Relish THIS: The Nonprofit Marketing Podcast

Stu Swineford

Are you looking for ways to shorten your marketing learning curve and strengthen your organization’s ability to survive and thrive? Welcome to Relish THIS, a show for purpose-focused leaders seeking to leverage the power of marketing to fuel their organizations’ growth. Each week your host, Stu Swineford – author of Mission Uncomfortable: How Nonprofits can embrace purpose-driven marketing to survive and thrive (https://missionuncomfortablebook.com) – talks with a purpose-focused leader or marketing ecosystem expert to explore ways to transform lives through marketing. Using the techniques developed working with hundreds of for- and nonprofit organizations at the digital marketing agency he co-founded, Relish Studio (https://relishstudio.com), he inspires you to take action to improve your organization's ability to shine.Are you feeling stuck with your outreach? Not sure if your message is reaching anyone – much less the right audience? Do you view your marketing as a cost rather than an investment in your organization’s health and growth? If so, Relish THIS is the podcast you have been looking for.If you are seeking to take your organization to the next level and take the mystery out of your marketing, you are in the right place. With Relish THIS, you’ll learn that you are not alone. The roadmap for a successful marketing campaign is at your fingertips. This marketing podcast explores ways your organization can adjust its relationship to marketing to build relationships that will fuel your growth. Learn how to develop and nurture relationships through authentic marketing tactics like email marketing, content marketing, brand story development, social campaigns, effective landing page design, cause marketing, funnel creation, paid search, SEO, and much more. Learn how you can apply purpose marketing throughout the stakeholder lifecycle and nurture relationships to create thrust in your business. Relish THIS anchors its conversations in the audience engagement lifecycle – a framework that identifies each step of the stakeholder journey – from initial interest to lifelong advocate and supporter. By optimizing each phase – ATTRACT, BOND, CONNECT, and INSPIRE – we’ll dig into what makes any organization's marketing successful and how to ensure that you have a roadmap to win. Each week, Stu and his guest have a thoughtful, in-depth conversation about what’s working, what’s not, where one can take their organization and how to get there quickly and effectively. Relish This is all about creating opportunities to expand your mission through marketing.If you find yourself struggling with marketing your nonprofit or purpose-focused business and are looking for fresh ideas for how to motivate your team, engage your stakeholders, build your volunteer and donor base, encourage repeat business, and inspire your existing connections to promote your organization, Relish THIS is here to help. Each episode unearths marketing gold that can be applied to your own organization to help you reach your goals.Stu and his guests explore a full range of business-building topics that will help your organization expand your mission. Most guests say they come away with a laundry list of ideas to take back to their team to improve their performance and fuel their organization’s ability to connect with it’s target audience. Team-building, organization and process development, motivational techniques, fundraising, how to inspire ALL your stakeholders, and the nuts-and-bolts of running a successful marketing campaign and process… all of these and more are explored on this weekly, hour-long show.Get ready for action with Relish THIS!For more or to listen to past episodes, check out http://relishthis.org read less
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Episodes

Ep 101: How to Get Volunteers on Board from the Onset with Karen Knight
Mar 14 2023
Ep 101: How to Get Volunteers on Board from the Onset with Karen Knight
Volunteers are the fuel that keeps nonprofit organizations humming.Not discounting volunteers' hard work to serve nonprofits’ missions, volunteers and how they talk about their experiences working with their favorite organizations provide the thrust that brings an abundance of donations, interest, and other volunteers into the system. In short, when you treat your volunteers well and create an experience that a) positions them as the heroes in your mission story and b) treats their time as an invaluable resource not to be wasted, you’ll be on the path to real success.See, many nonprofits position the organization as the hero of their story. In this narrative, the organization is cast as the creator of the majority of the thrust leading the charge to fulfill its mission.Turning that framework on its head to position the volunteer as the hero is a fantastic way to encourage better engagement and attract more volunteers to