be maybe addressed at the amount of categories, maybe. Maybe, but then they wanna make sure that they're covering everybody, so I can see where organizers have a big job here.  0:17:19 - Lau Yeah it's tough, you know, there's a lot.  0:17:20 - Anne You know everybody wants to be represented. As a matter of fact, I am like all for let's have the best medical narration demo. I want that because you know that's something that I do and that's something I would love to submit for, and there's no category anywhere for that, so I can see where they have to.  0:17:37 - Lau Of course it's entertainment as well, so they have to pad the whole evening with different kinds of entertainment and videos and jokes, and that pads it with another hour or another hour and a half. So I get that, but I totally get that.  0:17:52 - Anne I'm gonna say what do you say Lau about? Like cause, I'm okay with the words. I'm okay with the words because over the years I've learned a little bit more about how they work. And I've won, I've lost, I've not been nominated. I've been nominated. I've been through it all myself, the emotional swing that it can cause, right. And I'm still okay with the words because I can understand them for what they are.  And so, bosses, I hope that this helps you to just kind of get a better grip on what they are and not that it determine your value at all. If you choose not to enter or not support award service, that's entirely fine. You can still be a boss, absolutely. But I don't think that this kind of back and forth war that we have about awards, I think it gets a little bit divided and for not really a good reason. I don't think. If you want to enter, go ahead and enter and don't shame people who enter awards. I really am a big fan of that. I mean I don't love negative talk on social media for people who enter awards or get awards or that kind of a thing.  0:18:54 - Lau I am so with you on that. And that would extend too to people who do not come to the awards, who for many reasons, can't, won't or don't want to come to the awards. I think that's fine. I mean, if I'm being nominated, I'll go because I'm very honored and I'll buy the dress and I'll do the thing and I'll enjoy it. But there are others that say no, it's not my scene or I can't afford it.  0:19:18 - Anne Yeah, oh yeah, I don't want to because I'm in Florida. It can get expensive. I mean, you're talking about, typically, people like to dress for these things. So you're talking airfare, maybe, travel expenses, hotel expenses, dress expenses or suit? Yeah, absolutely, and for me, I had makeup and hair, but I always liked to have an excuse to have it make up and hair.  0:19:40 - Lau But You're so schmelzy that way. Well for me.  0:19:44 - Anne I'm telling you, for me it's a little spa day.  I mean, if somebody can just handle that for me I can think about like what I have to do I always talk about when I present. I like to have hair and makeup because then I don't have to worry about those things, that I can concentrate on my presentation. So while I'm somebody who's doing my hair, I am like doing notes for presentations. For me it's just an investment, but it can be very expensive. Awards can be very expensive and sometimes you have to buy the award after the fact and that is also expensive. So there's a lot of, I think, pros to it but yet a lot of cons, and I don't want you bosses out there to feel any less than worthy or valuable just because you do or don't enter an award show.  0:20:26 - Lau I'm with you on that Ann and. I would say no matter how you take part, I would urge people to take part in some way, whether you're a witness or you're submitting or you're just congratulating someone who won and just support the community in any way that's best and comfortable for you because it is ultimately, I would imagine, there for the people and for the community and for the recognition and we don't want to completely lose that. We want to preserve that, you know. However, you take part.  0:20:57 - Anne And also I wanna just say, unless you're organizing an award event, I think if you could maybe steer clear of criticism. I just I mean, I just I think that if people criticize people who hold events and they say, well, it's all about the money, or they try to figure out, oh, how many people times how much the cost of a ticket, wow, they're making a lot of money. And then they make assumptions on the fact that, oh, they're just doing that because they're greedy or whatever reason you have. I think, honestly, just having a husband who does events and myself I've done events live- YouTube events like.  I think, anybody that can sit back behind a keyboard and criticize about an event if they've not organized one themselves, especially one that's in a hotel, where you have to pay probably a big chunk of fees to a hotel for food, for the space. Just to do that is not a cheap thing at all. And so what event organizers charge for their event? I mean, I just steer clear of any kind of criticism because I know how expensive it can be very expensive, Very, especially in this day and age.  0:22:05 - Lau it's the most expensive it's ever been.  0:22:07 - Anne Oh yeah, absolutely so have a little mercy and understanding on event organizations.  0:22:11 - Lau And then the other thing too and I wanted to say not just about awards, but we're talking about awards right now is like don't look the gift horse in the mouth in regards to, like, the people who organize a range direct all of that deserve the profit they make oftentimes.  0:22:29 - Anne Oh, absolutely, because they are going through such stress.  0:22:33 - Lau It's beyond a full-time job. No one realizes that unless they're involved with that kind of work.  0:22:38 - Anne Well, my husband does it as a full-time job, I mean, and it's crazy because even people that he works with don't understand what it takes to prepare for an event.  0:22:46 - Lau It is crazy, but I love that you said please have compassion, I'm backing you up on that.  0:22:51 - Anne I'm backing you up on that, because it's not easy to do something like that.  But yet it seems so easy for us to sit behind our keyboards and just make assumptions. And I think yeah, and so don't make assumptions about, I think, awards, events, the event organizers or even the judges, or even if you agree or don't agree with awards. I really feel like just one of my favorite sayings is to mind your own business, and I don't mean that in a mom way, I mean that my VO business is my business. And if I feel that maybe entering an award competition will maybe help my marketing, I'm going to do it and I don't want to be criticized for that or looked upon badly for that. But again, and I will try not to cry if I don't win, because I think anybody that knows me knows how darn competitive I am- Ooh, I am competitive, you are, I've got a box of tissues for you.  Thank you, so you don't need to worry about that at all. See the Lau.  0:23:41 - Lau that's why I want you at my side at all at all times I'm ready with a tissue, a handkerchief whatever, a shoulder and a turkey sandwich and a turkey sandwich at all costs A turkey sandwich, and that's what support is like.  0:23:55 - Anne I love that, that kind of support. Right, we need to lift each other up, and so, if awards are your thing, support the people in the community, like Lau supports me with a turkey sandwich and a box of tissues. I love that right, it's so true, it's so true. And Lau. And if I can get you a turkey sandwich at any time, I will do so, and that's why I love you back because we're all about getting of the turkey sandwich.  0:24:23 - Lau It's not even Thanksgiving, that's the best part.  0:24:25 - Anne Bosses, you might be wondering what are they talking about? Well, at one of the last conferences, it happened to be late at night and I had been presenting and had gotten out of like multiple panels and X sessions or whatever it was, and by the time I got to the restaurant to eat they had closed. It was like after 10 o'clock and everything had shut down and I was starving. I literally was like I need something and there was no door dash that could be quick, and so Lau to the rescue. Who actually went and secured me a turkey sandwich that magically appeared from behind the desk Late at night.  0:25:05 - Lau Behind the front desk. Yes, I was like the Ooma Thurman in the Kill Bill series. I just jumped over the desk, I tackled the woman behind there and I said how could you not be?  0:25:17 - Anne open and it was fresh and I ravaged that turkey sandwich. I did, I literally did, and it was, the bread was flying, the turkey was in my mouth and I ate it like a caveman. I mean literally, it was beyond Quentin Tarantino stuff. I didn't even have utilities to eat it with. I ate it with my hands, I know I didn't even have a sword.  0:25:35 - Lau I just used the verbal sword play of my mouth and my words.  0:25:39 - Anne But that's the story of the turkey sandwich and Lau how she came to save me. Okay, so everybody needs a Lau, right, Everybody needs a Lau on their side.  0:25:47 - Lau So, Lau.  0:25:48 - Anne I mean, what a great conversation. I mean, I hope bosses, you guys always know your value, whether you are winning awards or not. Winning awards, you guys, you are gifts and awards in our hearts, and so make sure that you feel that way about yourself and, of course, others in the industry, and let's lift each other up. So I love it.  0:26:08 - Lau We love you if you win, and we love you even more if you don't win, because it's all about your process. There you go.  0:26:15 - Anne There you go, and, speaking of awards and making a difference, you guys can use your voice to make an immediate difference in our world and give back to the communities that give to you. Just like Lau gives me turkey sandwiches, so you guys visit 100voiceswhocareorg to commit and big shout out to IPDTL, our favorite way to connect Bosses. You, too, can find out more at IPDTLcom. Have an amazing week, guys, and we'll see you next week. Bye.  0:26:47 - Lau Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host and Ganguza, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast to coast connectivity via IPDTL.  0:27:17 - Anne This time a little more conversational. I'll give something I actually give something really, really conversational once and they're like oh yeah, give me a little more conversation and I'll give it completely conversational. They'll be like oh Hmm, how about a little more energy? And you know, when they ask for more energy, that usually means they're looking for a little more cell, yeah, if you're not anywhere near it, oh yeah maybe a little more smile, a little more smile, a little more smile, a little more energy that gives you the cell back.  Transcribed by https://podium.page