your organization. It’s a subtle shift that can be challenging, but magic happens when you get it right. This shift in messaging helps bring volunteers into the system as they see themselves cast that the hero. Who wouldn’t want to work with an organization that views its volunteer force through that lens?Once you have enticed your volunteers to take action to engage with your organization is the next area in which planning and process development works wonders.Crafting an onboarding process and following that process each and every time a volunteer offers to engage with your organization is paramount. Have a plan, make the volunteers feel welcome and valuable, and ensure they don’t feel that their time was wasted.When you nail these two elements of your organization, you will see an uptick in your repeat volunteerism, your helpers will start recruiting for you, and you will see referral-based donations start rolling in.That’s a long introduction to this week’s guest on Relish THIS, Karen Knight. Karen has worked in the nonprofit space since first volunteering at age 11 and has been helping nonprofits improve their volunteer engagement ever since. Her consulting business helps nonprofit organizations knock their volunteer engagement out of the park by developing proven, repeatable processes and a better understanding of effective volunteer engagement and management.If you leverage the talent and hard work of volunteers, this episode is tailor-made for you.Dig in to see a different approach to volunteerism. Links: Karen Knight Consulting Ask: Show your appreciationThank your volunteers on every shift
Ep 99: Reenergize Your Nonprofit to Survive and Thrive with Kristen Faith of The Nonprofit Makeover
Dec 6 2022
Ep 99: Reenergize Your Nonprofit to Survive and Thrive with Kristen Faith of The Nonprofit Makeover
All of us have a desire to be liked. And many of us hide our true selves from fear of rejection. We tailor our appearance, what we say, and what we talk about to try to curate a persona we believe will be more attractive to more people. This curation may create a likeable avatar, but it may exist through the exclusion of authenticity. And what might have been stifled through this creation?My guest today on Relish THIS is Kristin Faith, the CEO of The Nonprofit Makeover. If there’s anything to be said about Kristin it’s this: she is awash with enthusiasm for helping nonprofit leaders find their voice and the authenticity to help people really step out of their shells and take their nonprofit organizations to the next level.Our conversation was wide-ranging, with a particular focus on the importance of revenue-stream diversification for your organization. When Kristin started her nonprofit she quickly realized the power and importance of having a variety of revenue streams and how diversification frees you up to take fuller advantage of opportunities. This is a methodology she helps others in the space leverage.Have a listen to this great show and learn how you can make adjustments in your organization to help it thrive.Links: The Nonprofit MakeoverLinkedInFacebookInstagramUncharitable: How Restraints on Nonprofits Undermine Their PotentialAsk: Diversify your funding streams. Get prepared and find the resources that will push you and challenge you to be better.
Ep 98: Creating a More Authentic Conversation with Aaron Wrixon
Nov 29 2022
Ep 98: Creating a More Authentic Conversation with Aaron Wrixon
Are you struggling with content marketing?In one sense, getting your message out to prospects has never been easier. A quick web search reveals dozens, if not hundreds, of content tools to help you quickly distribute your latest ideas via email, social media, your site, and nearly anywhere else you can think of. However, this ease of access has come at a price. These distribution gains have come with a loss in the authenticity required to develop strong, lasting relationships. That’s one of the many topics my guest, Aaron Wrixon, and I discuss today on Relish THIS.Aaron is not only an amazing copywriter but also just a fantastic human being. I had the pleasure of meeting Aaron at a conference many years ago and we instantly clicked. He’s one of my favorite people on the planet and I thoroughly enjoy our conversations. Whether we are chatting about hockey, the latest Nic Cage movie, books, or marketing, there’s always gold to be mined.Dive into your approach to copywriting and hone your ability to write copy that embraces the idea of developing a 1-to-1 relationship – one that casts your stakeholder in the role of “hero” in the story they are experiencing with your organization. Aaron is just the best. Take your content marketing to the next level with this episode of Relish THIS.Links: https://www.wrixon.com/Ask: “Give your head a shake” lolTry to be more authentic and bold in your communication. Be more vulnerable and more engaging. Daring to commit to authentic conversation.
Ep 95: Reframing Costs As Investments with Alex Romero
Nov 1 2022
Ep 95: Reframing Costs As Investments with Alex Romero
Particularly when one is a solopreneur, there’s a tendency to think of expenses as money coming out of one’s pocket instead of as an investment into one’s organization. It stems from adopting a scarcity mindset (rather than framing one’s experience from abundance) and also is seen quite a lot when one attaches oneself very closely to one’s occupation. (But that’s a whole other conversation.)The problem is compounded when framing every investment opportunity against the direct revenue this allocation is likely to create.So before introducing this week’s guest here on Relish THIS, I’ll relate a quick tale.When I first started my life as an entrepreneur, I had a tendency to fall into this “cost trap”. I viewed every expense through the lens of “how does this make us money” and neglected the other benefits investing in support, resources, tools, etc. could bring to an organization. I know now that there are many intangible benefits to investment, including boosts in morale, comfort, and the like, as well as time savings (both direct and indirect saving accrued simply by no longer having to think about an activity needing to be accomplished). For me, one of the first places this type of investment attitude paid off was in bookkeeping. Every month I dreaded doing our books. I didn’t enjoy it and knew I wasn’t great at it. I tended to put it off until the last minute and then fret about it after I was done. Neither, any good bookkeeper will tell you, are good for the health of one’s books.So I overcame the “this cost won’t make me money” demon in my head and hired a bookkeeper. Mischa has been helping us ever since and I don’t think I have once questioned the “cost” of her engagement. It freed up a ton of noise in my own head and I know our books get done correctly and on time each month. Now THAT was a great investment!So coming back to my guest today on Relish THIS. Alex Romero is one of the financial masterminds (her “real” title is Virtual CFO) at Chris Hervoshon CPA. They are a virtual CPA team that helps nonprofits get their financial house in order so that they can confidently serve their constituents most effectively.Alex is just great. She has been working in the nonprofit space for years and shared a TON of valuable information during our conversation to help your nonprofit navigate bringing on a CPA to help you stay compliant with state and federal regulations and have a healthier understanding of your nonprofit’s financial status. Of course, we talked about the cost vs. investment conundrum as well as what you need to know before bringing on a CPA, ways to bridge the gap between DIY and hiring an expert,  and ways to get really proactive about your finances so that you can be able to run your organization most effectively. We dove into managing and tracking grants and donations as well, so there is a LOT of great information in this episode. Whether you are just getting started with your organization or have been up and running for years, there’s something for you in this episode. I hope you have as much fun with it as I did.Links: Better Way CPA TwitterLinkedInAsk: Start a spreadsheet to track any money that you get through your door at your nonprofit. Just start tracking and keeping records.
Ep 94: Reimagining the Elevator Pitch With Building Bridges
Oct 25 2022
Ep 94: Reimagining the Elevator Pitch With Building Bridges
In the past, one’s “elevator pitch” lasted 30-60 seconds. There was a reasonable expectation that one could hold someone’s attention for that period of time during which a longer conversation could be created. These days, however, 30-60 seconds is an eternity. In the world of TikTok and SnapChat and Twitter, we now have roughly 7 seconds to capture your audience’s attention before they move on to something else.That’s why you have to answer these questions immediately on your site:What is this?Who is it for?How does it make their life better?How do they get it? Or what should they do next?Today’s guests on Relish THIS, Maren Miller and Nikki Murillo from Building Bridges, are working to transform the world through DEI training. They see an opportunity to inspire both current and future leaders to embrace inclusivity in the workplace and beyond to shift perspectives and make the world a better place. They are doing amazing work in the space.They are also doing a pretty good job of fleshing out their story on their site: demonstrating empathy and establishing authority, differentiating their services and processes, and leveraging social proof. But (at least on the date of our conversation) were missing an opportunity to nail the 7-second test to really throw the hook into those looking to improve Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion practices in their organizations.Just the nature of their work, which requires individuals to take a pretty hard look at their own privilege, requires overcoming some interesting challenges. We chatted through some sales ideas, ways to create some sparks in their INSPIRE phase activities and more. This was a really fun conversation and I hope you can check out the show.Links: https://buildingbridgesshift.org/Building a Story BrandSmall Business Marketing AssessmentAsk: Fill out the Building Bridges Survey Go Slow To Go Fast! Pause take a breath, be aware of yourself, of your environment, your surroundings, your community, and, examine what is the next right step.