Casting Trends
Nov 7 2023
Casting Trends
Gain a fresh perspective on the evolving casting landscape. Whether you're a newbie or an industry veteran, this episode will equip you with knowledge on how to market yourself to a specific niche. The Bosses cover the importance of understanding the language and mindset of your clients. Don't miss this enlightening chat where Anne and Lau share the emerging trends in casting, especially the push for diversity and authenticity. They emphasize the importance of staying true to your individuality, advising actors to embrace their unique accents and regional characteristics, as more companies are seeking authentic representations. Transcript: Anne Ganguzza: Hey everyone, welcome to the VioBoss Podcast. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and I'm here with the lovely and most wonderful Lau Lapides. Hello, welcome to our Business Superpowers series. Lau Lapides: Mmm, so excited Anne Ganguzza: Woohoo. Lau Lapides: to be here as always. Anne Ganguzza: And you know, we always need to really up our business superpowers, don't we, Law? Lau Lapides: We do, Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: always, every day. Anne Ganguzza: And I think probably one of the most common things, questions that I get asked as a coach, and also you must as well as an agent and casting directors, what are the current trends in casting? And so how can I better prepare myself to evolve my business to keep up with the trends in casting? So I thought it would be a great opportunity to talk, especially with you, who casts on a day-to-day basis. What are you seeing in terms of casting trends these days, Law? Lau Lapides: Mm, trendy trendy, yes. Well, what's been going on for quite a while is diversity casting. Like Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: we're Anne Ganguzza: mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: always in need of more diversity, more representatives, both accent-wise, language-wise, Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: delivery-wise, culturally. ethnically, I mean, this is all in the mix right now and kind of at the front of the line, Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: which is exciting Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: to see such an international mix of Indigenous peoples that are really representing their country, their region, their, you know, their profile, so to speak. So we're always looking to certainly up our roster, up our game in our roster, finding authentic talent from all over the world, even just Spanish talent. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: I'm totally in need of authentic Spanish talent of many dialects. Accent-free is fantastic, but then if you're not accent-free, dialects are wonderful if we know specifically where you're placed, because we really have to go with the real deal. Anne Ganguzza: Sure. Lau Lapides: It can't be an actor who's just really great at sound or accents. It really has to be the real person representing. Anne Ganguzza: Well, I'll tell you what I love about it is... not just diversity, but authenticity. I think authenticity all the way around, which has been a trend just coming through the years, and especially now, people are just looking for other people to be authentic. And Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: so when it comes to my students who originally used to be there, they're like, can you please take away my accent? Or I wanna be good at narration, so should I have this neutral accent? And I'm like, look, as long as I can understand you, number one, important. I mean you don't want to have necessarily you know maybe a speech impediment that would inhibit me from understanding what you're saying. However when it comes to accents I don't think it's as critical as it used to be. It used to be that thing that you had to have absolutely neutral accent whatever that might be these days. But I'm having people in you know embrace their authenticity and if their authenticity is regional right and they have an that would really, you know, work with that. And, you know, I think we've always tried to do that, but even more so now, I feel encouraged to tell my students, don't worry about that. We really just want you to be, I want you to bring you to the party first. That is the most important objective that I have as an educator and as a coach to get you to be authentic. And that really is what I think casting trends today are all about. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. If you can be the best version of you and really Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: bring that to the table authentically, that's what we're looking for. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: If you can also neutralize it a bit, you know, round it out a bit, Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: that's great too. It just gives Anne Ganguzza: mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: you more options. But Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: I fear for clients that come in, or I should say talent that comes in, especially at a certain stage, you know, once you hit Like even 30 or 35 or 40, it's very, very difficult to authentically change your Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: dialect or shift your accent. It just is. It's not impossible, but it would take a lot of work with a dialectician to do something Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: like that. And I don't think it's necessary. I don't Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: think it should Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: be an objective for you. It really Anne Ganguzza: Oh, Lau Lapides: should Anne Ganguzza: gosh, Lau Lapides: be Anne Ganguzza: it, Lau Lapides: like your vocabulary. Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: What is it, Anne Ganguzza: I mean, Lau Lapides: right? Anne Ganguzza: work with a dialect coach if you want to Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: maybe consider other dialects for characters, maybe. Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: But I don't think it's to remove your dialect these days unless, of course, you have a very heavy regional accent, in which case, if you would like to maybe try to lessen that a little bit, I don't think it's necessary to remove it at all, actually. So many companies embracing that authenticity. And now, of course, in the casting specs, they're looking for talent who are authentically from particular areas and regions. And now, if you kind of had that fake accent or that generic accent, that I don't think is needed as much anymore. Is there such a thing? What was it the other day I was on a panel? What is it with the authentic, Midlantic accent, I think. Lau Lapides: Oh, right, Anne Ganguzza: Is that even Lau Lapides: right. Anne Ganguzza: a thing anymore? Lau Lapides: I don't know, Anne Ganguzza: I think Lau Lapides: I Anne Ganguzza: really Lau Lapides: mean. Anne Ganguzza: it's just, they want to have some sort of a, maybe of a dialect where you can't really tell where you're from. I'm not sure. So Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: guys, embrace your authenticity. I think that's so important. And first of all, that's a tall order law Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: to embrace your authenticity. Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: That I think as actors is really one of the hardest things that we have to do many times I encounter talent who want to sound a particular way or they Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: feel it should sound a particular way and again bringing their authentic selves to the copy is so very difficult. They're either able to you know do that if the copy is written maybe in a dialogue format but when it's not it's very difficult to do that and also I find that a lot of character actors law like Lau Lapides: Mmm. Anne Ganguzza: their characters seem authentic, but yet when you ask them to bring themselves to the table, that becomes an immense challenge. Lau Lapides: Huge, huge challenge. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: I would say too, in regards to the Superpower show that we're Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: working on right now, like one of your superpowers is being a really great business person. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: So a trend I've seen over the last few years is, how qualified are you as a business partner? in terms of your correspondence, in terms of your timing? Are you timely about your responses? We're casting something really big right now with a client and one of our talent, not her fault at all. But our records were just, they either weren't updated or whatever Anne Ganguzza: Mm. Lau Lapides: the case may be. The email never reached her in regards to availability. And so I called her on the phone, I reached her. She said, that's actually not even my email. That's person lets me know when they get my emails. There's something in the system Anne Ganguzza: Mmm. Lau Lapides: that defaults. So my point is, like, are you on top of your records, your Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: emails, Anne Ganguzza: Oh. Lau Lapides: your back? Are you flagging your people Anne Ganguzza: I would be Lau Lapides: that you're reaching out Anne Ganguzza: kicking Lau Lapides: to? Anne Ganguzza: myself if that were the case. You know what I mean? If there's one thing that you can prevent, right? In terms of what can you do to help get yourself cast more. Lau Lapides: Right. Anne Ganguzza: It would be making sure your agents and all your, you know, rosters have the most current relevant information and demos as well. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, and demos as well. Lau Lapides: And making sure it's easily accessible. You expedite really well and really quickly. And, like, being on top of those trends. Like, when we went to a recent conference, you and I, I found that less and less people were giving out actual physical business cards, even though I still Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: love them. I'm old school that way. I like to hold something in my hand. They were doing QR codes. They were Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: on their phone going, you know, take it right off my phone onto your phone, boom, it was fun, it was done, it was quick, I got it. My point is, do the physical business cards if that's what you love and do, but know what the trend is for the online business card Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: because that shows you've got your finger on the pulse of technology Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: and what's going on in our industry. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, and I think casting trends in terms of, yeah, making yourself available, understanding what your agent expects from you communication wise, I think, is very, very important. And also, I'm going to go back to the sound slash demographic. One thing that I want to make people aware of is a lot of times demographics and casting is based on, and trends in companies selling products to a specific demographic. So there are a lot of companies that may have an older audience, or there might be companies that cater to moms, or products that are catering towards young people. I think there's a lot, a lot of times we see the trend going back towards millennial young, because there's so many companies that are just trying to expand their market. So understand guys, I think sometimes we don't think about it. think about casting in terms of, oh, did I, was I making it sound correct, right? Was I the right sound for them? But sometimes you're not the right demographic, right, for the product. And so just remember that if, you know, the next time you get really disappointed that you didn't land that big gig and think that you didn't perform to your ability, a lot of times it's because it's a demographic, a sales demographic, right? It Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: wants to cater to a particular age group. And Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: that would be another thing, La I wanna talk to you about. In terms of casting age groups, I see a lot younger, but also middle-aged. What about older? What about the older demographic? Lau Lapides: We're Anne Ganguzza: That's Lau Lapides: getting Anne Ganguzza: always, Lau Lapides: more. We're Anne Ganguzza: okay, Lau Lapides: getting more Anne Ganguzza: okay. Lau Lapides: and more of that. I mean, probably, Annie, now more than ever, we've had the more Anne Ganguzza: Mmm. Lau Lapides: mature demographics. So the senior in the industry is known as like 50 to like 65. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: 50 to 64 would be a young senior, and then a more mature senior would be the 65 and up. Anne Ganguzza: Okay. Lau Lapides: So we're seeing more of 50 and up for sure, whether Anne Ganguzza: That's Lau Lapides: it's Anne Ganguzza: good. Do you Lau Lapides: health Anne Ganguzza: know what Lau Lapides: or travel. Anne Ganguzza: type, yeah, I was gonna say health, Lau Lapides: Yeah, health, Anne Ganguzza: travel. Lau Lapides: travel, Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: finance, you know, even software is seeing more and more of that coming through. Anne Ganguzza: Okay. Lau Lapides: So Anne Ganguzza: That's actually Lau Lapides: I think there's Anne Ganguzza: really Lau Lapides: a Anne Ganguzza: good. Lau Lapides: lot to look forward to. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, that's really good because I know for a while there, it's tough sometimes, you know, because what products do we have that cater towards, you know, that 55 and up age group? You really have to start thinking about it. And I would always encourage bosses, you know, I do a lot of work in corporate, I do a lot of coaching in corporate and just researching companies in general, researching what products are out there. for what Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: age groups and as a matter of fact, I'll always have my students, they fill out one of their very first forms and in the vocal branding form is, let's talk about brands you're familiar with for babies. What are brands you're familiar with for teenagers? What brands are you familiar with for middle aged, for seniors? And really try to come up with the brands that you hear being talked about today for these different groups. And understand, just understand that there is a sound in a demographic for each group, and it's all based on sales. So the next time you don't get that big gig, it could just be for the, and we discussed this during our audition demolition, multiple times, Law, that the person might've nailed the performance, but they just didn't have the right demographic. Lau Lapides: Yes, yes, Anne Ganguzza: Mm. Lau Lapides: actually, that is so much of casting, whether Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: you're just, you know, you're a voiceover on camera or both. So much of it is based off of things that, you know, you just is out of your hands. It's out of Anne Ganguzza: Mm hmm. Lau Lapides: your hands. So Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: you Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: have to understand that the profile of who you are, your bio, your background, your is sometimes we can't do much about that. We are Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: who we are. And that's why accepting who you are. being the best version of that is Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: really, really important. Anne Ganguzza: Oh, yes. Lau Lapides: You Anne Ganguzza: Yeah Lau Lapides: know, and finding Anne Ganguzza: Amen. Lau Lapides: what is your strongest Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: suit? Like, what Anne Ganguzza: Yeah Lau Lapides: is your strongest, most competitive value proposition? And really putting that at the forefront Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: so that Anne Ganguzza: agreed. Lau Lapides: you're spending a lot more of your energy in that direction than Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: in 10 different directions, Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: right? Niche it. Niche it down. Anne Ganguzza: it's wonderful to have versatility. I'm all for versatility. However, you need to be able to market yourself, right? Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: Niche it down, right? To specific niches. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: And I found that myself as well, right, in terms of voiceover-wise, right? Where would my voice fit in? Where was I getting hired the most? And Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: I think that bosses out there, depending on how you're being cast, you're gonna be able to find that and also do work to develop that more and to really push that, go for auditions that speak to that strength. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: Now, I'm not saying that you should not audition for anything else. I truly believe that every once in a while you surprise yourself and you audition for something that maybe you don't feel is in your wheelhouse and all of a sudden you'll get cast because you never quite know where that company is headed, right? Maybe they want to switch directions and maybe their demographic is... maybe an older sound, and then maybe they've decided they wanna go more middle-aged, or maybe they wanna, I don't know, speak from a millennial point of view. And so you're never really gonna know. I mean, just like we try to cater to the people who will hire us the most, we can also, every once in a while, give ourselves that surprise. Audition for things that you feel maybe you're not. well suited for, but maybe the company will have a change of heart. Lau Lapides: And also, too, Annie, to piggyback onto that point, is you can, when you're going after your own client base, your own prospects, right, outside of casting director, outside of an agency, outside of all of that, you can mold a little bit of what you do Anne Ganguzza: Mmm. Lau Lapides: and who you are in a couple different directions, Anne Ganguzza: Sure. Lau Lapides: but it has to be based on the target demographic. So for instance, if you're going after... as a talent, I'm going after the medical field, I want to do some medical reads, I'm excellent at that, I'm wonderful at technical language. I want to put that out there in my cover letter or at or in my website so that they can point right to that and Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: see, oh, there's my there's my technical reads, I can do medical Anne Ganguzza: Sure, Lau Lapides: reads, Anne Ganguzza: sure. Lau Lapides: I'm understanding healthcare, I get that. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: So speaking the language and understanding the lingo of a prospect client is going to go a long way. versus them sitting and listening to four Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: demos. Anne Ganguzza: absolutely, Lau Lapides: Oftentimes Anne Ganguzza: absolutely. Lau Lapides: they won't do it. They wanna Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: see where are you coming from? Where's your mindset Anne Ganguzza: mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: and where's your language actually coming from? Does it match Anne Ganguzza: Sure, Lau Lapides: the Anne Ganguzza: absolutely. Lau Lapides: type of work that we do? So I would say go on the website, go on the YouTube channel, look at who they are and what they do before you approach them. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, absolutely. And then have a portion of your demo or have your demo catered to that. You know, I'm a big believer in, let's say, in a lot of corporate demos that I do or long format narration demos. I'm always looking at the different industries that hire voiceover and making a spot for each one of them. So therefore, if you want to cater to an automotive company and you're going to be maybe a narrator on a walkabout or a new sales video, can cater a spot on that demo that speaks the language of the people that you are going, you know, you are selling to. Lau Lapides: That's Anne Ganguzza: And just Lau Lapides: right. Anne Ganguzza: like they want to, you know, a company wants to sell to their demographic, you want to sell your voice that is specifically suited to a particular genre or a particular industry. Make sure that you have samples and you have demo. material that can be sent to these people so that they can hear it right away. And it doesn't, they don't have to listen to like, oh, I listened to your entire commercial demo or your entire corporate narration demo and it was the sixth spot. And I didn't know, you know, from the get go, if it was even in your demo. So Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: you have to really start catering. And I talk about target marketing a lot in my business. And I like to create target marketed demos because I think that helps you to get cash. easier. And now, Law, I'm going to talk to you specifically on the commercial aspect of things because you cast a lot of commercial work. How important is the demo in the commercial work or is it the audition that's most important? Lau Lapides: It's Anne Ganguzza: What Lau Lapides: both. Anne Ganguzza: do you think? Okay. Lau Lapides: It's both. Of course, first it's going to be the demo because I may not have met you or Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: may not have heard you yet. Until you're in our roster, you Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: know, we don't know what you do. We don't know what you're capable Anne Ganguzza: Right. Lau Lapides: of doing. So the first thing that we're going to look at is the demo because chances are great we're not going to do a live audition. Like we never Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: do a live audition when we're listening to people to bring them in as talent to the Anne Ganguzza: Right. Lau Lapides: roster. It's always from a demo. It just Anne Ganguzza: But your Lau Lapides: is. Anne Ganguzza: clients, however, are they going to want to hear a demo or an audition? Lau Lapides: You know, it's a good question and there's some guesswork in that. It's Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: shifting. The trends are really shifting. I think less and less clients are listening to demos and Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: more and more just for time's sake. They want an audition Anne Ganguzza: the audition. Lau Lapides: with a copy from their specific job. Now, that's not to say that if they're considering five people, that they're Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: not going to quickly go and listen to the demos. And here, have you done that kind of work before? I'm sure that they Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: do. But I think upfront, time seems to be always of the issue and they just want to get people in. They want to get them reading and they want to get, so they're relying on us to Anne Ganguzza: Sure. Lau Lapides: have listened to the demo. We have the demo. We've vetted the demo. They're relying Anne Ganguzza: Mm. Lau Lapides: on us that we don't need they, that we don't need to listen to the demo. Anne Ganguzza: because Lau Lapides: The Anne Ganguzza: you've Lau Lapides: agency Anne Ganguzza: already Lau Lapides: already Anne Ganguzza: done it. Lau Lapides: listened Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, Lau Lapides: to it. Yes, Anne Ganguzza: right. Lau Lapides: yes. Anne Ganguzza: Now, I asked you that question specifically because we were talking about commercial or things that typically Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: are broadcast, right? Now, let's talk about non-broadcast, which I like to think is one of my specialties, right? Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: Non-broadcast, yeah, your demo's gonna be an important part of it, as well as your audition, okay? So you may get those auditions from an agent, right? I get a certain percentage of corporate work from my agent, and I know that you cast as well. But probably the majority of what you do is commercial work. But for me, corporate work, I get cast either on my audition, but I also get cast quite a bit from my demo. And so it is very important that demo is strategically target marketed towards the market you want to sell to. And so it's good Lau Lapides: always. Anne Ganguzza: to have that demo, because I've been hired off my demo multiple times Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: in a non-broadcast. Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: market multiple times and my spots on my demo have been able to be split up if I needed to send an independent spot to You know to a particular client to showcase a particular talent They're also on my website kind of they are they are always split apart so that people can see the industry and they can also Listen to the spot and they can say oh, that's automotive and it is You know informational and Inspiring believe it or not. It could be inspiring to be automotive. Lau Lapides: Absolutely, absolutely. Anne Ganguzza: And so both are very, very important. So for me, I'm always a big proponent and a big fan. And I know I, yes, I'm a coach and I do produce demos, but I really believe because I have had personal experience and I know a lot of people in non-broadcast get hired off their demos quite a bit. Lau Lapides: Mm hmm. Anne Ganguzza: So Lau Lapides: Yes. And Anne Ganguzza: it's important. Lau Lapides: I just want to impress upon your bosses, your listeners, that you could get hired in all different realms and for all different reasons. Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: I've gotten hired so many times just during lunch, like Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: just having a lunch meeting with someone just talking to them as I talk to them. And and just recently, I don't know if you even know this, but we're where producers in an audio drama that we're recording in the fall with some big partners out Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: in New York and some amazing names coming into that. And I was producing a preliminary rehearsal table read before it was even cast. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: And I was reading one of the roles because we needed another voice for one of the roles. And the producers came to me and they said, Yala, we kind of want you to play the role. And I said, oh Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: wow, really? Anne Ganguzza: Well, that's Lau Lapides: And Anne Ganguzza: that Lau Lapides: they said, Anne Ganguzza: personal. Lau Lapides: yeah, we do. And that's Anne Ganguzza: That's Lau Lapides: the Anne Ganguzza: that Lau Lapides: personal Anne Ganguzza: personal, Lau Lapides: relationship. Anne Ganguzza: the personal relationship, personal network, which Lau Lapides: Yeah. Anne Ganguzza: is really important, guys. Lau Lapides: Really. Anne Ganguzza: And casting trends, I think this has always been a trend in casting, is that relationship. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: And gosh, when I went to Amsterdam, you know, to teach at one of the retreats there for J. Michael, I met up with a studio in Amsterdam, who just because they saw me on my website, listened to my demos, and then I met them in person, a working relationship with them. And is it because, am I the absolute best female voice they've ever heard in their life? Of course so, but no. But really, do you know what I mean? Like, Lau Lapides: It's... it's... Anne Ganguzza: it's all about that relationship, right? That relationship. And I, Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: look, I am not proud, guys. I, my ego does not get in the way. If I get the job, I get the job. You know what I mean? And I'm like, look, this is a business to me. For me, my ego doesn't need to be the best, be labeled as the best and touted as the best female voiceover ever legend. Because gosh, it's all subjective. We know this over and over again. But because I worked on that relationship, I had things in place. And I was ready, willing, and eager to help. and lend my thoughts when they asked, hey, what's it like in the States in hiring for this type of work? And because I developed that relationship and I did that work, bam, I got the job. Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: And that is absolutely a valid, successful way to get cast. Lau Lapides: And sometimes it's not, it's very pure. Sometimes your Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: intention is literally not to get cast or get the Anne Ganguzza: Yeah? Lau Lapides: job. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: It's really to get the relationship. I always Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: like to say, I would rather get the relationship than the job because I'm building a career. I'm not working jobs, I'm building a career. And there are two different things. So if I'm gonna sort of lose the battle, but I'm gonna win the war, so to speak, I'd rather do that. In other words, I wanna make myself invaluable. So if I'm not the voice, as a voice talent, I'm going to find you great Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: people that are the voice. I'm going to recommend friends of mine. Anne Ganguzza: Oh, absolutely. Lau Lapides: I'm going to recommend Anne Ganguzza: Now, Lau Lapides: other agencies. Anne Ganguzza: law. way Lau Lapides: Right? Anne Ganguzza: back in the beginning, it's one of the reasons why I wanted to start the VO Peeps networking group. Because I started the VO Peeps because I wanted to have a collection of like-minded people, but then I said, what am I going to do for them? I want to provide an educational resource. So I started interviewing, right? I started interviewing all of my idols because I Lau Lapides: Mm-hmm. Anne Ganguzza: wanted to develop that relationship. Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: Okay? And it wasn't coming at them in a hire Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: you know, a very different format where I just wanted to, I was interested in them and I wanted to share their resources with my community. And because of that, I became known. And once you become known, right, over the years, then you become top of mind for referrals. Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: And that absolutely is where that relationship work comes into play. Lau Lapides: And there's no, or at least there shouldn't be any desperation surrounding that. I don't know if you'd call that a trend. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: I think that Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: was always the case. Anne Ganguzza: Well, I like Lau Lapides: But Anne Ganguzza: to Lau Lapides: now Anne Ganguzza: say Lau Lapides: so Anne Ganguzza: casting Lau Lapides: more than Anne Ganguzza: trends, Lau Lapides: ever Anne Ganguzza: this Lau Lapides: is Anne Ganguzza: is just Lau Lapides: like, Anne Ganguzza: a casting like known, Lau Lapides: yeah, Anne Ganguzza: it's a Lau Lapides: if Anne Ganguzza: known Lau Lapides: we're talking, Anne Ganguzza: fact. Lau Lapides: right, it's a fact. Anne Ganguzza: Why Lau Lapides: If Anne Ganguzza: do Lau Lapides: we're Anne Ganguzza: you get Lau Lapides: talking Anne Ganguzza: cast? Lau Lapides: to people like, like quiz yourself, if Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: I'm in an event or if I'm talking to someone on Zoom, am I thinking the whole time, oh, I want them to hire me. Oh, I want that Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: job. Or am I? really actively listening to what they're Anne Ganguzza: Yeah. Lau Lapides: saying to me and offering value to them in points that make the conversation invigorated and alive and then following up after that and doing Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: the due diligence to follow up after that. Am I doing all of that or am I just Anne Ganguzza: Right. Lau Lapides: thinking oh I want I would love them to get that get me that job and I really want Anne Ganguzza: And Lau Lapides: to Anne Ganguzza: yeah, and a lot of times, you know what? You'll get the job because you have proven yourself to be reliable, to be focused and intent on serving that client's needs and or agents needs. I can't tell you how many agents I interviewed first and then they got to know me and guess who got put on the roster? Just saying, right? As long as everything is in place. Right, we have that. And again, I know we're talking casting trends, but I think we would be remiss if we did not mention the importance of, maybe it's not a trend, but the fact that the relationships account. And that's relationships between you and your agents, and relationships between you and your direct clients. Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: And of course, agents are all dependent on relationships with their clients to get you work, right? Lau Lapides: Yes. Anne Ganguzza: It all just kind of feeds into the system. Lau Lapides: Yeah, and I think the trend part comes in, Annie, where we say, okay, we all know this, we want real voices, casual, relatable voices, we want that. Well, how does that transcribe to the real world? Well, as I'm making the relationships, building the relationships, really talking, really conversing, really paying attention, I'm showcasing and demoing what I do for my real Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I love that. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Lau Lapides: in like now the last couple years are gonna say, ooh, I'm listening to them. I like the way they sound. Ooh, Anne Ganguzza: Mm-hmm. Lau Lapides: they sound really cool. And they're going to assume, they're gonna run on the assumption Anne Ganguzza: that Lau Lapides: that Anne Ganguzza: you Lau Lapides: you Anne Ganguzza: can Lau Lapides: can Anne Ganguzza: do Lau Lapides: then Anne Ganguzza: that. Lau Lapides: bring that into the booth. Anne Ganguzza: Yeah, Lau Lapides: Yeah, Anne Ganguzza: yeah. Lau Lapides: so that's Anne Ganguzza: That's Lau Lapides: where Anne Ganguzza: a Lau Lapides: I think Anne Ganguzza: huge, Lau Lapides: the trend is. Anne Ganguzza: that's a huge assumption guys. So bosses, I want you to be prepared for that. That means, right? The fact that you're gonna bring that authenticity, that connection to you in the booth. What does that mean? That means you need to be the actor. You need to be an actor. You can no longer, no longer is it. And maybe back, I don't know, in the 60s, it was okay to have that announcer-y voice and make it sound a particular way, but it is no longer the case where you can just go in and make it
Mythbusters Part 1
Oct 31 2023
Mythbusters Part 1
Ready to lift the veil on the VoiceOver industry and its many facets? My guest co-host, Tom Deere, and I are here to give you the insider's scoop on the role of agents, pay to plays, and emerging technology in the field. We spill the beans on how agents earn their crust, the types of work where they might prove beneficial, and why they're not a must-have for a successful voice-acting career. We also venture into the territory of synthetic voices and the effect they have on non-broadcast contracts, while underscoring the importance of time limits on contracts for one-off jobs. Plug in and join us on this enlightening journey that will offer you a new perspective on the VoiceOver industry.     About Tom   Tom Dheere is the VO Strategist, a voiceover business & marketing consultant. As a voice actor with over 25 years of experience, he brings his wealth of voiceover knowledge to the table with his 1-one-1 voiceover strategy sessions, Diagnostic sessions, his Mentorship Program, and many public appearances. 0:00:01 - Anne Alright, everyone, welcome to the VO Boss podcast. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and this is the real boss series. I'm happy to welcome back to the show real boss guest co-host Tom Deere. Tom, thanks so much for joining me. 0:00:16 - Tom Hello, thanks for having me back. 0:00:20 - Anne I love having real talk. I think there's so many things in this industry that sell the dream of being a Vio artist, being a Vio actor making money just talking behind your microphone, all of those things. I like to think that Tom and I have been in the industry for so long that, god, we've seen it all. We're just going to be real with you guys, because I think that everyone deserves the real talk, the real story behind VoiceOver. I'm going to tell you that I had a student this week who came to me, a beginner, and who was asking me all about agents. They were under the impression that they needed an agent in order to get the work and that the agent would be the one that got all the work for them. All they had to do was perform behind the mic. Perhaps we should talk about some myths and truths about what this industry is really about. We'll start with agents. 0:01:25 - Tom Tom Sure. One of the biggest challenges for voice actors coming into the industry aspiring voice actors is that most of them feel that they immediately need to relieve themselves for the responsibility of actually doing the work to get the work. 0:01:41 - Anne This leads right into that. 0:01:44 - Tom That's exactly the mindset that your student that you just referred to has. It's like the second I get into the industry, I got to find someone who will do all the work for me, because that's how it works. A huge myth is that you need an agent to be a successful voice actor. 0:02:00 - Anne I'll be honest, tom. When I first started I didn't know. Again, we talk about this all the time. I didn't know what I didn't know. Here we are bosses For those of you just starting out. You don't need an agent, Tom. We're going to expand on that. I used to think that I would get an agent and then that would give me all of my work. I erroneously thought that. Then, once I realized very quickly that that wasn't the case, I proceeded to work for four years before I got my full time, before I got my first agent. 0:02:32 - Tom I don't remember how long it took. I know my longest standing representative I got in 2005. It's been 18 years that I've worked with that particular manager. Everyone before that was either ripping me. Everyone I had that rep me before that was selling me stuff or wouldn't pay me on time. It was just a big mess. 0:02:54 - Anne That was a different time. Tom right, yes, With agents and agents that we didn't really know who they were and there were people that did take advantage. I don't know if that exists so much anymore, but that might be a different podcast. 0:03:09 - Tom Tom One of my students just said this week that there's a particular agent that they have that keeps bothering about. Oh, you need new headshots. You got to come to me to get headshots, but you have to pay me. I know a guy you want to stay on my roster. 0:03:20 - Anne You got to work with him. I know a guy. I know a guy. I know where he's from. 0:03:23 - Tom I think it still happens just a lot less than it used to, mostly because of educational reasons. Most people now know what it means to be a franchised agent, which is one that is certified, approved by SAG-AFTRA. That's one of them. But yeah, you don't necessarily and the operative term is necessarily need an agent to be a successful voice actor, because you, as a voice actor, need to define what success is for you as a voice actor and that will tell you if you need an agent. So, like, if you want to you know you want to narrate audiobooks you don't need an agent. You want to be in fallout halo cartoon network pilot. Yeah, you probably need an agent. 0:04:03 - Anne You want to do a national spot commercial? Probably, although I would say local spots maybe not so much anywhere but national spots, national spots probably you're going to need an agent, and I think the one thing is to be educated on, first of all, what an agent does and truly you know what is in the best interest of an agent. Right, agents are a business as well, right they're? I mean, they want to make money just as much as we want to make money. So how are they going to make money? They're going to develop relationships with clients who will then hire them to cast or help cast right for voiceover jobs, and typically they will be spots that will be paid with usage intact, and so there's an opportunity to make a percentage of money each and every time that voice gets used. And that's why agents will deal in a lot in commercial or anything that's broadcast, and anything that's non-broadcast typically does not require an agent. So, again, as you, as Tom, as you mentioned e-learning, corporate, anything that's one and done. But I'm going to just kind of put this out here, tom, with the advent of synthetic voices and I know we had a wonderful podcast episode about that not so long ago, and actually we're going to be at evocation talking about. Yes, we're going to be on the same panel talking about that, yeah yeah, I think that we have to start thinking about maybe changing that non-broadcast in perpetuity clause. I mean, I know that for me, with the coming up of synthetic voices, I have been really wanting to put like a time limit on all my non-broadcast stuff. Just at the end of my little contract or my email I'll say this is for a year and most people if I'm doing a one-off they're not going to need it or the content will expire after a year and so that's okay. So I actually put a time limit on it. So I kind of give it usage, but not necessarily broadcast usage which every year. Well, of course, it would be great. You're going to pay me again in a year. I'm going to do another content module for you. But yeah, I diverge off of that. So for agents, you don't necessarily need an agent, but I do get corporate work from my agents. 0:06:20 - Tom Literally. Yesterday I narrated two explainer videos for a company through one of my agents and so, yeah, once in a while it'll be an explainer or corporate thing. But yeah, the majority of the stuff that I get through my agents and managers is political, which is broadcast. And I get a lot of pharma commercials but like spec demo stuff which doesn't necessarily turn into broadcast. And if they do choose my voice and it does turn into broadcast, then I get paid for the usage beyond just the internal usage of the project. So, yes, agents, do you know who is it said that agents are like baseball cards they're fun to collect, but only a couple are valuable. 0:07:06 - Anne I love that. That's actually. I think that's really true. Yeah, somebody in our business and somebody in our industry said that that's very interesting because I at one point acquired I have 11, but in reality pandemics come and go and markets shift and change, and so there are a number of agents who are not. I have a couple of agents that I think I really stick with because they know me, they know my voice, they give me opportunities that are catered to my voice and it's not necessarily a cattle call and I'm not belittling any agent that does that, because agents are busy. I mean, if they've got work, they wanna make it available to their roster, and I think that that's a wonderful thing. But just you don't have to have a ton of agents either. I mean really just work with the ones that you have a great relationship with, and that becomes fruitful for both of you. 0:07:58 - Tom Yeah, and it is a synergistic relationship. And here's another myth when it comes to agents is that most voice actors think that they work for their agents. That is not true. 0:08:12 - Anne You work with your agents. 0:08:14 - Tom It's a complimentary, synergistic B2B relationship, because they can't make money without you and you can make money without them, if you think about it, because you can use other ways of booking voiceover work, which we'll talk about down the road. But yes, but just remember, it's an equal relationship and you need to vet your agent and ask them the right questions to see if they're a good fit for you, if you have determined that they're right for you, at this current point in your voiceover journey and for the vast majority of voice actors who are starting out, you do not need an agent. You don't. You also don't have value, yet you don't have the value delivery that an agent would want you for for the most part. 0:09:00 - Anne For the most part, they're looking for you know you've already done some work, so typically they're looking for some experience in the field and a recommendation, typically All right. Let's talk. Another myth. All right and it's another big one that always causes a lot of controversy. Pay to plays right, pay to plays okay. Do you need pay to plays? Do you not need pay to plays? If you use pay to plays, you're a loser because you're bringing down the value of the industry. There's just so many things, and especially certain pay to plays. Right, oh, if you use this pay to play, you're evil or you're working for the enemy or whatever it is. I think that there are good pay to play online casting sites, and there are online casting sites that maybe I wouldn't want to align myself with. 0:09:45 - Tom But that's a personal preference. 0:09:47 - Anne It is a decision I make for my business. But yeah, I think myths about pay to plays is, if you are on them, you are a bottom feeder. Tom what are your thoughts? 0:09:57 - Tom Here's the thing about that, ann, is that every sector of every industry, of every business on the planet has a percentage of people who are sketchy, shady bottom feeders. 0:10:11 - Anne Every single industry. 0:10:12 - Tom So true, the voiceover industry is no exception. There are a percentage of people, because there are humans doing this. A percentage of them will be predatory. That will try to get you to do voiceovers for as little money as possible and clone your voice or turn it into a commercial. You know, do stuff. 0:10:30 - Anne Speaking of which, if I can just interject, that's the whole discussion about AI as well. You will have bad actors. You will have evil companies that will try to steal your voice. The same thing, right A? 0:10:42 - Tom percentage of them AI, pay to play or anyone else will try to take advantage of you, and there are a percentage of voice actors, regardless of how they're booking their voiceover work, will be unscrupulous, because there are a percentage of voice actors who try to go behind the back of their agent and work directly with the producer. There's a percentage, and just like there's a percentage of them, who are on certain pay to play sites whose guideline says you need to maintain the relationship with the client on site, for reasons that I totally understand. I understand and they will try to undermine that. So pay to plays does not make people unscrupulous Unscrupulous people go to pay to play sites. They have agents. They do all sorts of stuff. So I do not buy that argument. It's also pay to plays is just reflection of technology and the economy of supply and demand. 0:11:35 - Anne Oh, thank you. Thank you, tom, for saying that. I mean really it's, and you know I worked in technology, so I mean just having been in that industry for gosh, you know, over 20 years. It just it happens, guys. Technology happens. We're not stopping it. We can fight it, we can put our head in the sand, we can kick and scream and yell and cry and do all these things, but gosh, it's not going away and ultimately we need to evolve. And, gosh, I will just say this until the cows come home and, tom, you say the same thing. We just need to evolve with it and the market will evolve with it. Ultimately it doesn't happen. I just caution. I tell the story. When I, in the early, well, late, 1990s, I installed voice over IP phone systems and it was early adopted technology and the calls would drop. There would be horrible sound, it would sound echoey, and everybody said this technology sucks, it's never gonna last. Well, guess what? Everyone? We use it today and we don't even realize that we use it. So give yourself, I say for any large disruptor of technology, right, which happens for all of us. Like home studios were a disruptor of technology. Digital music, mp3s were a disruptor of technology. Synthetic voices there, a disruptor of technology. I say it's got a lifespan of. You know, not a lifespan, but let it evolve a good 10 to 15 years, because that's what I saw from voice over IP, and then it's going to be seamlessly integrated somewhere in some way. That will become the norm. And that is something that if we do not accept that right, the norm, then we certainly it's gonna be hard for us to be in business. 