Ep 92: Help Is Always Available: You Don’t Have to Go It Alone with Mike Hess From The Blind Institute of Technology
Sep 20 2022
Ep 92: Help Is Always Available: You Don’t Have to Go It Alone with Mike Hess From The Blind Institute of Technology
One of the challenges most entrepreneurs create for themselves is an inability to ask for help. This can stem from fear of appearing weak, a desire for control, or a heightened sense of responsibility honed by years of “Gettin’ it done.”Regardless of the root cause, one thing is certainly true: You are not alone. Neither in your thinking that you ARE alone nor your actual state of aloneness. Help is available for you and it’s ok to be vulnerable and ask for assistance. (In fact, asking for help is seen as a way to help others. The Jewish faith calls this a worthy deed – a “mitzvah”.)My guest today is Mike Hess. He is the Founder and Executive Director of the Blind Institute of Technology. Mike and I actually met several years ago when he was doing a presentation for the Entrepreneurs Organization (EO). Mike took us through a really cool exercise that demonstrated how entrepreneurs in particular have a hard time asking for help. Mike and I chatted about this challenge – particularly in relation to the idea of loss aversion and how he experiences that as a person with blindness. Mike says he gets a sense of this kind of “squishy” feeling sometimes when he's talking with people and makes some recommendations for ways to avoid creating that experience for others if you are starting to put off that vibe. Mike believes that if one can just be vulnerable and admit the challenges that they're having, how that becomes a way to diffuse the “squishiness” and creates a stronger foundation on which to build relationships. As you may have guessed, Mike is just an amazing person. His willingness to share his perspectives to help others grow is truly a gift.Links: Blind Institute of TechnologyASK: Partner up! If you don’t know how to do something, find a partner and engage with them – particularly if things are feeling “squishy”
Ep 91: Relationship-building on Social Media with Nick Black from Good United
Aug 30 2022
Ep 91: Relationship-building on Social Media with Nick Black from Good United
Marketing is all about relationship-building.From selling a $0.25 widget to landing a multi-million dollar corporate sponsor, your ability to close business is only as strong as the relationships you build. People do business with people… and it’s becoming increasingly evident that people do even MORE business with people they like. That’s why any chance to further your relationships with other and to strengthen those bonds is an important part of your organization’s tactics.And that’s what our guest today, Nick Black is all about. Nick is the Co-Founder and CEO of Good United, an organization that helps nonprofits build lasting relationships with their stakeholders at scale.If there's one takeaway from today's show it's that you need to go over to Facebook right now and make sure that you have “Facebook Giving Tools” activated for your organization. This tool enables you to start collecting donations on Facebook and Instagram immediately, improving your ability to tap into the power of these social platforms to expand your means of collecting donations from those who are interested in the good work you do.From a relationship-building standpoint, Good United has you covered. They have developed an amazing platform that allows nonprofits to engage with their potential audiences through Facebook messaging. It's unique, cutting edge, and is something that almost every nonprofit could take advantage of. Have a listen to this episode to expand your ability to leverage the power of social media and the opportunities for relationship-building that it provides.Links: https://www.goodunited.io/Ask: Go onto Facebook and make sure that the Facebook Giving Tools are turned on for your organization.
Ep 90: Framing your donations as investments with Greg Harrell Edge from Coachart
Aug 23 2022
Ep 90: Framing your donations as investments with Greg Harrell Edge from Coachart
A small adjustment in the language you use can make a big impact on your outcomes. A lot of nonprofits, in fact, MOST nonprofits, talk about donations in terms of  “gifts”. This tees up a certain dynamic – one with low expectations which can reduce the frequency and volume of said “gift”. My guest today is Greg Harrell-Edge, the Executive Director at CoachArt. He and his team have completely reimagined how they talk about donations to reframe the narrative to one with heightened expectations, resulting in an increase in revenue and engagement with their donors.Instead of simply being a donor who gives a gift to the organization, CoachArt uses language framed around “investment” language. They talk about IPOs and ROI and use similar language that transitions the relationship they are building with their stakeholders from one that is a one-way exchange of value into one where there is increased interest and investment in the outcomes, creating more of a two-way relationship with donors.This was an incredibly fascinating conversation jam-packed with valuable insights that can be applied to any organization’s playbook.Links: https://coachart.org/Surveymonkey Audience: https://www.surveymonkey.com/market-research/solutions/audience-panel/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregharrelledge/Expectations vs. Agreements: https://relishstudio.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/Expectation-vs-Agreement.mp3Ask: Head to CoachArt’s website and Join our Impact Investment Club