0:13:08 - Tom Yeah, pay to plays are now. What was once disruptive 15 years ago is now part of the norm, and I know this because my direct marketing and indirect marketing strategies became, over the few, over span of a few years, far less effective. My cold calls. My emails, my blogging, my newsletters, my social media, all of it just took a nosedive and effectiveness because those clients that I was courting or working with via direct and indirect marketing strategies went to pay to play sites. 0:13:40 - Anne And why? Because it was easy for them. 0:13:42 - Tom Easier, faster. 0:13:44 - Anne Convenient and fast, and isn't that the whole idea behind the technology? So reality bosses right. Reality bosses, is technology right and again myth or you know, we're going to bust the myth. Another myth that I'm going to say that goes along with this is that technology is a disruptor and we can fight it and we can stand up together and we can stop. What we can do is we can maybe stop unfair usage through technology of our voices, but we're not going to stop the technology itself? 0:14:17 - Tom No, no. 0:14:18 - Anne Technology is designed to make lives easier, exactly and convenient and human nature is to do those things right. Yes, that will be easier. Right, I'm. And again, I say it all the time I use Alexa, I talk to Alexa. All the time I use new softwares on my computer that are faster, easier. You know new apps that I download. Oh my God, this is going to be great. I can do this now. I can now record this, or I can do this so much easier. I've got rocket money tracking my subscriptions. Oh my God, that's fantastic. This technology, ai, synthetic voices, all this stuff that we are fighting and screaming about, it happens and at some point we do evolve with it, without necessarily having a complete impact. just the one of us right. I will say, though, that I do believe, like you know. I want to say that this is no way reflective of my thoughts about the strike right now, because I do believe that you can fight collectively for rights that are due to you. You just cannot stop the technology. 0:15:23 - Tom Right, it's yes, because I mean, do you think back in the day when the wheel was invented, that there were people who were protesting the use of the wheel because it was disrupting? Their you know whatever business they were, that was disrupted by wheels. No, it's insane, everyone's like. Of course you use the wheel. It makes your life easier. Pay to plays, make voice seekers' lives easier. And it also makes it easier for us because, instead of spending so much time going on Google and LinkedIn and creating all these marketing campaigns which you should do- and can do and can be effective. 0:15:55 - Anne It just adds to your marketing plan. 0:15:57 - Tom Yes, it complements it. 0:15:59 - Anne It's not one size fits all, because direct marketing can be effective if you've got a plan right. I mean, I have a direct marketing package. I mean, tom, I know you do direct marketing, so I do. And it will. It will work, but I think to be just the one solution. I think you've got to really just grab as many solutions as you can and get yourself out in front of as many people as you can to have more and more opportunities. 0:16:23 - Tom Absolutely, absolutely. 0:16:26 - Anne Yeah, so what's another myth, tom? 0:16:28 - Tom Oh well, let's see. Well, you know the union, that's another one. 0:16:32 - Anne Yeah. 0:16:33 - Tom Absolutely. The myth is that if you, if you want to be a successful voice actor, you have to join the union SAG After we're talking about, and if you are not in SAG. The other myth is that if you are not in SAG After, you are, by definition, unethical. 0:16:50 - Anne Yeah, okay. 0:16:51 - Tom And I have had conversations with both people who are desperate to get into SAG After because they think that once they enter SAG After they will automatically be successful as a voice actor, which is not true. That will be the top echelon of being a voice actor, which is not necessarily true, and I have spoken to SAG After members who think I am scum and I've been pursuing voiceover and charging you know industry standard rates for 25 years. Well, isn't that great. But I am a scumbag because I am not in SAG After. 0:17:21 - Anne Isn't our rate guide based off of SAG After, to begin with anyways, absolutely. I think that's everything started that way I mean I remember when I started you know, quoting people, jobs and it was all based on SAG After rates. And then, ultimately, you know GVA. Everybody talks about GVA rate guide, which is amazing, but that evolved after. You know, a bunch of us that have been in the industry for 5000 years had developed our own rate sheets and our own painstaking ways and by the way that is oh, there's a met. That's another myth, tom, that we can talk about in just a minute. That's the myth of like there's a specific amount to charge per job. Okay, yeah, we can get that, let's finish talking about yeah, let's finish talking about the union. And I based my rates off of union and I thought, oh God, am I a horrible actor if I don't join the union, or I must join the union? And once I do so, I will have made it, and so, in reality, you just have to understand what jobs the union is supporting and behind and helping to serve their client base. 0:18:26 - Tom Right, I am, and for the record I am non-union but I am pro-union. I am pro-collectively-bargained, Absolutely. You know, protecting everybody, make sure everybody gets paid a fair amount. 0:18:36 - Anne Agreed. 0:18:37 - Tom And health intention and all of that stuff, but as a voice actor who's early in your journey, you wanna make the same exact calculation about SAG-AFTRA as you do about agents, which we just talked about a second ago. Which is what kind of work do I wanna have? What's my perfect voiceover day? What genres of voiceover am? 0:18:56 - Anne I doing. 0:18:57 - Tom And are those casting opportunities that I want? Are they union driven? So if you wanna do class A national commercials, yes, you need to be in SAG-AFTRA. Do you wanna narrate audio books? Well, you can be in SAG-AFTRA, because there's very specific contracts which I don't pretend to understand the intricacies of. But you can be union or non-union and do audio books and it can contribute to your health and pension. And I know a lot of people I know you do too whose path into and saying in the union is through audio books and they do a great and they make a great living and they get their health and pension and everything's fantastic. So it just all depends. If you wanna be an e-learning narrator, do you. Must you join SAG-AFTRA? Not necessarily. It all depends on what kind of work you're getting, where are you getting it. And then there's the whole. You can turn non-union into union work, but that's a whole other conversation. But, yeah, you go through the same thought process of will being an agent make me an effective voice actor for my definition of success and will joining SAG-AFTRA make me, or contribute to making me, an effective voice actor based on my definition of success. 0:20:09 - Anne Absolutely, absolutely. So now let's get to that point where there's a magic number to charge for every specific job. So I like to address this one because I think, tom, you and I both we're in the trenches okay that in the trenches where there weren't a lot of Facebook groups, we were like before there were, you know, voiceover conferences, before there was really the internet. I mean, I'm not saying not before there, although the internet really became big in the early 1990s. 0:20:40 - Tom Remember we talked about it, Right, but social media. 0:20:41 - Anne But social media and all of this collective right, collective networking online which has really brought a lot of wealthy, a wealth of information, I should say, to us as voice actors and for our businesses. It didn't exist. And so, Tom and I, when we I feel like get off my lawn, I had to walk 10 miles to the voiceover booth and-. 0:21:08 - Tom Up hill both ways. 0:21:09 - Anne Up hill in the snow and there was no one there to tell us what to charge no one. And literally from I swear to God, from the air I pulled rates. I didn't know what to do. The only thing I had available at the time was SEG after rates, and all the SEG after rates didn't really talk about e-learning and so, in reality, I just pulled it from the air. I pulled it from the air based upon what I thought my time was worth, and I'm gonna say we clawed our way into creating our rate sheets. And remember, tom, when it was a big thing, do we publish our rate sheets? 0:21:49 - Tom Or we not. I always say no. Every job is negotiable. Every job is negotiable, Terrible idea. 0:21:56 - Anne But honestly there is no magic number for really any of it. There's a baseline, there's a guideline right. And you can certainly. Today we have all sorts of references. We have SEG, after we have GVAA, we have gravy for the brain all those wonderful guides that give us ideas on what to charge. But is there a perfect number for a live announce that's going to happen three days in a row? And what do you charge on the third day if it's only half a day? You know that kind of thing and you're gonna be sharing the mic with another person. You know that kind of thing when there's all sorts of special circumstances. Is there a perfect number for that? And why isn't it in the rate guide? There just isn't. And guys, sometimes you just gotta pull it from the air or your rear end. That's what. 0:22:37 - Tom I say I just tell you that's where I got that number and there's no shame. There's no shame in that, and there's no shame in just asking the client what's your budget? Yes, oh my god. And they say the boss gave me this amount of money to work with and either you're comfortable with that number or you're not and if it's in within 10, 20% of what you normally charge, take it, do it. 0:22:58 - Anne That's, I think one of the smartest things you can do is ask what the budget is. I mean really. I mean because your budget, like you, might only wanna charge them, I don't know a few hundred dollars, but then their budget might be a thousand. I'm like, oh yeah, I think I can manage that. 0:23:10 - Tom Right right. 0:23:11 - Anne And so always asking the budget and that's like real. I think that's rule one of negotiations, right. Ask what the budget is. 0:23:18 - Tom And it's funny, ann and I know you know this is that budgets, you know, Budgets are usually set in advance for departments and whatever, for the often the year or sometimes quarter or whatever, and and these people that we're working with know that if they don't use all of that budget, next year their budget may be smaller Because they didn't use all of that budget. 0:23:39 - Anne Oh my god, you just brought your corporate to me. I love it. 0:23:42 - Tom Yeah, so sometimes, sometimes they want to pay you more than you would normally charge because they want to make sure they have they can get this budget, same budget for next year. So and that actually puts you at an advantage, that puts you in an advantage, not over them, but with them. 0:23:59 - Anne Are you with me in terms of have we not more than once thought about, oh gosh, if I were to, if I were to go on the corporate side and charge my coaching fees for corporate? Or what I do for Corporate and a corporate rate. 0:24:11 - Tom I'd be putting zeros at the end of my hourly rates. 0:24:13 - Anne That's exactly it I mean. So, remember, guys. I mean, companies have budgets and again, companies, departments, fight like hell for budgets, right, and they fight like hell to get Bigger budgets so that they can be successful, right, and the and and really is it are they. Are they caring so much about the company? Well, in reality, I think the people within the companies and within the departments, they again, we all just want to feel loved, right, we want to do a good job, we want to be appreciated and loved for what we do, and and that's really what it is. So I, you cannot, you cannot scrape me away from loving the corporate market, for sure. In a lot of ways. I may not work for a corporation anymore in the traditional sense, but I certainly do. In voiceover land, I work for them and I and I understand that budget. So, yeah, so there is no magic number, for you know what will it cost me to do? You know three pages of on hold messages for this company that I? You know they said their budget is only this amount. What should I do? You know, a lot of times, guys, you, you really just have to learn the art of this, the subtle art of negotiation, and sometimes that number just is is made up. 0:25:32 - Tom Made up. Guys. Sometimes and most of the time, it's not about you taking advantage of them or trying to take advantage of you. It's not about, yeah, what most of our students and go through is like they're terrified that if they're too aggressive the client's gonna walk away and if they're not aggressive enough they're gonna get taken advantage of. I'd say at least 80% of the time that is not the case at all. They've got this budget, they've got this thing to do. They found you, they like you. They want to give you money to say stuff out loud, which is what you want. So, most of the time you're gonna be fine and you know I've got so many clients I'll be like 400. They'll be like okay, or just same as last time, okay or hey. It's a new year. Can I up this by 50 bucks? 0:26:12 - Anne And they go okay. 0:26:13 - Tom Yeah, so most of time it's just, it's just easy peasy, just you know. 0:26:17 - Anne And here's one other thing I'll say is up in your price, yeah use the workaround of the rate guides. 0:26:22 - Tom I don't charge this rate. 0:26:23 - Anne This is the industry standard. 0:26:25 - Tom You know what I mean. You can use that so yeah, do we have time? For one more myth. 0:26:29 - Anne All right, one more myth. We got time for one more myth. What do you? Got time? 0:26:33 - Tom The AI myth well, which we don't even know, is a myth, yet not because it's still too early that could be an entire, that could be an entire podcast episode. 0:26:40 - Anne But okay, yeah, let's start. Let's start well. 0:26:42 - Tom Well, just just just the inkling of you know the myth, the well I, well I the myth that AI is gonna take all of our jobs, take our jobs away? 0:26:49 - Anne Yeah, no, and look, I'm a technology buff. I worked in technology for gosh 20 some odd years. I love technology. Tom and I are on multiple panels talking about AI and, honestly like, is it going to take our jobs away, tom? 0:27:05 - Tom It's gonna. It has the potential to take small percentage of some of our jobs away. I think that's reasonable. 0:27:15 - Anne But I think the mass panic right now, I think Tom is maybe good because it will get people's attention and it will and mostly our attention right, I wanted to get the people in the industry's attention so that they can educate themselves on how to be smart about their business. And that means don't let anybody take advantage of you, don't let anybody put something in a contract that will allow them to steal your voice or use your voice in perpetuity, forever and ever and ever, without knowledge, or create a synthetic voice, and that's what is going on now. I think that you know a big part of the strike is, you know, is got that AI rider in there and that companies need to compensate us. If they're going to use the technology and utilize our, our creative assets right, then we need to be compensated for that. We need to be compensated fairly and that's what I think we are all fighting for and as long as you are smart about that and you educate yourself and again, vo Boss has done over 30 episodes of talking. I talked to CEOs of companies who make voices. I talked to industry leaders in the AI industry, tom I've talked to Tom. I've talked to I'm going to be presenting next week, actually at an AI conference talking about ethical, you know, and and and rights for voice artists and in synthetic voices. So, guys, educate yourself on that. It's it will not there. We will have to evolve along with that technology. But be stay on top of it and understand how you can. You can run your business around that. 0:28:48 - Tom Right. One quick thing all the way on the other side of it is that there are certain voice actors and groups of voice actors on social media who are perpetuating the myth that AI is not going to take away any of our jobs and if you are just doing nothing but direct marketing, you're gonna be perfectly fine. That is also not true. It's not true because that means they are ignoring the reality of technology that is affecting our industry. Don't put your head in the sand either. Don't put your head in the sand, yeah absolutely and just and just understand and evolve. 0:29:19 - Anne And so, if it's going to, if it's probably and again, I I'm of the belief that there is that percentage of the market like we talked about in the beginning right, the bottom feeders. Right, they'll always be the bottom feeders that don't care about the quality of the voice, right, when that's not you know, the top quality of voice is not on their, their budget or on their brain then they're going to use synthetic voice and there's nothing you're going to do to stop that. Right, because it's going to be convenient and it's going to be easy and it's going to be cheaper. Okay, now, if somebody but again, I am the, I'm always the perpetuating manifesting, I am a celebrity voice, I am an influencer, right, tom, you are an influencer. If somebody wants to use my synthetic voice, they're going to have to pay me, compensate me for it. Oh yeah, and I'm not going to be cheap, right, because my brand is not cheap and I'm not saying it's going to be more expensive than my human voice, but I'm certainly going to be able to. Oh sure, I can cut you a deal on that, right, but it's not going to be pennies. I'll tell you that because my voice is worth something, my influence my the way that I can help brand and market for a company. I am holding true to that now. Whether a company chooses to buy into that and pay me fairly, then that's awesome. If they don't, they don't. I say no to it. Right and that's it, and my voice is protected just like any other type of job that I would do, right. Yeah, if you are not going to pay me what I am worth or what I am. You know this is my price. Then that's okay. I will spend that time looking for people who will. Right Simple as that, right, right, good topic. Oh my gosh, we could probably go on. We maybe should have part two of the myths. 0:30:55 - Tom Oh, we can do that? 0:30:57 - Anne Yeah, I think we should do that. So, yeah, bosses, tom, thank you again for another amazing real talk with the bosses. We totally appreciate you bosses. Simple mission, big impact. 100 voices, one hour, ten thousand dollars. If you need to know more, or if you want to know more, find out at 100 voices who careorg and join us and big shout out to sponsor IPDTL. Youtube can connect and network like bosses, like Tom and I. Find out more at IPDTLcom. You guys have an amazing real week and we'll see you next week. Alright, take care. 0:31:31 - Tom Bye. 0:31:31 - Anne Bye, alright, stopping. Transcribed by https://podium.page