Ep 89: Own Your Marketing With David Pisarek of Wow Digital
Aug 16 2022
Ep 89: Own Your Marketing With David Pisarek of Wow Digital
If there’s one takeaway from this week’s episode it’s that “your site is a member of your team.”And, like the other members of your team, your site needs to be nurtured in order for it to thrive and work as effectively as you would like.See, a lot of people think that having a website is enough. They tend to fall into the Field of Dreams fallacy. “Build it and they will come,” they say.But this just isn’t how the web works these days.You have to nurture your site to enable it to work to its fullest potential. And that means introducing new content, building out hub pages, storytelling effectively, etc.The conversation today is with David Pisarek, Founder and Chief Digital Aficionado of Wow Digital. David and the team at Wow Digital focus on building strong brands with effective sites for both for- and nonprofit organizations seeking to maximize their positive impact on the world.Our conversation was wide-ranging and had a LOT of great information for anyone seeking to fuel their organization’s growth through marketing.Hope you have as much fun with this conversation as I did.Links: david@wowdigital.comwowdigital.com/ebook/http://nonprofitdigitalsuccess.com/  (redirect to the podcast page on my site at https://wowdigital.com/podcast - eventually I'll probably build out a proper site for it, but for now enjoying the SEO benefits of having it on my site)https://www.amazon.com/Hooked-You-Genius-Anybody-Anything-ebook/dp/B00PWE8IXA/ - the book I mentioned - it's a quick read, $5 for the paperback...Ask: Look at your analytics and get a feel for what people are actually doing when they visit your site
Ep 88: Getting Culture “Right” and Focusing on Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) in your Organization with Michael Rolph from New Sincerity
Aug 9 2022
Ep 88: Getting Culture “Right” and Focusing on Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) in your Organization with Michael Rolph from New Sincerity
Aside from “pivot”, “culture” is a word that has been getting a bit of a workout in the business world over the last several years. There are SO many reasons why a focus on “culture” is a clutch move for any organization. We are seeing a big shift in how people engage with businesses and brands, and when one can lead with culture, there are a variety of benefits to be had.Attention to one’s prowess (or lack thereof) with Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) is an area where many organizations are also focusing attention these days, as these elements have a direct influence on team culture. That’s why this week’s discussion is so valuable.My guest today is Michael Rolph, Founding Partner at New Sincerity. Michael and his team help with DEI awareness, training, and culture-building for organizations ready to up their DEI game.Michael and I had an incredibly valuable conversation about how to work on building a great culture and how those efforts are not only rooted in “the right thing to do” but have spillover benefits to all aspects of any organization. Our conversation was rooted in the idea that it’s important to not worry so much about getting it “right” immediately but to get it started and get better as it grows. I hope you enjoy this episode. It’s jam-packed with goodness.Links: New Sincerity Ask: Commit to one action this week and get to know somebody with a different lived experience.
Ep 87: Aligning and Defining Your Company’s Culture with HR Strategist Otisa Eads
Jul 12 2022
Ep 87: Aligning and Defining Your Company’s Culture with HR Strategist Otisa Eads
Building a team seems like a pretty straightforward endeavor. Figure out what you want people to “do” then get someone on board to accomplish that task, right?Turns out, there is a better way to approach the hiring process and it comes from “BEing” rather than “DOing”.And it really comes down to seeking cultural fit before task fit.It’s a bit of a scary mindset shift but when you can see that it’s WAY easier to train someone to expand upon their set of skills than to facilitate a cultural alignment, your ability to build a solid, happy, healthy team will be unparalleled.Leading with culture has SO many benefits that go beyond efficiencies and output gained by having cultural alignment. A strong company culture influences everything around it. From vendor relationships, to marketing, to investment opportunities. When your culture is humming, everyone who has a relationship with your organization gets on board.That’s why today’s conversation is so important. My guest is Otisa Eads and she’s a HR Consultant and Systems Strategist who is fully steeped in culture and team building. Yes, Otisa can help you with your HR needs, AND that starts with culture.Otisa is also a big proponent of measuring. See, when you can identify ways to measure the effectiveness of the modifications you make – the experiments you run in your organization – you can then make more educated decisions about what to try next. Running your organization is really just a series of experiments. Define a hypothesis. Establish tests to prove or disprove that hypothesis. Measure. Repeat.Otisa is AMAZING at this stuff and our conversation was super valuable.Have a listen to this episode and help get your culture game humming.Links: Otisa EadsAsk: Gather feedback and data. Whether from the staff or stakeholders, spend time doing research on what is happening internally at your organization.
Ep 86: The power of purpose and leading with authenticity with Cheryl Farr and Cristina Ferreri from SignalCSK
Jun 21 2022
Ep 86: The power of purpose and leading with authenticity with Cheryl Farr and Cristina Ferreri from SignalCSK
At one point, having a purpose-focused organization was a bit of a differentiator. Lately, the term comes up a lot, and for those organizations that are truly leading with purpose and have a mission that drives their decisions and daily activities, kudos to you.At Relish Studio, we like working with people with a purpose for a variety of reasons. Mostly, helping organizations and their leaders who have a “giving back” ethos just feels good. However, we also see that many of these organizations just have a stronger culture and drive and the purpose they are embracing unites their teams and provides an added thrust that can be absent in those organizations that just have revenues to motivate performance.That’s why my conversation with Cristina Ferreri and Cheryl Farr from Signal CSK was so much fun. These two are definitely on a mission. They help develop brand strategy that goes above and beyond just logo creation and simple messaging. They help their clients lead with real authenticity to build a strong culture that gets teams engaged and gets audiences motivated to take action.If you are interested in taking your organization to the next level, this conversation is definitely for you. Cristina and Cheryl will help you harness the power of purpose and lead with authenticity to make your organization shine in the marketplace. Hope you enjoy the show.Link: Signal CSK Brand Partners LogicMoose International Ask: Lead with authenticity. take time to consider the purpose you are chasing. live it out loud. Look at brands you engage with in a new light to understand how that brand relates to YOU. Learn and apply lessons learned.
Ep 85: CRMs, the number one tool you need to grow the success of your nonprofit with Lidiane Mocko of CRM Growth Strategy
Jun 14 2022
Ep 85: CRMs, the number one tool you need to grow the success of your nonprofit with Lidiane Mocko of CRM Growth Strategy
When asked, “What’s the best Customer Relationship Management Tool (CRM)?” I like to joke, “The best CRM is the one you will use.” And though this is mostly a pithy reply to a legitimate inquiry, in my experience just getting started and committed to using a CRM is one of the best actions one can take to get their sales humming.And yes, nonprofits can benefit from a CRM too. (One they will use, of course.)Your CRM helps you stay on track with outreach, check-ins, and where people currently reside in their engagement lifecycle with your organization. Using one effectively helps you build relationships and keep conversations and actions from falling through the cracks.Some of the more full-featured CRMs even help you keep your one-to-many outreach on track with email automations, funnel capabilities, and even social media management functionality that enables you to be more proactive with your outreach and improve your team’s efficiency and effectiveness with social engagement. In fact, we wrote a whole post about getting organized with a CRM.That’s why I’m so excited about today’s guest, Lidiane (Liddy) Mocko. She’s a CRM expert and the founder of CRM Growth Strategy and if you are interested in getting your CRM game on point, Liddy is your go-to person to make sure you are set up and running at peak efficiency.See, Liddy is steeped in the CRM world. She’s a SalesForce expert and helps teams in both for- and nonprofit organizations get the most out of their systems. She not only helps organizations customize their platforms, but has a wealth of experience and knowledge she shares with the world to ensure that you get the most out of your CRM and engagement plan.This episode is a game-changer for those who currently have a CRM or those looking to add this valuable tool to their kit. I hope you enjoy it.Links: CRM Growth Strategy Salesforce GreaterGivingClickBidGiveLively Ask: If you are using a CRM, now is time for Spring Cleaning, go ahead and check in on people you haven’t talked to in a while, pick up the phone or send some emails to get them reengaged with you and your organization.
Ep 84: Embracing the new future of virtual events to greatly increase your engagement, attendance, and donations with We and Goliath
May 3 2022
Ep 84: Embracing the new future of virtual events to greatly increase your engagement, attendance, and donations with We and Goliath
Like it or not, we are still living in a world where virtual events continue to be a necessity. In order to accommodate the widest possible audience, getting your virtual events dialed is imperative to ensure that you enable optimum engagement. And what’s fortune is that we do live in an era where technology exists to make these types of events not only possible but incredibly engaging.Instead of fighting the “new normal”, my guests today, Michelle Garrison and Daniel Moss from We and Goliath took a forward-thinking approach and focused on updating and optimizing virtual events to keep your attendees interested and engaged.There are benefits to putting on your event in the virtual (or hybrid) space. First, you are no longer limited to local audiences (or ones with the facility to travel to your locale). Second, virtual events by their very nature include a built-in mechanism that create materials that can be repurposed to allow a one-time, in-person event to gain increased reach and a bulk of materials that can be shared for years to come. In fact, assets created in one year can be used to promote future events. Our conversation today is jam-packed with great tips, clever breakout activities, and ways to make your next event shine. The events Daniel and Michelle have helped create over the years  have helped organizations turn their in-person events into international events and have even helped increase online attendance by over 7x of their previous years' in-person attendance.If you are seeking to put on an event, this show is a must-listen.Links: Pledgling Give Butter We and GoliathAsk: ASK: Create coalitions. team up across spaces and support each other. Check out this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFsNL_EWA9AEmbrace the efficiency that virtual events provide to make connections you never could at an in-person event.